Benefits of Speaking, Praying, and Singing in Tongues

[notuptome]

So many of you are experts at presenting straw man arguments and beating people who speak in tongues over their heads with them.

Speaking in tongues is not "abusing prayer", nor is it "frivolity".

You want to remain ignorant? That's on you, Roger.

1 Cor 14:
38) But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.

What scripture shall you use to justify your remarks about ignorance? Where does it say that scripture is a bludgeon to beat one another over the head? My bible say that scripture is a two-edged sword not a battle axe.

Prayer for the believer is a very special time of fellowship with the Lord. Many saints have found strength and refreshing in times of prayer. One cannot walk with the Lord without prayer.

You would reduce prayer to a mystical experience making yourself hyper-spiritual and above the lesser believers who simply speak with their Lord in a saint to Savior manner.

Your attitude is all wrong.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[shrume]

Let me rephrase - should have said modern tongues are not language. Biblical tongues are language as all references to spoken/sung, etc. tongues denote real language.

It is nothing intentional, but modern tongues are what they are.

If a person is speaking in tongues, he is speaking a language of men or of angels. There is no difference between the tongues they spoke in the first century and the tongues being spoken today.

 

[shrume]

What scripture shall you use to justify your remarks about ignorance?

Primarily, 1 Cor 12-14. One day you will understand what they mean.

Where does it say that scripture is a bludgeon to beat one another over the head? My bible say that scripture is a two-edged sword not a battle axe.

Maybe you should reread some of your comments to me. You have been quite insulting, accusing me of not knowing how to pray, abusing prayer, frivolity.

Prayer for the believer is a very special time of fellowship with the Lord. Many saints have found strength and refreshing in times of prayer. One cannot walk with the Lord without prayer.

I heartily agree!

You would reduce prayer to a mystical experience making yourself hyper-spiritual and above the lesser believers who simply speak with their Lord in a saint to Savior manner.

Speaking in tongues is not a "mystical experience", I am not making myself "hyper-spiritual", nor do I think myself above any other Christian.

Your attitude is all wrong.

This is yet another straw man. You first construct a false attitude and then try and apply it to me. What you have constructed is not my attitude at all.

I have presented the scriptures several times as to what speaking in tongues is, and why we are to speak in tongues. You obviously do not agree, but rather than addressing the scriptures I presented, you just jump in and belittle people who speak in tongues.

Roger, if you do not want to speak in tongues, nobody can make you. Not even God, even though He would like every Christian to do so.

If I may say so, your attitude towards those of who do speak in tongues is hardly "for the cause of Christ".

 

[stonesoffire]

If you had a bilingual person staying with you, I can’t imagine you’ve never heard him speak his other language. Pretty sure you’ve just picked up a few words in it and are repeating them here and there as part of your glossolalia, but also pretty sure you may not have any idea what they mean; they’re just words you’ve picked up on for whatever reason. When you use T-speech, the kid is hearing you repeat these words and recognizes them.

Like a baby first learning how to speak – one day they say a complete sentence as clear as day, but they’re too young to even know they’ve done it, let alone what it means; to them it’s just sounds they’re copying. Same principle here.

Many Christian denominations are keen on using Hebrew terms like Meshiakh, Yeshua, Yahweh, etc. They’re way too commonly used in these religious circles not to have heard them and picked up on them. Many people will use them in their T-speech because it ‘sounds’ foreign; it’s not English and fits with the notion of T-speech being a language.

I’m not putting tongues down; it is a legitimate tool used in many cultures and belief systems and clearly has many beneficial effects; but it’s not language.

He was with us for a few months and only spoke English. Otherwise his words would of been gibberish. lol I would have to have an interpreter.

Kidding.

A natural man cannot understand the things of the Spirit. Repent Kavik and turn to God. Ask Him for His Holy Spirit to fill you and join us.

 

[stonesoffire]

What scripture shall you use to justify your remarks about ignorance? Where does it say that scripture is a bludgeon to beat one another over the head? My bible say that scripture is a two-edged sword not a battle axe.

Prayer for the believer is a very special time of fellowship with the Lord. Many saints have found strength and refreshing in times of prayer. One cannot walk with the Lord without prayer.

You would reduce prayer to a mystical experience making yourself hyper-spiritual and above the lesser believers who simply speak with their Lord in a saint to Savior manner.

Your attitude is all wrong.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Well, Roger

You're pretty good at bludgeoning others yourself. I remember first coming here.

You can have the same thing..ask.

 

[Kavik]

If a person is speaking in tongues, he is speaking a language of men or of angels. There is no difference between the tongues they spoke in the first century and the tongues being spoken today.


The above is correct (with the exception of 'angelic language'), only if you are referring to real language. Modern T-speech is not at all what is being described in Biblical references to ‘tongues’.

