pauls design in truth

[followjesus]

Why does this make you think Paul wasn't sure?

1 Corinthians 9:25-26
25 And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible.
26 I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:

because paul knew better than to judge, when Jesus is the judge come judgement day. so paul lived His life as did all the followers of Jesus.

ephesians 5:10- 17 "(for the fruit of the light consists in all goodness, righteousness and truth) 10and find out what pleases the Lord. 11Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them. 12It is shameful even to mention what the disobedient do in secret. 13But everything exposed by the light becomes visible—and everything that is illuminated becomes a light. 14This is why it is said:“Wake up, sleeper,
rise from the dead,
and Christ will shine on you.”

15Be very careful, then, how you live—not as unwise but as wise, 16making the most of every opportunity, because the days are evil. 17Therefore do not be foolish, but understand what the Lord’s will is. "

what is it that clears a conscience in christ? should anyone presume that weve done enough that we have payed for Jesus Life? paul wasnt God, wasnt Jesus. all judgement was Given to Christ. to assume well face Him and hell say " well done my good and faithful servant" while we spend L;ife claiming we arent reqwuired to serve faithfully, what sense does that make? the finished work doctrine, is a twist. who we are now, and all we can do now is based on the foundation of what Jesus did, just as He fulfilled the Law, we are to fulfill the gospel in our lives. He obeyed God, we are to obey Him. paul was wise is why he spent His life pressing forward in the hope of attaining to the resurrection, he didnt live it saying he is already perfect. but pressed forward to attain to what He had already received, " the righteousness that is " credited " by faith.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

actually no, its about whether or not we who receive Gods true Grace, are willing to honor Jesus who died to Give us hope and Life. its the difference between saying I belong to Jesus, who is the Lord" and saying Jesus died so i dont need to honor him, if i need to honor Him, then its not grace. HUGE difference. one is the doctrine of Jesus, the other is to omit the gospel, saying it applies to others, to omit repentance, eternal Judgement, the responsability to honor Jesus with every part of our Lives because He gave all His blood to redeem us from death.

Can you please show me one person who had true saving faith, Who understood completely his or her plight against God. Who knew, apart from Jesus they were headed straight to hell, would not pass go or collect 200 dollars. but straight to hell, after all their works were tried. And experienced the true newbirth of Jesus because of their complete faith in Christ, and giving their eternity to him. Would have NO DESIRE TO PLEASE THE ONE WHO SAVED THEM?

I am sorry, But this excuse that a man or woman can be saved, then have no desire to please the God who saved them from eternal damnation which they admit and acknowledge they rightfully deserve, is just crazy talk, Anyone who claims they were saved, and has no desire to please God. They have never been saved, Faith produces action. It does not produce armchair Christianity. The people who sit on their behinds and do nothing are the people who have never met God..

 

[followjesus]

lol.. Nice try.

Paul said no one can judge another person. We will all be judged by God. It does not mean we do not have eternal life now. Jesus said we do, John said we do. Do you want to argue with Jesus?

The believer is not condemned already, those are the words of Christ, Yes they will be judged, at the BEMA seat. where their work will be tried by fire, and they will be rewarded. Gold silver precious stone, Wood hay and stubble,,

The non believer, he is condemned already, If he is not saved, by repenting and coming to christ, He will be delivered to Jesus at the great white throne judgment. His works will be tried, and he will be found lacking (because our works can not save us) and since he rejected the salvation of Christ, he will be swent to eternal darkness, ther will be weepeing and gnashing of teeth.

No unsaved person will be at the bema seat trial, No saved person will be at the great white throne trial.

