Not By Works

[FranC]

No...we are NOT to do good works in the way that some seem to be implying.

Good works are a natural manifestation of the fruit of the spirit on us the branches that are on the Vine. They are Christ's good works flowing in and through us.

I also have said this many times . We are working with the Lord in the family business of telling people of the love and grace of our loving Father and Lord towards them.

We get to participate in the good works that God has prepared for us to walk in before the foundation of the world. Eph 2:10.

It is NOT a requirement for salvation that some try to make it out to be. That is where the hang-up is it seems with these different views from people which is exactly what blue_ladybug was trying to get across in this thread as well as a whole host of others.

So you're answer is NO.
We are NOT to do works.

Then why did JESUS say this:

John 15:14-15 Amplified Bible (AMP)

14 You are my friends if you keep on doing what I command you.

 

[FranC]

I know you are not saying works save.

Sanctification is two way.

We we have to cooperate with God.
Trust me I know this

God asked me once to go and offer to pray for a women who was dying, sad as she was in her 30's.
I only got to know her because her husband owned a corner shop where my company got our tea and coffee from.

Any way God has asked to me offer prayer. They didn't know I was a Christian.

So I am sat in my car as I parked up. Arguing with God, no I can't do it, not gonna do it. He insisted as he insisted I'm throwing my hands up in the air and talking out loud.

Goodness knows what the poor lady in the parking space next to me thought.

Anyway with a grump I went and offered, only to be toled by the husband Don't do it cause if you do she is going to tell you what she thinks of God and tell you where to stick it"

Anyway I went, did because God asked me to, but before I left her husband I asked him, please let her know I'm willing to pray and that God loves her, he said he would"

So my hope is he did and my ultimate hope is "Jesus forgive me"

AGREED AGAIN!

Maybe we're there???
Our final destination...we understand what we're saying!

 

[JIMBO43]

You wouldn't have to pay your bills on time, if they were already paid for by someone else.

your speaking of past tho and not present of course.. ?

 

[PeterJens]

I had a thought. God is there going, who is actually listening to me?

One group say Jesus does it all, we do nothing ourselves, rather we realise He does it all.
We show we believe this by doing nothing, because doing something is an insult to God
who does it all. So nothing has to change, no fruit, no separation from the world, narda.

Another group believe God, listen to Him and follow His commands, becoming like
Him in everything they do.

Now the world listens to everyone, and does what it likes, sinning and doing evil wherever
they go. They are doomed to judgement. Now who is like them, and who is not?

If God says do this, obey me, guess who He loves and who He does not love?

God is not quiet on this issue. He destroyed nations, butchered people, swallowed people
into the earth, blasted them with fire. And those who listen and do, He saved from fire,
delivered from prison, stopped lions from eating them.

God is not silent, you have to be willfully blind not to see.

I know what the outcome will be, most will carry on because the heart is stronger than Gods
word or will in their lives, even though healing is a prayer away.

 

[BillG]

First of all, I never said that he was dumb. I simply reiterated to him, ad nauseam, that we don't need daily salvation..

I didn't say you said he is dumb.

I said we are all dumb.

Now I have said that I am going to put a duvet over my head with a tin helmet on and hide behind the sofa

 

[Grace777x70]

Hi G7,

Actually I also get from your past posts that Jesus is doing it all. And even in this post that you clarified your ideas are still saying that Jesus does it, but we're participating in it somehow.

How I believe scripture teaches us is that we do it all........through obedience and through the power and life He's given us.

In other words work out your salvation with fear and trembling. I'm doing the work, but it's God who enables me. He's not working out my salvation in that command. I am, but it's through His power and His giftings so the glory goes to Him for what He's done in me. But it's still me doing the doing.

In many of your posts you say Jesus is doing it. He's not doing it in the way you've said He is. Maybe what you write isn't what you mean, but we can only go by what you've written.

I thought you might like to know that Fran isn't the only one misunderstanding you if you mean differently that what you've written.

I understand what you are saying because sometimes the things of the Spirit are confusing to our minds. = well they are to me anyways until the Lord gives me more clarity on some subjects.

Sometimes this is like trying to explain to someone about speaking in tongues and they have not had their minds renewed to this truth yet. It is difficult for them to understand this with the natural mind and with our current understanding.

I have this very same thing happen to me all the time in truths that the Lord is trying to show me. It's a process. Line upon line.

At no point did I say that we don't do anything - that we do not participate in it - I am simply saying that the "doing" is a product of His life being manifested in us and we participate in it with the Lord.

I have said this about 30x times but I'll say it again.

For it is God who is at work in us both to will ( He gives us the desire ) and to do ( He gives us the capability ) of His good pleasure. Phil. 2:13

 

[JIMBO43]

No...we are NOT to do good works in the way that some seem to be implying.

Good works are a natural manifestation of the fruit of the spirit on us the branches that are on the Vine. They are Christ's good works flowing in and through us.

I also have said this many times . We are working with the Lord in the family business of telling people of the love and grace of our loving Father and Lord towards them.

We get to participate in the good works that God has prepared for us to walk in before the foundation of the world. Eph 2:10.

It is NOT a requirement for salvation that some try to make it out to be. That is where the hang-up is it seems with these different views from people which is exactly what blue_ladybug was trying to get across in this thread as well as a whole host of others.

Your refering to the the fruits of the seed... well guess what even a seed needs a foundation............... end of story... there is one seed that must come from the believer first....that is sincerity which is the foundation seed...

 

[blue_ladybug]

His answer is YES. But those works are not done to keep salvation. THAT'S what we're trying to get you to understand.

So you're answer is NO.
We are NOT to do works.

Then why did JESUS say this:

John 15:14-15 Amplified Bible (AMP)

14 You are my friends if you keep on doing what I command you.

 

[JIMBO43]

so has anyone just watched the holy spirit come over 1 million people gathered in prayer..... wow...........i wonder how many the holy spirit touched..

 

[BillG]

so has anyone just watched the holy spirit come over 1 million people gathered in prayer..... wow...........i wonder how many the holy spirit touched..

Cant say I have but I would love to see it

 

[FranC]

I didn't say you said he is dumb.

I said we are all dumb.

Now I have said that I am going to put a duvet over my head with a tin helmet on and hide behind the sofa

I miss those emoticons...

 

[PennEd]

All I see going on here is tactics usually employed by a bullying lawyer, or pharisee if you will.

Insisting that people give one word answers to a rigged question proves nothing but that the person doing it is a bullying lawyer.

If the question was framed fairly, it would say "Do you have to do works to gain eternal life, or is Jesus Sacrificial death and subsequent resurrection sufficient for our eternal life".

No games. No twisting people's answers. Either WE HAVE to do works for Salvation, OR Jesus' Sacrifice is SOLELY what saves us.

 

[FranC]

His answer is YES. But those works are not done to keep salvation. THAT'S what we're trying to get you to understand.

Blue,

Relax. Take it easy.

There's not much you need to make me understand.
Just trust me on this.

I just DON'T AGREE.

 

[JIMBO43]

for those who missed the holy spirit just desecend over 1.7 million people .........[video=youtube;eyr8z8MyVK4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyr8z8MyVK4[/video]

 

[Grace777x70]

So you're answer is NO.
We are NOT to do works.

Then why did JESUS say this:

John 15:14-15 Amplified Bible (AMP)

14 You are my friends if you keep on doing what I command you.

It's obvious you didn't listen or couldn't hear what I am really saying. Just forget it. It's ok...

We don't take what are "descriptions" of the life of Christ being manifested in us and then "dictate" we are to do them. They are a product of our union with Christ.

I will say that the more we behold the glory/goodness of the Lord as in a mirror - the more His life will be manifested in us as the Holy Spirit transforms us. 2 Cor. 3:171-18

Transformation is really the emerging new man that is in Christ being manifested in our bodies while we are here on this earth.

This transformation of what already is in us in Christ in our new creation ( It is not called a "new evolution" ) can be seen by man as our minds get renewed to the truth of Christ's work for us. Rom. 12:2

We are simply "being" who we already are when we "put on Christ".

The new man in Christ is like the invisible man - when he put clothes on, people could then see him. We put on Christ and people see the new man in Christ manifested and God gets glorified. This is the "good works" that we get to participate in with our Lord.

This all happens by grace through faith in what Christ has done and we participate in it with Him for it is God who is at work in us both to will and to do of His good pleasure. He will be faithful to us. Phil. 2:13

 

[BillG]

Anyway this man here who turned 49 today and celebrated his birthday is soon off to bed.

Did I tell anyone today is my birthday? Don't think I did.

Hey everyone today is my birthday. Have I told you that already?

No need to sing happy birthday to me, no seriously you don't have to.

Ok if you insist.

 

[FranC]

All I see going on here is tactics usually employed by a bullying lawyer, or pharisee if you will.

Insisting that people give one word answers to a rigged question proves nothing but that the person doing it is a bullying lawyer.

If the question was framed fairly, it would say "Do you have to do works to gain eternal life, or is Jesus Sacrificial death and subsequent resurrection sufficient for our eternal life".

No games. No twisting people's answers. Either WE HAVE to do works for Salvation, OR Jesus' Sacrifice is SOLELY what saves us.

A bullying lawyer or a pharisee?

Thanks. It's Always nice to hear a good word.

How else to get to the bottom of a question that has been going on for pages and pages.

Do you think YOU'VE solved it with the above post??

 

[BillG]

I miss those emoticons...

Cant recall a dumb sheep one

 

[88]

Anyway this man here who turned 49 today and celebrated his birthday is soon off to bed.

Did I tell anyone today is my birthday? Don't think I did.

Hey everyone today is my birthday. Have I told you that already?

No need to sing happy birthday to me, no seriously you don't have to.

Ok if you insist.

*** happy birthday Mel...

 

[BillG]

Cant recall a dumb sheep one

Maybe I should post a selfie, then people could see the face of a dumb sheep