So if corrected to read: “If a person is speaking a language (presumably a foreign one), he is speaking a language of men. There is no difference between the languages they spoke in the first century and the languages being spoken today.” I would agree with this 100%.




(All my references to ‘tongues’ below refer to ‘modern tongues’ / T-speech. See above)

Some people are quick to tell me that I am trying to ‘explain/understand the spiritual in earthly terms’, or something along those lines. There are indeed many intangible things in religion that that must be taken on faith alone; they cannot really be proven, nor can they be disproven.

Tongues however are not one of these things – they are something very tangible, something very physical. Tongues can be and have been examined, analyzed and studied with all results yielding the same conclusions.

Tongues are completely self-created, whether speakers are consciously aware of it or not. As a result, each and every one of the countless number ‘spoken’ is, for the most part, unique to its speaker; no two will ever be quite the same.

Tongues are simply not what their speakers want, perceive, or need them to be.

Whether describing the Christian or non-Christian practice, tongues are simply a tool by which one may establish a closer relationship with the divine and/or strengthen one’s spiritual path. Tongues are also frequently used to aid in healing (whether spiritual or physical in nature).

Use of this tool is highly dependent on one’s faith; the two go hand-in-hand. Tongues cannot correctly be used without faith, no matter what religious path that faith may encompass. For many, both Christians and non-Christians alike, tongues are in fact a very powerful tool.

For all that though, tongues remain simply a tool created by their speakers; nothing more, nothing less. In and of themselves, they are neither divine nor mysterious.

 

[notuptome]

Primarily, 1 Cor 12-14. One day you will understand what they mean.


Maybe you should reread some of your comments to me. You have been quite insulting, accusing me of not knowing how to pray, abusing prayer, frivolity.


I heartily agree!


Speaking in tongues is not a "mystical experience", I am not making myself "hyper-spiritual", nor do I think myself above any other Christian.


This is yet another straw man. You first construct a false attitude and then try and apply it to me. What you have constructed is not my attitude at all.

I have presented the scriptures several times as to what speaking in tongues is, and why we are to speak in tongues. You obviously do not agree, but rather than addressing the scriptures I presented, you just jump in and belittle people who speak in tongues.

Roger, if you do not want to speak in tongues, nobody can make you. Not even God, even though He would like every Christian to do so.

If I may say so, your attitude towards those of who do speak in tongues is hardly "for the cause of Christ".

I am going to tell you the truth from Gods word. If you do not like what Gods word says there is nothing I can do about that.

You are at liberty to consider me harsh if you choose but it does not change what the word of God teaches.

Are you applying a 20th century definition to a first century word when you consider the word ignorance?

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[notuptome]

Well, Roger

You're pretty good at bludgeoning others yourself. I remember first coming here.

You can have the same thing..ask.

If you are not at peace with what Gods word teaches it's not my fault.

The word of God cuts both ways. I have had my toes stepped on by the Lord more times than I can count. I cannot quote a verse without first reading it myself.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[stonesoffire]

What makes you think I am not in peace?

You "think" too much when it comes to Spiritual things. Faith is what has substance in the realm where God exists. And tongues is of His realm. It's a direct line if you will, to Him.

 

[shrume]

I am going to tell you the truth from Gods word. If you do not like what Gods word says there is nothing I can do about that.

If you do not know the truth of God's word, you cannot teach it. I submit that concerning tongues, you do not know the truth.

You are at liberty to consider me harsh if you choose but it does not change what the word of God teaches.

Agreed! The word of God is how we learn about God, and the things of God. You don't understand what the word of God teaches concerning speaking in tongues.

Are you applying a 20th century definition to a first century word when you consider the word ignorance?

Ignorance means ignorance.

 

[shrume]

If a person is speaking in tongues, he is speaking a language of men or of angels. There is no difference between the tongues they spoke in the first century and the tongues being spoken today.


The above is correct (with the exception of 'angelic language'), only if you are referring to real language.

Speaking in tongues is real language of men or of angels.

Modern T-speech is not at all what is being described in Biblical references to ‘tongues’.

So if corrected to read: “If a person is speaking a language (presumably a foreign one), he is speaking a language of men. There is no difference between the languages they spoke in the first century and the languages being spoken today.” I would agree with this 100%.

I stand by what I said.

 

[CS1]

I am always concerned when a person says they are going to tell you the truth from Gods word. Then if you do not agree with their idea of what Gods truth is, then you are against God lol. Most of the time those who do that are very prideful and wrong.

 

[notuptome]

2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.

Does seem to be what scripture expects us to do?

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[shrume]

2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.

Does seem to be what scripture expects us to do?

Without a doubt.

But if we aren't preaching, reproving, rebuking, and exhorting according to true doctrine, then we aren't doing it. Right?

 

[CS1]

Without a doubt.

