Not By Works

[PeterJens]

The commandments, “You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” “You shall not covet,” and whatever other command there may be, are summed up in this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” Love does no harm to a neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
Rom 13:9-10

Now for those who feel Paul preached the law is irrelevant here is the defining
quote where Paul links the fulfilment of the law with loving your neighbour.

We are free from condemnation under the law because we do not break it walking
in the Spirit. So the law becomes an academic exercise except these believers
are breaking it daily, or they feel they are so fall under its condemnation.

Odd that they then claim spiritual authority to lecture others about their errors
and heresy, when they already have written themselves off from walking the
way of Christ or even desiring to follow Jesus. More like the sinner I once heard
saying he would believe in Jesus if he saw any believers living like Jesus did.

So now the mockers are in the church and the church is no longer capable of
seeing them or identifying their failure. Time to leave those churches.

 

[dcontroversal]

if you wanted proof GB9, There you have it.

1. He thinks your evil
2. He wants nothing to do with you

for this reason

1. Nothing you say will even remotely come to be seen by him as any semblance of truth
2. He will twist and turn whatever you say, as long as he is right, and you are wrong (in his view, not in reality)
3. When you show him his faults. (like taking a passage out of context and ignoring a verse) instead of repenting, he will further attack you.

then he will go tell people how great he is and holy and righteous he is, and how he loves God. And then wonder why people treat him like they do.

He also does not realize, We do want to fellowship with him, even though he calls us evil (like he just did you)

And the sad thing is what he states is applicable unto himself....false gospel, sinless perfectionism and pushing a message that is not of God.....

 

[PeterJens]

Peter your name isn't spongebob aka willybob.,, Dcon ain't talk on to ya. So why do you take offense?

It is a good point, that spongebob could mean willybob, but also as the post was linking
to the post I had written, I assumed it was a general swipe.

I do not read all the posts or even keep up with some interplays, so it does not really
matter that much. I put my position and case.

And I was stunned by 2 John today when reading it how clear John is about apostacy
and wicked works. It really illuminated my world, to which I am gratefull to the Lord.

 

[PeterJens]

And the sad thing is what he states is applicable unto himself....false gospel, sinless perfectionism and pushing a message that is not of God.....

Hey dc. the great thing is we will both go to the King to see the outcome.

When the word started to open up to me recently, I am just amazed at how
the emotions are flowing between the individuals and I understand their interplay
and frustrations. It is so similar to talking on cc, you could pinch me.

But then my friend you know nothing of this. May the Lords love melt your heart
and teach you the way of grace and truth, Amen.

 

[Stephen63]

EG....you remember the game when we were kids that we did with the toes...this little piggie went to market, this little piggie stayed home....this little piggie was an attention hog and got slaughtered by the butcher?

I can't believe you of all people fixed your mouth to say that, LOL!

 

[dcontroversal]

Hey dc. the great thing is we will both go to the King to see the outcome.

When the word started to open up to me recently, I am just amazed at how
the emotions are flowing between the individuals and I understand their interplay
and frustrations. It is so similar to talking on cc, you could pinch me.

But then my friend you know nothing of this. May the Lords love melt your heart
and teach you the way of grace and truth, Amen.

Your right..but based upon your doctrine we we will be in different resurrections.....those who trust Jesus by faith thru grace void of works will make the 1st ressurection upon whom the 2nd death will have no power......

 

[dcontroversal]

if you wanted proof GB9, There you have it.

1. He thinks your evil
2. He wants nothing to do with you

for this reason

1. Nothing you say will even remotely come to be seen by him as any semblance of truth
2. He will twist and turn whatever you say, as long as he is right, and you are wrong (in his view, not in reality)
3. When you show him his faults. (like taking a passage out of context and ignoring a verse) instead of repenting, he will further attack you.

then he will go tell people how great he is and holy and righteous he is, and how he loves God. And then wonder why people treat him like they do.

He also does not realize, We do want to fellowship with him, even though he calls us evil (like he just did you)

We have all known for some time the spirit that drives him...all the workers for and sinless perfectionist crew seem to be led by something other than the Spirit of God...God's spirit wohld not lead one to say the imputed righteousness of Christ is a neat little trick that does not work...nor we he lead one to say Jesus is not enoigh.......

 

[PeterJens]

Your right..but based upon your doctrine we we will be in different resurrections.....those who trust Jesus by faith thru grace void of works will make the 1st ressurection upon whom the 2nd death will have no power......

We have a big difference my friend. I bow the knee before my King and know that He alone
is the judge. You appear happy to throw me into Hell for something you cannot prove.

