WHY BARGAINING WITH DEMONS MAT. 8:31

[Zmouth]

Jesus did not bargain with them and the bigger picture is even the demons are subject to his will....more proof of who he is.....

I am sure Jesus gave them their cut of the haul.

While I have never actually heard you say it, I have no doubt that you would strongly disagree if anyone said the gospel isn't free. I can't tell if it is because you and other NT believers think that the NT laws prohibit it being received or whether they simply consider it to be worthless; but before you use your imagination to assume that I said anything about the selling of the gospel, nah, I was simply pointing out just before getting on the ship going to Gergesenes a scribe had approached him saying, Master, I will follow thee whithersoever thou goest. Thus in verse 20, And Jesus saith unto him, The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head.

So why do wonder why he had no place to lay his head, @or lest I be poor, and steal, and take the name of my God in vain.

And when he was come to the other side into the country of the Gergesenes, there met him two possessed with devils, coming out of the tombs, exceeding fierce, so that no man might pass by that way.Matt 8:28 So is your avatar for real or were you just playing dress up. You never walked a post?

Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. Matt 24:23
And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not: Mark 13:21

And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time? Matt 8:29

Well, they didn't say lo here is Christ, so they must be creditable.

So the devils besought him, saying, If thou cast us out, suffer us to go away into the herd of swine. Matt 8:31 (Reminds me of Pancho and Lefty)

 

[Synergy]

Slave, did you write this? You know that most of it is complete nonsense? Water is fatal to demons? NOT.

The people herding the pigs were most likely not Jews, because Jews don't eat pork. They were classified as unclean.

The men only thought they were possessed? NOT

They knew they were possessed. That's why they came to Jesus to start with.
The people did not want Jesus around because he destroyed their pigs? NOT..

They were frightened by the display of the kicking out of the demons. and the result.

The people did not care about the man? NOT Read the account in Mark 5 Read the entire chapter..... I'm sorry my friend. You have the whole thing wrong.

I don't really know why you should quote Slave wrong; if you read your Bible very well, you would discover that the events that took place in Mat. 8:31-32 and Mark 5:1-17 are different;

1. In Mat. 8:28 the country Jesus visited was Gergesenes where He drove out devils from two possessed people.

2. In Mark 5:1-2 Jesus visited the country of Gadarenes, there Jesus healed one man with unclean spirit.

The only common thing between both accounts is "The Swine" . Mat. 8 :32 and Mark 5 :13.

If you think they are same... I'm sorry. You have the whole thing wrong.

 

[slave]

I don't really know why you should quote Slave wrong; if you read your Bible very well, you would discover that the events that took place in Mat. 8:31-32 and Mark 5:1-17 are different;

1. In Mat. 8:28 the country Jesus visited was Gergesenes where He drove out devils from two possessed people.

2. In Mark 5:1-2 Jesus visited the country of Gadarenes, there Jesus healed one man with unclean spirit.

The only common thing between both accounts is "The Swine" . Mat. 8 :32 and Mark 5 :13.

If you think they are same... I'm sorry. You have the whole thing wrong.

We are not used to the terms of evil spirits of uncleanness not being automatically meaning complete demon possessions. But what we need to understand is that we all can become influenced by unclean spirits simply by allowing the right conditions in our minds to be availed to the evil spirits to gain ground. We many times think that because we are God's Child satan cannot take ground in our minds unless we say it can. But if a person does not employ their thoughts in accordance with the Holy Spirits intuitive relationship with our spirit, we will be shocked to learn satan only needs the right conditions of the mind to move in in influencing us.

In trying to follow the leading of the Holy Spirit, many believers consider that they do not need to weigh, consider, or decide whether any seemingly God-given thoughts are according to the light of the Bible. They think that the meaning of being led by the Holy Spirit is like being dead, and that they should only listen to the thoughts and impulses that come from the mind.

In particular, they believe that the thoughts that come after praying are from God. As a result, while they pray and after they pray, they allow their minds to sink into passivity. They stop their own thoughts and every other activity of the mind, in hope of receiving "God's thoughts." They believe that this kind of thought is from God, and they become hardened, obstinate, and unreasonable persons doing many hardened, obstinate, and unreasonable things.

Little do they realize that:

1). Praying does not cause thoughts to become God's thoughts;
2). Waiting for godly thoughts, before and after they pray, only invites evil spirits to counterfeit God; and..
3). God's guidance is in the "intuition" and not in "the mind".

Many believers do not understand that God does not want man to be passive, but to co-labor with Him in an active way. They expend considerable effort to train themselves to become men with passive minds—to become persons who do not know how to think by themselves governed by the Holy Spirit thru intuition.—and they expect to receive God's thoughts this way. Little do they realize that when they do not use their minds, God does not use their minds either, and He does not give them His thoughts, because His principle is that man would use his own will to control his own faculties and co-labor with Him.

