Verse for "once saved always saved"?

[Chester]

But when the kindness of God our Saviour, and His love towards man appeared, not by works done in righteousness which we did ourselves, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, which He poured out upon us richly through Christ Jesus our Saviour, that being justified by His grace we might be made heirs according to the assured hope of eternal life. (Titus 3.4-7).

Of course salvation is by God's mercy, not by our works. We are saved by God's grace and mercy, and that is how we stay saved.

But again I don't see this text saying clearly and directly that once a person is saved that he will always be saved. If one assumes it is a Scriptural truth that salvation cannot be lost, then of course that can be read into this verse.

I am looking for the verse that clearly gives the presupposition that once a person is saved (by believing in Jesus) that he will always continue to believe (stay saved).

 

[Chester]

Psalm 37:28 - For the Lord loves justice, And does not forsake His saints; They are preserved forever, But the descendants of the wicked shall be cut off.

No argument with what the text says: His saints are preserved forever! Amen and Amen - 100% amen!

But the unbeliever is not preserved forever! The promise is to those that believe (are his saints).

I don't see that the text says that once a person is a saint that he will be a saint forever. The promise is that a person who is a saint (is believing in Jesus) can know that he will be "preserved forever". As the New Testament says - believe in Christ and you have the gift of eternal life: but the one who does not believe does not have eternal life.

 

[Chester]

I am saddened by the amount of people who think they are more powerful than God. and can "pluck themselves" out of his hands, When God said plainly, NO ONE IS ABLE TO DO THAT.

Of course, if people truly experienced the love of God, and saw the riches of his blessings being poured out. THEY WOULD NEVER WANT TO LEAVE.. so thus begs the question, Why do they think ANYONE would want to leave, and return back to the world they begged on their knees to be brought out of?

I believe very adamantly just as John 10:27-29 say: the sheep who are hearing God's voice and who are following Him -- they have eternal life and will never perish and no man (including themselves) can pluck them out of God's hand. The promises apply for the sheep: they don't apply to the person who is not believing - who is not a sheep.

I love your thought in the last paragraph:

Of course, if people truly experienced the love of God, and saw the riches of his blessings being poured out. THEY WOULD NEVER WANT TO LEAVE.. so thus begs the question, Why do they think ANYONE would want to leave, and return back to the world they begged on their knees to be brought out of

I can't either figure out why anyone would want to leave - I know I surely do not want to or intend to - and yet I know that in me is the moral capability to do just that!

 

[Chester]

same difference really. a passage sayign salvation can be lost would prove your point would it not?

And many of those so called verses have been shown.. have they not?

Yes, a passage that clearly said that salvation can be lost would by definition also prove that OSAS is wrong.

But, are you going to agree that any Scripture says this? Hmmmm!!!!

But if there is no verse that clearly states either truth, then we are left to decide from what we believe the Scriptures as a whole teach. And I do not want to add as dogmatic doctrinal truth something that Scripture does not clearly say.

What I do know clearly is that the one who is believing in Christ has the promise of eternal life. The one who is not believing does not have eternal life. I will leave it at that.

 

[88]

It does talk about having your name blotted out of the Book of Life---- could be a warning...personally I think it hard to lose salvation----don't really want to find out either...

 

[Chester]

It does talk about having your name blotted out of the Book of Life---- could be a warning...personally I think it hard to lose salvation----don't really want to find out either...

Amen and amen!!

 

[Greek2Me]

While I understand the "landmine", it is important to understand that new Christians are coming up every day (to His glory), and each will need to work through many of the doctrines that older Christians have settled long ago. Patience all...

 

[stonesoffire]

Despite years of Bible study and talking to many people, I have not yet had anyone show me a verse that clearly says "once saved, always saved?" Is there such a verse in the Bible, or is the doctrine of eternal security a conclusion from study of Scriptural themes and principles?

2Ti 2:13 If we believe not, yethe abideth faithful: he cannotdeny himself.