Where did the "judge not" command get left out of your faith? People who judge alone on what
they believe people are, will always fail to see innocence and victims from posers and the pushy.

If you throw believers into Hell, the danger is you yourself have reversed realities and are just
projecting anger and resentment.

Let me show you. If I came to faith believing only on Jesus, born of the Holy Spirit, I am going
to heaven no matter what I might believe in the future. So by your own beliefs you cannot say
anything, but you show you do not believe what you claim.

Odd that. If you cannot even hold you faith together with me, what hope is there before the
Lord.

 

[PeterJens]

We have all known for some time the spirit that drives him...all the workers for and sinless perfectionist crew seem to be led by something other than the Spirit of God...God's spirit wohld not lead one to say the imputed righteousness of Christ is a neat little trick that does not work...nor we he lead one to say Jesus is not enoigh.......

So I am not driven by the Holy Spirit? Jesus came in the flesh and died for our sins and rose again, and
sits at the right hand of God our Saviour, Amen. We are saved through faith in Him shown by the good
works that flow from our hearts.

Now my dear friend, I cannot believe these things unless the Holy Spirit has revealed them to me. The
enemy alone desires to disown and distort these eternal truths.

So you have a problem. If you condemn me you are condemning yourself.
Imputed righteousness in one sense is true, we are cleansed and righteous before our King, but
God is not blind to sin or who we are. Gods desire is to resolve everything.

This resolution is something many find hard to believe or maybe just too costly.
And the difference between a walk and a done deal is everything. Many want safety over reality
because their fear is greater than the cross, but the cross is everything we need.

God bless you my friend, Christ loves you, and so do I. Why do you kick so hard?

 

[PeterJens]

Roads

We walk down a road which will lead us either to God or somewhere else. We will be convinced
we are right no matter what because we are all victims of what we become.

Sow to the Spirit, reap life, sow to the flesh, reap death.

The nicest people can still be lost, because all we really know is the love in our hearts or the lack
of it. And what else matters above this treasure God has given us? We are called to be lights,
nothing more, because we cannot lose what God has given us if we continue to walk in it.

Many will dispute many things, but if the treasure is within, amen, if not let us pray the light of
life dawns and their hearts open. It is this simple, but sin will always fight to maintain its grip.

Weakness. Please tell me something in Christ or in life we are strong in? I know in everything
I need help, it is this that keeps me going, knowing in Christ I have strength and almost everyone
is better than me, but I know I am loved, secure in the cross of Christ and His forgiveness.

Amen, and Praise the Lord.

 

[Ariel82]

I can't believe you of all people fixed your mouth to say that, LOL!

Yeah, not suprised you came by to jab at me....you still chasing G777 and anyone you believe teaches easy believism?

Most people do NOT teach easy believism, but don't let a little thing called the TRUTH stop you from your fun.

 

[Ariel82]

So I am not driven by the Holy Spirit? Jesus came in the flesh and died for our sins and rose again, and
sits at the right hand of God our Saviour, Amen. We are saved through faith in Him shown by the good
works that flow from our hearts.

Now my dear friend, I cannot believe these things unless the Holy Spirit has revealed them to me. The
enemy alone desires to disown and distort these eternal truths.

So you have a problem. If you condemn me you are condemning yourself.
Imputed righteousness in one sense is true, we are cleansed and righteous before our King, but
God is not blind to sin or who we are. Gods desire is to resolve everything.

This resolution is something many find hard to believe or maybe just too costly.
And the difference between a walk and a done deal is everything. Many want safety over reality
because their fear is greater than the cross, but the cross is everything we need.

God bless you my friend, Christ loves you, and so do I. Why do you kick so hard?

Because your answers don't really address calling Christ imputed righteousness, "a neat little trick" and he is not convinced you don't teach works salvation.

I don't know why I even bother speaking.

You could say you didn't mean it the way he is taking it. That you meant that Christ's righteousness should not be used as a cloak for sin. God is not blinded by our sin and seeks not only to wash away our sins but also to tear down the spiritual strongholds that war against His knowledge and tempt us to sin.

However this doesn't address the accusation that you teach works salvation or that you are being lead by another spirit besides God's.

Can God's children be lead astray by deceiving spirits?

Ones that warp what the other person says and causes conflict and strife?

Is there really any point in continuously engaging people who have such a low opinion of you?

I know there are folks who false idea of my beliefs or some who just don't like me because our beliefs are different. It's their choice.just as it's my choice not to waste hours each day debating them.

Wouldn't time be better spent fellowshiping with others who you believe are your brothers and sisters?

Or speaking to nonbelievers about the Gospel?