When men do not use their mind, the conditions are right for evil spirits to take the opportunity to come in and control. God does not want men to become machines in order to receive His revelation. Only evil spirits want men to behave this way. Hence, all passivity affords convenience for evil spirits. Evil spirits utilize the ignorance and passivity of the believers to work in their minds.

The point is whether one or the other evil influences are controlling, and need Jesus to be exercised. In us having Jesus within us, we are to remain in motion with Him, and to employ our minds in seeking with all of our mind; with all of our strength, while also exercising the understanding of our intuition of our spirit from His Spirit - First. From God to Jesus to the Holy Spirit to our spirit to our use volitionally of our mind placing our soul and then body as well in submissive obedience to His will is righteousness in a nutshell.

 

[Denadii]

I don't really know why you should quote Slave wrong; if you read your Bible very well, you would discover that the events that took place in Mat. 8:31-32 and Mark 5:1-17 are different;

1. In Mat. 8:28 the country Jesus visited was Gergesenes where He drove out devils from two possessed people.

2. In Mark 5:1-2 Jesus visited the country of Gadarenes, there Jesus healed one man with unclean spirit.

The only common thing between both accounts is "The Swine" . Mat. 8 :32 and Mark 5 :13.

If you think they are same... I'm sorry. You have the whole thing wrong.

Yeah! A good investigator questions all witnesses. He was wrong because he came to a conclusion based on partial information and not all of it....The Word says that a man who forms a judgement without all the facts is a ...... He formed a judgment without all the facts.

 

[Dade]

The people of Jesus time were very superstitious, the word demon is not in the original Greek, it's the word diamonizomai..in the KJV they used devils.diamonizomai comes from the Greek word diamon. This word means to distribute fortunes. God had repeatedly told the Jews false idols , tree worship , fire and moon worship , Baal worship , these God's were false ..dead. in other words they don't exist. The man possessed by devils was possessed by self/babylon..the doctrine of devils introduced to the world by Satan..Jesus cast out the doctrine of devils/self/ rebellion of the Truth. And cast it into the swine driving them mad

 

[Gabriel2020]

People are still that way, there is no comparing here. The ungodly do those things all over the world.

 

[Denadii]

The people of Jesus time were very superstitious, the word demon is not in the original Greek, it's the word diamonizomai..in the KJV they used devils.diamonizomai comes from the Greek word diamon. This word means to distribute fortunes. God had repeatedly told the Jews false idols , tree worship , fire and moon worship , Baal worship , these God's were false ..dead. in other words they don't exist. The man possessed by devils was possessed by self/babylon..the doctrine of devils introduced to the world by Satan..Jesus cast out the doctrine of devils/self/ rebellion of the Truth. And cast it into the swine driving them mad

Yeah...In the Hebrew they used the word 'demons'

 

[Dade]

The old testament word in Hebrew for devils is saiyr ..the word demon is not in the bible from the original Greek and Hebrew.The word demon is a English word. Saiyr is a goat a hairy goat.the Jews used alot of symbolism rituals contracts idioms analogies and by alot I mean ALOT. By using saiyr which comes from saar meaning horror storm tempest..indicates evil.By the way the New Testament is written in Greek the Old Testament is written in Hebrew.... my advice to you and all who read the Bible be sure to define the words because English has been so diluted and unclearly defined , especially in our present times also English is a mixture of many languages. So it behooves you to define the words..Greek and Hebrew are wonderful languages very descriptive

 

[Dade]

The doctrine of devils..is a plague upon this earth from the day Eve saw the tree was pleasant to the eye ,was good to eat , and would make her wise. That is the doctrine of devils.lust of the eye, lust of the flesh, pride of life. The tree was also forbidden to eat thereof. Rebellion disobedience. In Babylon they took it to extremes by building a tower to reach to the heavens indicates they were intending to rule this world . Lest they be scattered in the earth . Earth indicates being ruled . They were not going to be Ruled by heaven. Then they were going to make a Name for themselves..meaning authority . They would make the laws according to themselves with authority to rule this earth. That is ruling this earth today . All who reject Jesus Christ as Lord(authority) and savior are given to the beast(babylon) the doctrine of devils. That is why Jesus Christ taught us . Unless you die to self and take up your cross daily you will not enter heaven. Death to self and submission to the Father.

