Did Christ do enough to save us?

[DiscipleDave]

Disciple Dave wasn't it you who said that you don't sin anymore or am I mistaken in saying that?

There was a man that had an infirmity for 38 years. Jesus healed him, and told him

Joh 5:14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.

Do you think after hearing those words from Jesus, and being sick for 38 years, that he was going to start living in sin again? i am like that man. i do all things to please Jesus Christ. i do not knowingly or willingly commit any sin.

There is no sin that you do that you can't cease from, not a one. Therefore the question is, why are you not ceasing from them? Those who love to sin, will not cease to sin.
i love Jesus Christ so much, i have given him my life. literally, i am His slave, i do all things to please my Lord Jesus Christ. Every temptation that comes my way, He helps me to overcome them.

Now What? because you don't think it is possible, i must be lying? Jesus gave His life for me, therefore i have given my life for Him. i listen to the Bible 8 hours a day at work, pray going to and from work. i have no Cable, satalite, or the like. i do have netflix and like watching Jesus movies, Bible stuff, and occasionally Frasier. i abhor satan, he is the enemy of my Lord and Savior, i will NOT obey the Lord's enemy when he comes tempting me. All sin is selfishness, if i give my life to Him, it is no longer my life, but His to do with as He sees fit. Jesus Christ is on my mind every waking minute of the day. Christian Stickers all over my car, Jesus pictures on every wall in my house, Shirts that i wear, all testify of Jesus, except my work shirts, Music that i do listen to every so often is Christian or oldies, wear a ring that says Jesus, wear a cross necklace. i do all those things to help me keep my mind and thoughts on HIM all day long. i do not give satan time or place in my life. i have been called a Jesus Freak not a little. Which i confirm that i am. If i give place one little bit in my life. satan will devour me, and eat me up. Therefore i don't give him any foothold in my life. i do all things to please Jesus Christ. i am His, i belong to Him, i do not do anything that i think He would not like.

And hear is the kicker, which this generation is not going to like. If i can do it, SO CAN YOU. But how many are willing to Truly give up the life that they living now, to serve ONLY Jesus Christ? Again, there is NO sin that you do that you can't cease from, so why are you not ceasing from it, that is the question isn't it?

^i^

††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††

DiscipleDave

 

[KJV1611]

Tell me, if an atheist who gets angry all the time and loses many girlfriends because of his anger problem, puts off anger. Was it Christ in them that put off the anger or the guy himself? What if a Muslim decides to stop raping, was it Christ in that person that stopped that person from raping? If an atheist, and a Muslim can put off their bad works through their own power and not from Jesus Christ. How are you saying you can't do the same?

I don't think you understand who we are nor who God is. The heart of man is desperately wicked and if it weren't for the grace of God we would all be rapist and murders. I do think that some peoples pride is so strong that it can cause them stop doing certain things for a while or maybe even permenately but from what I've seen the sin manifests itself somewhere else in their lives i.e. stop raping women and start believing you are holier than thou.

Did Jesus in me Make me quit looking at porn, or did i choose to stop looking at porn and prayed to help for His help in that matter?
Did Jesus make me quit smoking cigarettes, or was it the hardest thing i have ever done in my life? He did not do it for me, But i did it for Him.
Did Jesus make me quit having sex, been celibate over 10 years now, or did i choose to never again have a sexual relationship so that it would please Jesus Christ?
Did Jesus make me quit having the desire for money? Or did i choose to be poor to please Him?

I would think since YOU did those things, it would fit under this verse.

Isaiah 64:6 KJV
But we are all as an unclean thing , and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

 

[CS1]

In all by Biblical study I have never heard of one even suggesting that Christ did not do enough to save us. this is actually two topics in one title did Christ do enough to save us YES Bible 101 are we reqired to have faith in HIS work on the Cross yes faith is not what you do faith is what you have in Christ thus Christ did it all now you have to live a life that is unto the one that paid for it. what a joke

 

[KJV1611]

This is simply not True. Atheist, who do not even believe in God have put off those things. Are you saying they have not? Indians who never knew Jesus Christ was able to put off those things as well. People all over the world not of the Christian Faith, have been able to put off those things without the help of Jesus Christ at all. Now you are saying we Christians can't either? Here is the problem. as long as this generation is waiting for Jesus to do the work in them, to MAKE them be better, more Godly, more Loving and what have you, they will NEVER attain it. Only those who draw close to God will He then draw close to them. If a person makes him/herself go out and Love One Another, this is drawing close to God, because when you do it for the least of them, you do it for God.. But if you are waiting for Jesus to change something in you that will cause you to go out and Love Other, you are going to wait forever, because it is not going to happen. We are Commanded to Love One Another, why? because it is not something that Jesus causes us to do automatically, it is something that we CHOOSE to obey. People wake up, you have been sleeping long enough.

