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No. Its really easy.
If you work at them, like the Jews did, that is a carnal commandment. Your understanding, your work...
If they are fulfilled through you by the Lord Jesus Christ through the Holy Spirit that is spiritual.
This is absolutely elementary. If you think your understanding and your work fulfills a spiritual law then you are among the blind leading blind.
John 15:5 [FONT="]I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.[/FONT]
If you work at them, like the Jews did, that is a carnal commandment. Your understanding, your work...
If they are fulfilled through you by the Lord Jesus Christ through the Holy Spirit that is spiritual.
This is absolutely elementary. If you think your understanding and your work fulfills a spiritual law then you are among the blind leading blind.
John 15:5 [FONT="]I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.[/FONT]
this is simple not the truth, repeating a lie over and over does not make it right
Do what Paul did?
Act 13:14 But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia,
and went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and sat down.
Act 13:42 And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue,
the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.
-here was A perfect chance to tell gentials not to follow the commandments,
but here he was teaching new gentials on the sabbath, who never before keep it.
Act 13:43 Now when the congregation was broken up, many of the Jews
and religious proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas: who, speaking to them,
persuaded them to continue in the grace of God.
Act 13:44 And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together
to hear the word of God.
-why not preach the next day, why wait a whole week before speaking.
Act 16:12 And from thence to Philippi, which is the chief city of that part of
Macedonia, and a colony: and we were in that city abiding certain days.
Act 16:13 And on the sabbath we went out of the city by a river side,
where prayer was wont to be made; and we sat down, and spake unto
the women which resorted thither.
-
Act 17:1 Now when they had passed through Amphipolis and Apollonia,
they came to Thessalonica, where was a synagogue of the Jews:
Act 17:2 And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them,
and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,
-
Act 18:1 After these things Paul departed from Athens, and came to Corinth;
Act 18:2 And found a certain Jew named Aquila, born in Pontus, lately come from Italy,
with his wife Priscilla; (because that Claudius had commanded all Jews to depart
from Rome and came unto them.
Act 18:3 And because he was of the same craft, he abode with them,
and wrought: for by their occupation they were tentmakers.
Act 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath,
and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.
In each case Paul was preaching to Gentiles in Gentile cities on the Sabbath.
it is recorded over 80 times Paul preached to gentials on the sabbath day.
Paul also keep Gods Sabbath convocations[holydays], as directed by Christ
The Sabbath was instituted in Eden before the fall.
The Sabbaths will be done in the future, and done in Heaven now.
Do what Paul did?
Act 13:14 But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia,
and went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and sat down.
Act 13:42 And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue,
the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.
-here was A perfect chance to tell gentials not to follow the commandments,
but here he was teaching new gentials on the sabbath, who never before keep it.
Act 13:43 Now when the congregation was broken up, many of the Jews
and religious proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas: who, speaking to them,
persuaded them to continue in the grace of God.
Act 13:44 And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together
to hear the word of God.
-why not preach the next day, why wait a whole week before speaking.
Act 16:12 And from thence to Philippi, which is the chief city of that part of
Macedonia, and a colony: and we were in that city abiding certain days.
Act 16:13 And on the sabbath we went out of the city by a river side,
where prayer was wont to be made; and we sat down, and spake unto
the women which resorted thither.
-
Act 17:1 Now when they had passed through Amphipolis and Apollonia,
they came to Thessalonica, where was a synagogue of the Jews:
Act 17:2 And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them,
and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,
-
Act 18:1 After these things Paul departed from Athens, and came to Corinth;
Act 18:2 And found a certain Jew named Aquila, born in Pontus, lately come from Italy,
with his wife Priscilla; (because that Claudius had commanded all Jews to depart
from Rome and came unto them.
Act 18:3 And because he was of the same craft, he abode with them,
and wrought: for by their occupation they were tentmakers.
Act 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath,
and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.
In each case Paul was preaching to Gentiles in Gentile cities on the Sabbath.
it is recorded over 80 times Paul preached to gentials on the sabbath day.
Paul also keep Gods Sabbath convocations[holydays], as directed by Christ
The Sabbath was instituted in Eden before the fall.
The Sabbaths will be done in the future, and done in Heaven now.
If Jesus fulfilled them all for us why would He give us the commandments to love God and neighbour ? If all the law is done away with why would we have scripture telling us it is sin to transgress it ?
None of these scriptures make sense if they don't apply to us ! what for if we are not to DO anything ?
If one is in agreement with what GOD/Jesus say and do how can it then be seen as 'your own work ....you tell me that ! You are blatantly denying GOD's authority when you take from Him and ascribing it to man. It is you who is making a gross mistake in this.
None of these scriptures make sense if they don't apply to us ! what for if we are not to DO anything ?
If one is in agreement with what GOD/Jesus say and do how can it then be seen as 'your own work ....you tell me that ! You are blatantly denying GOD's authority when you take from Him and ascribing it to man. It is you who is making a gross mistake in this.
1. Paul was a Pharisee. A teacher of God's law. He continued to
call himself a Pharisee even after joining the church.
