Are you really saved or do you just think you are? Exposing the lie of Easy Believism

LoveGodForever · Jul 5, 2017

Dear all,

One more thing is that if we have a faith that does not lead to obedience in following all the Word of God, this is not the faith that will get you into God's Kingdom. Now the next thing to happen is that the stone throwers will arrive that do not believe God and will cry works works we are not saved by works you are under the Law... To be Under the law means to reject salvation through faith and to be condemned as a sinner because sin is the transgression of God's Law and the wages of sin is death.

I do not believe we are saved by our works at all. I believe that I am the chiefest of sinners who Christ has come to save. I believe that God can save me from my sins because His Word says so. I also believe that we are only saved by having complete faith and dependence on the Word of God to do what it says it will do and there is nothing that we can do in our own strength to save ourselves.. The only thing I am saying is that it is only through love (New Covenant laws written on the heart) that anyone of us can ever follow God's Word. Jesus did the works of His father. We must do the works of our farther.

If your not obeying God's Word you do not love him or have the faith that Jesus wants you to have. It is only by personally knowing Jesus that we can all have the faith and love that Jesus wants us all to have. You can only find Jesus personally by finding him through his Word.

"Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near: Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon." Isa 55:6-7

"And ye shall seek me, and find me, when ye shall search for me with all your heart." (Jer 29:13)

My prayer is that you all will find Jesus through his Word because he is the Word.

May God bless you all

Grace777x70 · Jul 5, 2017

UnderGrace said:

Thanks for posting that website. It has some great teachings about the Lord Jesus Christ on it...

UnderGrace · Jul 5, 2017

Yes Lord Jesus Christ indeed.

Good thing we do not assign Him that title He is Lord.

Grace777x70 said:

followjesus · Jul 5, 2017

Stephen63 said:

thats the issue bro, if you only read single scriptures, omit the context and whatever you dont like you can make "easy believism" seem pretty legitimate its what alllll the grace grace new teachers do. they have explainations for everything that doesnt apply to " believers" they label any condition the law of moses, and label faith as saying i believe.

for instance look at that list

[FONT=&quot]Are united eternally with the Father, Son and Holy Spirit – John 14:20,

[/FONT]only thats 1 scripture of whats being said. and it is said to those who keep the commands of Jesus, the promise is to His disciples who dont omit whats being said and attempt to make what they want to be said. whats actually there though is much different

At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you. <<< this is whats being quoted as a grace benifit"

>>> this and actually from verse 15 is whats being said 21He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

22Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world?

23Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. 24He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

so if we scour the bible for positive seeming verses, end up like the gog omitting Gods actual Word, and His actually condition for actual salvation. Gods Promises are faithful, and also the conditions for those promises will never change. most modern theology is humanism and basically says romans 8:1 alone. no condemnation in Christ" but whats left out is what being in Christ actually means, what walking in the spirit actually means. its left out because people simply dont want to Hear the truth. the truth boils down to Loving sin more than God or Loving Jesus More than our sins that put shame, torture and suffering unto a slow agonizing death on Jesus shoulders......

And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. 20For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. 21But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

The world is a dark place even many "churches" have no light because its increasingly more "tell the people what they want to hear" theology, make people feel comfortable in thier sin and tell them they can never lose " salvation" its really more and more especially in the west, about what the masses want to Hear. few care to hear the real Gospel because it severs sin from our life, and the world Loves sin. it seperates self from a person, and the world Loves self. the Bible isnt obscure or a cloaked message things like repentance of sin and right living are all part of the Gospel, our part obedience to Gods Word. but hey....that just wouldnt be the modern accepted " grace" though its the grace of the Gospel the only grace that God will give. sad really to see How much Gods Word is avoided and omitted but its been written that it would go this way for ages.

Stephen63 · Jul 5, 2017

UnderGrace said:

Folks who don't quote inadvertantly make themselves look smarter than they are. When readers begin to expect that, they fail in their eyes & they lose respect with them.

But when a reader sees someone being humble, prefering others before themselves, & then they read your post that's informative..... then they are impressed with your words of wisdom.

In other words, Humble yourself under the mighty hand of God, & He will lift you up.

