FALLING FROM GRACE; WHAT IT MEANS AND HOW YOU FALL

[Kimeworc]

Hello Ladylynn, have not seen you in the Bible study room for a while now. And I keep naming you as one of the "good" ones, who "get it" to people who are discouraged by the others.

 

[ladylynn]

No, you did not learn to speak evil of God's commandments from the Holy Spirit. Just as you did not learn to be silent when it comes to speaking out against sinful behavior from the Holy Spirit. Those things come from the spirit of this world, which is the same spirit working in many deceivers like Joseph Prince.

It is of no secret to me who the ones are who support and constantly post Joseph Prince teachings on this site, and you are also among that same group. I would urge all of you to repent of your sins and stop following the false doctrines of worldly preachers like Joseph Prince who still walk after the lusts of the flesh and sin. His doctrine is pleasing to the sinful masses because he does not speak out against sinful behavior, but rather they speak evil of God's laws and commands, even the teachings and sayings of Jesus Christ.

Joseph Prince and his followers are a fulfilling of prophecy about the falling away from the faith, and that man of lawlessness being revealed "in them." Joseph Prince and his followers teach "Antinomianism"

That teaching is called "lawlessness" and that is what the Holy Spirit warned of concerning the falling away from the faith.

2 Thessalonians 2:3
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin (lawlessness) be revealed, the son of perdition;

If you follow the false teachings of preachers like Joseph Prince you also are going to follow the broad path that leads to perdition, or destruction.

Well ISIT, I'll say it again for you and then I'll leave you to your opinions. I'm not going to fight you on these threads as it's counter productive for all involved. Since the Lord has given me grace, I know He promises to give it to anyone and I believe Him. So I know and believe you are loved and have access to His grace too. Here is the rest of my post you didn't post here.



[FONT=&quot]I'm not sure why you want to say they are not my own words?? Seriously., not all roads lead to Joseph Prince. [/FONT][FONT=&quot] 2 years ago I was reading "Streams In The Desert" by Mrs.Cowman. I read that devotional for 3 years before going to this one. Now I'm reading "Destined To Reign" by J.Prince. I'm an 'equal opportunity devotional devotee'. I like certain preachers and teachers and writers at certain times in my life.

I was reading Oswald Chambers "My Utmost For His Highest" before that and mid stream changed to the easier English from the old English version. I'm 58 so I've enjoyed many different morning devotionals. I'm not going to apologize for liking certain writers and wanting to share their Biblical insight here. I joined CC for that very reason.

I don't think it is a fair reaction on your part to follow my posts around calling me names for liking different writers or preachers or teachers. I'm not going to be in agreement with you all the time and neither will a whole lot of people.,or you for that matter. That's why we are encouraged to share and edify one another. Can't you see the benefit of all of us doing this sort of thing?

When I don't find someone's writing interesting., I just don't join in the thread. I think you might find that enjoyable and edifying too as well as help keep stress down in life. Coming to CC to share the Lord is a good thing. Coming to CC to fight is not.[/FONT]

 

[Grace777x70]

No, you did not learn to speak evil of God's commandments from the Holy Spirit. Just as you did not learn to be silent when it comes to speaking out against sinful behavior from the Holy Spirit. Those things come from the spirit of this world, which is the same spirit working in many deceivers like Joseph Prince.

It is of no secret to me who the ones are who support and constantly post Joseph Prince teachings on this site, and you are also among that same group. I would urge all of you to repent of your sins and stop following the false doctrines of worldly preachers like Joseph Prince who still walk after the lusts of the flesh and sin. His doctrine is pleasing to the sinful masses because he does not speak out against sinful behavior, but rather they speak evil of God's laws and commands, even the teachings and sayings of Jesus Christ.

Joseph Prince and his followers are a fulfilling of prophecy about the falling away from the faith, and that man of lawlessness being revealed "in them." Joseph Prince and his followers teach "Antinomianism"

That teaching is called "lawlessness" and that is what the Holy Spirit warned of concerning the falling away from the faith.

2 Thessalonians 2:3
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin (lawlessness) be revealed, the son of perdition;

If you follow the false teachings of preachers like Joseph Prince you also are going to follow the broad path that leads to perdition, or destruction.

