Lord we need you! Foundational truths

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the gospel is about repentance, confession and walking righteously


  • Total voters
    16
A

Ariel82

Guest
How does someone gain salvation? Well, the Lord comes in and rescues us from the messes we make of our lives, but then he expects us to learn from our mistakes.

How does the Lord want us to live our lives? He wants us to obey his commandments and have fun.
What about Jesus?

What happens if obeying His commandments isn't fun? Should we ignore them and just focus on the fun?
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
Fyi, if you haven't noticed I am reading the thread backwards, lol.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
I think the idea is let them see what the Gospel (Jesus) has done for US. This is what I WAS, this is now what I am. Especially if they knew you before being born again. I WAS a sinner,... drunkard, fornicator gossiper, fill in the blank, who didn't love people. But I was miserable and lost. NOW, I have a hope and joy because of who Jesus is, and what He has done for me and to me.

They don't need me to tell them they are filthy sinners. Before Jesus sent the Holy Spirit they needed to be told that they were sinners. Unless their conscience is seared, they KNOW they need a Savior. John 16:[FONT=&quot]7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot]8 And when He has come, He will convict the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot]9 of sin, because they do not believe in Me; [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot]10 of righteousness, because I go to My Father and you see Me no more; [/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot]11 of judgment, because the ruler of this world is judged.

[/FONT]
Now they need to see Him in US, so that they desire Him too.

So let's give them the Gospel and pray they accept it.
What if you as an unbeliever live more righteously than those who claim to have Jesus in their life?

I wasn't raised Christian and I followed the rules better than the teenagers preaching at me about Jesus.

I even read the Bible more than they did. I could quote more verses and they couldn't answer my questions. Even the preachers they introduced me to were disappointing, because they preached at me and prayed for me, but never took the time to listen and pray with me.

Maybe when I have time, some day I will tell you some of my life story and how God called me to Him.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
LOL In this case, I understood because she's got my background in faith. We're reformed, so get reformed go-to verses. lol
Zone was one of the first people I ever fought with on this site. We go way back. I love her dearly and we have gone through a lot over the years. Still a few things we debate about, but we agree on the basics.

I just wanted her to explain more fully so we can prevent misunderstandings if possible.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
TEST the voices, Ariel! There have been many times, in my past, where I was taken before the "Councils of God", and found wanting! DON'T give up, and DON'T give in! WRESTLE with that beast! EARN acts attributable towards righteousness! within your OWN self!

Why did Paul state that which he said about "breast milk?"....Ya remember the story when the people of Israel were transporting the Ark Of The Covenant, back to Jerusalem? And the cart ran over a stone or something, which caused the Ark to teeter? And this guy with EVERY GOOD INTENTION, just touched, the Ark, in trying to steady it?...Yeah! Tis a lot like that!
But God isn't going to strike us dead, is He?

, so yeah we need to test the voices but I don't get your analogy with the ark.

Could you explain?
 
Jan 21, 2017
647
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Lets not turn this into a problem.

Repent, believe, be baptized in water, grow in knowledge and sanctification.

Thats all there is to it folks.
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
13,413
8,945
113
I have no idea how you explain why a bloody cross and all the talk of sacrifice.

I've seen many children, teens, and young adults understand the Gospel, and believe and accept it, and their need for a Savior, WITHOUT explaining to them what a grain offering, peace offering, sin offering, trespass offering, was, or get into the daily animal bloodletting, that was all prophetic of Jesus Christ.

They simply heard that God came to save the world in the form of a human being, paid the price for THEIR wrongdoings (sin), and rose to life.

As they grow in faith, they learn more and more from the Word. Including the sacrificial system and it's relation to Jesus.
 

PennEd

Senior Member
Apr 22, 2013
13,413
8,945
113
What if you as an unbeliever live more righteously than those who claim to have Jesus in their life?

I wasn't raised Christian and I followed the rules better than the teenagers preaching at me about Jesus.

I even read the Bible more than they did. I could quote more verses and they couldn't answer my questions. Even the preachers they introduced me to were disappointing, because they preached at me and prayed for me, but never took the time to listen and pray with me.

Maybe when I have time, some day I will tell you some of my life story and how God called me to Him.
More righteous by who's standard? I haven't met an unsaved person, who WE might consider righteous, that wasn't also SELF-righteous.

But you do illustrate why it is so important not to take the Lord's Name in vain. And by that I mean call ourselves by His Name and then act in a un-Christlike manner.
 

Blain

The Word Weaver
Aug 28, 2012
19,212
2,547
113
More righteous by who's standard? I haven't met an unsaved person, who WE might consider righteous, that wasn't also SELF-righteous.

But you do illustrate why it is so important not to take the Lord's Name in vain. And by that I mean call ourselves by His Name and then act in a un-Christlike manner.



that's a shame because I have met several unsaved people who could easily be called righteous. I know several people who are unsaved and while having many flaws have some of the most virtuous hearts i have ever met, they stand for what is right and care for the needs of others. They are atheists but I always pray for God to come into their hearts because once he does they will be some of his greatest warriors.

I don't know how you see things but for me personally i look to the heart not if they are saved are not to decide things about them. true it is vital they be saved but a righteous person is one who stands for good and who shows this virtue in all they do and believe it or not many of them are not who you might expect
 
Jan 21, 2017
647
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A

Ariel82

Guest
More righteous by who's standard? I haven't met an unsaved person, who WE might consider righteous, that wasn't also SELF-righteous.

But you do illustrate why it is so important not to take the Lord's Name in vain. And by that I mean call ourselves by His Name and then act in a un-Christlike manner.
Most Christians fall into the trap of being self righteous hypocrites too.

It took me a long time to be able to tell the difference between the gospel Jesus preached and what the rest of the world teaches.

It will probably take me a lifetime to learn to live it.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
I've seen many children, teens, and young adults understand the Gospel, and believe and accept it, and their need for a Savior, WITHOUT explaining to them what a grain offering, peace offering, sin offering, trespass offering, was, or get into the daily animal bloodletting, that was all prophetic of Jesus Christ.

They simply heard that God came to save the world in the form of a human being, paid the price for THEIR wrongdoings (sin), and rose to life.

As they grow in faith, they learn more and more from the Word. Including the sacrificial system and it's relation to Jesus.
One would hope, but many just "fall away" because they never had very deep roots in study or prayer.
 
A

Ariel82

Guest
Lets not turn this into a problem.

Repent, believe, be baptized in water, grow in knowledge and sanctification.

Thats all there is to it folks.
Why baptized in water and not the Holy Spirit?
 

Billyd

Senior Member
May 8, 2014
5,169
1,571
113
One of the things that Grace7 says often is that we must look at the word through the lens of Christ (something to that effect). I believe that this statement is very true when we read or teach the OT and the law. If we fail to do this, we confuse ourselves and others that we try to teach it to.

Thank you, Ariel, for bringing this thread. The BDF seems to always get hung up on how to be saved, and never gets to the real meat of the Gospel. We are Saved, now what?

My question for everyone. When you have shared the Gospel with a person, and that person accepts Christ as his Savior, What do you do next? I suspect that many will hand that person a track or a bible, and never speak to him/her again.
 
Nov 22, 2015
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So you are saying I can sit on the mountain top and meditate upon God and everything He has done for me and we would be groovy?

Can you give a real life example of what "God's love flowing to others" look like?
NO I am not saying that we just sit on a mountain and meditate on God and we will be groovy. Why would you come up with that type of foolishness?

A real life example would be driving some one to get food. There are a million things that can show God's love flowing to others.
 
Jan 21, 2017
647
28
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Why baptized in water and not the Holy Spirit?
Both. The order is different in scriptures. Sometimes people get the Spirit before, at or after water baptism but both baptisms definately are included in the foundations as per hebrews chapter 6
 
Nov 22, 2015
20,436
1,431
0
One of the things that Grace7 says often is that we must look at the word through the lens of Christ (something to that effect). I believe that this statement is very true when we read or teach the OT and the law. If we fail to do this, we confuse ourselves and others that we try to teach it to.

Thank you, Ariel, for bringing this thread. The BDF seems to always get hung up on how to be saved, and never gets to the real meat of the Gospel. We are Saved, now what?

My question for everyone. When you have shared the Gospel with a person, and that person accepts Christ as his Savior, What do you do next? I suspect that many will hand that person a track or a bible, and never speak to him/her again.

I agree. Without looking at scripture through the finished work of Christ we can get ourselves all messed up between the Old and New Covenant. The bible is progressive revelation of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Without the epistles of Paul we would have no idea what happened from the cross to the throne by just reading the 4 gospels. We wouldn't know that we too died on the cross with Christ and were risen from the dead with Him.

Here in Acts 20 is what Paul did about leaving people with the Lord. After doing this below - he would then pray his prayers in his epistles for them - that the Father would grant them to be strengthened with might by His Spirit in the inner man - give them a spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of Christ. That their love would abound more with real knowledge and all discernment.

Acts 20:32 (NASB)
[SUP]32 [/SUP] "And now I commend you to God and to the word of His grace, which is able to build you up and to give you the inheritance among all those who are sanctified.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
One of the things that Grace7 says often is that we must look at the word through the lens of Christ (something to that effect). I believe that this statement is very true when we read or teach the OT and the law. If we fail to do this, we confuse ourselves and others that we try to teach it to.

Thank you, Ariel, for bringing this thread. The BDF seems to always get hung up on how to be saved, and never gets to the real meat of the Gospel. We are Saved, now what?

My question for everyone. When you have shared the Gospel with a person, and that person accepts Christ as his Savior, What do you do next? I suspect that many will hand that person a track or a bible, and never speak to him/her again.
work with them immediately to be baptized