I can not judge your salvation, You can not judge mine, Only God can, That is what paul was saying.. PERIOD!

nice ommital.

who will receive eternal life"

galatians 6:7-8 "Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life."

is sowing not to work? or again
romans 2:7-8 "To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.8But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger"

you suppose pauls letter is adressed to unbelievers lol. lets see who He addresses it to

romans 1 5-7 "Through him we received grace and apostleship to call all the Gentiles to the obedience that comes from[SUP]c[/SUP] faith for his name’s sake. 6And you also are among those Gentiles who are called to belong to Jesus Christ.7To all in Rome who are loved by God and called to be his holy people:Grace and peace to you from God our Father and from the Lord Jesus Christ."

to all in rome loved by God and called to be his holy people. unbelievers? or was this letter wt=ritten to the vhurch at rome? as all of pauls letters, they are written to the church. believing and not doing will condemn, believing and doing will save having proven sincerity of faith.

matthew 7:21-27 "Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!24“Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock. 25The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house; yet it did not fall, because it had its foundation on the rock. 26But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand. 27The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house, and it fell with a great crash.”"

whats the differnce? those who are rejected prophesied in Jesus name, drove out demons and performed miracles. OBVIOUSLY they believed, the differnce is they did not do His will. the same principle in matthew 25 31-46

“When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.34“Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’37“Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’40“The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’41“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’44“They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’45“He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’46“Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”


its best to Just see what God is saying and accept it. there is a rewuiorement to do what Jesus says, because He died for us, even beforehand, just like abraham was credited righteousness, and then he did what God commanded. but im gonna bow out, always get into the same argument.

2 different doctrines one is to say to him lord lord, the other is to do His will because He is Lord

 

[Grandpa]

because paul knew better than to judge, when Jesus is the judge come judgement day. so paul lived His life as did all the followers of Jesus.

ephesians 5:10- 17 "(for the fruit of the light consists in all goodness, righteousness and truth) 10and find out what pleases the Lord. 11Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them. 12It is shameful even to mention what the disobedient do in secret. 13But everything exposed by the light becomes visible—and everything that is illuminated becomes a light. 14This is why it is said:“Wake up, sleeper,
rise from the dead,
and Christ will shine on you.”

15Be very careful, then, how you live—not as unwise but as wise, 16making the most of every opportunity, because the days are evil. 17Therefore do not be foolish, but understand what the Lord’s will is. "

what is it that clears a conscience in christ? should anyone presume that weve done enough that we have payed for Jesus Life? paul wasnt God, wasnt Jesus. all judgement was Given to Christ. to assume well face Him and hell say " well done my good and faithful servant" while we spend L;ife claiming we arent reqwuired to serve faithfully, what sense does that make? the finished work doctrine, is a twist. who we are now, and all we can do now is based on the foundation of what Jesus did, just as He fulfilled the Law, we are to fulfill the gospel in our lives. He obeyed God, we are to obey Him. paul was wise is why he spent His life pressing forward in the hope of attaining to the resurrection, he didnt live it saying he is already perfect. but pressed forward to attain to what He had already received, " the righteousness that is " credited " by faith.

Is that the same Paul who wrote this;

Ephesians 2:4-10
[FONT=&quot]4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

That looks like a totally different picture than the one you are trying to paint.

If Salvation is a gift of God and not of works what, exactly, was Paul working towards??? I don't think you understand Paul at all.

Why is it that you don't capitalize his name? [/FONT]

 

[followjesus]

Can you please show me one person who had true saving faith, Who understood completely his or her plight against God. Who knew, apart from Jesus they were headed straight to hell, would not pass go or collect 200 dollars. but straight to hell, after all their works were tried. And experienced the true newbirth of Jesus because of their complete faith in Christ, and giving their eternity to him. Would have NO DESIRE TO PLEASE THE ONE WHO SAVED THEM?

I am sorry, But this excuse that a man or woman can be saved, then have no desire to please the God who saved them from eternal damnation which they admit and acknowledge they rightfully deserve, is just crazy talk, Anyone who claims they were saved, and has no desire to please God. They have never been saved, Faith produces action. It does not produce armchair Christianity. The people who sit on their behinds and do nothing are the people who have never met God..

lol so faith without works is dead then?

 

[followjesus]

lol so faith without works is dead then?

and theres a differnce in desiring to please God, and actually doing what His will is because of that desire. faith is to believe, and do. thats the whole point. so why is it an offense, when someone is pointing out "do the will of God rather than say i have faith? i have never understood why this group returns time and again to any post regarding obeying Jesus, and then after awhile " im not saying you dont have to obey" you do have to repent of sin, and obey. are we now to the point where " if your really saved you will" but you dont need to obey ? its a circle and the reason i again bow out of this one........