Again..more complete nonsense. This has been posted many times to show the absolute lies and slander being spoken but we will post it again for any new people to see who is doing the real "twisting".

[h=1]Grace Preachers are Against God’s Law[/h]Some take this claim so far as to suggest that we even want to throw out or ignore the Old Testament. Wow! What wild imaginations these accusers have! The truth is that we are by no means antinomian (against the law of God), nor do we disbelieve or avoid teaching the Old Testament. Most of us actually esteem the power and purpose of God’s law so highly that we understand grace to be the only way of escape from its impossibly stringent demands.

Paul shared in Romans 3 and elsewhere that God’s purposes for the law were two-fold:

1) to stop our self-righteous excuses, minimizations and justifications of our sin and..

2) to reveal our desperate need of a Savior by grace through faith. The entire thrust of Jesus’ Sermon on the Mount was to bury His very self-righteous audience under the weight of one inescapable reality: “Unless your righteousness surpasses that of the world’s most stringent law-keepers (the Pharisees and teachers of the law) you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven” (Matt.5:20).

That Jesus came to “fulfill” the Law (Matt. 5:17) means that He came to keep its demands perfectly because He knew that we couldn’t and wouldn’t. He fulfilled the stringent demands of the Law on our behalf as our Substitute so that His record of perfection could be credited to our spiritual account when we received Him by grace through faith. He did what you and I couldn’t and wouldn’t, and the Sermon on the Mount is a damning indictment of anyone who thinks they can measure up to God’s standards on their own effort.

And have you heard of this “cheap grace” idea? Sometimes the term is ripped off and redefined from Bonhoeffer’s vocabulary to insinuate that the hyper-grace movement has cheapened the grace of God by making it “too easy” for people to attain. After all, we live in a world where there’s no such thingas a free lunch, right? We certainly don't believe or teach that grace is cheap. It cost Jesus His life! But we DO agree with the New Testament that His grace is FREE to those who receive it freely by faith.

The truth of the matter is that hyper-grace teachers are not guilty of promoting cheap grace at all. Rather, our critics are often guilty of promoting cheap Law! Far from being anti-law, WE are the ones who esteem God's Law so highly as to conclude that there is no escape from its condemnation apart from faith in Christ alone!

The Law is an all-or-nothing proposition. To stumble in just one aspect of keeping it is the equivalent of breaking all of it (James 2:10). The Law is a ministry of death and condemnation (2 Cor. 3:7-11). The Law is not the bad guy, however. It simply points out who the bad guys are (the world, the flesh and the devil)! The Law is holy and pure and designed to show us what sin is (Rom.7:7).

But living under Law cannot save, change or transform a single heart – only grace can! And this is why we are so adamant about never mixing a law-based mentality with a grace-based mentality toward spiritual life or growth under God’s New Covenant.

The New Testament repeatedly affirms that our salvation and sanctification are either completely by law or completely by grace, but cannot be a result of mixing the two.
[h=1]Conclusion:[/h]With all of that said, the idea of trying to somehow “balance grace” with anything is ludicrous according to both Scripture and plain reason. Grace, by definition, is radically IMBALANCED in our favor! If it were not, it would cease to be grace on that very basis! The term “hyper-grace” is far from insulting! It is in fact the ONLY kind of grace taught, supported and promoted in the Bible.

God understands that His grace is open to the possibility of abuse by those who might misunderstand it. He understands that people may take His grace for granted or even at times misrepresent it as a license to sin. Paul addressed those concerns very clearly, as did Jesus and the other New Testament writers.

Why I am Hyper-Grace: Answering Five Common Objections

 

[ladylynn]

Hello Ladylynn, have not seen you in the Bible study room for a while now. And I keep naming you as one of the "good" ones, who "get it" to people who are discouraged by the others.

HIIII Kimeworc!! Thank you for such sweet words of encouragement at this time especially! I got a promotion recently at work (thank you Jesus) so I've been making some changes to my CC time. Actually I was on the other night sis!! Let's make sure we don't miss each other again in the Bible study room.