Galatians2-20 · Jul 5, 2017

I find it humorous when people accuse me of teaching a works based salvation or of being a legalist simply because they either disagree with me or do not understand my position. Nothing could be further from the truth. I'd like to share with you a "parable" that I wrote some time ago that explains my position in simple terms:

Let's say you were drowning in rough seas. A captain of a nearby boat sees you struggling, rushes over, and pulls you out of the water. He then gives you a change of clothes and allows you stay in his personal quarters, eating from his own table, for the remainder of the voyage. He tells you to stay off the deck because it is very possible that the waves could pull you back into the water where you could drown.

You are now faced with three options:

#1. Trust the Captain and stay inside the boat, no self effort involved.
#2. Ignore the Captain, and jump back into dangerous waters where you will probably die.
#3. Flirt with disaster by going on deck on assuming that, if you do fall in, the captain will be there to rescue you time and time again.

Now, common sense tells you that the easiest and safest option is to stay inside the boat. Biblical faith works similarly. Jesus saves us and accepts us into His Presence, which is life in the (Holy) Spirit. He then warns us to avoid temptation because to indulge in sin is to venture outside of His Presence:

"But you know that he appeared so that he might take away our sins. And in him is no sin." ~ 1 John 3:5

However, in regards to salvation, most believers choose the equivalent of option #3. They go about living their lives with little regard to what the Bible says about the dangers of sin, assuming that God will be there to bail them out of trouble again & again. Christ's primary role in daily their lives is that of a life preserver, needed only in emergencies.

True, biblical faith not only saves us but it also sanctifies us, past tense. Yet, we remain sanctified, today and each day onward, by walking in the Spirit.

"He who walks in the Spirit need not indulge the lusts of the flesh." ~ Galatians 5:16

It is a matter of choice to walk daily in the presence He who sanctifies. A person need not do anything to remain sanctified other than rest in Christ, placing all trust in Him and His word. It's when we take our fate into our own hands and follow the desires of our flesh that we stumble into sin.

So I ask you; Since when is it considered work not to do something? Everything that I believe and teach places full responsibility of our salvation and sanctification on the shoulders of Christ and Christ alone.

UnderGrace · Jul 5, 2017

Question, who teaches easy believism and sin all you want..... I have yet to read one book, hear one pastor or teacher, find a single website, blog, youtube video etc., etc., that is reputable teach this, in fact I find it is quite the opposite.

Galatians2-20 said:

I find it humorous when people accuse me of teaching a works based salvation or of being a legalist simply because they either disagree with me or do not understand my position. Nothing could be further from the truth. I'd like to share with you a "parable" that I wrote some time ago that explains my position in simple terms:

Let's say you were drowning in rough seas. A captain of a nearby boat sees you struggling, rushes over, and pulls you out of the water. He then gives you a change of clothes and allows you stay in his personal quarters, eating from his own table, for the remainder of the voyage. He tells you to stay off the deck because it is very possible that the waves could pull you back into the water where you could drown.

You are now faced with three options:

#1. Trust the Captain and stay inside the boat, no self effort involved.
#2. Ignore the Captain, and jump back into dangerous waters where you will probably die.
#3. Flirt with disaster by going on deck on assuming that, if you do fall in, the captain will be there to rescue you time and time again.

Now, common sense tells you that the easiest and safest option is to stay inside the boat. Biblical faith works similarly. Jesus saves us and accepts us into His Presence, which is life in the (Holy) Spirit. He then warns us to avoid temptation because to indulge in sin is to venture outside of His Presence:

"But you know that he appeared so that he might take away our sins. And in him is no sin." ~ 1 John 3:5

However, in regards to salvation, most believers choose the equivalent of option #3. They go about living their lives with little regard to what the Bible says about the dangers of sin, assuming that God will be there to bail them out of trouble again & again. Christ's primary role in daily their lives is that of a life preserver, needed only in emergencies.

True, biblical faith not only saves us but it also sanctifies us, past tense. Yet, we remain sanctified, today and each day onward, by walking in the Spirit.

"He who walks in the Spirit need not indulge the lusts of the flesh." ~ Galatians 5:16

It is a matter of choice to walk daily in the presence He who sanctifies. A person need not do anything to remain sanctified other than rest in Christ, placing all trust in Him and His word. It's when we take our fate into our own hands and follow the desires of our flesh that we stumble into sin.

So I ask you; Since when is it considered work not to do something? Everything that I believe and teach places full responsibility of our salvation and sanctification on the shoulders of Christ and Christ alone.

royalscot · Jul 5, 2017

his own people did not receive him.(the cross)

was there a lesson to be learned ,by finding out contect of the bible.