 

[Talishi]

Why does this make you think Paul wasn't sure?

Paul was saying he tried to master his own passions so his journey to the glory of eternal life wouldn't be a drunken tumble down a mountain. It's the use of the word "disqualified" that makes me think he didn't feel like he had eternal security.

 

[Talishi]

who will receive eternal life

Romans 2:

[6] [God] will render to every man according to his deeds:
[7] To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
[8] But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath

 

[followjesus]

Is that the same Paul who wrote this;

Ephesians 2:4-10
4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved
6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

That looks like a totally different picture than the one you are trying to paint.

If Salvation is a gift of God and not of works what, exactly, was Paul working towards??? I don't think you understand Paul at all.

Why is it that you don't capitalize his name?

it is the same paul lol thats the point because He says "when we were dead in sins" he forgave us, thats my whole point. he forgave us for sins commir=ted under the old covenant. and also " we are created to DO the good works. im the first to say its all grace, grace was shown on the cross, we honor it. by learning how to Love others as commanded. simple. and you make a good point, because paul is saying grace, yet He is so adament about how we live our lives , ridding our lives of all impuruty, and being imitators of God, should tell you all that were not supposed to say "grace grace" and all is now well. but we are to repent of sin NOW, because were forgiven for our previous life of sin, and then obey God. we dont see a scriptures saying were saved by Grace, and then omit the far more concerning how we Live, and the many many warnings for those who do not repent and do right. by Grace, through Faith. created TO DO Good works. and what of those who refuse to do those works?

 

[mpaper345]

1Co 9:27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

adokimos
ad-ok'-ee-mos
From G1 (as a negative particle) and G1384; unapproved, that is, rejected; by implication worthless (literally or morally): - castaway, rejected, reprobate.

 

[Grandpa]

Paul was saying he tried to master his own passions so his journey to the glory of eternal life wouldn't be a drunken tumble down a mountain. It's the use of the word "disqualified" that makes me think he didn't feel like he had eternal security.

Paul knew that his Salvation was a gift. I would think the only thing he could be disqualified for was maybe preaching if he was found to be a hypocrite. Saying he was righteous but then showing something different.

But I see how you could take his words to mean it the way you said.

There has got to be a reason for keeping a careful leash on this flesh of ours. Especially if we know we are forgiven and the Lord loves us and He has given us Salvation. Not to attain, but because It has already been freely given.

 

[Grace777x70]

Philippians 2:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] for it is God who is at work in you, both to will and to work for His good pleasure.

Philippians 1:6 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] For I am confident of this very thing, that He who began a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Christ Jesus.

 

[followjesus]

Paul was saying he tried to master his own passions so his journey to the glory of eternal life wouldn't be a drunken tumble down a mountain. It's the use of the word "disqualified" that makes me think he didn't feel like he had eternal security.

he didnt, if he had, his sin would have ruled Him, thats human nature, instead He spent His life pressing forward toward the goal. not claiming He was already perfect. he says that over and over again. if a person feels like God rewuires nothing, we will make His things an afterthought like many do. the warnings are true, and thier design is to Keep us moving toward the gosl of perfection in Jesus, though none are perfect, we never should think the work is already done, that breeds complacency and that is the devils playground. Gods word should always be most important.

 

[Grandpa]

it is the same paul lol thats the point because He says "when we were dead in sins" he forgave us, thats my whole point. he forgave us for sins commir=ted under the old covenant. and also " we are created to DO the good works. im the first to say its all grace, grace was shown on the cross, we honor it. by learning how to Love others as commanded. simple. and you make a good point, because paul is saying grace, yet He is so adament about how we live our lives , ridding our lives of all impuruty, and being imitators of God, should tell you all that were not supposed to say "grace grace" and all is now well. but we are to repent of sin NOW, because were forgiven for our previous life of sin, and then obey God. we dont see a scriptures saying were saved by Grace, and then omit the far more concerning how we Live, and the many many warnings for those who do not repent and do right. by Grace, through Faith. created TO DO Good works. and what of those who refuse to do those works?