It's been a while since I've gotten on the mic!! Thank you very much again for your kind words. I don't think we can ever get enough kind and encouraging words!! Love you sis!! ((((HUGS))))))

 

[eternally-gratefull]

​I got the whole fall from grace thing confused at one point until getting a hold of what having the grace of God implemented in my life really meant. There is an actual working out this sort of faith that brings with it many promises and blessings. When I began giving credit to Jesus for anything right that I was able to do or think, stuff began to change in my life.

Now when I go out into the world, I'm aware that my protection and safety are found in the fact that Jesus is my salvation. The promises are mine because of Him and not because of my ability to be good enough.

I've watched the Lord progressively show me how to walk in grace. I'm still learning but this has been a major turning point. I go out the door and know the car is there because of Jesus. The job I go to is because of Jesus. The new job I just was offered in August and have been working since Sept. are because of Jesus.

There is nothing that I have that is apart from Jesus. God loves me because of Jesus giving His righteousness to me. I can go to the Lord without hesitation because of Jesus. The other Bible truths I've known most of my life come alive because of this grace truth about Jesus. Acknowledging Him has caused Him to direct my path in life. There is a cause and effect with grace.

But it's not based on us it's based on the righteous standing Jesus has given to us. Acknowledging Jesus has opened doors of faith that I never had before. He teaches by encouragements as well. Leaning on the unmerited favor of God in Christ is the Gospel. It begins when we are saved Eph.2:8-9
[SUP]8 [/SUP]For it is by grace [God’s remarkable compassion and favor drawing you to Christ] that you have been saved [actually delivered from judgment and given eternal life] through faith. And this [salvation] is not of yourselves [not through your own effort], but it is the [undeserved, gracious] gift of God; [SUP]9 [/SUP]not as a result of [your] works [nor your attempts to keep the Law], so that no one will [be able to] boast or take credit in any way [for his salvation].

Then it continues the same way by grace through faith. I made the mistake once saved when I began moving into works through faith. I tried to gain favor and faith by working my way to Him. When I should have followed exactly the same as when I got saved. By GRACE through FAITH.

The Bible says once we were saved by grace through faith should we then try to work our way to God? NO. If we begin by grace through faith that is how we have to keep going. Or we do fall from grace.

Legalism, no matter which flavor, is damaging to the soul, to the gospel. and to the christian way of life.

It is satans greatest victory.

 

[eph610]

Right from the Joseph Prince play book.....Joseph Prince exposed, false teachings of Joseph Prince

Quote from article....

And here..... And here...

And here is one of my favs.... LOL!

Yea, Joseph Prince likes to bash the law of God, but mums the word when it comes to speaking out against sinful behavior.

Does anyone else think this is a tad bit off, or a bit strange?

Why would I need to preach and teach there is a hell to shun to mature believers who are world changers for the Kingdom and their fruit shows it?

 

[AuntieAnt]

LOL!

Yea, Joseph Prince likes to bash the law of God, but mums the word when it comes to speaking out against sinful behavior.

Does anyone else think this is a tad bit off, or a bit strange?

I think it's more than a tad bit off and a bit strange to think "sinful behavior" is even a thing for a Christian. We are crucified with Christ, and the Lord is the one keeping us and conforming us.

Are you under the impression your "sinless behavior" is what's keeping you in God's grace? So then at every single second of every single day in order to keep from hellfire, you must keep repenting over & over & over of any sinful thought or act?

What about this very second? Are you 100% free of "sinful behavior"? Doesn't that even sound odd to you?

 

[NarrowRoadDisciple]

I think it's more than a tad bit off and a bit strange to think "sinful behavior" is even a thing for a Christian. We are crucified with Christ, and the Lord is the one keeping us and conforming us.

Are you under the impression your "sinless behavior" is what's keeping you in God's grace? So then at every single second of every single day in order to keep from hellfire, you must keep repenting over & over & over of any sinful thought or act?

What about this very second? Are you 100% free of "sinful behavior"? Doesn't that even sound odd to you?