(Acts 23:6) Then Paul, knowing that some of them were Sadducees and the others Pharisees,
called out in the Sanhedrin, "My brothers, I am a Pharisee, descended from Pharisees.
I stand on trial because of the hope of the resurrection of the dead."
2. Paul loved God's law. It was a delight to him.
(Romans 7:22) For I delight in the law of God, in my inner being,
3. Paul called God's law holy.
(Romans 7:12) So then, the law is holy, and the commandment is holy,
righteous and good.
4. Paul knew that breaking God's law is the very definition of sin.
(1 John 3:4) Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law:
for sin is the transgression of the law.
5. Paul said that we don't nullify the law of God by our faith in Jesus Christ.
(Romans 3:31) Do we nullify the law by this faith? By no means!
Rather we uphold the law.
6. Paul often read from the scriptures on the sabbath (which is kept by the apostles 84
times in the book of Acts). And the only scriptures at that time was the old testament.
(Acts 17:2) As was his custom, Paul went into the synagogue,
and on three Sabbath days he reasoned with them from the Scriptures.
7. Paul was accused of forsaking the law of Moses when he first joined the church.
(And ironically, he's still being accused today.)
(Act 21:21) They have been informed that you teach all the Jews who live among
the Gentiles to turn away from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children
or live according to our customs.
8. These accusations were shown to be false.
(Acts 21:24) Take these men, join in their purification rites and pay their expenses,
so that they can have their heads shaved. Then everyone will know there is no truth
in these reports about you, but that you yourself are living in obedience to the law.
9. When Paul was accused of forsaking the law of Moses, he always denied this,
and said he does live according to the law.
(Acts 24:14) But this I confess to you, that according to the Way, which they call
a sect, I worship the God of our fathers, believing everything laid down by the Law
and written in the Prophets,
10. Paul said that those who refuse to submit to the law are "carnal minded"
and hostile to God.
(Romans 8:7-8) The mind governed by the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit
to God's law, nor can it do so. So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
11. Paul continued to travel to Jerusalem to celebrate God's feast days
after joining the church.
(Acts 18:21) But bade them farewell, saying, I must by all means keep this feast that
cometh in Jerusalem: but I will return again unto you, if God will. And he sailed from Ephesus.
12. Paul often quoted from Moses's writings, and cited it as authority.
(1 Corinthians 9:9-10) Do I say this merely on human authority?
Doesn’t the Law say the same thing? For it is written in the Law of Moses:
“Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain.” Is it about oxen that God
is concerned? Surely he says this for us, doesn’t he? Yes, this was written for us,
because whoever plows and threshes should be able to do so in the hope of sharing in the harvest.
13. Paul claimed that ALL scripture is good for instruction in righteousness,
and given through inspiration of God. He never singled out Moses' writings.
(2 Timothy 3:16) All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking,
correcting and training in righteousness,
14. Paul mentions that the levitical priests are still offering sacrifices to God
even after Christ's death on the cross.
(Hebrews 8:3-4) Every high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices,
and so it was necessary for this one also to have something to offer.
If he were on earth, he would not be a priest, for there are already priests
who offer the gifts prescribed by the law.
15. The most well known teaching in Paul's letters is the one where he says
"you are not under law but under grace".
Millions of people quote this scripture, they almost always leave out the scripture
that immediately follows it. Watch what happens when you add the context....
(Romans 6:14-16) For sin shall no longer be your master, because you are not under
the law, but under grace. What then? Shall we sin because we are not under the law
but under grace? By no means! Don't you know that when you offer yourselves to
someone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one you obey--whether you are
slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness?
16. Paul told the Colossians not to let anyone judge them because they were observing
God's sabbaths and feasts because these appointed times are "a shadow of things to come".
Meaning they reveal future events, just like the passover foreshadowed Christ's
sacrifice on the cross.(Colossians 2:16-17)
17. Paul never repremanded anyone for obeying God's law. Instead, he repremanded
new gentile converts, the Galatians, who were trying to be justified by the law,
instead of faith in Jesus Christ.
(Galatians 2:16) Know that a person is not justified by the works of the law, but by faith
in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by
faith in Christ and not by the works of the law, because by the works of the law no one will be justified.
18. The Galatians, who Paul was repremanding for trying to be justified by the law,
were going back to serving other gods after they were circumcised. This is why Paul
had to explain that the works of the law can't earn your salvation.
(Galatians 4: 8-11) Formerly, when you did not know God, you were slaves to those
who by nature are not gods. But now that you know God—or rather are known by God
—how is it that you are turning back to those weak and miserable forces? Do you wish
to be enslaved by them all over again? 10 You are observing special days and months
and seasons and years! I fear for you, that somehow I have wasted my efforts on you.
- those weak and miserable forces where not Gods convocation
19. Paul understood that obedience to God's law is a natural result of salvation.
Once you become a true christian, God writes His law on your heart and mind,
and causes you to walk in them.(Hebrews 10:16)
(Hebrews 10:16) "This is the covenant I will make with them after that time,
says the Lord. I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds."
