RE: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

[DanD]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

What do you think is my point of view?

You already expressed your point of view, by trying to argue that all believers in Christ are under the admonition Paul specifically gave to bishops, elders, and deacons, not to Priests or Kings.

 

[samuel23]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

Hi Dan: Why did you say I was judgmental against those who practice Polygamy? For one thing you cannot practice polygamy in the US because it is against the law. If you practice it in a country that allows it then that is your business, however you cannot be a leader in the church.

 

[Chokmahiel]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

You already expressed your point of view, by trying to argue that all believers in Christ are under the admonition Paul specifically gave to bishops, elders, and deacons, not to Priests or Kings.

If that is the admonition of the Holy Apostle Paul, is it my point of view?

 

[DanD]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

No, I am not. Being faithful means just that. If you think being faithful to your wife means or includes having sex with other women, you are terribly deceived.

I don't think it means having sex with any woman who is not one of your wives. You have a 21st century understanding of what was meant by being faithful. If you want to use that passage, you need a Biblical understanding of what God meant by being faithful, or you end up applying a meaning to the text that God never intended, and you yourself are sadly deceived.

 

[Magenta]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

Nowhere in that passage is it ever indicated that having a second wife is being unfaithful to the first wife.

So your idea of fidelity includes having sexual relations with others? Such deception!

 

[Magenta]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

I don't think it means having sex with any woman who is not one of your wives. You have a 21st century understanding of what was meant by being faithful. If you want to use that passage, you need a Biblical understanding of what God meant by being faithful, or you end up applying a meaning to the text that God never intended, and you yourself are sadly deceived.

No, your proclivity to sexual promiscuity tells you you can have as many women as you want as long as you marry them, and you rationalize it by perverting Scripture. Go read up about Hosea.

 

[DanD]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

Hi Dan: Why did you say I was judgmental against those who practice Polygamy? For one thing you cannot practice polygamy in the US because it is against the law. If you practice it in a country that allows it then that is your business, however you cannot be a leader in the church.

I am only saying that I am hopeful that you are not judgmental, which is more a general statement that I hope everyone who reads this takes to heart. Polygamy is sadly against the law in the US, just as mixed race marriage at one time was illegal in certain states. As a Christian, I stand for the Biblical definition of marriage, and oppose any attempt to change that definition. In the US and other countries, certain unions have been defined as marriage that go against that Biblical standard. It is my contention that we should only go as far as Scripture allows when it comes to our decision making regarding who we vote for, and what ballot measures we should or should not approve of.

 

[DanD]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

No, your proclivity to sexual promiscuity tells you you can have as many women as you want as long as you marry them, and you rationalize it by perverting Scripture. Go read up about Hosea.

I have not perverted any Scriptures. You have. Sex within the boundaries of marriage is Biblical. I have read about Hosea. I am not sure what your point is.

 

[DanD]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

So your idea of fidelity includes having sexual relations with others? Such deception!

Nope. You are putting words into my mouth.

 

[Magenta]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

The clearest evidence that monogamy is God’s ideal is from Christ’s teaching on marriage in Matt. 19:3–6. In this passage, He cited the Genesis creation account, in particular Gen. 1:27 and 2:24, saying ‘the two will become one flesh’, not more than two.

Another important biblical teaching is the parallel of husband and wife with Christ and the Church in Eph. 5:22–33, which makes sense only with monogamy—Jesus will not have multiple brides.

The 10[SUP]th[/SUP] Commandment ‘… You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife [singular] …’ (Exodus 20:17) also presupposes the ideal that there is only one wife. Polygamy is expressly forbidden for church elders (1 Tim. 3:2). And this is not just for elders, because Paul also wrote: ‘each man should have his own wife, and each woman her own husband.’Paul goes on to explain marital duties in terms that make sense only with one husband to one wife.

The example of godly people is also important. Isaac and Rebekah were monogamous—they are often used as a model in Jewish weddings today. Other examples were Joseph and Asenath, and Moses and Zipporah. The only survivors of the Flood were four monogamous couples.

All others were wicked and destroyed. Does the Bible clearly teach monogamy? - creation.com

 

[DanD]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

If that is the admonition of the Holy Apostle Paul, is it my point of view?

You have gone outside what the apostle Paul admonished. You are trying to put words into Paul's mouth that he never intended.

 

[DanD]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

I have already addressed this.

The clearest evidence that monogamy is God’s ideal is from Christ’s teaching on marriage in Matt. 19:3–6. In this passage, He cited the Genesis creation account, in particular Gen. 1:27 and 2:24, saying ‘the two will become one flesh’, not more than two.

Another important biblical teaching is the parallel of husband and wife with Christ and the Church in Eph. 5:22–33, which makes sense only with monogamy—Jesus will not have multiple brides.

The 10[SUP]th[/SUP] Commandment ‘… You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife [singular] …’ (Exodus 20:17) also presupposes the ideal that there is only one wife. Polygamy is expressly forbidden for church elders (1 Tim. 3:2). And this is not just for elders, because Paul also wrote: ‘each man should have his own wife, and each woman her own husband.’Paul goes on to explain marital duties in terms that make sense only with one husband to one wife.

Righteouswarriors has already addressed this. The Greek words used for "own" are different for husband and wife.