View attachment 159131

Why is it the first thing people do is equate sinless perfectionism with calling out false teachers or informing the brethren of sin that may be present? Aren't we called to help a brother in sin? Or aren't we called to help brothers who may be listening to and following a false teacher? This isn't about throwing a stone or judging someone, but instead, calling out error when error is present. That's not judgment. We also need to understand that teachers are held to a higher line of judgment by God. If they lead the sheep astray, it is a pretty awful thing. I would argue that helping the brethren walk from a false teacher is love. Sinless perfectionism is a heresy. No one is sinless, and if we claim we are sinless, the love of God is not in us.

Now onto InSpiritInTruth:
InSpiritInTruth, people sometimes don't want to get rid of their pet teachers. You have only been met by a brick wall with people who truly believe in these doctrines. They are many and numerous on these forums and also around the world. Many of us also understand that Joseph Prince has many false teachings. Do you think it's perhaps time to use a different method than posting a link exposing Joseph Prince? He is already exposed. Use scripture. Regardless of man's interpretation of the scripture, the Holy Spirit will not contradict Himself. If God has said it, it is truth, even if people rail against you.

 

[MessageOfTheCross]

All and every commandment is kept if the Believer is operating and understand "The Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus!" (Romans 8:2)

Majority of Christians are living under the "Law of Sin and Death." Very few Christians live in "The Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus."

There are seven great Laws outlined in the New Testament, all devised and created by God. They are:
1. The Law of God (Romans 7:22)
2. The Law of Sin and Death (Romans 7:23)
3. The Law of the Mind (Romans 7:23)
4. The Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus (Romans 8:2)
5. The Law of Faith (Romans 3:27)
6. The Law of Christ (Gal. 6:2); and,
7. The Law of Liberty (James 1:25)

 

[Grace777x70]

Why is it the first thing people do is equate sinless perfectionism with calling out false teachers or informing the brethren of sin that may be present? Aren't we called to help a brother in sin? Or aren't we called to help brothers who may be listening to and following a false teacher? This isn't about throwing a stone or judging someone, but instead, calling out error when error is present. That's not judgment. We also need to understand that teachers are held to a higher line of judgment by God. If they lead the sheep astray, it is a pretty awful thing. I would argue that helping the brethren walk from a false teacher is love. Sinless perfectionism is a heresy. No one is sinless, and if we claim we are sinless, the love of God is not in us.

Now onto InSpiritInTruth:
InSpiritInTruth, people sometimes don't want to get rid of their pet teachers. You have only been met by a brick wall with people who truly believe in these doctrines. They are many and numerous on these forums and also around the world. Many of us also understand that Joseph Prince has many false teachings. Do you think it's perhaps time to use a different method than posting a link exposing Joseph Prince? He is already exposed. Use scripture. Regardless of man's interpretation of the scripture, the Holy Spirit will not contradict Himself. If God has said it, it is truth, even if people rail against you.

Personally I don't agree with any teacher on every subject but as far as the gospel of the grace of Christ goes - Joseph Prince is right on. It may "conflict" with your religious beliefs from your own teachings or church affiliate.

But to say that Joseph Prince is a false teacher is spiritual ignorance gone to seed and he is no more a false teacher then you are one of the 2 witnesses in the book of Revelation. I do understand your "subtle" way of trying to make him look like a false teacher but many of us know the difference.

The gospel of the grace of Christ will prevail over man's traditions no matter how much they fight against it. Some people think that they are "defending the faith" but in reality they are just "defending their religious traditions".

 

[vic1980]

Isaiah 26:10 But when grace is shown to the wicked, they do not learn righteousness; even in a land of uprightness they go on doing evil and do not regard the majesty of the LORD.

This is evident in this generation, as it was when it was written.

Shalom

 

[AuntieAnt]

Why is it the first thing people do is equate sinless perfectionism with calling out false teachers or informing the brethren of sin that may be present? Aren't we called to help a brother in sin? Or aren't we called to help brothers who may be listening to and following a false teacher? This isn't about throwing a stone or judging someone, but instead, calling out error when error is present. That's not judgment. We also need to understand that teachers are held to a higher line of judgment by God. If they lead the sheep astray, it is a pretty awful thing. I would argue that helping the brethren walk from a false teacher is love. Sinless perfectionism is a heresy. No one is sinless, and if we claim we are sinless, the love of God is not in us.

