Not By Works
- Thread starter dcontroversal
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Yes! All of creation speaks of Christ.
I love to look at how a plant faces the "sun" to produce the nutrients that creates life within itself to live. We too face the "Son" to see the goodness/glory of Him and His life supplies the nutrients for us to live and grow. We are transformed as we "behold Him". 2 Cor. 3:17-18
This is not true, sorry....you are not helpless over sinning.......this is a lie from hell to keep you in bondage and is refuted in scripture.
PS....you seem to be working very hard to stay in things so you will not sin.... yet you tell us salvation is not work...None of the things you are staying in keep you from sinning....enabling grace and renewing your mind to the word of God does
Please list the verses that say staying in:
Fellowship
Discipleship
being accountable for your sins and keeping your old man alive keeps you from not sinning....
This is Sin-consciousness doctrine, which is an even greater false doctrine than works based salvation...it teaches people SIN is a action they are helpless over...not a choice.....Satan loves this doctrine, because it puts the effort on the person, not put them into the rest of Jesus.
If you ask the unbelievers and lost why they do not want Jesus, they will tell you it is because they like to sin and that is their own choice....they do not believe they are helpless in their sinful condition....they freely admit they chose to sin.....yet we have thousands of "Christians' that say they are....and that is how the world sees us as hypocrites....sin-consciousness based theology is warned and preached against in 2 Peter 1.1-15.....
We dabbled in "accountability groups" and nobody got free....and it created real problems in terms of religious spirits, etc..they only Got free when they realized they were a truly a new man in Christ and the Spirit keeps them from fighting 2 natures....
Paul had 2 natures but his old nature was killed by the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus....He tell us his fight in Romans 7 and then shows us how it got killed in Romans 8....never again did Paul ever, talk about 2 old dogs fighting each other in his spirit....
People sin because they choose and want to sin, not because they are powerless over it.....people war within themselves because they do not surrender things fully, because they won't let go....and grow spiritually
It would seem to me you are working harder than anyone in this thread on your salvation walk.....
PS....you seem to be working very hard to stay in things so you will not sin.... yet you tell us salvation is not work...None of the things you are staying in keep you from sinning....enabling grace and renewing your mind to the word of God does
Please list the verses that say staying in:
Fellowship
Discipleship
being accountable for your sins and keeping your old man alive keeps you from not sinning....
This is Sin-consciousness doctrine, which is an even greater false doctrine than works based salvation...it teaches people SIN is a action they are helpless over...not a choice.....Satan loves this doctrine, because it puts the effort on the person, not put them into the rest of Jesus.
If you ask the unbelievers and lost why they do not want Jesus, they will tell you it is because they like to sin and that is their own choice....they do not believe they are helpless in their sinful condition....they freely admit they chose to sin.....yet we have thousands of "Christians' that say they are....and that is how the world sees us as hypocrites....sin-consciousness based theology is warned and preached against in 2 Peter 1.1-15.....
We dabbled in "accountability groups" and nobody got free....and it created real problems in terms of religious spirits, etc..they only Got free when they realized they were a truly a new man in Christ and the Spirit keeps them from fighting 2 natures....
Paul had 2 natures but his old nature was killed by the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus....He tell us his fight in Romans 7 and then shows us how it got killed in Romans 8....never again did Paul ever, talk about 2 old dogs fighting each other in his spirit....
People sin because they choose and want to sin, not because they are powerless over it.....people war within themselves because they do not surrender things fully, because they won't let go....and grow spiritually
It would seem to me you are working harder than anyone in this thread on your salvation walk.....
Last edited:
2 Peter 1 is incredible Scripture brother, and should be exactly what what we should attain.
But the author of that great Scripture himself still had plenty of sinful issues the Holy Spirit was working in him with. Sins such as hypocrisy, and worse, a watering down of THE Gospel. These sins are laid out in Galatians 2.
I say this because I thought your comments were a little harsh to brother EG. Perhaps you could have said it better in a loving manner.
Have a blessed night.
But the author of that great Scripture himself still had plenty of sinful issues the Holy Spirit was working in him with. Sins such as hypocrisy, and worse, a watering down of THE Gospel. These sins are laid out in Galatians 2.
I say this because I thought your comments were a little harsh to brother EG. Perhaps you could have said it better in a loving manner.
Have a blessed night.
E
wow dude, you seem to love to take what people say and tear it apart. Not knowing what they sad or even trying to understand
1. Can you show me where I said those thing would keep me from sinning?
maybe those things do not help you, but everyone I know find hose things not only useful but essential,
2. scripture?
do not forsake the assembling of your yourselves as in manner of some, church is not an hour of worship on Sunday and maybe wed, it is a way of life and a family of people getting together often. It includes discipleship groups of a few people getting together weekly, and other tims when you get together with A group for prayer,and study.