 

[Denadii]

The old testament word in Hebrew for devils is saiyr ..the word demon is not in the bible from the original Greek and Hebrew.The word demon is a English word. Saiyr is a goat a hairy goat.the Jews used alot of symbolism rituals contracts idioms analogies and by alot I mean ALOT. By using saiyr which comes from saar meaning horror storm tempest..indicates evil.By the way the New Testament is written in Greek the Old Testament is written in Hebrew.... my advice to you and all who read the Bible be sure to define the words because English has been so diluted and unclearly defined , especially in our present times also English is a mixture of many languages. So it behooves you to define the words..Greek and Hebrew are wonderful languages very descriptive

Interesting The Word in my Hebrew bible is "Shedim" Which means demons. But that is not even a point of contention. It's simply arguing semantics....

You take a dump and look and say "Oh Look. Fairy dust. I made a pile of fairy dust. Call it what you will...It does not change what it is! Demon...devil.....whatever It is what it is!

 

[WingsOfFidelity]

1. The people ran in to the city shouting, and the people came out and were amazed. If Lord Jesus cast them out then not as many people would have seen the miracle. God doesn't do miracles in front of the unbelieving, He left the places of the people who didn't have faith.

2. No, these things would happily jump on you while you are praying and put blasphemy in your mouth while praying so that God would kill you. They hate you, they hate everything about you. They hate God and everything good from God. These malicious disgusting things laugh at perversion, because people made in the image of God corrupting themselves bring them sick pleasure.

Transhumanism makes more sense when you understand that the corrupt spirit pushing the idea hates God, and thus hates the image of God. So too with transexuals, they are relentless in telling people to mutilate themselves and pervert everything, that's why 'transgenderism' is becoming such a big thing. Now there's 3 year olds being put on hormone therapy and mutilated by their sodomite parents, etc.

What I learned is don't feel pity for God's enemies, it really displeases God.

PSA 139: 19-22
19 Surely thou wilt slay the wicked, O God: depart from me therefore, ye bloody men.
20 For they speak against thee wickedly, and thine enemies take thy name in vain.
21 Do not I hate them, O LORD, that hate thee? and am not I grieved with those that rise up against thee?
22 I hate them with perfect hatred: I count them mine enemies.

 

[OneFaith]

Matthew 8:31-32 King James Version (KJV)

So the devils besought him, saying, If thou cast us out, suffer us to go away into the herd of swine.
And he said unto them, Go. And when they were come out, they went into the herd of swine: and, behold, the whole herd of swine ran violently down a steep place into the sea, and perished in the waters.

1. Why did Jesus granted the wish of demons?

2. Should we (the followers of Christ) pity demons?

Even people act like you are going to do what they would do. If you ever seen the movie "The Karate Kid", at the end,
when Mr. Miogi has the upper hand at the end of the fight, he even repeats the evil trainer's words back to him "An enemy deserves no mercy." Then, after expecting Mr. Miogi to take him out (cause that's what he would have done), Mr. Miogi just honks his nose.

Listen to what the demons said beforehand "Have you come to destroy us before our appointed time?" Now why ask this if you know that 'appointed' means 'God's Will' and 'before' means 'it's not God's Will to happen now'? It's because if roles were reversed, the demon would do it now instead of wait for the appointed time.

The demons had to go into something anyways. They were cast down to the earth (physicality) as punishment. They cannot float around freely, they have to be in something physical- whether it be and animal, a germ, whatever. In their fearful mind, they mentioned the first thing they saw- a bunch of pigs. Their goal was to get away from Jesus as quick as possible.

Now have you ever had an antagonizing brother? They hit you with your own hand and ask "Why are you hitting yourself? Or they state the obvious- like "Go make a phone call, go make a phone call." When they see you were already headed for the phone. Their trick is to make it seem like you are obeying them. And if you don't do it, then it seems they are controling you.

Well Jesus makes decisions according to what He would do, no matter whether it's obvious or not, or seems like He's being controlled or not. So even if the demons didn't say "Let us go into the pigs" Jesus still would have cast them out, and they would have had to go into another physical thing anyways. So when He said "Go" it was not because the demons had convinced Him of what to do, He would have done the same whether they said that or not.

 

[Zen]

PSA 139: 19-22
19 Surely thou wilt slay the wicked, O God: depart from me therefore, ye bloody men.
20 For they speak against thee wickedly, and thine enemies take thy name in vain.
21 Do not I hate them, O LORD, that hate thee? and am not I grieved with those that rise up against thee?
22 I hate them with perfect hatred: I count them mine enemies.

This is also related to the book of Enoch thread that is currently active, it implies that Enoch is righteous because he pleaded for satan and its cronies. It's absolutely false. God will have no mercy on wickedness.

 

[WingsOfFidelity]

This is also related to the book of Enoch thread that is currently active, it implies that Enoch is righteous because he pleaded for satan and its cronies. It's absolutely false. God will have no mercy on wickedness.

Well, honestly, I haven't read the book of Enoch so l can't commit on that thread. All I can say is if it is God's will that His Word is heard by His people He would make sure the right 'books' where preserved and include in the Bible.