 

[FlSnookman7]

Maybe instead of trying to prove something the bible does not say we should think about why some are so worried about losing their salvation in the first place. What is it that causes someone to worry about losing salvation instead of believing in what Jesus did at the cross?

Is it a case of someone being fed lies so that their priest or pastor can maintain control over them? Jesus offers freedom from bondage, do not allow those with an agenda to steal your freedom. Have faith!

 

[stonesoffire]

It does talk about having your name blotted out of the Book of Life---- could be a warning...personally I think it hard to lose salvation----don't really want to find out either...

Could the book of life just be a book where all births are recorded? I tend to think this because His death was for the whole world, but if not received at our death, we would be blotted out. ?

 

[Grandpa]

Ephesians 2:8 [FONT=&quot]For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [/FONT][FONT=&quot]it is the gift of God:[/FONT][FONT=&quot]

Romans 11:29 [/FONT] [FONT=&quot]For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

1 Peter 1:3-5
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.


[/FONT]

 

[mailmandan]

No argument with what the text says: His saints are preserved forever! Amen and Amen - 100% amen!

But the unbeliever is not preserved forever! The promise is to those that believe (are his saints).

I don't see that the text says that once a person is a saint that he will be a saint forever. The promise is that a person who is a saint (is believing in Jesus) can know that he will be "preserved forever". As the New Testament says - believe in Christ and you have the gift of eternal life: but the one who does not believe does not have eternal life.

His saints are preserved forever. What is the point of a saint being "preserved" by God if a saint can become a non-saint all over again? Does God only preserve those who preserve themselves?

 

[Chester]

2Ti 2:13 If we believe not, yethe abideth faithful: he cannotdeny himself.

Without more explanation, I wonder what your thinking is on this verse?

Do you think it means that an unbeliever will get to heaven?

I think it means simply that if we do not believe in God, that does not negate that He is still a God who rewards and is faithful to those who do believe in Him.

 

[Chester]

Maybe instead of trying to prove something the bible does not say we should think about why some are so worried about losing their salvation in the first place. What is it that causes someone to worry about losing salvation instead of believing in what Jesus did at the cross?

Is it a case of someone being fed lies so that their priest or pastor can maintain control over them? Jesus offers freedom from bondage, do not allow those with an agenda to steal your freedom. Have faith!

Hey! I like what you have to say here! I am in complete agreement that there is absolutely no need to worry about losing your salvation. The answer to worry/fear/dread/doubt is to hang onto Christ and believe in Him!

Amen and amen!

 

[Chester]

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Romans 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

1 Peter 1:3-5
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,
5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

No argument with any of the verses here:

Ephesians 2:8 says very clearly that salvation is by grace through faith: it is a gift from God -- Amen and amen!

Romans 11:29 is speaking about the love of God for Israel. He is not throwing out the people whom he has called and loved, even though they as a nation have not believed. - Amen and amen

I Peter 1:5 highlights that God keeps us by His power (not by the works that we do) as we have faith in Him. - Amen and amen!

But I don't see here that a person who is not believing (having faith) will be saved. Nor do I see a clear statement that once a person believes in Christ that he will always continue to believe in Christ.

 

[Chester]

His saints are preserved forever. What is the point of a saint being "preserved" by God if a saint can become a non-saint all over again? Does God only preserve those who preserve themselves?

You ask two questions:

(1) What is the point of a saint being "preserved" by God if a saint can become a non-saint all over again?

The point is that a saint needs the power of God to stay preserved. Nothing we can do can preserve us!

(2) Does God only preserve those who preserve themselves?

God only preserves those who believe.

We cannot preserve ourselves, anymore than putting strawberries in the freezer makes them preserves! LOL!

 

[Grace777x70]

I firmly believe in eternal security of the believer that is in Christ. I also can see the many warnings in the life for those that live according to the flesh too.

Take up shooting heroin in your arms and you will see very quickly how death will come to us. Same for eating so much until we are so obese we have a heart attack.

Notice that Paul says "after" you were believing when we heard the message of Christ - you were sealed with the Holy Spirit.