Confess your sins to one another and pray for one another so you may be healed,
3. what does working hard for salvation and not sinning come into he equation? I did not know stopping sin was required for salvation, So can you help me understand what you meant by saying I work hard to stay in things so as to not sin (which I never said) and salvation is not wrk? Is it work? Or is it not?
4. as for what I said, I sad those things HELP you, I never said the cause you to stop.
as for thE sin conscious doctrine? Where did that come from? You might want to stop reading people through tainted glasses and actually start the read what they say, if you have a question, ASK, it gets seriously old when people assume things and spout off without understanding a word people are trying to say, I though you were one who would not do that. Maybe I was wrong?
i will say one thing, if you're you think you can stop sin under your own power apart from the power of GOD
1. You think to highly of yourself
2. You will fail, you may change a few dirty habits, but you fail, that's why you must be in a discipleship relationship with someone who knows you and can learn your tendencies
3. You are better than Paul, who never though he could do it, his way to help was to seek after the spirit, As apposed to seek to serve self, and he NEVER went into the worl on any ministry without taking a ministry partner.
1. Can you show me where I said those thing would keep me from sinning?
maybe those things do not help you, but everyone I know find hose things not only useful but essential,
2. scripture?
do not forsake the assembling of your yourselves as in manner of some, church is not an hour of worship on Sunday and maybe wed, it is a way of life and a family of people getting together often. It includes discipleship groups of a few people getting together weekly, and other tims when you get together with A group for prayer,and study.
Confess your sins to one another and pray for one another so you may be healed,
3. what does working hard for salvation and not sinning come into he equation? I did not know stopping sin was required for salvation, So can you help me understand what you meant by saying I work hard to stay in things so as to not sin (which I never said) and salvation is not wrk? Is it work? Or is it not?
4. as for what I said, I sad those things HELP you, I never said the cause you to stop.
as for thE sin conscious doctrine? Where did that come from? You might want to stop reading people through tainted glasses and actually start the read what they say, if you have a question, ASK, it gets seriously old when people assume things and spout off without understanding a word people are trying to say, I though you were one who would not do that. Maybe I was wrong?
i will say one thing, if you're you think you can stop sin under your own power apart from the power of GOD
1. You think to highly of yourself
2. You will fail, you may change a few dirty habits, but you fail, that's why you must be in a discipleship relationship with someone who knows you and can learn your tendencies
3. You are better than Paul, who never though he could do it, his way to help was to seek after the spirit, As apposed to seek to serve self, and he NEVER went into the worl on any ministry without taking a ministry partner.
Last edited by a moderator:
Hi Meg,
I notice you appear to truly embrace the new Gnostic spirit man idea.
You seem to want true victory, and real reality in Christ.
EG and dc both accept this except the hold the are held by sin irrevocably.
I agree this does lead to working in bondage to avoid self acts, only God acts,
and paints all as enemies.
I used to think to be healed was almost impossible and too complicated, but now
I know through love, faith and obedience we become the new man, sowing to the Spirit
and not the flesh. Key to this is emotional openness, walking in the light.
The darkness in so many is demonstrated by words like psycho babble. But it is our own
defences that make us adults that deceive us from the source of life, because other than
Him all is lost. If we open up but to Christ, wounds get worse, and hopelessness deeper.
The cross is our healing and the Lord our master.
I notice you appear to truly embrace the new Gnostic spirit man idea.
You seem to want true victory, and real reality in Christ.
EG and dc both accept this except the hold the are held by sin irrevocably.
I agree this does lead to working in bondage to avoid self acts, only God acts,
and paints all as enemies.
I used to think to be healed was almost impossible and too complicated, but now
I know through love, faith and obedience we become the new man, sowing to the Spirit
and not the flesh. Key to this is emotional openness, walking in the light.
The darkness in so many is demonstrated by words like psycho babble. But it is our own
defences that make us adults that deceive us from the source of life, because other than
Him all is lost. If we open up but to Christ, wounds get worse, and hopelessness deeper.
The cross is our healing and the Lord our master.
Free loaders
Have you noticed what the greatest command is?
Love God with all your, heart, soul, mind and strength. In other words everything.
Are those who love like this are they idle doing nothing, just along for the ride?
Jesus says the kingdom is like a man who finds treasure in a field, sells all he has
to buy this field. Nothing is held back, all is given.
Finding the path, listening, learning from the teacher, following, growing in understanding,
choosing to die to self and live to Christ are all what? Effort and work.
Work out your salvation in fear and trembling. Repent of sin, weep, wail, humble yourselves,
and He will lift you up.
One has to be blind, deaf and dumb not to see this. But then you all tell me why.
No true fellowship, always too independent, too private, fighting struggles without
connecting, being vulnerable and knowing the touch of His grace and forgiveness.