Yeah I admit I like attention from my loved ones. However, most days listening is more important than speaking. Then praying and discern if your thoughts and belief about what is said Is in line with God's reality and what the person actually said is also important.

Too often Peter you hear things that isn't said by anyone in this thread. Too often you listen to that false voice, when you should reject it. Instead you buy into the lies and speak to those false voices instead of to the real people here.

I do believe the Holy Spirit guides you, but too often you it doesn't seem that you pray before speaking. Too often you fall for the trick of the Enemy, who puts up strawmen and pretends to be the person you are talking to.

If you pray God will burn up those strawmen and you might see clearly those around you.

Have you apologize for accusing folks of any of the false beliefs you later found out was lies and not what they believed at all?

Maybe if you take the first step, they will apologize also...if you can ever convince them that you actually don't teach works salvation.

(okay off my soap box, you can continue with your monologues or you can go back and read what you,have already wrote and apologize specifically for,any insult you said previously. That is if you actually want peace.)

I should apologize for implying that you are an attention hog. Even though you do like to have attention, you try and listen and respond. Maybe one day you will hear what folks are actually saying, instead of from the lying filter that surrounds you some days. You know if you take the time to pray, God will get rid of that lying filter and allow you to see what folks are actually saying.

You still believe folks can loose their salvation?

Still ignoring that the proper word usage would be "lose"?

 

[PeterJens]

Still ignoring that the proper word usage would be "lose"?

I have dislexia to a degree where I will use words in the wrong way.
I have to reread and correct often, but hey, we all have different weaknesses.

A common error one sees is to type you for your etc. Sometimes I redo a sentence halfway
through thinking it out, or leave out an important word. But at least I can touch type, lol.

I looked at Tyndales version of the bible, very illuminating and humbling

Blessed are the povre in sprete: for theirs is the kyngdome of heven.
Matt 5:3

It is the meaning not how we express it that counts really, God bless you.
We are so blessed today with such clear script and the internet is such
a blessing to fantastic resources.

 

[Stephen63]

Yeah, not suprised you came by to jab at me....you still chasing G777 and anyone you believe teaches easy believism?

Most people do NOT teach easy believism, but don't let a little thing called the TRUTH stop you from your fun.

It's a sad day when church goers can't see they're living in a delusion, & cannot see they've crossed the line.

Neither can they see their actions don't personify who they claim they are.

They will twist scripture, even lexicons to back their doctrine, & see nothing wrong with that. This exposes the fact that their morals have changed as well.

The lies are enormous, but the delusion is still greater.

 

[PeterJens]

Can God's children be lead astray by deceiving spirits?
Ones that warp what the other person says and causes conflict and strife?
Is there really any point in continuously engaging people who have such a low opinion of you?

Ariel, as a sister in Christ, I say God bless you.
These questions are ones I sincerely would like an answer to.

I have dear friends who went off into the prosperity gospel and all it entails.
I have to decide, do I think they are lost, deceived, miss-guided, or just compromised?

You have made me think about one issue, roots, a pure heart, and a good faith.
And I engage because in these things I am growing. In everything I do, the Lord blesses.

Thank you for apologizing. I have felt so blessed over the last few days and weeks.

Can people gain salvation or lose it once found?

If you accept the Kingdom is about a walk with the Lord.
Because it is a walk, you can walk away. And what we know is we are walking, not
what is ahead, and we know some of what was behind, and so we walk on knowing
our friend and Lord is by our side. Do we need to know more?

I think the issue for most is facing their insecurity and fear. I stand as I am.
I have times of fear and dread, I sometimes have wimpered in my sleep. But I also
know the Lord lifting up my Spirit to the throne of grace, and flying like a eagle.

I have stopped trying to construct models or ideas of what is possible or not and
just trust my Lord, because I know in Him I have everything.

Two times love speaks to me out of scripture. Elijah spoken to by the Lord, in all
His power and greatness, a still small voice. Mary at the tomb, a woman who knew
her debt to the King, hears her name, Mary. "Rabonni" He is the great King and loves
us dearly, but we do need to follow and listen. We need to do our part, yet some seem
to be denying this very reality, but I do not know why.

Times when I have expressed these things of my heart, I get responses that seem to
miss it all. But I will search better ways of expressing the light, and not wanting to
judge another, but just to open a door of hope. God bless you.

 

[Grace777x70]

This is what the gospel of the grace of Christ has done in my life:

I realize that these beliefs in the grace of God....especially the acceptance grace, repentance from dead works and the total forgiveness that Jesus bought and paid for with His blood are a major stumbling block to our religious minds and some church teachings. Jesus has become a Rock of offense.