Ephesians 1:13 (NASB)
[SUP]13 [/SUP] In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,

You were sealed is in the Greek Aorist Indicative tense - passive voice - which means it was a one time act in the past - completed and this act was done to you - we didn't do it to ourselves.


How does one "unseal" themselves from the Holy Spirit? - by an act of their own will? Can we as an act of our own will un-born ourselves as a human?

Can someone by an "act of their will" un-born themselves from being a human being?

Can they one day say "I don't want to be a human anymore so I as an act of my will - I am un-born myself" ( we would think there is something wrong with this person's mind )

Can some one by "an act of their will" stop being a son/daughter to someone? Of course not - they will always be the child of their parents whether they like it or not.

We can no more by "an act of our will" un-born ourselves from God which Peter says we are born again of incorruptible seed which lies and abides forever. We cannot "un-child" ourselves from being God's child because of Jesus Christ.

( we can become sick in our minds as the person that wants to "un-born" themselves as a human but the real us - the inner man of the heart that is in Christ - that inner man has his will entwined with God's perfect will because of union with Christ )

This is one of the reasons we need to "renew our mind" to align up with the spiritual truths that are in our new spirit in Christ.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Yes, a passage that clearly said that salvation can be lost would by definition also prove that OSAS is wrong.

But, are you going to agree that any Scripture says this? Hmmmm!!!!

But if there is no verse that clearly states either truth, then we are left to decide from what we believe the Scriptures as a whole teach. And I do not want to add as dogmatic doctrinal truth something that Scripture does not clearly say.

What I do know clearly is that the one who is believing in Christ has the promise of eternal life. The one who is not believing does not have eternal life. I will leave it at that.

I agree. it does not actually say either word for word (Although to me ETERNAL LIFE is about as close as you can get)

I will add though, that whoever does not believe is condemned already..

A person who has faith in a god who will never let the down, does not just all of a sudden stop having faith, They may lack faith. but to come to the point where they deny Christ? That will never happen.

And that IS in scripture in 1 john, concerning an antichrist, who denys christ. (which is what a non believer is)

 

[valiant]

Verse 37 says that the one "coming" (present tense = ongoing action) to the Father will not be cast out.
This is an absolute 100% truth - a beautiful promise. It says nothing about the person who is knowingly, ongoingly rejecting Christ -- the promise of verse 37 does not apply to such a person.

The verse uses a simple present. It is not talking of 'going on coming' but each individual as he comes, and WHY he comes. Those who were given to Him were those who come to Him. The promise is that they would not be left open to reject Him. They come to Him because they are irresistibly drawn. The promise applies to all Who come to Him

If one has already decided the Bible teaches "once saved, always saved", then I could see how verse 38 could be interpreted as meaning this. But if one comes without this presupposition, then this verse does not even come close to saying that "once a person is saved they will always be saved".

you mean you are trying to dodge the obvious. They will not be allowed to be lost because their shepherd is their keeper. it is as plain as daylight. (Oh sorry you are in the dark).

It says that the will of the Father is that everything that He has given to the Son - that of this the Son should lose nothing . . ." What has He given to the Son? Probably the ones "coming to him" in verse 37. Surely it does not include those who are openly ongoingly rejecting Christ.

But the latter have not come to Him. So they are not included,

I am looking for a verse that clearly says that once a person has believed in Christ and been born again, that it is impossible for him to stop believing in Christ.

well you've been given it!!!!!

I believe Scripture is clear that the one who believes is saved and the one who does not believe is not saved.

that is true, because only the one who believes will be saved.

These verses talk about the blessing and the security of the one who is believing in Christ. This security does not belong to the one who is not believing in Christ.

The blessing and security of the one believing in Christ, AMEN, He alone is eternally saved.

But if you want to say that Jesus Christ is not telling the truth that is up to you. To me 'I should lose NOTHING' is perfectly clear,

 

[eternally-gratefull]

It does talk about having your name blotted out of the Book of Life---- could be a warning...personally I think it hard to lose salvation----don't really want to find out either...

I beieve everyones name is in the book of life, if they die in unbelief (unsaved) then their name is blotted out.