20. Paul's letters come with a warning label attached to them.
(2 Peter 3:16-17) He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these
matters.His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant
and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.
Therefore, dear friends, since you have been forewarned, be on your guard so that you
may not be carried away by the error of the lawless and fall from your secure position.
call himself a Pharisee even after joining the church.
(Acts 23:6) Then Paul, knowing that some of them were Sadducees and the others Pharisees,
called out in the Sanhedrin, "My brothers, I am a Pharisee, descended from Pharisees.
I stand on trial because of the hope of the resurrection of the dead."
2. Paul loved God's law. It was a delight to him.
(Romans 7:22) For I delight in the law of God, in my inner being,
3. Paul called God's law holy.
(Romans 7:12) So then, the law is holy, and the commandment is holy,
righteous and good.
4. Paul knew that breaking God's law is the very definition of sin.
(1 John 3:4) Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law:
for sin is the transgression of the law.
5. Paul said that we don't nullify the law of God by our faith in Jesus Christ.
(Romans 3:31) Do we nullify the law by this faith? By no means!
Rather we uphold the law.
6. Paul often read from the scriptures on the sabbath (which is kept by the apostles 84
times in the book of Acts). And the only scriptures at that time was the old testament.
(Acts 17:2) As was his custom, Paul went into the synagogue,
and on three Sabbath days he reasoned with them from the Scriptures.
7. Paul was accused of forsaking the law of Moses when he first joined the church.
(And ironically, he's still being accused today.)
(Act 21:21) They have been informed that you teach all the Jews who live among
the Gentiles to turn away from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children
or live according to our customs.
8. These accusations were shown to be false.
(Acts 21:24) Take these men, join in their purification rites and pay their expenses,
so that they can have their heads shaved. Then everyone will know there is no truth
in these reports about you, but that you yourself are living in obedience to the law.
9. When Paul was accused of forsaking the law of Moses, he always denied this,
and said he does live according to the law.
(Acts 24:14) But this I confess to you, that according to the Way, which they call
a sect, I worship the God of our fathers, believing everything laid down by the Law
and written in the Prophets,
10. Paul said that those who refuse to submit to the law are "carnal minded"
and hostile to God.
(Romans 8:7-8) The mind governed by the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit
to God's law, nor can it do so. So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
11. Paul continued to travel to Jerusalem to celebrate God's feast days
after joining the church.
(Acts 18:21) But bade them farewell, saying, I must by all means keep this feast that
cometh in Jerusalem: but I will return again unto you, if God will. And he sailed from Ephesus.
12. Paul often quoted from Moses's writings, and cited it as authority.
(1 Corinthians 9:9-10) Do I say this merely on human authority?
Doesn’t the Law say the same thing? For it is written in the Law of Moses:
“Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain.” Is it about oxen that God
is concerned? Surely he says this for us, doesn’t he? Yes, this was written for us,
because whoever plows and threshes should be able to do so in the hope of sharing in the harvest.
13. Paul claimed that ALL scripture is good for instruction in righteousness,
and given through inspiration of God. He never singled out Moses' writings.
(2 Timothy 3:16) All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking,
correcting and training in righteousness,
14. Paul mentions that the levitical priests are still offering sacrifices to God
even after Christ's death on the cross.
(Hebrews 8:3-4) Every high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices,
and so it was necessary for this one also to have something to offer.
If he were on earth, he would not be a priest, for there are already priests
who offer the gifts prescribed by the law.
15. The most well known teaching in Paul's letters is the one where he says
"you are not under law but under grace".
Millions of people quote this scripture, they almost always leave out the scripture
that immediately follows it. Watch what happens when you add the context....
(Romans 6:14-16) For sin shall no longer be your master, because you are not under
the law, but under grace. What then? Shall we sin because we are not under the law
but under grace? By no means! Don't you know that when you offer yourselves to
someone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one you obey--whether you are
slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness?
16. Paul told the Colossians not to let anyone judge them because they were observing
God's sabbaths and feasts because these appointed times are "a shadow of things to come".
Meaning they reveal future events, just like the passover foreshadowed Christ's
sacrifice on the cross.(Colossians 2:16-17)
17. Paul never repremanded anyone for obeying God's law. Instead, he repremanded
new gentile converts, the Galatians, who were trying to be justified by the law,
instead of faith in Jesus Christ.
(Galatians 2:16) Know that a person is not justified by the works of the law, but by faith
in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by
faith in Christ and not by the works of the law, because by the works of the law no one will be justified.
18. The Galatians, who Paul was repremanding for trying to be justified by the law,
were going back to serving other gods after they were circumcised. This is why Paul
had to explain that the works of the law can't earn your salvation.
(Galatians 4: 8-11) Formerly, when you did not know God, you were slaves to those
who by nature are not gods. But now that you know God—or rather are known by God
—how is it that you are turning back to those weak and miserable forces? Do you wish
to be enslaved by them all over again? 10 You are observing special days and months
and seasons and years! I fear for you, that somehow I have wasted my efforts on you.
