well, by grace we are saved... we agree there.
Does God save everybody in the world, then? or do certain people access his grace, and others don't?
Ask a "Messianic/Hebrew Rooter" (AMA)
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well, by grace we are saved... we agree there.
Does God save everybody in the world, then? or do certain people access his grace, and others don't?
[FONT="]Romans 10:9-10
"that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;[/FONT][FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation."[/FONT]
Obedience to any instruction in Scripture (including the Torah) should be a response to the salvation given to us; not a means to obtain it or keep it. Instructions in Scripture are meant to show us how to live in a practical way.
in your view, does the passage say how torah-keeping relates to salvation?
or is torah-keeping even mentioned?
well, I'm confused about your views, then...
if if torah-keeping not a means to obtain salvation
or keep it
why were you uncertain about
Torah-keeping doesn't relate to salvation, just the same as obedience or lack thereof to any instructions in the NT doesn't. That's why obedience isn't mentioned in that passage.
I see a difference in breaking a command or disobedience to one of God's commands as different from "knowingly, willfully, flagrantly, and carelessly" disregarding a commandment. It seems like there's 2 different attitudes towards God there.
if torah-keeping doesn't in any way relate to keeping one's salvation, then how does willfully disregarding a commandment from torah put one in danger of losing one's salvation?
Like I said, I see a difference between disregarding one, and willfully disregarding all. But again, I'm not going to make that call for anybody else.
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
just so I do not misread you.
It is ok if we break one, but if we break them all we are doomed?
yes, similar to what eternally-grateful asked... willfully disregarding one is OK?
Apparently, you don't like my answers thus far. So what's your take on the topic? How does willfully disregarding a command in the NT affect our salvation? If you willfully choose to hate your neighbor and withhold love from him, what happens in your relationship with God?
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LaurenTM
Guest
maybe introducing forgiveness and what Jesus said about leaving your gift at the altar?
and what about not just forgiving, but forgiving from the heart?
I'm going through Hebrews right now and honestly, there is no room for law keeping if you trust in Jesus and that does not mean breaking commandments
it means understanding there is nothing you can add to what your Savior has done for there is no sacrifice but His that is acceptable to God the Father
throwing this out to anyone
answers from the heart?
and what about not just forgiving, but forgiving from the heart?
I'm going through Hebrews right now and honestly, there is no room for law keeping if you trust in Jesus and that does not mean breaking commandments
it means understanding there is nothing you can add to what your Savior has done for there is no sacrifice but His that is acceptable to God the Father
throwing this out to anyone
answers from the heart?
our heart-felt sacrifice to Him is leaving our gift of thankfulness at His altar, accepting His Holy gift and
only desiring to enter into His state of Grace, this is what is pleasing to God,
our following Jesus' example...
only desiring to enter into His state of Grace, this is what is pleasing to God,
our following Jesus' example...
P
pottersclay
Guest
There is no condemnation for those in Christ Jesus...conviction yes...condemnation no.
The law condemns you the holy spirit convicts you.
Man without the holy spirit cannot keep the law, without Christ no way.
Jesus in Matt 5 talks about the law being issues of the heart. "You have heard it said but I say to you" he didn't change the law but corrected those who were taught wrong about it.
To put the law in perspective it's not rules you need to follow but a life you should lead in Christ.
Love the Lord your God with everything you have, some profess they do. But do they, would you like to be tested on it?
Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy. Jesus is our Sabbath, hopefully there is no one like him in your life. He should be above all things in your life. His finished work is perfect and needs no add ons. Your thoughts toward him should be the same as his thoughts towards you ..precious.
Do not murder..that's easy I never killed anyone you might say...do you harbor ill feelings about someone? do you gossip about them? Do you think there useless? Are you praying wrath on them?......
Adultery...well never cheated on my spouse....ever check another one out from the neck down? Do you occasionally visits a certain site on the net? Ever cheat on God? (We are the bride ya know).
Just a few examples and some will say it's not the law it's the commandments..and the point?
Untill we are born again the sin nature in all will flourish. As the Lord said to Cain " sin lays at your door step" go and do that which is right. Did he...ask Abel.
Many times I've seen the teaching of the rich young ruler here in the bdf but always fail to see imo the most important thing asked...." what do I lack".....do you ask jesus this? Or do you think you've arrived?
A perfect law by a perfect God...dividing Jew and gentiles should never be imo...for the perfect one has come to lay it to rest in his perfect work.
The law condemns you the holy spirit convicts you.
Man without the holy spirit cannot keep the law, without Christ no way.
Jesus in Matt 5 talks about the law being issues of the heart. "You have heard it said but I say to you" he didn't change the law but corrected those who were taught wrong about it.
To put the law in perspective it's not rules you need to follow but a life you should lead in Christ.
Love the Lord your God with everything you have, some profess they do. But do they, would you like to be tested on it?
Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy. Jesus is our Sabbath, hopefully there is no one like him in your life. He should be above all things in your life. His finished work is perfect and needs no add ons. Your thoughts toward him should be the same as his thoughts towards you ..precious.
Do not murder..that's easy I never killed anyone you might say...do you harbor ill feelings about someone? do you gossip about them? Do you think there useless? Are you praying wrath on them?......
Adultery...well never cheated on my spouse....ever check another one out from the neck down? Do you occasionally visits a certain site on the net? Ever cheat on God? (We are the bride ya know).
Just a few examples and some will say it's not the law it's the commandments..and the point?
Untill we are born again the sin nature in all will flourish. As the Lord said to Cain " sin lays at your door step" go and do that which is right. Did he...ask Abel.
Many times I've seen the teaching of the rich young ruler here in the bdf but always fail to see imo the most important thing asked...." what do I lack".....do you ask jesus this? Or do you think you've arrived?
A perfect law by a perfect God...dividing Jew and gentiles should never be imo...for the perfect one has come to lay it to rest in his perfect work.
K
kaylagrl
Guest
Oh my land! I finally rep-ed enough to get back to ya. Then I couldn't find you so I had to track down your posts. lol I became a CC detective.
GALATIANS 5:14 For the whole law is fulfilled in one word: You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
if you continually, willfully hate your brother, who you have seen,
you never did believe that God, who you haven't seen, incarnated and died for you.