Trump’s Order Blocks Immigrants at Airports

[maxwel]

Can you provide verification that lawyers are taught this or are you speaking figuratively?

Lawyers engaging in deception:


1. There are many first hand accounts of students being instructed in lying, by their law professors... even our own CC member, Desdichado, attests to this above in post # 581.

If you cannot believe lawyers are ever taught by their professors to lie... please skip the rest of this post, and just send a PM to Desdichado.


2. There are many articles, by prominent law professors (like the one I posted on a previous page) showing complete disregard for "truth" by delving into topics like the "acceptable limits of deception."


3. Logically, any profession given to parsing evidences in a rhetorical fashion in order to win a debate, will be naturally prone, at least in some degree, to employing various types of deception.

Historically, you find this exact dilemma occurring at least as far back as the ancient Sophists in the the 5th century B.C.

If you want to move into the Biblical realm, this is the same dilemma we find with the Pharisees during the time of Christ's ministry.

Therefore, it would seem to logically follow, that you could at least find some degree of "moral ambivalence" in any textbook on law which discusses actual debate, interpretations of statutes or precedents, handling of evidences etc.


4. Point #3 above becomes more pronounced if we consider the legal profession has no specific interest in moralizing over ethical paradigms such as "truth", but is instead concerned with interpreting the law in order to WIN CASES.

Again, we find this same exact scenario hearkening back to at least the 5th century B.C. with the ancient Sophists.


5. I suppose we could go on and on, but surely this is enough.

Again, if you don't believe attorneys are taught to lie, or to as least use some forms of intentional deception... then just send a PM to Desdichado. That should end the debate.

 

[hornetguy]

Dr Seuss created a political cartoon about denying refugees asylum:

this was supposedly in response to America Firststers of that era:

I somehow missed the memo establishing Dr Seuss as the final moral authority for the US... his opinions are worth just about what the average WalMart worker's are..... He just draws well....

 

[Tinkerbell725]

Can you provide verification that lawyers are taught this or are you speaking figuratively?

I just remembered someone who is trying to convert me into Islam said that Paul is a liar because he was a lawyer. But Paul already repented. Of course lawyers must learn how to lie, if not how can they win the case of a possibly guilty client if they are not well equipped.

 

[hornetguy]

I just remembered someone who is trying to convert me into Islam said that Paul is a liar because he was a lawyer. But Paul already repented. Of course lawyers must learn how to lie, if not how can they win the case of a possibly guilty client if they are not well equipped.

I don't think Paul was a "lawyer".... he was a tentmaker, as a profession. He studied Jewish law under Gamaliel, but as far as I know, he was never a lawyer. From his studies, he probably would have been classified more a rabbi than lawyer.

Acts 18....

18 After these things he left Athens and went to Corinth. [SUP]2 [/SUP]And he found a Jew named Aquila, a native of Pontus, having recently come from Italy with his wife Priscilla, because Claudius had commanded all the Jews to leave Rome. He came to them, [SUP]3 [/SUP]and because he was of the same trade, he stayed with them and they were working, for by trade they were tent-makers. [SUP]4 [/SUP]And he was reasoning in the synagogue every Sabbath and trying to persuade Jews and Greeks.

 

[Utah]

You were accused of making a racist statement about Obama and accused your accuser of certain negativity of which need not be repeated here.

Later you accused me of making bigoted comments and I indicated which post you made that on. But you have yet to prove that I made any bigoted comments here.

Still waiting for your proof.

Since you failed to do so, I shall post daily reminders here of your error.


Beddy bye time. See you tomorrow - that should give you ample time to provide your "proof" {sic} that I have made bigoted comments on this forum.

Hiding behind your memes actually weakens your position.

So does lying.

 

[Sirk]

Mike drop.

it isn't nice to drop Mike.....now dropping a mic on the other hand still isn't nice but at least Mike doesn't get hurt.

 

[Tommy379]

I just remembered someone who is trying to convert me into Islam said that Paul is a liar because he was a lawyer. But Paul already repented. Of course lawyers must learn how to lie, if not how can they win the case of a possibly guilty client if they are not well equipped.

In common law, defense attorneys don't win cases by lying for their guilty clients. They win by having evidence excluded by the mistakes the government made when either collecting or presenting the evidence.

 

[Depleted]

I suspect, by now, everyone has forgotten the OP. But, yay! The ones sent back from the Philadelphia airport have come HOME today. This time they were smart enough to go through NY's airport.

They should be with their family by noon EST.

http://www.mcall.com/news/local/mc-allentown-syrian-heading-back-to-usa-20170205-story.html

You are now free to go back to your arguing.

 

[Sirk]

Modern day lawyering doesn't have much basis in truth in my opinion. Lawyers learn to argue points 7 ways from sunday to fit whatever narrative they are trying to bolster. Kinda like some people on CC.

 

[Willie-T]

I suspect, by now, everyone has forgotten the OP. But, yay! The ones sent back from the Philadelphia airport have come HOME today. This time they were smart enough to go through NY's airport.

They should be with their family by noon EST.

Reunited: 'Roller-coaster' ride nearing its end as Allentown-bound Syrian family back in USA - The Morning Call

You are now free to go back to your arguing.

Do they continue to be turned away at the Philly airport at this time?

 

[kaylagrl]

Had to share this,saw it on a friends FB page and made me chuckle...

 

[Willie-T]

Do they continue to be turned away at the Philly airport at this time?

Never mind. I just read what's probably the truth in the article you posted. They were never "turned away" at all. They chose to go back rather than wait to see if their papers turned out to be valid. (There might have been a little "Lawyer Presentation of the true facts" in the OP.)