I love you enough to tell you the truth... and I didn't even have to work to do it.

lol, talking to someone who does all things to please Him. i have not failed. It is my desire to please Jesus which lives inside of me that helps me to live a life that is pleasing to Him. Sure i have to look to Him for His Strength and Power, every singly time i am tempted to commit a sin. But to Love One Another is a choice that we all make, it is not something that Jesus causes in us. If that were the case, then every single person who Jesus lived in, would be Loving Others 100% of the times. because Jesus is NOT weak, He is all powerful and could do that, IF that is how it was done, which it is NOT. Jesus lives inside of you, you choose to obey Him or not. You choose to Love One Another, or NOT. He does not make you Love Other, just as satan does not MAKE you commit sins. You choose to Love Others, you choose to commit sins.

Before I got saved I would've hated you. Not so any more! Now that I'm saved, I love you... and I'm not chosing to love you right now, I just do. It truly is a miracle and I don't know what else to call it. Are you having to work to love me?

yeah i see a generation of those, All professing to be Christians, yet lacking Love One for Another is rampant. All waiting for God to change them, instead of them drawing close to God and start doing what He Commanded them to do. He, Jesus Christ, Commanded Christians to LOVE ONE ANOTHER, but as long as typical Christians from the last days continues to wait for God to do the work in them, they will do not work at all themselves.

Better start obeying Jesus Christ. Better start Loving One Another, don't care what the World says your doing "Oh he/she is just trying to get to Heaven by their works, poor soul" But guess what that poor soul is obeying Jesus Christ, which COMMANDED us to Love One Another. i guess the logic is then, if you are not Loving One Another, it must be the fault of Jesus because He is not working in you as He should. God forbid.

If you Love Jesus You will be doing what He says, and He says to Love One Another. This generation says they love Jesus are patiently waiting for Him to do a work in them. There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when they are Judged to be goats saying "Lord my Savior, when did we not feed you, when did we not cloth you, when did we not help you, when did we not visit you?" And He will say to those Goats, when you did it NOT to the least of these, you did it not unto Me. So go ahead and wait for Jesus to do a work in you, when He is waiting for you to get off you tush, and start doing what He Commanded you to do, to Love One Another.

Some how your angle has changed... at first you were talking about DO and now you're only talking about love. Is love all that's necessary to please God? I think it is.

And yet, Scriptures are full of things teaching us what to Do? Should i believe you which say we don't need to DO anything, but REST, or Scriptures which teach us what we should DO? Scriptures Commands us to Love One Another, you say Christians are DONE, let us REST instead, is that correct?

^i^

††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††

DiscipleDave

What works are we supposed to do? Again it seems like you're waffling on your position. Also your posts are waaaaay too long, you say the same things over and over. Try shortening them a bit for better engagement

 

[KJV1611]

There was a man that had an infirmity for 38 years. Jesus healed him, and told him

Joh 5:14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.

Do you think after hearing those words from Jesus, and being sick for 38 years, that he was going to start living in sin again? i am like that man. i do all things to please Jesus Christ. i do not knowingly or willingly commit any sin.

There is no sin that you do that you can't cease from, not a one. Therefore the question is, why are you not ceasing from them? Those who love to sin, will not cease to sin.
i love Jesus Christ so much, i have given him my life. literally, i am His slave, i do all things to please my Lord Jesus Christ. Every temptation that comes my way, He helps me to overcome them.