9 The true light, which enlightens everyone, was coming into the world.10 He was in the world, and the world was made through him, yet the world did not know him.11 He came to his own, and his own people did not receive him.12 But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,13 who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.
14 And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth.15 (John bore witness about him, and cried out, "This was he of whom I said, 'He who comes after me ranks before me, because he was before me.'")16 And from his fullness we have all received, grace upon grace.17 For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.18 No one has ever seen God; the only God, who is at the Father's side, he has made him known.

the pharisee and teachers of a jewish nation , at the time jesus was on earth, did not see a resurrected jesus. even though they were given or believe the law was given through Moses. by reject him , they are blind to the grace and truth that came through Jesus Christ.

the point , strange ,how some miss the resurrected, jesus going back to heaven, in the book of acts
now it makes sense , to the unbeliever , or blind ,you can carry, your own burden or cross in to death.

7 so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast

Galatians2-20 · Jul 5, 2017

UnderGrace said:

This entire conversation hangs on the following set of questions:

Do you believe it is possible to be saved without an ongoing relationship with Christ, in whom our salvation rests?

Do you believe a person can possess the righteousness of Christ apart from fellowship with Christ?

If a person believes that the answer is "yes" to one or both of these questions, then that person embraces "easy believism".

royalscot · Jul 5, 2017

if grace is gift from god,

why are you still looking at sin. the jewish, condemn jesus , with this law or tried to. (hence the resurrection)

the point, when did your actions obtain, grace a gift, yet you look at a wrong action, as being a sin.

there is a word for that, i will let you work, out that word. the same way you define what a sin is. \0/

5 Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith Galatians 3

shrume · Jul 5, 2017

Galatians2-20 said:

Do you believe these scripture?

Rom 10:
9) That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10) For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Eph 1:
13) In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
14) Which is the earnest [guarantee] of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Eph 2:
8) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9) Not of works, lest any man should boast.

2 Cor 1:
22) Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest [guarantee] of the Spirit in our hearts.

Rom 8:
31) What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
32) He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
33) Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
34) Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
35) Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
36) As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
37) Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
38) For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
39) Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

You may call hearing and believing the gospel resulting in salvation "easy believism".

I believe it's what the Bible teaches.

Should Christians do good works? Absolutely!

But doing good works does not save you, and not doing good works does not unsave you.

We are saved by faith in Jesus Christ.

And to answer your OP: "Are you really saved or do you just think you are?"

I am really saved.

UnderGrace · Jul 5, 2017

Well you did not answer my question.

By the way your questions I worded I tend to think that you are melding together being justified with discipleship.

In which I cannot answer because they are based on a false premise.

But you can still answer my question since I did ask first.

Galatians2-20 said:

UnderGrace · Jul 5, 2017

Amen and Amen!!!

shrume said:

Do you believe these scripture?

Rom 10:
9) That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10) For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Eph 1:
13) In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
14) Which is the earnest [guarantee] of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

Eph 2:
8) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9) Not of works, lest any man should boast.

2 Cor 1:
22) Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest [guarantee] of the Spirit in our hearts.

Rom 8:
31) What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
32) He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
33) Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
34) Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
35) Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
36) As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
37) Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
38) For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
39) Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

You may call hearing and believing the gospel resulting in salvation "easy believism".

I believe it's what the Bible teaches.

Should Christians do good works? Absolutely!

But doing good works does not save you, and not doing good works does not unsave you.

We are saved by faith in Jesus Christ.

And to answer your OP: "Are you really saved or do you just think you are?"

I am really saved.

royalscot · Jul 5, 2017

Galatians2-20 said:

all men

who appoint our (humans)righteousness to be believed in. god will save, who he wants to save.

For God So Loved the World
16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God John 3:

Death in Adam, Life in Christ
12 Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned---13 for sin indeed was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not counted where there is no law.14 Yet death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those whose sinning was not like the transgression of Adam, who was a type of the one who was to come.
15 But the free gift is not like the trespass. For if many died through one man's trespass, much more have the grace of God and the free gift by the grace of that one man Jesus Christ abounded for many.16 And the free gift is not like the result of that one man's sin. For the judgment following one trespass brought condemnation, but the free gift following many trespasses brought justification.17 For if, because of one man's trespass, death reigned through that one man, much more will those who receive the abundance of grace and the free gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man Jesus Christ.
18 Therefore, as one trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one act of righteousness leads to justification and life for all men.19 For as by the one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, so by the one man's obedience the many will be made righteous.20 Now the law came in to increase the trespass, but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more,21 so that, as sin reigned in death, grace also might reign through righteousness leading to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