The example of godly people is also important. Isaac and Rebekah were monogamous—they are often used as a model in Jewish weddings today. Other examples were Joseph and Asenath, and Moses and Zipporah. The only survivors of the Flood were four monogamous couples.

All others were wicked and destroyed. Does the Bible clearly teach monogamy? - creation.com

 

[Magenta]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

A very important point to remember is that not everything recorded in the Bible is approved in the Bible. Consider where polygamy originated—first in the line of the murderer Cain, not the line of Seth. The first recorded polygamist was the murderer Lamech (Gen. 4:23–24). Then Esau, who despised his birthright, also caused much grief to his parents by marrying two pagan wives (Gen. 26:34).

God also forbade the kings of Israel to be polygamous (Deut. 17:17). Look at the trouble when they disobeyed, including deadly sibling rivalry between David’s sons from his different wives (2 Samuel 13, 1 Kings 2); and Solomon’s hundreds of wives helped lead Solomon to idolatry (1 Kings 11:1–3). Also, Hannah, Samuel’s mother, was humiliated by her husband Elkanah’s other wife Peninnah (1 Sam. 1:1–7).

What about godly men who were polygamous?

Abraham and Sarah would have been monogamous apart from a low point in their faith when Hagar became a second wife—note how much strife this caused later. Jacob only wanted Rachel, but was tricked into marrying her older sister Leah, and later he took their slave girls at the sisters’ urging, due to the rivalry between the sisters. Jacob was hardly at a spiritual high point at those times, and neither was David when he added Abigail and Ahinoam (1 Sam. 25:42–43).

Why did God seem to allow it, then?

It is more like the case of divorce, which God tolerated for a while under certain conditions because of the hardness of their hearts, but was not the way it was intended from the beginning (Matt. 19:8). But whenever the Mosaic law had provisions for polygamy, it was always the conditional: ‘If he takes another wife to himself …’ (Ex.21:10), never an encouragement. God put a number of obligations of the husband towards the additional wives which would discourage polygamy. In view of the problems it causes, it is no wonder that polygamy was unknown among the Jews after the Babylonian exile, and monogamy was the rule even among the Greeks and Romans by New Testament times. Does the Bible clearly teach monogamy? - creation.com

 

[Chokmahiel]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

You have gone outside what the apostle Paul admonished. You are trying to put words into Paul's mouth that he never intended.

What words have I put into the Holy Apostle Paul's mouth?

 

[DanD]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

A very important point to remember is that not everything recorded in the Bible is approved in the Bible. Consider where polygamy originated—first in the line of the murderer Cain, not the line of Seth. The first recorded polygamist was the murderer Lamech (Gen. 4:23–24). Then Esau, who despised his birthright, also caused much grief to his parents by marrying two pagan wives (Gen. 26:34).

God also forbade the kings of Israel to be polygamous (Deut. 17:17). Look at the trouble when they disobeyed, including deadly sibling rivalry between David’s sons from his different wives (2 Samuel 13, 1 Kings 2); and Solomon’s hundreds of wives helped lead Solomon to idolatry (1 Kings 11:1–3). Also, Hannah, Samuel’s mother, was humiliated by her husband Elkanah’s other wife Peninnah (1 Sam. 1:1–7).

What about godly men who were polygamous?

Abraham and Sarah would have been monogamous apart from a low point in their faith when Hagar became a second wife—note how much strife this caused later. Jacob only wanted Rachel, but was tricked into marrying her older sister Leah, and later he took their slave girls at the sisters’ urging, due to the rivalry between the sisters. Jacob was hardly at a spiritual high point at those times, and neither was David when he added Abigail and Ahinoam (1 Sam. 25:42–43).

Why did God seem to allow it, then?

It is more like the case of divorce, which God tolerated for a while under certain conditions because of the hardness of their hearts, but was not the way it was intended from the beginning (Matt. 19:8). But whenever the Mosaic law had provisions for polygamy, it was always the conditional: ‘If he takes another wife to himself …’ (Ex.21:10), never an encouragement. God put a number of obligations of the husband towards the additional wives which would discourage polygamy. In view of the problems it causes, it is no wonder that polygamy was unknown among the Jews after the Babylonian exile, and monogamy was the rule even among the Greeks and Romans by New Testament times. Does the Bible clearly teach monogamy? - creation.com

I will address this at a later time, when I have more time to do so.

 

[DanD]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

What words have I put into the Holy Apostle Paul's mouth?

Priests and Kings.

 

[Magenta]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

Nope. You are putting words into my mouth.

You promote polygamy but say it does not include having sexual
relations with others? Just how stupid do you think people are?

 

[samuel23]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

Hi Dan: I am not against polygamy as long as the woman has not in any way been forced by manipulation into a plural marriage. It would have never worked for me, I had trouble finding just one woman that was willing to put up with me,he,he.

 

[DanD]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

Hi Dan: I am not against polygamy as long as the woman has not in any way been forced by manipulation into a plural marriage. It would have never worked for me, I had trouble finding just one woman that was willing to put up with me,he,he.

I am right there with you. Enjoy your marriage!

 

[Magenta]

Re: Polygamy -- continuation of older thread.

Hi Dan: I am not against polygamy as long as the woman has not in any way been forced by manipulation into a plural marriage. It would have never worked for me, I had trouble finding just one woman that was willing to put up with me,he,he.

Of course women (and girls) were forced into it. And they still are.

Mohammed married a six year old.