- those weak and miserable forces where not Gods convocation
19. Paul understood that obedience to God's law is a natural result of salvation.
Once you become a true christian, God writes His law on your heart and mind,
and causes you to walk in them.(Hebrews 10:16)
(Hebrews 10:16) "This is the covenant I will make with them after that time,
says the Lord. I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds."
20. Paul's letters come with a warning label attached to them.
(2 Peter 3:16-17) He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these
matters.His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant
and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.
Therefore, dear friends, since you have been forewarned, be on your guard so that you
may not be carried away by the error of the lawless and fall from your secure position.
That's not what I asked. Nonetheless, I will answer your question. Scripture says:
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work. 10 But the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God. Exodus 20:8-11 (KJV)
Please note that scripture specifies six days of work, and every seventh day is the Sabbath. One day each week. It doesn't say Saturday. It doesn't say Sunday. The early followers of Christ were Jews. I suspect that many of them kept the Jewish Sabbath and then also worshiped Jesus on Sunday. Eventually they were forced to choose between the two. They chose Jesus. I too choose Jesus rather than the laws of the Pharisees.
===========================
Okay, I answered your question. Now kindly answer mine: Do you believe it's a sin for you to judge people? Because that appears to be what you are doing in this thread: judging people. I've noticed that judging people seems to be a beam in thine own eye of those who maintain Saturday as the Sabbath. Is it?
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work. 10 But the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God. Exodus 20:8-11 (KJV)
Please note that scripture specifies six days of work, and every seventh day is the Sabbath. One day each week. It doesn't say Saturday. It doesn't say Sunday. The early followers of Christ were Jews. I suspect that many of them kept the Jewish Sabbath and then also worshiped Jesus on Sunday. Eventually they were forced to choose between the two. They chose Jesus. I too choose Jesus rather than the laws of the Pharisees.
===========================
Okay, I answered your question. Now kindly answer mine: Do you believe it's a sin for you to judge people? Because that appears to be what you are doing in this thread: judging people. I've noticed that judging people seems to be a beam in thine own eye of those who maintain Saturday as the Sabbath. Is it?
The simple truth is Paul simply went to where the people gathered. To the Jews and Greeks/Gentilers that were proselytes - he went to the synagogues on their Sabbath day when they would all be there.
The Sabbath is a type or a shadow of the real thing which is Christ Himself. Do you kiss your wife's shadow? The carnal keeping or observing a day is like kissing the shadow instead of the real thing. Come to Christ and believe in Him only - not in the Law of Moses.
You are free to observe any day how you will but if people are saying that we are not obeying the Lord because we don't observe the Jewish Mosaic Sabbath - that is an anti-Christ belief system and it is a sign of Judaziers trying to get us to desert Christ for their law-keeping which they don't even do themselves.
Christ Himself is the fulfillment of the Law - and the truth is you are not keeping Him holy or set apart because you are not honoring His work. Keep the Sabbath holy - means to spiritual see Christ as our true Sabbath rest of which the Old Covenant was a mere shadow of. Law-keepers are breaking this commandment to keep the Sabbath holy every day by refusing Christ's work and place.
Here is a great teaching to show that Jesus is the fulfillment of the 10 commandments and that we live by Him now - not in the carnal keeping of a command of the Law of Moses.
[video]http://www.gracecovenantcc.org/Messages.aspx?mid=142[/video]
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Are you trying to say Jesus Christ,when become A human person on earth
did not even know the correct sabbath day that He made long ago?
And he came to Nazareth, where he had been brought up: and, as his custom was,
he went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and stood up for to read.
The seventh day was set apart and made holy at creation...
Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made;
and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
Gen 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it:
because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
Exo 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou
shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant,
nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all
that in them is, and rested the seventh day:
wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
God (Jesus Christ) revealed the seventh day to Israel for forty YEARS.
Every meal they were reminded which day the Sabbath was.
Christ did all the creating and He knew which day the Sabbath was...
Mar 2:27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:
Mar 2:28 Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.
He passed this on to the Apostles and the church. the oracles of God
-Astronomy observence
"The human race never lost the septenary [seven day] sequence of week days and
that the Sabbath of these latter times comes down to us from Adam, though the ages,
without a single lapse."—Dr. Totten, professor of astronomy at Yale University.
"Seven has been the ancient and honored number among the nations of the earth.
They have measured their time by weeks from the beginning. The origin of this was
the Sabbath of God, as Moses has given the reasons for it in his writings."
—Dr. Lyman Coleman.
"By calculating the eclipses, it can be proven that no time has been lost and the
creation days were seven, divided into 24 hours each."—Dr. Hinkley,
The Watchman, July 1926 [Hinkley was a well-known astronomer].
"There has been no change in our calendar in past centuries that has affected in
any way the cycle of the week."—James Robertson, Director American Ephemeris,
Navy Department, U.S. Naval Observatory, Washington, D.C., March 12, 1932.
"It can be said with assurance that not a day has been lost since Creation, and all
the calendar changes notwithstanding, there has been no break in the weekly cycle."
—Dr. Frank Jeffries, Fellow of the Royal Astronomical Society and Research
Director of the Royal Observatory, Greenwich, England.
There is no question about which day the seventh day of the week is. The weekly cycle
the break between the shift from the Julian to the Gregorian calendar?
There was a well known break of 10 days.
In 1582, that Thursday the 4th was followed by Friday the 15th.
The weekly cycle was not interrupted. Now take a look at 1752, Wednesday
the 2nd was followed by Thursday the 14th. Again, the calendar had to be
adjusted to correct it to the seasons but the weekly cycle remained unchanged.
Exo 16:25 And Moses said, Eat that to day; for to day is a sabbath unto the LORD:
to day ye shall not find it in the field. Six days ye shall gather it; but on the seventh day,
which is the sabbath, in it there shall be none.
Exo 16:27 And it came to pass, that there went out some of the people on
the seventh day for to gather, and they found none.
Exo 16:28 And the LORD said unto Moses, How long refuse ye
to keep my commandments and my laws?
Exo 16:29 See, for that the LORD hath given you the sabbath, therefore
he giveth you on the sixth day the bread of two days; abide ye every man
in his place, let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.
Exo 16:30 So the people rested on the seventh day.
Notice in verse 28 that it is God speaking? This was not Moses doing,
this was straight from God's mouth.
did not even know the correct sabbath day that He made long ago?
And he came to Nazareth, where he had been brought up: and, as his custom was,
he went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and stood up for to read.
The seventh day was set apart and made holy at creation...
Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made;
and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
Gen 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it:
because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
Exo 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou
shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant,
nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
Exo 20:11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all
that in them is, and rested the seventh day:
wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
God (Jesus Christ) revealed the seventh day to Israel for forty YEARS.
Every meal they were reminded which day the Sabbath was.
Christ did all the creating and He knew which day the Sabbath was...
Mar 2:27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:
Mar 2:28 Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.
He passed this on to the Apostles and the church. the oracles of God
-Astronomy observence
"The human race never lost the septenary [seven day] sequence of week days and
that the Sabbath of these latter times comes down to us from Adam, though the ages,
without a single lapse."—Dr. Totten, professor of astronomy at Yale University.
"Seven has been the ancient and honored number among the nations of the earth.
They have measured their time by weeks from the beginning. The origin of this was
the Sabbath of God, as Moses has given the reasons for it in his writings."
—Dr. Lyman Coleman.
"By calculating the eclipses, it can be proven that no time has been lost and the
creation days were seven, divided into 24 hours each."—Dr. Hinkley,
The Watchman, July 1926 [Hinkley was a well-known astronomer].
"There has been no change in our calendar in past centuries that has affected in
any way the cycle of the week."—James Robertson, Director American Ephemeris,
Navy Department, U.S. Naval Observatory, Washington, D.C., March 12, 1932.
"It can be said with assurance that not a day has been lost since Creation, and all
the calendar changes notwithstanding, there has been no break in the weekly cycle."
—Dr. Frank Jeffries, Fellow of the Royal Astronomical Society and Research
Director of the Royal Observatory, Greenwich, England.
There is no question about which day the seventh day of the week is. The weekly cycle
the break between the shift from the Julian to the Gregorian calendar?
There was a well known break of 10 days.
In 1582, that Thursday the 4th was followed by Friday the 15th.
The weekly cycle was not interrupted. Now take a look at 1752, Wednesday
the 2nd was followed by Thursday the 14th. Again, the calendar had to be
adjusted to correct it to the seasons but the weekly cycle remained unchanged.
Exo 16:25 And Moses said, Eat that to day; for to day is a sabbath unto the LORD:
to day ye shall not find it in the field. Six days ye shall gather it; but on the seventh day,
which is the sabbath, in it there shall be none.
Exo 16:27 And it came to pass, that there went out some of the people on
the seventh day for to gather, and they found none.
Exo 16:28 And the LORD said unto Moses, How long refuse ye
to keep my commandments and my laws?
Exo 16:29 See, for that the LORD hath given you the sabbath, therefore
he giveth you on the sixth day the bread of two days; abide ye every man
in his place, let no man go out of his place on the seventh day.
Exo 16:30 So the people rested on the seventh day.
Notice in verse 28 that it is God speaking? This was not Moses doing,
this was straight from God's mouth.
Perhaps you have never read Lev 23 where in the first few verses it says that the sabbath is GOD's - not the Jews.....it belongs to GOD and is HIS holy time. Even in the NT JESUS is Lord of it, not man, though it was made for us. NOT to do with as we like but to SHARE holy time with God and Jesus.
Maybe that will help you better understand.
There have always been Strangers (non-Israelites) included with God's people since they came out of Egypt as a 'mixed multitude see Exodus and Isiah, so lets not keep up the wall of partitian and hatred.
The Sabbath was made at Creation when there was no mention of Jews and is therefore not jewish.
As for judging - I repeat what God says ! you consider that sin ?
Maybe that will help you better understand.
There have always been Strangers (non-Israelites) included with God's people since they came out of Egypt as a 'mixed multitude see Exodus and Isiah, so lets not keep up the wall of partitian and hatred.