 

[Denadii]

This is also related to the book of Enoch thread that is currently active, it implies that Enoch is righteous because he pleaded for satan and its cronies. It's absolutely false. God will have no mercy on wickedness.

The book of Enoch does not imply that Enoch was righteous because he asked God for mercy for the Giants. It says no such thing.

 

[Dade]

Thanks for edifying me on semantics . Now fairy dust that's foolishness or you're trying to make a joke ( foolishness)

 

[Zen]

Well, honestly, I haven't read the book of Enoch so l can't commit on that thread. All I can say is if it is God's will that His Word is heard by His people He would make sure the right 'books' where preserved and include in the Bible.

Psalm 12:
[SUP]6 [/SUP]The words of the Lord are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]Thou shalt keep them, O Lord, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.

There are gaps in the book of Enoch, so it wasn't preserved.

The book of Enoch does not imply that Enoch was righteous because he asked God for mercy for the Giants. It says no such thing.

Enoch XIII
7. Then I wrote a memorial of their prayer and supplication, for their spirits, for everything which they had done, and for the subject of their entreaty, that they might obtain remission and rest.

8. Proceeding on, I continued over the waters of Danbadan, which is on the right to the west of Armon, reading the memorial of their prayer, until I fell asleep.

What would Enoch be doing going talking to God's enemies and collecting their prayers?

 

[reneweddaybyday]

1. Why did Jesus granted the wish of demons?

From Benson Commentary:


"Matthew 8:30-32. And there was a good way off from them — That is, at a considerable distance, although, it seems, within their view; a herd of many swine — Which it was not lawful for the Jews to keeps much less to eat: yet great numbers of them were bred up in that extreme part of the country, out of regard to the gain of such merchandise, for they sold them to the Roman soldiers, and other Gentiles, who were very numerous in these parts. So the devils besought him — For they were entirely in his power, and under his control; saying, if thou castest us out — Which they suspected he would do; suffer us to go into the herd of swine — By making this request the devils acknowledged that it was not in the power even of a legion of them to do any mischief to so contemptible a creature as a swine without Christ’s permission, far less could they destroy the man in whom they lodged. Indeed the whole of this history teaches us to rely on the providence of God, and not to live in fear of evil spirits. They are under the strictest restraint, and cannot hurt us without the divine permission.Mark says that they first besought him much, that he would not send them out of the country; and Luke, that he would not command them to go into the deep, εις αβυσσον, into the abyss, meaning, doubtless, the place where wicked spirits are punished. By requesting to be permitted to enter into the swine, “they doubtless proposed to prevent any good effect which the miracle of delivering the men from their power might have had on the Gadarenes, and to render Christ odious to that wicked people.” Their design could not be hid from Jesus, nevertheless he granted their request, “not only because he knew it would render the miracle more public, but because it would prove the reality of the possession, and make men understand both how great the power of evil spirits is, and how terrible the effects of their malice would be, if they were not restrained. For no sooner was the permission granted, than the keepers, who were with the swine, and the disciples, who were at a distance, beheld, to their great astonishment, the whole herd running furiously down the mountains, and leaping from the tops of the rocks into the sea, where they were drowned, to the number of two thousand; while the possessed furious madmen became all of a sudden meek and composed, having recovered the entire use of their reason, the first exercise of which doubtless would lead them to a high admiration of his goodness, who had delivered them from the oppression of the devil. Jesus might permit the devils thus to fall on the herd as a punishment also to the Gadarenes for keeping swine, which were a snare to the Jews, and to make trial of their disposition, whether they would be more affected with the loss of their cattle, than with the recovery of the men, and the doctrine of the kingdom. Whatever were the reasons, it is certain that, though he might rightfully have used all men’s properties as he pleased, yet this, and the withering of the barren fig-tree, are the only instances wherein man suffered the least damage by any thing our Lord ever did. However, neither the owners of the herd nor of the fig-tree could justly complain of their loss, since the good of mankind, not in that period and corner only, but in every succeeding age, through all countries, has been so highly promoted at such a trifling expense to them.” “No miracles are more suspicious than pretended dispossessions, as there is so much room for collusion in them; but it was self-evident that a herd of swine could not be confederates in any fraud: their death, therefore, in this instructive and convincing circumstance, was ten thousand times a greater blessing to mankind than if they had been slain for food, as was intended.” — See Macknight and Doddridge.”


http://biblehub.com/commentaries/matthew/8-30.htm

2. Should we (the followers of Christ) pity demons?

Why do we not pity God?

God created all things, including lucifer and his minions. According to Ezekiel 28, lucifer was the anointed cherub (vs 14) and was perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee (vs 15).

Do you think God takes pleasure in the destruction of the wicked?

Ezekiel 33:11 Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live …