 

[JosephsDreams]

The first immigrants were Adam and Eve. They were displaced.
There was a "wall" put up when Adam and Eve were compelled to leave.
I wonder how long it took them to realize they wanted back in?

Or when the marital arguments about the apple and its results began to get heated?
"You know Adam, we would still be in the garden if it wasn't for you. I hate this place."
'Me? Your the one who bit into the fruit. How do you make me responsible? It's not my fault you don't listen when God speaks."
"Well where the heck were you when I needed you? What were you doing? Naming yet another insect?"

And it's been that way ever since...

 

[Willie-T]

The first immigrants were Adam and Eve. They were displaced.
There was a "wall" put up when Adam and Eve were compelled to leave.
I wonder how long it took them to realize they wanted back in?

Or when the marital arguments about the apple and its results began to get heated?
"You know Adam, we would still be in the garden if it wasn't for you. I hate this place."
'Me? Your the one who bit into the fruit. How do you make me responsible? It's not my fault you don't listen when God speaks."
"Well where the heck were you when I needed you? What were you doing? Naming yet another insect?"

And it's been that way ever since...

My wife and I both cracked-up over that one. Excellent!

 

[kaylagrl]

Dr Seuss created a political cartoon about denying refugees asylum:

this was supposedly in response to America Firststers of that era:

​ So here's the difference. Blocking the Jews was antisemitism,it was wrong. What we are talking about is thousands of refugees with no records and ISIS which has said they will hide among the refugees and infiltrate other countries. No one has said no,they are saying wait until we can be sure of who is coming into the country. Apples and oranges from the Jews. We have refugees in Germany and you cant get mace there because women are being assaulted and raped.They have kicked them out of Sweden. The Jews were peaceful and did harm to no one. They did not expect the law to change for them like Muslims trying to push Sharia Law here and in Canada. So not the same situation at all.

 

[Susanna]

Lawyers engaging in deception:


1. There are many first hand accounts of students being instructed in lying, by their law professors... even our own CC member, Desdichado, attests to this above in post # 581.

If you cannot believe lawyers are ever taught by their professors to lie... please skip the rest of this post, and just send a PM to Desdichado.


2. There are many articles, by prominent law professors (like the one I posted on a previous page) showing complete disregard for "truth" by delving into topics like the "acceptable limits of deception."


3. Logically, any profession given to parsing evidences in a rhetorical fashion in order to win a debate, will be naturally prone, at least in some degree, to employing various types of deception.

Historically, you find this exact dilemma occurring at least as far back as the ancient Sophists in the the 5th century B.C.

If you want to move into the Biblical realm, this is the same dilemma we find with the Pharisees during the time of Christ's ministry.

Therefore, it would seem to logically follow, that you could at least find some degree of "moral ambivalence" in any textbook on law which discusses actual debate, interpretations of statutes or precedents, handling of evidences etc.


4. Point #3 above becomes more pronounced if we consider the legal profession has no specific interest in moralizing over ethical paradigms such as "truth", but is instead concerned with interpreting the law in order to WIN CASES.

Again, we find this same exact scenario hearkening back to at least the 5th century B.C. with the ancient Sophists.


5. I suppose we could go on and on, but surely this is enough.

Again, if you don't believe attorneys are taught to lie, or to as least use some forms of intentional deception... then just send a PM to Desdichado. That should end the debate.

If someone accused you of a crime you didn't commit, would you rather get a lawyer or would you go on bashing an entire profession that has saved innocent people from life without parole or even Huntsville?

Defense lawyers are seen as the "dark side" from a police point of view, but checks and balances applies to us as well. People are often slamming lawyers defending criminals, but they are sorely needed.

 

[maxwel]

If someone accused you of a crime you didn't commit, would you rather get a lawyer or would you go on bashing an entire profession that has saved innocent people from life without parole or even Huntsville?

Defense lawyers are seen as the "dark side" from a police point of view, but checks and balances applies to us as well. People are often slamming lawyers defending criminals, but they are sorely needed.

Please consider referring to what I actually said, instead of what you "think" I said.



1. I never said lawyers aren't a necessary part of our legal system.

2. I never said lawyers are ALL bad.

3. I never said lawyers never do any good.



If you want to throw rocks at me, that's fine...
but first take the time to figure out what I actually said.
: )

God Bless,
Max

 

[Susanna]

Please consider referring to what I actually said, instead of what you "think" I said.



1. I never said lawyers aren't a necessary part of our legal system.

2. I never said lawyers are ALL bad.

3. I never said lawyers never do any good.



If you want to throw rocks at me, that's fine...
but first take the time to figure out what I actually said.
: )

God Bless,
Max

I said you were slamming lawyers. Which is what you did. Now go play your deflection games with someone else.

 

[Depleted]

Never mind. I just read what's probably the truth in the article you posted. They were never "turned away" at all. They chose to go back rather than wait to see if their papers turned out to be valid. (There might have been a little "Lawyer Presentation of the true facts" in the OP.)

Still intentionally ignoring what you don't want to see, huh? Post 415 is still on this thread. any time you get tired of your blinders, feel free.

Meanwhile, how about stop lying by pretending you even want to know the story, once more understand it?

 

[Willie-T]

Still intentionally ignoring what you don't want to see, huh? Post 415 is still on this thread. any time you get tired of your blinders, feel free.

Meanwhile, how about stop lying by pretending you even want to know the story, once more understand it?

Which of the two stories you posted as being the correct one are we supposed to take as the truth? Maybe neither of them?

You are the person who posted two directly conflicting stories..... not one of us.