And when I shine the light on issues, I must be the enemy???? If there is darkness, only
the enemy wants it hidden? In the light there are no issues other than the ones
we are working on. Here defeat is not seeing needs well enough, and not knowing
how to respond to the lost.
In Christ we have life, life without end if we stay within it.
Have you noticed what the greatest command is?
Love God with all your, heart, soul, mind and strength. In other words everything.
Are those who love like this are they idle doing nothing, just along for the ride?
Jesus says the kingdom is like a man who finds treasure in a field, sells all he has
to buy this field. Nothing is held back, all is given.
Finding the path, listening, learning from the teacher, following, growing in understanding,
choosing to die to self and live to Christ are all what? Effort and work.
Work out your salvation in fear and trembling. Repent of sin, weep, wail, humble yourselves,
and He will lift you up.
One has to be blind, deaf and dumb not to see this. But then you all tell me why.
No true fellowship, always too independent, too private, fighting struggles without
connecting, being vulnerable and knowing the touch of His grace and forgiveness.
And when I shine the light on issues, I must be the enemy???? If there is darkness, only
the enemy wants it hidden? In the light there are no issues other than the ones
we are working on. Here defeat is not seeing needs well enough, and not knowing
how to respond to the lost.
In Christ we have life, life without end if we stay within it.
Salvation is like a seed planted in the ground. What it grows into shows the type of seed it is.
Jesus said something profound.
1 He is the Father
2 His people listen to Him
To deny His commands is to declare your lack of foundation.
Are you truly a lost blind teacher or just deceived?
If one repents and listens to Christ rather than ones leading there is hope.
Ironically those who do not listen will say I am wrong, except these are the words
of Christ. Mark these teachers well, and ignore them.
Jesus said something profound.
1 He is the Father
2 His people listen to Him
To deny His commands is to declare your lack of foundation.
Are you truly a lost blind teacher or just deceived?
If one repents and listens to Christ rather than ones leading there is hope.
Ironically those who do not listen will say I am wrong, except these are the words
of Christ. Mark these teachers well, and ignore them.
Observations are not wrong because they are made.
If one is as described, what hurts is it is correct, which means action is needed
or one is just self condemning. Oh wait, that is what you expect, and your response
is to say you are safe in Christ. lol. The irony is so deep. It binds the soul ever tighter
into inaction, so nothing gets through.
Do you know, I just realised something. It is a complement for you guys to call me a
worker of salvation, because relative to you, we truly are. Amen.
If my heart was dead to Christ, it would not leap for joy to serve Him. Paul says, work
for others as if you are working for Him. Why? Because you are, in the joy of your
salvation. Amen, glory to Jesus, the son of God made flesh.
If one is as described, what hurts is it is correct, which means action is needed
or one is just self condemning. Oh wait, that is what you expect, and your response
is to say you are safe in Christ. lol. The irony is so deep. It binds the soul ever tighter
into inaction, so nothing gets through.
Do you know, I just realised something. It is a complement for you guys to call me a
worker of salvation, because relative to you, we truly are. Amen.
If my heart was dead to Christ, it would not leap for joy to serve Him. Paul says, work
for others as if you are working for Him. Why? Because you are, in the joy of your
salvation. Amen, glory to Jesus, the son of God made flesh.
A
No one denies Jesus two commandments: love God and love others.
What is rejected is man made laws and traditions that add to what God requires of His children.
Every other law is not an addition but an example of how love can be displayed.
Just as the Sabbath is made for man and not man for the sabbath, God's laws are made to help us and give us rest..,,not to enslave or be used to beat down others.
What is rejected is man made laws and traditions that add to what God requires of His children.
Every other law is not an addition but an example of how love can be displayed.
Just as the Sabbath is made for man and not man for the sabbath, God's laws are made to help us and give us rest..,,not to enslave or be used to beat down others.
A
"How by our own power we can do nothing good"
Learn to read whole sentences..,it would make your life easier.
We do good by the empowerment of the Holy spirit.
******
Wow,, peterjens
you don't know the power and responsibility that comes with being a messenger and Ambassador, do you?
1. You have to get your message right for you are representing the King of kings,
2. You have diplomatic immunity.
3, I said Father king, thus I know I am a child of God. Even if you don't agree.
4, you should live godly lives because again.., you are representing the most High God.
Learn to read whole sentences..,it would make your life easier.
We do good by the empowerment of the Holy spirit.
******
Wow,, peterjens
you don't know the power and responsibility that comes with being a messenger and Ambassador, do you?
1. You have to get your message right for you are representing the King of kings,
2. You have diplomatic immunity.
3, I said Father king, thus I know I am a child of God. Even if you don't agree.
4, you should live godly lives because again.., you are representing the most High God.
Last edited by a moderator: