Son's of God Genesis 6:1-8

[Denadii]

Yes it is that no one will take the contextual challenge, because it can not be done. I notice none of you guys that talk book of enoch and the such. Will not go from Genesis 4:11-6:1 explain how they are. Then show from that context how Genesis 6:2, 4 are fallen angels in that context. It's not a trick question, it's simple hermeneutics.

Johnny B....What is your problem?! We are not insisting that the bible says they were angels...But you also cannot say the Bible says they were men...In all of the Old Covenant the phrase 'Sons of God' refers to angels who were made by God. Thus they were sons. In the New Covenant the phrase 'sons of God' refers to the adopted children of the most high... You have still not explained how, if the sons of God were men, where the giants came from..They did result from this joining of the 'sons' with the daughters of men....Men and women make human babies...NOT GIANTS....Why are we not seeing giants born today from men and women. So stop yelling about how we won't take some silly challenge and answer some questions....My goodness boy! You guys sound like democrats...

 

[dcontroversal]

Yes it is that no one will take the contextual challenge, because it can not be done. I notice none of you guys that talk book of enoch and the such. Will not go from Genesis 4:11-6:1 explain how they are. Then show from that context how Genesis 6:2, 4 are fallen angels in that context. It's not a trick question, it's simple hermeneutics.

Cannot is one word......and who needs Enoch....the context....the contradiction between the Sons of God and daughters of Adam as well as Judes sexual cannotation with the use of strange flesh is sufficient....the Sons of God is not a concept applied unto men until the New Testament...Adam was a son of God....after that MEN are the sons of MAN.....SO.....your little "gone to seed" challenge means zero!

 

[dcontroversal]

Johnny B....What is your problem?! We are not insisting that the bible says they were angels...But you also cannot say the Bible says they were men...In all of the Old Covenant the phrase 'Sons of God' refers to angels who were made by God. Thus they were sons. In the New Covenant the phrase 'sons of God' refers to the adopted children of the most high... You have still not explained how, if the sons of God were men, where the giants came from..They did result from this joining of the 'sons' with the daughters of men....Men and women make human babies...NOT GIANTS....Why are we not seeing giants born today from men and women. So stop yelling about how we won't take some silly challenge and answer some questions....My goodness boy! You guys sound like democrats...

Amen to that......he makes me think of the workers for and cake takers that push works for salvation even though Paul and Jesus both hammer it.....he would argue with a fence post that it was not a fence post if he thought it was a telephone pole....!

 

[Denadii]

Amen to that......he makes me think of the workers for and cake takers that push works for salvation even though Paul and Jesus both hammer it.....he would argue with a fence post that it was not a fence post if he thought it was a telephone pole....!

That's about it my friend. Democrat thinking. The louder you yell it the more true it is?

 

[dcontroversal]

That's about it my friend. Democrat thinking. The louder you yell it the more true it is?

Exactly......I challenge you to knock this chip off my shoulder<----the Pharisees had the same approach....yell a bit, have you threatened, then beaten and if that don't work...crucify him and give us the thief instead....!

 

[Denadii]

Exactly......I challenge you to knock this chip off my shoulder<----the Pharisees had the same approach....yell a bit, have you threatened, then beaten and if that don't work...crucify him and give us the thief instead....!

Hmmm Do you think we should start running? LOL

 

[Johnny_B]

Hello JohnTalmid,

I totally agree with you. I have my own copy of Ethiopic Enoch and it sheds much light on what Genesis 6:1-4 barely touches on, including the corruption caused by the angels, the sons of heaven and why the flood took place. It also mentions Noah and the flood itself. The prophesies of Enoch was itself apart of the scriptures up to the 3rd century. Those who dismiss it as not being God-breathed miss out on a lot of detailed information regarding the events related to the angels, the sons of God who took for themselves wives.

Can either one of you show us how that book shades light of the context of Genesis 4:11-6:4? Because if you don't understand who the Scriptures are talking about you don't know who is in Genesis 6:1-4. The only way you theory works is by taking it out of context, which you have to do for your theory to work.

But I like the way you guys stick together and pat each other on the back, because you agree with each other, but a simple exegete of the Scriptures in context tells the story and reveals how the sons of God are in Genesis 6:2, 4. But you would rather eisegete the context of the story. A simple exegete of Genesis 6:4 shows that the nephilim are not the result of Genesis 6:2 ESV "The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward(nephilim were in those days and after, what days?), when the sons of God came in to the daughters of man and they bore children to them (who were these children?). These were (not the nephilim, they were already on the earth, they were) the mighty men who were of old, the men of renown."

That's how simple it is if you go from Genesis 4:11-6:1 to understand Genesis 6:2, 4, with Genesis 6:3, 5-7 further confirming the context that they were not fall angels or angels. You can go outside the context of the story line and outside the Bible it does not change the context of the story or make fallen angels part of the context.

[FONT=Helvetica Neue, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]The challenge is still there for anyone to take and show how the context shows that fallen angels or other wise, does not fit the context. Or someone would of went verse by verse, paragraph by paragraph, to show who the Bible is telling us who they are, coming to the conclusion that after telling the story of two genealogies before Genesis 6:2, 4 and after that, showing how the context of the before and after Scripture change to introduce fallen angels, to the context dealing with the same two genealogies of the before and after verses.[/FONT]

 

[Denadii]

Can either one of you show us how that book shades light of the context of Genesis 4:11-6:4? Because if you don't understand who the Scriptures are talking about you don't know who is in Genesis 6:1-4. The only way you theory works is by taking it out of context, which you have to do for your theory to work.

But I like the way you guys stick together and pat each other on the back, because you agree with each other, but a simple exegete of the Scriptures in context tells the story and reveals how the sons of God are in Genesis 6:2, 4. But you would rather eisegete the context of the story. A simple exegete of Genesis 6:4 shows that the nephilim are not the result of Genesis 6:2 ESV "The Nephilim were on the earth in those days, and also afterward(nephilim were in those days and after, what days?), when the sons of God came in to the daughters of man and they bore children to them (who were these children?). These were (not the nephilim, they were already on the earth, they were) the mighty men who were of old, the men of renown."

That's how simple it is if you go from Genesis 4:11-6:1 to understand Genesis 6:2, 4, with Genesis 6:3, 5-7 further confirming the context that they were not fall angels or angels. You can go outside the context of the story line and outside the Bible it does not change the context of the story or make fallen angels part of the context.

The challenge is still there for anyone to take and show how the context shows that fallen angels or other wise, does not fit the context. Or someone would of went verse by verse, paragraph by paragraph, to show who the Bible is telling us who they are, coming to the conclusion that after telling the story of two genealogies before Genesis 6:2, 4 and after that, showing how the context of the before and after Scripture change to introduce fallen angels, to the context dealing with the same two genealogies of the before and after verses.

That's just what you're reading into it that you're spouting...Doesn't make you right.

 

[jaybird88]

Can either one of you show us how that book shades light of the context of Genesis 4:11-6:4? Because if you don't understand who the Scriptures are talking about you don't know who is in Genesis 6:1-4. The only way you theory works is by taking it out of context, which you have to do for your theory to work.

i think your theory has been debunked several times. and each time we do this you ignore the facts presented, then rinse and repeat back to step one like nothing happened.

 

[CS1]

Your choice.

Originally Posted by Denadii
Let me answer it this way...God adopted you right? Ok...Your Earthly father is human right? Your mother too, I assume. That would make you human too? I thought so....If God is god, Jesus is God and you are adopted so that God is your father....You are as god too. Let's see....You are a three part being You have the same creative abilities, you have exactly the same authorities that Jesus has. You have dominion in the Earth..and you are to reign here....Yup. You're a god




nope not biblical

 

[valiant]

Can either one of you show us how that book shades light of the context of Genesis 4:11-6:4?

The context of 3.1-6.4 introduced a hidden supernatural being, and revealed his continued activity in 6.1-4. He was an Elohim (supernatural being). They were bene Elohim.

It revealed who 'the daughters of men ('adam)' were, mainly the daughters of Seth (in ch 5).

Because if you don't understand who the Scriptures are talking about you don't know who is in Genesis 6:1-4.

Yep we are right in context.

The only way you theory works is by taking it out of context, which you have to do for your theory to

work.

Hmmmm?

But I like the way you guys stick together and pat each other on the back, because you agree with each other,

I didn't notice, but true Christians are to love one another.

but a simple exegete of the Scriptures in context tells the story and reveals how the sons of God are in Genesis 6:2, 4.

Yes in the OT bene Elohim are Satan and the other angels (Job 1 & 2).

But you would rather eisegete the context of the story.

?????

A simple exegete of Genesis 6:4 shows that the nephilim are not the result of Genesis 6:2 ESV

Who said they were?

The Nephilim

were on the earth in those days, and also afterward(nephilim were in those days and after, what days?), when the sons of God came in to the daughters of man and they bore children to them (who were these children?).

So the Nephilim were the sons of God? Fallen angels (from naphal).

These were (not the nephilim, they were already on the earth, they were) the mighty men who were of old, the men of renown."

No they PRODUCED the mighty men of renown.

That's how simple it is if you go from Genesis 4:11-6:1 to understand Genesis 6:2, 4, with Genesis 6:3, 5-7 further confirming the context that they were not fall angels or angels.

But the context told me different?

You can go outside the context of the story line and outside the Bible it does not change the context of the story or make fallen angels part of the context.

O but it does LOL

The challenge is still there for anyone to take and show how the context shows that fallen angels or other wise, does not fit the context.

LOL we are proving that it DOES.

Or someone would of went verse by verse, paragraph by paragraph, to show who the Bible is telling us who they are, coming to the conclusion that after telling the story of two genealogies before Genesis 6:2, 4 and after that, showing how the context of the before and after Scripture change to introduce fallen angels, to the context dealing with the same two genealogies of the before and after verses.

Been there, done that lol

 

[jaybird88]

The context of 3.1-6.4 introduced a hidden supernatural being, and revealed his continued activity in 6.1-4. He was an Elohim (supernatural being). They were bene Elohim.

It revealed who 'the daughters of men ('adam)' were, mainly the daughters of Seth (in ch 5).

how would one know the sons of the Most High in G6 are the same as the sons of the Most High in the NT? being as one is in Greek and the other is in biblical Hebrew?

 

[Denadii]

Originally Posted by Denadii
Let me answer it this way...God adopted you right? Ok...Your Earthly father is human right? Your mother too, I assume. That would make you human too? I thought so....If God is god, Jesus is God and you are adopted so that God is your father....You are as god too. Let's see....You are a three part being You have the same creative abilities, you have exactly the same authorities that Jesus has. You have dominion in the Earth..and you are to reign here....Yup. You're a god




nope not biblical

[h=1]John 10:33-35 (CJB)[/h] [SUP]33 [/SUP]The Judeans replied, “We are not stoning you for any good deed, but for blasphemy — because you, who are only a man, are making yourself out to be God [SUP][a][/SUP].” [SUP]34 [/SUP]Yeshua answered them, “Isn’t it written in your Torah, ‘I have said, “You people are Elohim’ ”?[SUP][b][/SUP] [SUP]35 [/SUP]If he called ‘elohim’ the people to whom the word of Elohim was addressed (and the Tanakh cannot be broken),

Psalm 82.:6


[h=1]Psalm 82 (CJB)[/h] 82 [SUP](0) [/SUP]A psalm of Asaf:

[SUP](1) [/SUP]Elohim [God] stands in the divine assembly;
there with the elohim [judges], he judges:
[SUP]2 [/SUP]“How long will you go on judging unfairly,
favoring the wicked? (Selah)
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Give justice to the weak and fatherless!
Uphold the rights of the wretched and poor!
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Rescue the destitute and needy;
deliver them from the power of the wicked!”

[SUP]5 [/SUP]They don’t know, they don’t understand,
they wander about in darkness;
meanwhile, all the foundations of the earth
are being undermined.

[SUP]6 [/SUP]“My decree is: ‘You are elohim [gods, judges],
sons of the Most High all of you.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Nevertheless, you will die like mortals;
like any prince, you will fall.’”

[SUP]8 [/SUP]Rise up, Elohim, and judge the earth;
for all the nations are yours.

 

[CS1]

John 10:33-35 (CJB)

[SUP]33 [/SUP]The Judeans replied, “We are not stoning you for any good deed, but for blasphemy — because you, who are only a man, are making yourself out to be God [SUP][a][/SUP].” [SUP]34 [/SUP]Yeshua answered them, “Isn’t it written in your Torah, ‘I have said, “You people are Elohim’ ”?[SUP][b][/SUP] [SUP]35 [/SUP]If he called ‘elohim’ the people to whom the word of Elohim was addressed (and the Tanakh cannot be broken),

Psalm 82.:6


Psalm 82 (CJB)

82 [SUP](0) [/SUP]A psalm of Asaf:

[SUP](1) [/SUP]Elohim [God] stands in the divine assembly;
there with the elohim [judges], he judges:
[SUP]2 [/SUP]“How long will you go on judging unfairly,
favoring the wicked? (Selah)
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Give justice to the weak and fatherless!
Uphold the rights of the wretched and poor!
[SUP]4 [/SUP]Rescue the destitute and needy;
deliver them from the power of the wicked!”

[SUP]5 [/SUP]They don’t know, they don’t understand,
they wander about in darkness;
meanwhile, all the foundations of the earth
are being undermined.

[SUP]6 [/SUP]“My decree is: ‘You are elohim [gods, judges],
sons of the Most High all of you.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Nevertheless, you will die like mortals;
like any prince, you will fall.’”

[SUP]8 [/SUP]Rise up, Elohim, and judge the earth;
for all the nations are yours.

you do not understand the Hebrew translation in context to the word Elohim in Ps 82:6
the word "gods " has many meaning depending on the context of the word in which it is used in the text.

Ps 82:6 is speaking about men aka human being they are not divine as God is. So the translation of gods in the Hebrew for Ps 82:6 in context to man is the following:



(plural)
rulers, judges
divine ones: are not divine but men flesh . this doesn't apply
angels: they are not angels this does not apply
gods: they are not literal Gods this is descriptive

The only Normative for many in the passage or verse of Ps 82:6 ruler, judge.

The word Elohim also if the text support it. Ps 82:6

(plural intensive - singular meaning)
god, goddess man is not divine as God is this cannot apply
godlike one
works or special possessions of God = not a god

the last two
the (true) God = Elohim = GOD
God "G" = Elohim =GOD not man

you cannot use "your gods" in the literal because it is descriptive and not what the translation supports

 

[Denadii]

you do not understand the Hebrew translation in context to the word Elohim in Ps 82:6
the word "gods " has many meaning depending on the context of the word in which it is used in the text.

Ps 82:6 is speaking about men aka human being they are not divine as God is. So the translation of gods in the Hebrew for Ps 82:6 in context to man is the following:



(plural)
rulers, judges
divine ones: are not divine but men flesh . this doesn't apply
angels: they are not angels this does not apply
gods: they are not literal Gods this is descriptive

The only Normative for many in the passage or verse of Ps 82:6 ruler, judge.

The word Elohim also if the text support it. Ps 82:6

(plural intensive - singular meaning)
god, goddess man is not divine as God is this cannot apply
godlike one
works or special possessions of God = not a god

the last two
the (true) God = Elohim = GOD
God "G" = Elohim =GOD not man

you cannot use "your gods" in the literal because it is descriptive and not what the translation supports

LOL There you go. Nobody said we were divine. gods are 'one who reigns We are to reign in the Earth. So....

 

[CS1]

LOL There you go. Nobody said we were divine. gods are 'one who reigns We are to reign in the Earth. So....

if you are mindful of what you said earlier below:

Let me answer it this way...God adopted you right? Ok...Your Earthly father is human right? Your mother too, I assume. That would make you human too? I thought so....If God is god, Jesus is God and you are adopted so that God is your father....You are as god too. Let's see....You are a three part being You have the same creative abilities, you have exactly the same authorities that Jesus has. You have dominion in the Earth..and you are to reign here....Yup. You're a god

by your understanding you did just that .

 

[Denadii]

if you are mindful of what you said earlier below:

Let me answer it this way...God adopted you right? Ok...Your Earthly father is human right? Your mother too, I assume. That would make you human too? I thought so....If God is god, Jesus is God and you are adopted so that God is your father....You are as god too. Let's see....You are a three part being You have the same creative abilities, you have exactly the same authorities that Jesus has. You have dominion in the Earth..and you are to reign here....Yup. You're a god

by your understanding you did just that .

By your understanding I said that. I can see where you would think so. OK. Let me put it to you this way...If you are a son of God, which you are. If you are now an immortal being, which you are, if you have all the authority of the Godhead and the same creative abilities etc...What does that make you? Maybe we are divine by adoption.

 

[CS1]

By your understanding I said that. I can see where you would think so. OK. Let me put it to you this way...If you are a son of God, which you are. If you are now an immortal being, which you are, if you have all the authority of the Godhead and the same creative abilities etc...What does that make you? Maybe we are divine by adoption.

good question

we have the Spirit of God which is still who ? = God we have Understanding of His word by who ? The Holy Spirit which is God
God is the God of Creation known by His name of Creator His attribute
no of those thing are done by man without God doing them in us and through us.
He is all knowing we are not therefore we do not have all that God is nor do we have any authority in our self it is Gods

We have limited positional power and authority. Jesus said apart from HIM you could do nothing

 

[Denadii]

good question

we have the Spirit of God which is still who ? = God we have Understanding of His word by who ? The Holy Spirit which is God
God is the God of Creation known by His name of Creator His attribute
no of those thing are done by man without God doing them in us and through us.
He is all knowing we are not therefore we do not have all that God is nor do we have any authority in our self it is Gods

We have limited positional power and authority. Jesus said apart from HIM you could do nothing

Ok Here's another point to ponder..When you were born again you died. Right? Then you were born, part you, and part Holy Spirit..You cannot separate one from the other...You're all mixed up together with Him Know what that makes you? More than human...You're a hybrid now..Part you, and part Him, God... Would that make you at least part divine? Denadii shrugs.

 

[Denadii]

You said "We have limited positional power and authority. Jesus said apart from HIM you could do nothing" Apart from Him we can do nothing, but we are NOT apart from him.
[h=1]John 17:20-26 (KJV)[/h] [SUP]20 [/SUP]Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
[SUP]21 [/SUP]That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
[SUP]23 [/SUP]I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
[SUP]24 [/SUP]Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
[SUP]25 [/SUP]O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me.
[SUP]26 [/SUP]And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.
All mixed up together...