But if we aren't preaching, reproving, rebuking, and exhorting according to true doctrine, then we aren't doing it. Right?

right unless you believe that you are the one who has been sent by God and solely the one who is going to do that today . some remove 2Tim and place their own name in place of it. those who quote 2tim 4:2 and do not really go and read the rest where Paul mentioned many people who were men and women of God and known to have the Gifts of the Spirit.

Here are some of them you find :

Luke, Mark [FONT=&quot]Prisca and Aquila. [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Eubulus , and Pudens, and Linus, and Claudia, and all the brethren.[/FONT]

 

[shrume]

You forget the demons, if we would not call them angels.

??????????

 

[wolfwint]

Primarily, 1 Cor 12-14. One day you will understand what they mean.


Maybe you should reread some of your comments to me. You have been quite insulting, accusing me of not knowing how to pray, abusing prayer, frivolity.


I heartily agree!


Speaking in tongues is not a "mystical experience", I am not making myself "hyper-spiritual", nor do I think myself above any other Christian.


This is yet another straw man. You first construct a false attitude and then try and apply it to me. What you have constructed is not my attitude at all.

I have presented the scriptures several times as to what speaking in tongues is, and why we are to speak in tongues. You obviously do not agree, but rather than addressing the scriptures I presented, you just jump in and belittle people who speak in tongues.

Roger, if you do not want to speak in tongues, nobody can make you. Not even God, even though He would like every Christian to do so.

If I may say so, your attitude towards those of who do speak in tongues is hardly "for the cause of Christ".

Shrume, you say that God want that every man would like to speak in tongues. Where Scriptureigenen for that. ( 1.Cor 14, 5 is no proof ore would you say all men are be Single like Paul was? 1. Cor 7, 7 )
There is no single vers which proof that your theory is right. You have to make eisegese and bring your thoughts in to justify your teaching. By the way from where you have this teaching with the 9 manifestations? I found in the web a man who teaching the same. He is calling himself a prophet. But when I read his writings it becomes clear for me he is a false Prophet. So I wonder that you have nearly the same view about the gifts of the Holy Spirit. The name of this man? Charlie Shamp.

 

[wolfwint]

Primarily, 1 Cor 12-14. One day you will understand what they mean.


Maybe you should reread some of your comments to me. You have been quite insulting, accusing me of not knowing how to pray, abusing prayer, frivolity.


I heartily agree!


Speaking in tongues is not a "mystical experience", I am not making myself "hyper-spiritual", nor do I think myself above any other Christian.


This is yet another straw man. You first construct a false attitude and then try and apply it to me. What you have constructed is not my attitude at all.

I have presented the scriptures several times as to what speaking in tongues is, and why we are to speak in tongues. You obviously do not agree, but rather than addressing the scriptures I presented, you just jump in and belittle people who speak in tongues.

Roger, if you do not want to speak in tongues, nobody can make you. Not even God, even though He would like every Christian to do so.

If I may say so, your attitude towards those of who do speak in tongues is hardly "for the cause of Christ".

Shrume, you say that God want that every man would like to speak in tongues. Where Scriptureigenen for that. ( 1.Cor 14, 5 is no proof ore would you say all men are be Single like Paul was? 1. Cor 7, 7 )
There is no single vers which proof that your theory is right. You have to make eisegese and bring your thoughts in to justify your teaching. By the way from where you have this teaching with the 9 manifestations? I found in the web a man who teaching the same. He is calling himself a prophet. But when I read his writings it becomes clear for me he is a false Prophet. So I wonder that you have nearly the same view about the gifts of the Holy Spirit. The name of this man? Charlie Shamp.

 

[shrume]

Shrume, you say that God want that every man would like to speak in tongues. Where Scriptureigenen for that. ( 1.Cor 14, 5 is no proof

I believe it is.

ore would you say all men are be Single like Paul was? 1. Cor 7, 7 )

Read the next several verses. It's perfectly fine to get married.

There are no verses countering 1 Cor 14:5.

There is no single vers which proof that your theory is right. You have to make eisegese and bring your thoughts in to justify your teaching.

I disagree.

By the way from where you have this teaching with the 9 manifestations?

The Bible.

I found in the web a man who teaching the same. He is calling himself a prophet. But when I read his writings it becomes clear for me he is a false Prophet. So I wonder that you have nearly the same view about the gifts of the Holy Spirit. The name of this man? Charlie Shamp.

Never heard of him.

 

[notuptome]

Without a doubt.

But if we aren't preaching, reproving, rebuking, and exhorting according to true doctrine, then we aren't doing it. Right?

Correct we must ground our teaching on the word of God and rightly dividing the same. We are in the time of men not desiring sound doctrine.

Great liberty is taken with the scriptures and incorrect teaching is sought by those having itching ears or perhaps even wagging tongues.

For the cause of Christ
Roger