These beliefs in the grace of God in Christ which is the true gospel message - can be offensive to our religious beliefs and what we have been taught in church. (they were initially to me as well )

This gospel of the wondrous grace of Christ has had a beautiful affect on me. I am more in love with Jesus and the Father more then ever....in love with studying His word....praying in the spirit constantly with a heart full of joy!

This gospel has given me a compassion for other people and to reach out in love to them. To give more than I ever have with a heart full of love.

To live a holier life in Him...which is not only living separate from the "biggie sins" but everything that He reveals about anything that is contrary to life and His nature that is in me. This has led me to be a witness of the life and love of our Lord in me.

If these are the horrible fruit of the grace of Christ in me. I want more!. Give me more grace please my Lord and God!

I am living a much fuller life now, more deeply in love with Jesus and the Father then ever before or ever dreamed was possible and I am just starting.

I am free from the horrible religion of self-effort, having the love of God pour out in me to help others now that I understand the grace that is in Christ then I did when I was doing the self-performance based gospel ( which is not the gospel )

I was blind but now I see. I see Jesus and His finished work for me!

It will always be in eternity "Worthy is the Lamb".

It will never be. "Worthy is the Lamb......and me.....because I did my own D.I.Y self-righteousness/holiness to help Jesus out"

It has always been about Jesus and Him alone and it will always remain that way for all eternity. He alone is our true life for we have died and our life is hidden with Him in God.

 

[PeterJens]

I am free from the horrible religion of self-effort, having the love of God pour out in me to help others now that I understand the grace that is in Christ then I did when I was doing the self-performance based gospel ( which is not the gospel )
I was blind but now I see. I see Jesus and His finished work for me!
It will always be in eternity "Worthy is the Lamb".

Amen. Glory to God that you know His overwhelming love and acceptance, and in love you
can respond to walk righteously.

Now you came to this realisation how? By seeking the Lord and His revelation to your heart.

So is everything in the Kingdom. Seek and you shall find, knock and the door shall be opened
up to you.

So we must encourage others to seek and find this reality for themselves.
Without this revelation you do build a self works faith, because there is nothing else.
But the key to the door is not condemnation, but the light of love in your heart shining out to
others.

Unless they are drawn, condemning people is not going to make things different, because
if they do not know the cross and love flooding their life, what have they but their view.

I have seen people before have revelations like you have, and then turn on others judgmentally.
It splits churches, fellowships, ends in strong words and condemnation of good people because
one experience of a believer must be experienced by all to be validated.

You have been given something wonderful, what you do with it is your choice.
We are to grow into maturity, knowing how to bless and encourage, and how not to condemn
but see the good in people struggling through only a little revelation get insight into the deeper
mysteries of Christ. So may I encourage you to see people where they are not some terrible
evil you have to fight, as if this is how you came to your revelation.

 

[Grace777x70]

We don't fight people - we stand against the religion of Christianity which is a false gospel that destroys people's lives. Religion and it's D.I.Y self-righteousness is an enemy of the Lord Jesus Christ. Those stuck in religion need the light of the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ to be boldly proclaimed to them.

The light of "Him" will dispel the darkness in people and the lies of the enemy that has a stronghold in our minds.

I encourage the believers in Christ to boldly proclaim the gospel of the grace of God in Christ alone.

In "it" - the gospel - the righteousness of God in Christ is revealed and it is the power of God for salvation. We are the righteousness of God in Christ because of Christ's work on the cross and resurrection. We are a new creation in Him - created in righteousness and holiness.

Romans 5:17 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] For if by the transgression of the one, death reigned through the one, much more those who receive the abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.

 

[PeterJens]

We don't fight people - we stand against the religion of Christianity which is a false gospel that destroys people's lives.

My friend. How much do you know in Christ comes from this religion of Christianity?

I think you will find the answer is everything.

Your family, most of your life you spent in the church, but now it is destroying peoples lives.
If you cannot see how you are ending up contradicting your own very foundations I begin
to wonder what real revelation you have had.

I suppose it is easier to blame the church for your apparent failure than accept you where
spiritual blind through not seeking God all these years. You sound like a believer gone rogue,
who now turns on those they love, dedicated to destroy the very thing they dedicated their
lives to uphold. Ironic.

 

[Grace777x70]

The sky is blue...

The killing of religious "sacred cows" is needed in order to bring the people out of religious captivity. There is a vast difference between people and religion.

Look at the way Jesus responded to the religious Pharisees and you will se how He views it.

Religion itself is an enemy of the Lord Jesus Christ - not the body of Christ as some in deceitfulness are trying to say some are against.

Some people's behavior just seem to remain consistently foul.