Now What? because you don't think it is possible, i must be lying? Jesus gave His life for me, therefore i have given my life for Him. i listen to the Bible 8 hours a day at work, pray going to and from work. i have no Cable, satalite, or the like. i do have netflix and like watching Jesus movies, Bible stuff, and occasionally Frasier. i abhor satan, he is the enemy of my Lord and Savior, i will NOT obey the Lord's enemy when he comes tempting me. All sin is selfishness, if i give my life to Him, it is no longer my life, but His to do with as He sees fit. Jesus Christ is on my mind every waking minute of the day. Christian Stickers all over my car, Jesus pictures on every wall in my house, Shirts that i wear, all testify of Jesus, except my work shirts, Music that i do listen to every so often is Christian or oldies, wear a ring that says Jesus, wear a cross necklace. i do all those things to help me keep my mind and thoughts on HIM all day long. i do not give satan time or place in my life. i have been called a Jesus Freak not a little. Which i confirm that i am. If i give place one little bit in my life. satan will devour me, and eat me up. Therefore i don't give him any foothold in my life. i do all things to please Jesus Christ. i am His, i belong to Him, i do not do anything that i think He would not like.

And hear is the kicker, which this generation is not going to like. If i can do it, SO CAN YOU. But how many are willing to Truly give up the life that they living now, to serve ONLY Jesus Christ? Again, there is NO sin that you do that you can't cease from, so why are you not ceasing from it, that is the question isn't it?

^i^

††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††

DiscipleDave

How does that line up with this. Aren't you deceiving yourself, if not why aren't you?

1 John 1:8-10 KJV
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
[9] If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. [10] If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

 

[Ariel82]

This is a key question. Did Christ do enough to save us?
No.

We have to
1. Repent of our sins
2. Believe on the cross for the forgiveness of our sins
3. Follow Jesus
4. Obey Jesus's commands
5. Dwell in Gods word
6. Walk in the Spirit, in communion with God

Now you could add to this list or expand each item.

Some say Christ has done enough, and we need to do nothing but believe.

Jesus describes himself as the Shepherd.

I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep.
John 10:11

Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.
Matt 7:13-14

We are called to follow, to follow the road that leads to life.
If you are following, it takes effort and you are doing actual work.

Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.
Matt 11:28-30

A yoke is about being alongside another and taking their road and learning how to
walk it.

All of the above implies Christ has laid the way to salvation, but we have to walk it
to follow, to put effort in, to choose, to make decisions and fight the good fight.

So it is hard to believe people who say they know scripture, yet claim they
need do nothing and Christ has done it all, it is just resting and reaping.

This is just heresy.

Wow I guess this explains a lot.

The things you listed are good and God wants us to do them, but they aren't what saves us. They are works that may be made of gold, clay or hay. What is good will last like gold refined by fire.

What is bad will burn up like hay, but if the person faith is in Christ and His finished work upon the cross, then that person will be saved.

If the Rock isn't your foundation.

If you don't believe the cross is enough, then you are building upon sand.

It's a sad state of affairs.

I will give you the Bible verses that illustrate that God says Christ is enough even without works.

1 Corinthians 3
10 By the grace God has given me, I laid a foundation as a wise builder, and someone else is building on it. But each one should build with care. 11 For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, 13 their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. 14 If what has been built survives, the builder will receive a reward. 15 If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames.


*****so did Jesus do enough to save us?

Yes He did. Now let's move forward and learn what He saved us for and how He empowers us to do,those good works.

Here is a question:

Your son or daughter was kidnapped by a mob boss. Would you rescue them first or give them a list they must first show they repent of becoming addicted to drugs, etc before getting them out of bondage?

 

[Ahwatukee]

This is a key question. Did Christ do enough to save us?
No.

We have to
1. Repent of our sins
2. Believe on the cross for the forgiveness of our sins
3. Follow Jesus
4. Obey Jesus's commands
5. Dwell in Gods word
6. Walk in the Spirit, in communion with God

Now you could add to this list or expand each item.

Some say Christ has done enough, and we need to do nothing but believe.

Jesus describes himself as the Shepherd.

I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep.
John 10:11

Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.
Matt 7:13-14

We are called to follow, to follow the road that leads to life.
If you are following, it takes effort and you are doing actual work.

Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.
Matt 11:28-30

A yoke is about being alongside another and taking their road and learning how to
walk it.

All of the above implies Christ has laid the way to salvation, but we have to walk it
to follow, to put effort in, to choose, to make decisions and fight the good fight.