The Sabbath was made at Creation when there was no mention of Jews and is therefore not jewish.
As for judging - I repeat what God says ! you consider that sin ?
Maybe I can come at this from a different angle...
In the revelation thread there are some very interesting things being revealed that may (or may not) be soon approaching. In Revelation chapter 7:1-3 we read
...Now one would think that means the angels are sealing the majority of believers, but no they only seal 144,000.
Revelation 7:4
...Now wait just a minute here! Did I read that right? There are only 144,000 *servants of God?? But Christianity is HUGE; billions of people; countless...but only a very small fraction of them are defined as "servants of God"? The passage doesn't say, "until we have sealed some of the servants of God" but makes a definitive statement of "the servants". As a comparison, the passage continues by pointing out another group of people "too numerous to count".
Revelation 7:9, 13-14
...So if I were to compare these two groups it would look like this:
[TABLE="class: grid, width: 500, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]"Servants of God" (sealed)[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Non-Sealed[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]144,000 tribes of Israel[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Great Multitude too many to count[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
The great multitude are not considered servants of God (because they weren't sealed) but they DO praise God because they were washed by the blood of the lamb, coming out of the great tribulation. So this second group has all the characteristics of being the billions of people in Christianity, but why aren't they considered God's servants?? Surely all who believe in God serve him right??
One would think, surely there are more servants of God than 144,000. I mean, the great multitude is definitely praising God and celebrating the cleansing of their garments with Christ's blood, so they're definitely believers. But only the 144,000 are considered servants of God (because they were sealed). The passage doesn't say "we shall seal Israel." It says "we shall seal God's servants." See where I'm going with this? There's something that distinguishes a person from being simply a believer of God, to making that person a "servant of God" and considered one of the tribes of Israel.
Now here's another interesting passage in Chapter 9 that adds even more information...
Revelation 9:1-4 & 10
...So if I were to compare these two groups again it would look like this:
[TABLE="class: grid, width: 500, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]"Servants of God" (sealed)[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Non-Sealed[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]144,000 tribes of Israel[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Great Multitude too many to count[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"]goes through the great tribulation[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]Not hurt by the plague[/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Again, shouldn't ALL believers in God be considered God's servants?? And why hurt the great multitude of believers in God who aren't sealed? Don't they praise God; celebrating being washed in Christ's blood? What is this seal of God that only a small fraction of believers earn?
---
...This was my thought process years ago when I was trying to understand Revelation. So letting the bible define itself, I started looking for any other mention of the seal of God. I knew the seal of God couldn't be Christ's blood because, again, the great multitude had Christ's blood but not God's seal, and so would equally be hurt by the plague that would come on the whole world...but the sealed 144,000 servants would remain unharmed by the plague. So in searching through scripture, I found the following passages...
Revelation 14:11
...Ok so the seal must have something to do with having the sames of Christ and God written on one's forehead. But again, why wouldn't the great multitude, who go through great tribulation and are washed in the blood, have the same name written on theirs?? Again, if they apparently had Christ (i.e. his blood) why aren't they also written upon??
2 Corinthians 1:22
...not much here to help define the seal so continuing...
Ezekiel 9:4
Ok here we go. In this scene God was about to judge HIS PEOPLE for committing adultery against him (i.e. polluting his worship through idols, etc, etc). So before his judgment fell on his people as a chastisement he sealed those who didn't have to be punished...so apparently the sealed men pleased God.
There are dozens more passages in scripture that speak about seals and marks, but the passages in Exodus 13 stand out the most...
Exodus 13:9, 13, 16 & 17
So I think this answers the riddle. The 144,000 are set apart from the great multitude of believers because they are those who follow have Christ but ALSO serve God by following his Commandments, specifically keeping his Sabbaths as a memorial like he commanded to do forever. It's important to note that both groups are believers in God and Christ...and both groups avoid the lake of fire...but only those sealed by the perpetual mark of God's Sabbaths are called "Israel, God's servants", and are able to avoid the great tribulation that comes upon all the world.
In the revelation thread there are some very interesting things being revealed that may (or may not) be soon approaching. In Revelation chapter 7:1-3 we read
...Now one would think that means the angels are sealing the majority of believers, but no they only seal 144,000.
Revelation 7:4
...Now wait just a minute here! Did I read that right? There are only 144,000 *servants of God?? But Christianity is HUGE; billions of people; countless...but only a very small fraction of them are defined as "servants of God"? The passage doesn't say, "until we have sealed some of the servants of God" but makes a definitive statement of "the servants". As a comparison, the passage continues by pointing out another group of people "too numerous to count".
Revelation 7:9, 13-14
...So if I were to compare these two groups it would look like this:
[TABLE="class: grid, width: 500, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]"Servants of God" (sealed)[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Non-Sealed[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]144,000 tribes of Israel[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Great Multitude too many to count[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
The great multitude are not considered servants of God (because they weren't sealed) but they DO praise God because they were washed by the blood of the lamb, coming out of the great tribulation. So this second group has all the characteristics of being the billions of people in Christianity, but why aren't they considered God's servants?? Surely all who believe in God serve him right??