You aren't getting it.

At all.

You are going back to what Paul is preaching against.

Is that why you don't capitalize his name? Because you know you do him a dis-service?

 

[followjesus]

Paul knew that his Salvation was a gift. I would think the only thing he could be disqualified for was maybe preaching if he was found to be a hypocrite. Saying he was righteous but then showing something different.

But I see how you could take his words to mean it the way you said.

There has got to be a reason for keeping a careful leash on this flesh of ours. Especially if we know we are forgiven and the Lord loves us and He has given us Salvation. Not to attain, but because It has already been freely given.

jeep a careful leash ? or put this flesh of ours to death? i think you know the answer to that. keeping a leash wouldnt be belonging to christ.

galatians 5:24 "Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires." now think of what happens when a person follows Jesus teachings ? think if we are to "deny ourselves, pick up our cross and follow Him? Jesus is saying the same thing, crucify your sinful human nature with its passions and desires. this is only accomplished by Faith in His word faith in His word, is to accept and follow the commands and principles taught in the gospel. its right before you

 

[Grandpa]

jeep a careful leash ? or put this flesh of ours to death? i think you know the answer to that. keeping a leash wouldnt be belonging to christ.

galatians 5:24 "Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires." now think of what happens when a person follows Jesus teachings ? think if we are to "deny ourselves, pick up our cross and follow Him? Jesus is saying the same thing, crucify your sinful human nature with its passions and desires. this is only accomplished by Faith in His word faith in His word, is to accept and follow the commands and principles taught in the gospel. its right before you

I was talking to Talishi. And I think she understands exactly what I meant.

I would have entirely different words for you. Because I don't think you do understand.

 

[followjesus]

You aren't getting it.

At all.

You are going back to what Paul is preaching against.

Is that why you don't capitalize his name? Because you know you do him a dis-service?

lol Iget it just fine, why can i say that? because i take Jesus word for the truth, He is the truth who says " obey me" hear my commands and keep them" thats how i know the truth, i trust Jesus to speak it, and He does, and it works. why do i believe Him? because i believe that He is Gods Son, sent into the world to die to release me from my life before, i know he loves me enough to die, so therefore i believe His word that says "come, follow me" simple what i get and why i get it, its available to all men and women made plain. thr truth from God sent through His Son Jesus the Christ

 

[followjesus]

I was talking to Talishi. And I think she understands exactly what I meant.

I would have entirely different words for you. Because I don't think you do understand.

im good with that.

 

[followjesus]

You aren't getting it.

At all.

You are going back to what Paul is preaching against.

Is that why you don't capitalize his name? Because you know you do him a dis-service?

lol do you think paul would preach against Jesus? you guys amaze me sometimes with the blindness found in "the gospel of grace" but i think were at 2 different places, so for the sake of remaining out of the same argument that bruce always used to bring, ill add you to the ignore list in order to keep peace and let you guys follow unwarranted favor. its puzzling why your group always ends up on my posts, then oi notice every post about obeying god, there are the same people telling the person advocating doing What Jesus says, that they dont get it


to me, it rings of the serpent in the Garden. God says one thing, he says nah.....thats not right, but hey, thats just me i suppose.

 

[Grandpa]

lol Iget it just fine, why can i say that? because i take Jesus word for the truth, He is the truth who says " obey me" hear my commands and keep them" thats how i know the truth, i trust Jesus to speak it, and He does, and it works. why do i believe Him? because i believe that He is Gods Son, sent into the world to die to release me from my life before, i know he loves me enough to die, so therefore i believe His word that says "come, follow me" simple what i get and why i get it, its available to all men and women made plain. thr truth from God sent through His Son Jesus the Christ

Come, Follow me.

Where?

John 6:63 [FONT=&quot]It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

[/FONT]And now Paul. With a capital P.

Galatians 3:2-3
[FONT=&quot]2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?[/FONT]