So it is hard to believe people who say they know scripture, yet claim they
need do nothing and Christ has done it all, it is just resting and reaping.

This is just heresy.

I guess Jesus must have been lying to the thief who was crucified next to him and who said "Lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom." And Jesus said to him "today you will be with me in paradise."

That man could not come down off the cross to be baptized, to keep the law or perform any of works, but was saved by his faith. Likewise, we have the example of those of Cornelius household, who, while Peter was still speaking, the Holy Spirit fell upon them and they began to speak in languages and to prophecy.

Anyone who claims that Jesus' sacrifice was insufficient, is not truly trusting in Him as the One who provided salvation. After one believes and receives the Spirit, then this should result in our desire to follow Christ and the desire to do good works that we may glorify God in them.

 

[MadebyHim]

Revelation 3:21-22. Christ showed us Kingdom Living, we should follow His example. He showed we follow. He did His part, we need to do our part. The question of op seems Christ did do enough Yes. But that doesn't say we don't need to do our part.

 

[beta]

When we have been 'initially saved by Grace we must 'work together with Jesus' ! He does not work apart from us and we can not work successfully apart from Him !

Let us stop these arguments of 'who does what' - we must work together !!!
Everything Jesus could do for us on His own has been done and is available to us now, but still we need His help until we are perfected !!!

 

[gb9]

the last sentence is the key here. some people think that they are already perfected, and no longer need grace or forgiveness, so by ( wrongly ) thinking this, they ( wrongly ) think they have the right to shout at us unperfected ones to be like them.

 

[Ariel82]

the last sentence is the key here. some people think that they are already perfected, and no longer need grace or forgiveness, so by ( wrongly ) thinking this, they ( wrongly ) think they have the right to shout at us unperfected ones to be like them.

I always thought perfect was being mature in Christ, rooted in Him.....Not sinless but blameless.

A big difference because many saints were said to be blameless but only Jesus was sinless.

We have been forgiven, but yet we sinned and needed that forgiveness and mercy more.

Mature so that the Enemy can't toss us around with false doctrines and deceptions.

 

[beta]

The way I understand 'Godly perfection is to be 'conformed to the image of His Son - to have reached the stage that can not be improved on. In our case this would be at the time when we are resurrected (literally) from the dead Rom 1v4, because as long as we are in this flesh we are limited.

 

[Grace777x70]

As we received Christ - so we are to walk in Him. How did we get saved? By the hearing of the message of Christ and "believing" it. This proper believing in the heart changes us.

We got saved by grace through faith and we continue our whole Christian life in the same way. By grace through faith in Christ's finished work.

We renew our minds as we see the grace of God in Christ and we participate in it with the Holy Spirit. We don't get saved by grace through faith in Christ and then maintain salvation by our works.

Good works do follow but they are the result of being saved already and walking outwardly what already is - inside of us - the new creation in Christ.

Colossians 2:6-7 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] Therefore as you have received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk in Him,

[SUP]7 [/SUP] having been firmly rooted and now being built up in Him and established in your faith, just as you were instructed, and overflowing with gratitude.

 

[dcontroversal]

In all by Biblical study I have never heard of one even suggesting that Christ did not do enough to save us. this is actually two topics in one title did Christ do enough to save us YES Bible 101 are we reqired to have faith in HIS work on the Cross yes faith is not what you do faith is what you have in Christ thus Christ did it all now you have to live a life that is unto the one that paid for it. what a joke

Well, you heard it here......can you imagine saying...Jesus you did not do enough....They, by saying he did not do enough, are calling him a lair when he said IT IS FINISHED......and they also CALL THE HEAVENLY FATHER a liar when it states...HE SHALL see the travail of my soul and be SATISFIED.......they also deny the WORKS were FINISHED from the foundation of the world and on and on and on.......

the workers for and their false theologies slaps Jesus in the face with his fresh hot blood that he shed for humanity....the bible is clear....ALL SIN was nailed to the cross of Calvary and the RIGHTEOUSNESS of CHRIST is APPLIED to the believer based upon mercy, grace and faith....our salvation has been forever settled in heaven before God by FAITH into the SON of GOD....those who deny this and or add to Jesus are not saved based upon the word of GOD...end of story....a gospel of a different kind with NO power to save....double cursed period!

 

[John146]

The way I understand 'Godly perfection is to be 'conformed to the image of His Son - to have reached the stage that can not be improved on. In our case this would be at the time when we are resurrected (literally) from the dead Rom 1v4, because as long as we are in this flesh we are limited.

Totally agree. See also 1 Corinthians 15:49-54 and 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18.

 

[wolfwint]

This is a key question. Did Christ do enough to save us?
No.

We have to
1. Repent of our sins
2. Believe on the cross for the forgiveness of our sins
3. Follow Jesus
4. Obey Jesus's commands
5. Dwell in Gods word
6. Walk in the Spirit, in communion with God

Now you could add to this list or expand each item.

Some say Christ has done enough, and we need to do nothing but believe.

Jesus describes himself as the Shepherd.

I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep.
John 10:11

Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.
Matt 7:13-14

We are called to follow, to follow the road that leads to life.
If you are following, it takes effort and you are doing actual work.

Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.
Matt 11:28-30

A yoke is about being alongside another and taking their road and learning how to
walk it.

All of the above implies Christ has laid the way to salvation, but we have to walk it
to follow, to put effort in, to choose, to make decisions and fight the good fight.

So it is hard to believe people who say they know scripture, yet claim they
need do nothing and Christ has done it all, it is just resting and reaping.

This is just heresy.

Do you mean Jesus death at the cross what not sufficent to save us? Doesnt matter what we do, it will not help us to be saved. I believe what said in John 1,12!
I somebody is the child of God he should walk as child of God. Thats right! But its not a matter of slavation, but a matter of reward.
That we are saved is grace and not our earnings

"So it is hard to believe people who say they know scripture, yet claim they
need do nothing and Christ has done it all, it is just resting and reaping."

I would ask myself they are really believers?

I read a new statistik,, that in germany only around 30% believe that Jesus is the son of God, but 56% belong to the Protastant ore Catholic church. ( I know trust no statistik which you not manipulatet by yourself)

 

[PeterJens]

Do you mean Jesus death at the cross what not sufficent to save us? Doesnt matter what we do, it will not help us to be saved. I believe what said in John 1,12!
I somebody is the child of God he should walk as child of God. Thats right! But its not a matter of slavation, but a matter of reward.
That we are saved is grace and not our earnings

"So it is hard to believe people who say they know scripture, yet claim they
need do nothing and Christ has done it all, it is just resting and reaping."

I would ask myself they are really believers?

I read a new statistik,, that in germany only around 30% believe that Jesus is the son of God, but 56% belong to the Protastant ore Catholic church. ( I know trust no statistik which you not manipulatet by yourself)

Interesting.

The point I am saying is Jesus has done enough to save us, but we need to have faith
in Him to make it effective for us. We need to be born again.

 

[FreeNChrist]

Yes, i suppose so. Just as Jesus was, and all the Apostles were too. For which of them did not teach to maintain good works? You must be one of those Faith Only believers.

Could you describe to me a Faith ONLY Based religion? And then tell me how you do not fit into that category?

Faith ONLY Based religions believe that believing in Jesus is enough, need DO nothing else.
Works ONLY Based religions believe that by doing Good deeds/works will get you into Heaven.
TRUE Christians believe the Word of God (ALL OF IT, not just the parts that talk about Faith) which teaches Faith + Works go hand in hand, NOT one without the other. Faith by itself = DEAD. Works by itself = DEAD. Those who believe that Faith is enough = DEAD. Those who believe Works is enough = DEAD. Woe to this generation indeed.

^i^

††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††

DiscipleDave

I believe in Jesus only. It is He who has saved me.

 

[FreeNChrist]

Absolutely True. And AFTER you are SAVED, then there are things you MUST DO. That is why Jesus COMMANDED us to Love One Another. We don't Love One Another to get Saved, we Love One Another because we ARE SAVED. Woe to those who don't.

^i^

††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††

DiscipleDave

Either you're saved or your not. Love is the fruit not the root.

 

[dcontroversal]

Interesting.

The point I am saying is Jesus has done enough to save us, but we need to have faith
in Him to make it effective for us. We need to be born again.

So which is it?

Your opening salvo....

This is a key question. Did Christ do enough to save us?
No.