One would think, surely there are more servants of God than 144,000. I mean, the great multitude is definitely praising God and celebrating the cleansing of their garments with Christ's blood, so they're definitely believers. But only the 144,000 are considered servants of God (because they were sealed). The passage doesn't say "we shall seal Israel." It says "we shall seal God's servants." See where I'm going with this? There's something that distinguishes a person from being simply a believer of God, to making that person a "servant of God" and considered one of the tribes of Israel.
Now here's another interesting passage in Chapter 9 that adds even more information...
Revelation 9:1-4 & 10
...So if I were to compare these two groups again it would look like this:
[TABLE="class: grid, width: 500, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]"Servants of God" (sealed)[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Non-Sealed[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]144,000 tribes of Israel[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Great Multitude too many to count[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"]goes through the great tribulation[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]Not hurt by the plague[/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
Again, shouldn't ALL believers in God be considered God's servants?? And why hurt the great multitude of believers in God who aren't sealed? Don't they praise God; celebrating being washed in Christ's blood? What is this seal of God that only a small fraction of believers earn?
---
...This was my thought process years ago when I was trying to understand Revelation. So letting the bible define itself, I started looking for any other mention of the seal of God. I knew the seal of God couldn't be Christ's blood because, again, the great multitude had Christ's blood but not God's seal, and so would equally be hurt by the plague that would come on the whole world...but the sealed 144,000 servants would remain unharmed by the plague. So in searching through scripture, I found the following passages...
Revelation 14:11
...Ok so the seal must have something to do with having the sames of Christ and God written on one's forehead. But again, why wouldn't the great multitude, who go through great tribulation and are washed in the blood, have the same name written on theirs?? Again, if they apparently had Christ (i.e. his blood) why aren't they also written upon??
2 Corinthians 1:22
...not much here to help define the seal so continuing...
Ezekiel 9:4
Ok here we go. In this scene God was about to judge HIS PEOPLE for committing adultery against him (i.e. polluting his worship through idols, etc, etc). So before his judgment fell on his people as a chastisement he sealed those who didn't have to be punished...so apparently the sealed men pleased God.
There are dozens more passages in scripture that speak about seals and marks, but the passages in Exodus 13 stand out the most...
Exodus 13:9, 13, 16 & 17
So I think this answers the riddle. The 144,000 are set apart from the great multitude of believers because they are those who follow have Christ but ALSO serve God by following his Commandments, specifically keeping his Sabbaths as a memorial like he commanded to do forever. It's important to note that both groups are believers in God and Christ...and both groups avoid the lake of fire...but only those sealed by the perpetual mark of God's Sabbaths are called "Israel, God's servants", and are able to avoid the great tribulation that comes upon all the world.
J
Thank you Yahshua, My return to God has been lonely at times, Although I started to read the Bible I could not understand all that I read so I started to look towards what others had to say and asking God to help me find the right way to him, I felt an over powering need to keep the sabbath and to find out more about it, Your post has blossomed in my heart. God bless you.
Yes, I have read Leviticus 23 before. Verse 3 concerning the Sabbath supports what I said above: The scripture specifies six days of work, and every seventh day is the Sabbath. One day each week. It doesn't say Saturday. It doesn't say Sunday.
Since you are concerned with adhering to (your interpretation of) Leviticus 23, I notice that this chapter also recognizes the Passover, the Festival of Unleavened Bread, the Offering of Firstfruits, the Festival of Weeks, the Festival of Trumpets, the Day of Atonement, and the Festival of Tabernacles. Given your strict interpretation and adherence to Leviticus 23, do you also celebrate each of these other festivals that the Lord gave to the Israelites? If not, why not?
Given your concern about whether others are properly following the law of Moses, it would seem inconsistent for you to not honor these other holy festivals that the Lord gave to Moses.
Since you are concerned with adhering to (your interpretation of) Leviticus 23, I notice that this chapter also recognizes the Passover, the Festival of Unleavened Bread, the Offering of Firstfruits, the Festival of Weeks, the Festival of Trumpets, the Day of Atonement, and the Festival of Tabernacles. Given your strict interpretation and adherence to Leviticus 23, do you also celebrate each of these other festivals that the Lord gave to the Israelites? If not, why not?
Given your concern about whether others are properly following the law of Moses, it would seem inconsistent for you to not honor these other holy festivals that the Lord gave to Moses.
I said nothing of the sort. In fact, I provided an explanation of Saturday versus Sunday. But perhaps you missed it. Here it is again:
The scripture specifies six days of work, and every seventh day is the Sabbath. It doesn't say Saturday. It doesn't say Sunday. The early followers of Christ were Jews. I suspect that many of them kept the Jewish Sabbath and then also worshiped Jesus on Sunday. Eventually they were forced to choose between the two. They chose Jesus. I too choose Jesus rather than the laws of the Pharisees.