pottersclay · Jul 5, 2017

Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God. So now be ye doers of the word and not hearers only being deceived. Cause faith without works is dead. So what is faith? Why its a gift. Is it the greatest gift? And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, but have not love, it profits me nothing. So if I have faith and do the works that Jesus commanded me to do thats still not enough? Not according to whats written. then this love whats that? Love suffers long and is kind; love does not envy; love does not parade itself, is not puffed up; does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil; does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth; bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.Love never fails. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away.

Is God known for his love? . For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

to be continued....

LoveGodForever · Jul 6, 2017

pottersclay said:

Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God. So now be ye doers of the word and not hearers only being deceived. Cause faith without works is dead. So what is faith? Why its a gift. Is it the greatest gift? And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, but have not love, it profits me nothing. So if I have faith and do the works that Jesus commanded me to do thats still not enough? Not according to whats written. then this love whats that? Love suffers long and is kind; love does not envy; love does not parade itself, is not puffed up; does not behave rudely, does not seek its own, is not provoked, thinks no evil; does not rejoice in iniquity, but rejoices in the truth; bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.Love never fails. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away.

Is God known for his love? . For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

to be continued....

Well finally a post that many of us can learn from

royalscot · Jul 6, 2017

if a man/mankind lives in a time freezed bible, understanding, he has no truth, when the storm comes, the only house or foundations that he/they hold on to, will be in ruin. spot the difference.

context would ask ,who was jesus speaking too, in this verse.
.2 For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you.3 Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?4 Or how can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when there is the log in your own eye?Matthew 7

context would ask , what did it mean for paul, to believe in jesus.
4 And I was advancing in Judaism beyond many of my own age among my people, so extremely zealous was I for the traditions of my fathers.15 But when he who had set me apart before I was born, and who called me by his grace,16 was pleased to reveal his Son to me, in order that I might preach him among the Gentiles,Galatians 1

he was preaching, what became known as christian, believe system, not a continued jewish law or belief system.

who was the hebrew writer talking to
28 Anyone who has set aside the law of Moses dies without mercy on the evidence of two or three witnesses.29 How much worse punishment, do you think, will be deserved by the one who has spurned the Son of God, and has profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has outraged the Spirit of grace?30 For we know him who said, "Vengeance is mine; I will repay." And again, "The Lord will judge his people."31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

.4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us,5 even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ---by grace you have been saved---6 and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ JesusEphesians 2: By Grace Through Faith

7 so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God,9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast Ephesians 2

FranC · Jul 7, 2017

Galatians2-20 said:

Hi Galatians,

Of course you're right in everything you say.
But those who don't like to work are going to give you a difficult time by telling you that they don't HAVE TO work but they do because they love the Lord.

I agree with all you've said above except one thing.

In your last paragraph you said this:

Everything that I believe and teach places full responsibility of our salvation and sanctification on the shoulders of Christ and Christ alone.

Full responsibility for our salvation is placed on the shoulders of Jesus. This is correct.

However, FULL RESPONSIBILITY for our sanctification CANNOT be placed totally on the shoulders of Jesus.

This is because sanctification is a joint and cooperative effort that includes US with the help of the Holy Spirit.

This is why the Holy Spirit is called a paraclete. He walks besides us and HELPS US to follow the commands of our Lord Jesus.

I repeat this again and will continue to do so...:

IF TOTAL RESPONSIBILITY for our sanctification is placed SOLELY on the shoulders of Christ, then it would follow that
when we sin, it is Christ who has failed and not us.

It's important that this be understood.

The Holy Spirit helps us, He doesn't FORCE US.
We have free willl and keep that free will even after salvation.

mailmandan · Jul 8, 2017

Galatians2-20 said:

Do you trust in Christ's finished work of redemption as the ALL-sufficient means of your salvation? (1 Corinthians 15:1-4; Romans 1:16) OR do you "also" trust in your "best efforts to follow/obey His word" as the supplemental means of your salvation?

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Are you really saved or do you just think you are? Exposing the lie of Easy Believism

LoveGodForever

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Grace777x70

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UnderGrace

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followjesus

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Stephen63

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Galatians2-20

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UnderGrace

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royalscot

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shrume

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