Twice dead

[KyleRae]

The grace and Spirit of God does approve of sin, be rather reproves the world of sin. That is where the lies of Hyper grace are exposed by not speaking out against sinful behavior, but rather saying you are saved despite your sinful behavior. This is the doctrine of the Devil that proclaims you can still sin and not die.

the holy scripture dosnt say that we can keep sinning, it does say truly saved people may sin by accident or impulse like david and wehace an advocate with the father to forgive us, we get grace and we repentant, we wont want to keep sinning when we are really saved thats the word on good soil. You say hyper grace its funny you say that because its actually limitless like God, those who extend it to others who sin as jesus did may cause them to repentant if they dont we are to wipe the dust off and move on. If you shame one for sin you do to them what the Pharisees did to people and Jesus and if one keeps sinning who wants jesus treat them with love and grace teaching them that the word may be falling on shallow or thorny ground. I know all this because that was me. Sining and trap with the torns not truly saved not truly understanding gods love as to not sin as the result of love.

 

[Base12]

LOL @ all of the hypocrisy!

"Second Death" this... and "Second Death" that...

"Twice Dead" here... and "Twice Dead" there...

Bla bla bla.

Yet the minute One asks... "Say, is Reincarnation Biblical?", what do you do?

You LIE to them and say "oh no... the Bible clearly states that Man dies only ONCE"...

Hebrews 9:27
"And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment"

Care to explain yourselves?

Still waiting for someone to solve this obvious contradiction...

 

[JesusRules1]

Still waiting for someone to solve this obvious contradiction...

We do not reincarnate,for we only have one life,and whatever position we die in our flesh,will be the position that we will have for all eternity,whether with God,or not,for judgment is set as soon as we die once.

Twice dead means that the wicked die physically,and they die spiritually,for they are physically dead,and spiritually dead,for all eternity.

They physically die,but then they are spiritually dead,and there is no reversal for them dying in their sins,but judgment is set as soon as they die.

First death physical,second death spiritual.

 

[Base12]

We do not reincarnate...

Two Witness say different...

Job 1:21
"And said, Naked came I out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return thither: the LORD gave, and the LORD hath taken away; blessed be the name of the LORD"

Ecclesiastes 5:15
"As he came forth of his mother's womb, naked shall he return to go as he came, and shall take nothing of his labour, which he may carry away in his hand"

I have plenty more BTW.

First death physical,second death spiritual.

#1 - Show me Two Witnesses proving you didn't just make that up.

and...

#2 - Whether it's Physical or Spiritual is beside the point. Die once means die once... NOT twice.

 

[dcontroversal]

Still waiting for someone to solve this obvious contradiction...

Kind of goes along with what Jesus said about the Pharisees...encompassing land and sea to make one proselyte and in doing so making the two fold the child of hell.....

Now they have to get over
a. Their false religion
b. The lost state

My view.......twice dead = both physically and spiritually <--Blessed is he that hath part in the 1st Resurrection upon whom the 2nd death hath no power

Having said that....we could have an interesting chat about God knowing Jeremiah on a forensic level and personally before he was brought forth from his mother's womb......

 

[Base12]

My view.......twice dead = both physically and spiritually

Cool.

You and JesusRules1 pretty much say the same thing, and I like where you guys are going with that.

What I'm trying to prove out here is that this verse...

Hebrews 9:27
"And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment"

...has nothing to do with proving or disproving Reincarnation, thus it should never be used in that context.

That being said, I've seen Christians use that verse for the specific purpose of disproving Reincarnation.

I think that is an extremely disingenuous thing to do and I may start a thread on this one day.

I just want to get a little Trial Balloon out there so I can get a good debate going.

The way I read Hebrews 9:27 is simply this...

One Death = One Judgement

In other words, after the first death, it's judgment time... no ifs ands or buts about it.

No cheating.

Having said that....we could have an interesting chat about God knowing Jeremiah on a forensic level and personally before he was brought forth from his mother's womb......

There you go.

I know Christians hate the idea of Reincarnation, but I'm of the belief that it really is Biblical.

Matthew 17:12
"But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them"

 

[JesusRules1]

Cool.

You and JesusRules1 pretty much say the same thing, and I like where you guys are going with that.

What I'm trying to prove out here is that this verse...

Hebrews 9:27
"And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment"

...has nothing to do with proving or disproving Reincarnation, thus it should never be used in that context.

That being said, I've seen Christians use that verse for the specific purpose of disproving Reincarnation.

I think that is an extremely disingenuous thing to do and I may start a thread on this one day.

I just want to get a little Trial Balloon out there so I can get a good debate going.

The way I read Hebrews 9:27 is simply this...

One Death = One Judgement

In other words, after the first death, it's judgment time... no ifs ands or buts about it.

No cheating.



There you go.

I know Christians hate the idea of Reincarnation, but I'm of the belief that it really is Biblical.

Matthew 17:12
"But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them"

The Bible specifically states that it is appointed unto men once to die,then comes the judgment,which means that some people die with sins on their record,and some people die with no sins on their record,and however you die in the flesh,whether sins on your record,or no sins on your record,that is what will be your eternal state,and you do not get a second chance.

There is no coming back to try to make up for your short comings,and that is biblical,for you only get one chance to get it right.

So there is no reincarnation,because you only get one chance,according to the Bible.

John the Baptist,who prepared the way for Jesus,according to Jesus was Elijah to come,which this does not mean that he was Elijah,but that he came in the spirit of Elijah.

John the Baptist came in the spirit of Elijah,not Elijah himself.

And even of it was Elijah himself does not mean that God allows all people to be reincarnated.

But truthfully John the Baptist came in the spirit of Elijah,not Elijah himself.

And not only that but Jesus said that born of women there has not been a greater than John the Baptist,so how can John the Baptist be Elijah,for what importance is Elijah,when John the Baptist is greater than him,and would not Jesus want the greatest human being to ever live,beside Him,to prepare the way for Him.

Besides the man Christ Jesus,John the Baptist is the greatest human to born on this earth,including Moses,Elijah,David,or whoever a person cares to mention,so why would Jesus want Elijah to prepare the way for Him,the greatest of all being the man Christ Jesus,but none other than the greatest human to be born of women,John the Baptist,for it would be an insult for anybody else to prepare the way for the greatest human being to ever walk the planet the man Christ Jesus,than the second greatest person to walk the earth,John the Baptist.

John the Baptist is not Elijah reincarnated,but John the baptist in the spirit of Elijah.

 

[Base12]

...some people die with no sins on their record...

Really?

So there is no reincarnation,because you only get one chance,according to the Bible.

Yet the Bible says we are conceived of and born from Hell...

Psalm 139:15
"My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth"

Isn't that where God sends the unsaved?

Ezekiel 26:20
"When I shall bring thee down with them that descend into the pit, with the people of old time, and shall set thee in the low parts of the earth, in places desolate of old, with them that go down to the pit, that thou be not inhabited; and I shall set glory in the land of the living"

John the Baptist came in the spirit of Elijah,not Elijah himself.

So what you are saying here is that the word 'Spirit' in every other place in the Bible is used to describe something tangible that can be destroyed in a Second Death for example.

However, when we read these verses, we have to throw away that idea and say that the word Spirit now means that John the Baptist was merely 'acting'.

He was just 'Role Playing' in some silly Hollywood production and that Spirits aren't really what God says they are in this case because we have to make God's Word fit our beliefs.