===========================
For the third time: Do you believe it's a sin for you to judge people? Because that appears to be what you are doing in this thread: judging people. I've noticed that judging people seems to be a beam in thine own eye of those who maintain Saturday as the Sabbath. Is it?
The scripture specifies six days of work, and every seventh day is the Sabbath. It doesn't say Saturday. It doesn't say Sunday. The early followers of Christ were Jews. I suspect that many of them kept the Jewish Sabbath and then also worshiped Jesus on Sunday. Eventually they were forced to choose between the two. They chose Jesus. I too choose Jesus rather than the laws of the Pharisees.
===========================
For the third time: Do you believe it's a sin for you to judge people? Because that appears to be what you are doing in this thread: judging people. I've noticed that judging people seems to be a beam in thine own eye of those who maintain Saturday as the Sabbath. Is it?
I can agree with this JOSHUA as it could well be so, but we do not know for sure. We know that the 144.000 will be sealed and with Christ when He returns - but I can not see the others being punished before they had a chance to be corrected and shown truth....God likes to be fair and just before He resorts to punishment. I believe the time of correction is now !
J
It seems to me that this is the answer to the other sabbaths,
Therefore do not let anyone judge you with respect to food or drink, or in the matter of a feast, new moon, or Sabbath days that are only the shadow of the things to come, but the reality is Christ (Colossians 2:16-17). One person regards one day holier than other days, and another regards them all alike. Each must be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, does it for the Lord. The one who eats, eats for the Lord, because he gives thanks to God, and the one who abstains from eating, abstains for the Lord, and he gives thanks to God (Romans 14:5-6).
Only the Sabbath regarding God's day of rest is a commandment.
Therefore do not let anyone judge you with respect to food or drink, or in the matter of a feast, new moon, or Sabbath days that are only the shadow of the things to come, but the reality is Christ (Colossians 2:16-17). One person regards one day holier than other days, and another regards them all alike. Each must be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, does it for the Lord. The one who eats, eats for the Lord, because he gives thanks to God, and the one who abstains from eating, abstains for the Lord, and he gives thanks to God (Romans 14:5-6).
Only the Sabbath regarding God's day of rest is a commandment.
Yes I do honour and respect God's Holy days but you may be aware that Jesus brought changes to the law that now requires spiritually celebrating them rather than the old physical way....but they still stand and are respected. They were not only given to Israel but any Stranger who sojourned among them, all came under the same law Ex 12.
All commandments that were given to Moses contained in Ordinances are blotted out - and in any case never pertained to gentiles and/or christians. What we have are the commandments given by God personally - not Moses, Ex 20v1-17, which Jesus kept and Paul calls spiritual (eternal) holy just and good referring to 'loving God and neighbour.
As for not knowing whether the sabbath is saturday or sunday is a weak excuse for not keeping it, do you think God is unable to establish something and not make it known to His people ? Of course the disobedient and unbelievers won't know.
All commandments that were given to Moses contained in Ordinances are blotted out - and in any case never pertained to gentiles and/or christians. What we have are the commandments given by God personally - not Moses, Ex 20v1-17, which Jesus kept and Paul calls spiritual (eternal) holy just and good referring to 'loving God and neighbour.
As for not knowing whether the sabbath is saturday or sunday is a weak excuse for not keeping it, do you think God is unable to establish something and not make it known to His people ? Of course the disobedient and unbelievers won't know.
May God bless your desire to keep His Sabbath. I'm glad you found an online service to be a part of. I've been keeping the 7th day Sabbath for about 14 years now, and it has been one of the greatest blessings in my relationship with God and my ministry to Him.
A couple of thoughts about the Sabbath I've found helpful.....
The Biblical instructions on how to keep the Sabbath aren't too numerous. By reading the Biblical instructions, we see that it's pretty easy to keep. However, there are some folks who like to add additional instructions and interpretations which can weigh someone down from keeping the Sabbath. Kind of like what the Pharisees did.
While the Sabbath is a set apart and holy day of the week, any day of the week we can worship and fellowship is a good thing, just as long as we don't say that the Sabbath is "every day." It's not. So I have no problem with people fellowshipping and going to church on Sunday's or any other day of the week. As long as we remember it is the 7th day God set up as the Sabbath for eternity. If you're in need of good Christian fellowship, a Sunday church may be just fine.
Again, may God bless you as you continue to grow deeper in your relationship with Him!
A couple of thoughts about the Sabbath I've found helpful.....
The Biblical instructions on how to keep the Sabbath aren't too numerous. By reading the Biblical instructions, we see that it's pretty easy to keep. However, there are some folks who like to add additional instructions and interpretations which can weigh someone down from keeping the Sabbath. Kind of like what the Pharisees did.
While the Sabbath is a set apart and holy day of the week, any day of the week we can worship and fellowship is a good thing, just as long as we don't say that the Sabbath is "every day." It's not. So I have no problem with people fellowshipping and going to church on Sunday's or any other day of the week. As long as we remember it is the 7th day God set up as the Sabbath for eternity. If you're in need of good Christian fellowship, a Sunday church may be just fine.
Again, may God bless you as you continue to grow deeper in your relationship with Him!