Now onto InSpiritInTruth:
InSpiritInTruth, people sometimes don't want to get rid of their pet teachers. You have only been met by a brick wall with people who truly believe in these doctrines. They are many and numerous on these forums and also around the world. Many of us also understand that Joseph Prince has many false teachings. Do you think it's perhaps time to use a different method than posting a link exposing Joseph Prince? He is already exposed. Use scripture. Regardless of man's interpretation of the scripture, the Holy Spirit will not contradict Himself. If God has said it, it is truth, even if people rail against you.

There is nothing good in the carnal mind. But we have the mind of Christ.

If we have the mind of Christ, we are perfect spiritually because he is perfect.

We no longer walk according to the fleshly (carnal) mind, which cannot receive anything from God.

Yes, of course we struggle in our flesh but we will NEVER make our flesh right. It's a battle between will you believe Jesus or will you keep trying to change your flesh.

If you believe Jesus, you will continue to grow and be conformed in his image spiritually.

If you don't grasp that Jesus overcame your sinful flesh and put in you his mind and made you a new spiritual creation, you will keep striving with your outward man according to your own understanding.

 

[Grace777x70]

There is nothing good in the carnal mind. But we have the mind of Christ.

If we have the mind of Christ, we are perfect spiritually because he is perfect.

We no longer walk according to the fleshly (carnal) mind, which cannot receive anything from God.

Yes, of course we struggle in our flesh but we will NEVER make our flesh right. It's a battle between will you believe Jesus or will you keep trying to change your flesh.

If you believe Jesus, you will continue to grow and be conformed in his image spiritually.

If you don't grasp that Jesus overcame your sinful flesh and put in you his mind and made you a new spiritual creation, you will keep striving with your outward man according to your own understanding.

I agree 100%. Religion is in the "sin management" business. Christ is in the setting us free from sin business and until religion understands the new creation in Christ - they will be forever trying to "clean up the flesh" - and that is an impossible job.

 

[MessageOfTheCross]

God is moved by faith only! That faith must be exclusively in His Son Jesus and what He alone accomplished at Calvary. Faith in your deeds, performance, yourself, people, and anything else, etc., is sin. Why? Because it is worldliness. Worldliness means to leave God out of the equation. Worldliness voids the Cross (the power of God) immediately. Jesus says, "You can not do anything without me!" He says in Matthew 6:33, "the kingdom of God must be first and His righteousness." The scripture says the worlds wisdom voids the Cross immediately in a Believers life. 1 Corinthians 1:17

 

[Talishi]

We no longer walk according to the fleshly (carnal) mind, which cannot receive anything from God.

If faith is entirely the gift of God (not of ourselves that no man may boast) and
If the carnal mind cannot receive anything from God, and
If we all have carnal minds until justification, then
....no one can be justified.

 

[AuntieAnt]

If faith is entirely the gift of God (not of ourselves that no man may boast) and
If the carnal mind cannot receive anything from God, and
If we all have carnal minds until justification, then
....no one can be justified.

Romans 5:1
Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[ladylynn]

I heard it said like this; Religion is about trying to make bad men good., Jesus came to make dead men alive.

 

[UnderGrace]

Faith is not the gift from God, salvation is the gift!!!

If faith is entirely the gift of God (not of ourselves that no man may boast) and
If the carnal mind cannot receive anything from God, and
If we all have carnal minds until justification, then
....no one can be justified.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Joseph Prince is right on. It may "conflict" with your religious beliefs from your own teachings or church affiliate.

Teachings of Joseph Prince....

39-God didn’t unconditionally protect rebellious sinners in the Old Testament who were bitten by serpents but He will unconditionally protect rebellious sinners (“Christians”) in the New Testament

source....http://safeguardyoursoul.com/joseph-prince-exposed/

I guess that's why "rebellious sinners" like yourself love his teachings and say they are "right on!" ROFL!!!

 

[Talishi]

Faith is not the gift from God, salvation is the gift!!!

Hebrews 11:1 declares that faith is evidence of things not seen. So how can faith not be a gift from God?

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God.

1 Cor 12:8-9 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit; to another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit...