Let them Eat MEAT! Learning spiritual discernment: legalism

[Grace777x70]

Hmmmm...looks like David and Paul are charismatic too...go figure!

Psalm 23:4-6 (NASB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for You are with me; Your rod and Your staff, they comfort me.

[SUP]5 [/SUP] You prepare a table before me in the presence of my enemies; You have anointed my head with oil; My cup overflows.

[SUP]6 [/SUP] Surely goodness and lovingkindness will follow me all the days of my life, And I will dwell in the house of the LORD forever.

2 Timothy 1:7 (KJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

 

[Ariel82]

Labels - Legalism

To simplify an argument in a propoganda war, you create polarised language.
Judaisers is a typical word. So whatever your position, the opponents get
pushed into one group, and labelled Judaisers.

Another is all evil in the world is the corruption of true faith. So religion is
evil, we know God which is real and not religion, which is fake.

Another is everything is trying to prove to God we are ok, and working for
credit points to be acceptable as heaven bound, so is legalism.

Where this often falls down is in critising symbols, ceremonies, traditions,
organisations, emotional dilemmas, theological complexities.
Religion is about God and our relationship with Him. God created symbols,
ceremonies, traditions, organistations, deals with emotional dilemmas and
has theological complexities. So to label any of this wrong, is to condemn
oneself.

So a true definition of one aspect of looking at rules and qualification, called
legalism and taking it out of the idea of good or evil, but giving it a
proper emphasis would be helpful.

So a legal reading of a woman caught in adultery is death. Jesus stopped this
by saying the condemning crowd had not right to condemn unless they were pure.
A legalistic reading of this incident, was it was not to bring justice or honour to God,
but to trap Jesus, so their intent was rebellion against God, and not faithfulness to
His commands.

So maybe legalism is a false imposition of the law not to bring honour to God and
justice among His people, but for any other motive or situation.

Exactly. The legalism is the incorrect use of the law to do things against God's purpose for the world.

I believe the only way to combat this is to have a personal relationship with God through prayer and worship, a clear understanding of the Bible and God's laws through study and discussion and eyes willing to see the best version of who God wants others to be.

instead of always jumping to the false lies of the Enemy who accuses others of being condemned and deceived. The Enemy would cause contention over fellowship. Will whisper pride of being right, make you think you are defending your faith against strawmen of his making.
However do you have faith in God or in you being right?

God tells us to stand and learn to be mature in Christ.

 

[PeterJens]

Preferring the rich over the poor isn't legalism, it's being a respecter of persons, which is a sin.

Yes, it's sinful..... but legalistic? Is every sin under the legalism category?

I certainly hope this isn't gonna be a "everything & everybody is legalistic but us" kind of thread.

This is always a danger. Here is a label, there are the opposition, put it on their heads whether
it fits or not, who cares, they deserve it. I have seen this happen, because it is the emotion
of mocking and abuse, not truth or sincerity. If your "yes" is "yes" and your "no" is "no", we are not
allowed to do this.

It has been illuminating seeing peoples worldly sides come out, when annoyed or provoked,
whether innocently or not. Maybe sometimes Jesus's silence helps, and sometimes a right
response. I used to wonder at a white washed tomb, but dead people have no emotional life,
so it fits with show and pomposity. I have met some like this, but they never know, because
their state means they do not know how to respond or actually that this is the problem.

 

[Ariel82]

We need to speak words of life instead of death.

I get tired of the negative images folks seem to have of others.

When I look at someone I see two different people....who they are now and who they could become if they truly knew how much God loves them and how to use their gifts and talents as part of the Body of Christ.

Some would call me naive, but I call it hope and faith that God can change lives. He has the power to transform hearts and minds.

So a moment of silence to let go of the world's cares and thoughts and focus on God and His love. Giving thanks to all his blessings.

 

[zone]

I have absolutely no hope without God's Mercy.
the Law shows me that. my conscience confirms it.

 

[gb9]

we need to always, always, keep in mind- " Gospel " means good news, lit. good tale.

 

[Ariel82]

Dear Heavenly Father:

We often get so busy and caught up in what we are doing, we forget to spend time in prayer with You Lord. Even taking just a minute to recall all the blessings you have poured upon us, refreshes our soul and encourages to do the task you have given us to do today.

Lord let your mercy and grace pour out upon us. Help us to forgive those who have hurt us in the past. Tear down spiritual strongholds that war against Your wisdom. Make our hearts humble before You Lord. Help us not to fall into the trap of pride. Let us give you our anger or problems or feelings of worthlessness and not leave a place in our hearts and minds for Satan to plant seeds of doubt or despuar but let us grow form in Your love, truth and grace.

Help our words be like living waters flowing from hearts that see the best in others and who will speak words of hope and faith that speaks of who they will become in Christ. Lord let us grow strong in You. With deep roots, so that we are not shaken or tossed to and fro by false teachings of arrows of the Enemy.

Lord we pray a hedge of protection over our children and our loved ones. They have to walk their own walks, but our hearts break when the Enemy tempts them away from you. Lord help them be strong in You and see through the lies. You are our Light. Guide us and lead us in your ways.

In Jesus Holy name we pray, amen.

 

[Ariel82]

That sounds kinda charismatic, doesn't it?

Are you one?

If you are asking what denominational church I attend, it's Methodist. You?

 

[Ariel82]

Hmmmm...looks like David and Paul are charismatic too...go figure!

Psalm 23:4-6 (NASB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I fear no evil, for You are with me; Your rod and Your staff, they comfort me.

[SUP]5 [/SUP] You prepare a table before me in the presence of my enemies; You have anointed my head with oil; My cup overflows.

[SUP]6 [/SUP] Surely goodness and lovingkindness will follow me all the days of my life, And I will dwell in the house of the LORD forever.

2 Timothy 1:7 (KJV)
[SUP]7 [/SUP] For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

Thanks those were the verses I was thinking about.

Also the one with Daniel in the lions den.

 

[Stephen63]

Labels - Legalism

To simplify an argument in a propoganda war, you create polarised language.
Judaisers is a typical word. So whatever your position, the opponents get
pushed into one group, and labelled Judaisers.

Another is all evil in the world is the corruption of true faith. So religion is
evil, we know God which is real and not religion, which is fake.

Another is everything is trying to prove to God we are ok, and working for
credit points to be acceptable as heaven bound, so is legalism.

Where this often falls down is in critising symbols, ceremonies, traditions,
organisations, emotional dilemmas, theological complexities.
Religion is about God and our relationship with Him. God created symbols,
ceremonies, traditions, organistations, deals with emotional dilemmas and
has theological complexities. So to label any of this wrong, is to condemn
oneself.

So a true definition of one aspect of looking at rules and qualification, called
legalism and taking it out of the idea of good or evil, but giving it a
proper emphasis would be helpful.

So a legal reading of a woman caught in adultery is death. Jesus stopped this
by saying the condemning crowd had not right to condemn unless they were pure.
A legalistic reading of this incident, was it was not to bring justice or honour to God,
but to trap Jesus, so their intent was rebellion against God, and not faithfulness to
His commands.

So maybe legalism is a false imposition of the law not to bring honour to God and
justice among His people, but for any other motive or situation.

I agree. I believe if my doctrine is right I don't have to go around twisting God's word to prove it. I won't have to explain it to the world to defend it. God will defend what is His.

Utilizing unknown videos, slanted web sites, & purposefully ignoring other major scriptures that exposes one's beliefs as false is a sure sign of a cult. This what the Jehovah's Witnesses does. Their first tactic is to steer you into their thinking with their doctrine that seems harmless enough..... but it denies Jesus as the Son of God.

This is a religious system that "changes" the definitions of key subjects of salvation, such as faith without works, conviction without sorrow for our sins, repentance is only a change of mind, & every sin is forgiven in advance, whether you change or not.

If this were true, God couldn't discipline His children at all due to the fact they're automatically forgiven. God cannot bring something "negative" such as judgment on His people, even though God said judgment begins first in the house of God.

These doctrines, in essence, takes the majority of responsibility away from the christian, & grant them liberty to live as they please.

Don't even try to say "if I'm a true christian, I wouldn't want to sin in the first place". I'm tempted to sin every day..... sometimes I lose to sin. But I'm to confess AND forsake my sins if I'm to continue in Christ.

I'm glad God convicts me of sin. He wants me to improve my relationship with Him. God expects me to be sorry & repent of my sins. The Holy Spirit leads me to do that. I am a bondservant to Jesus Christ, because He bought me with His own blood.
I will gladly submit to Jesus as LORD, because He's done everything for me. I AM NOT ASHAMED OF MY BELIEFS, I DON'T RUN AROUND FEELING GUILTY ALL THE TIME LIKE OTHERS LIE ABOUT, & I'M HAPPY IN JESUS BECAUSE I AM WHAT I AM BY THE GRACE OF GOD. I find it offensive that someone has to paint an ugly picture of me as an old sorry, unhappy legalist. They intentionally do so to make themselves look good. The ends justify the means to get what they want.

When these people lie on me, they're lying on Christ whom I serve.

 

[GODisLOVE7]

Don't worry... There is always more pizza. I'll invite you next time!

Thank you...I eat pizza's on Fridays. Friday is my "re-feed" day. The rest of the week I eat very clean but Fridays are my Yahoo Day! What day is it now? Is Friday getting close?

When I wake up I love to say to the Lord .."What are we going to eat today?...it's re-feed day". He just loves that!

Noted...

Psst! Grace777x70... Bruce!

Its FRIDAY!!!!!!

You know what that means........

 

[Stephen63]

If you are asking what denominational church I attend, it's Methodist. You?

Pentecostal, & not ashamed of it.

 

[samuel23]

Legalism is a made up word, not really from the word of God. It seems to mean whatever the person using it wants it to mean. For some it is a way of attacking Christians who are living a more disciplined life then they are living. To follow God we chose the right and reject the wrong, we chose the righteous and reject the unrighteous, we chose the legal and reject the illegal. I think the church would be better off they buried this idea of legalism unless some Jews show up and try to place us back under the temple worship and animal sacrifices.

 

[PeterJens]

We need to speak words of life instead of death.

How do we help people heal from legalism?

It struck me Paul was 100% an example of a legalist and what happens
when you are filled with the Holy Spirit and walking in faith.

So Paul understood love at his core, and in everything he did.
Nothing he had done was too bad to be forgiven.
He walked with an open heart, expressing open feelings of need, joy, sadness,
hurt, trouble, praise, victory and trials.

He described his walk as pure, holy and blameless.
He was free about celebrations, yet also honoured some as he was led.
He circumcised Timothy yet did not believe in following the law of Moses
but did believe in the law of Christ and being a slave to righteousness.

So the sign of freedom from legalism is knowing love and how to follow
Christ without condemnation because you fulfill the law of Christ in obedience.

And central to it all is trusting in the promises Christ has given us.
This is no simple task, and Paul had many who opposed him, and many who
found his writings hard to understand.

 

[Stephen63]

If you are asking what denominational church I attend, it's Methodist. You?

United Methodist, I presume?

 

[Ariel82]

Wait did I miss a post in this thread that called Stephen a legalist?

 

[Ariel82]

Pentecostal, & not ashamed of it.

Nice, I have attended a few services. Always filled with energy and movement.

 

[Stephen63]

Wait did I miss a post in this thread that called Stephen a legalist?

You DO say Lordship Salvationists are legalists, don't you.....

 

[Ariel82]

Legalism is a made up word, not really from the word of God. It seems to mean whatever the person using it wants it to mean. For some it is a way of attacking Christians who are living a more disciplined life then they are living. To follow God we chose the right and reject the wrong, we chose the righteous and reject the unrighteous, we chose the legal and reject the illegal. I think the church would be better off they buried this idea of legalism unless some Jews show up and try to place us back under the temple worship and animal sacrifices.

No it isn't a "made up word". It is a word used to describe a concept.

Like all words are symbols to represent an idea.

Legalism is lying and saying man made customs and laws are God's laws.

There are plenty of examples in the Bible:

Long hair, women wearing veils, dressing up for church, keeping the Jewish holidays and sabbaths, circumcision.

 

[Ariel82]

Mark 7v8

For you ignore God's law and substitute your own tradition."