Not By Works
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Also Fran...
I did post your post and then answer. So please take back that accusation in 24428, that "I did it again". Not my fault you didn't read it or repost correctly.
~And what is the truth Stone?
Truth is a person Fran
.
According to what you've written above ---
The truth, according to you, is that we should have no worry for sinning.
Really? I just looked and I don't see those words at all. Perhaps you perceive that is what is said. Why would that be?
You said we help to lift he weight off. The weight of sin.
Wouldn't it be better to teach that we should NOT sin?
Sin consciousness Fran. Not individual sins. Look at the term and find out what it is. We have a conscience that knows right and wrong and that's not the new creation man. Even fallen men know.
Even Paul gave us a list of sins we are not to commit.
Romans 13:8-14
~Rom 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
Rom 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
The 10 commandments. Why didn't you just say the 10 commandments rather than a list that we must do?
Rom 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.
Rom 13:11 And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
Rom 13:12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.
Rom 13:13 Let us walk honestly, as in the day; not in rioting and drunkenness, not in chambering and wantonness, not in strife and envying.
Rom 13:14 But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof.
I've spoken of this many times. We don't obey laws which are outward obedience to what is written. Control. This does not work.
You aren't presenting the answer which is to put on Jesus Christ. Think righteousness. Walk in the love that He has given us. Even agape love is not of ourselves. This is His love.
In fact, in Romans 13:14 Paul says to make no provision for the flesh and its lusts. already addressed.
Why would he say this, if there is now no condemnation and we are not to think of the weight of sin?
There is no condemnation to those who walk in Spirit. How can one walk in Spirit if one thinks they are flesh? That's the very first step that we need to know. We are now Spirit. No longer flesh. Condemnation paralyzes one that they can't move forward to receive forgiveness. Mercy and love through forgiveness is restoration.
He has forgiven all sins. The sins of the world He has died for. That is all sin. The very nature of sin is struck down by the Cross. That is the gospel.
Even Paul said to be wise in what is good, and innocent in what is evil.
Romans 16:19
This is discernment. Going beyond what men can see with natural eyes, hearing of ears, but seeing in the Spirit.
You do seem to contradict Paul...
He is saying that if we LOVE, we WILL obey every Law God ever gave us.
Only in your head Fran.
Romans 13:8-14 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
8 Owe nothing to anyone except to love one another; for he who loves [a]his neighbor has fulfilled the law.
9 For this, “You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, it is summed up in this saying, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”
10 Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
11 Do this, knowing the time, that it is already the hour for you to awaken from sleep; for now [c]salvation is nearer to us than when we believed.
12 The night is almost gone, and the day is near. Therefore let us lay aside the deeds of darkness and put on the armor of light.
13 Let us [d]behave properly as in the day, not in carousing and drunkenness, not in sexual promiscuity and sensuality, not in strife and jealousy. 14 But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh in regard to its lusts.
My original post has quotes on yours and then my answers.
You trying to confuse me?
I did post your post and then answer. So please take back that accusation in 24428, that "I did it again". Not my fault you didn't read it or repost correctly.
~And what is the truth Stone?
Truth is a person Fran
.
According to what you've written above ---
The truth, according to you, is that we should have no worry for sinning.
Really? I just looked and I don't see those words at all. Perhaps you perceive that is what is said. Why would that be?
You said we help to lift he weight off. The weight of sin.
Wouldn't it be better to teach that we should NOT sin?
Sin consciousness Fran. Not individual sins. Look at the term and find out what it is. We have a conscience that knows right and wrong and that's not the new creation man. Even fallen men know.
Even Paul gave us a list of sins we are not to commit.
Romans 13:8-14
~Rom 13:8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
Rom 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
The 10 commandments. Why didn't you just say the 10 commandments rather than a list that we must do?
Rom 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.
Rom 13:11 And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
Rom 13:12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.
Rom 13:13 Let us walk honestly, as in the day; not in rioting and drunkenness, not in chambering and wantonness, not in strife and envying.
Rom 13:14 But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof.
I've spoken of this many times. We don't obey laws which are outward obedience to what is written. Control. This does not work.
You aren't presenting the answer which is to put on Jesus Christ. Think righteousness. Walk in the love that He has given us. Even agape love is not of ourselves. This is His love.
In fact, in Romans 13:14 Paul says to make no provision for the flesh and its lusts. already addressed.
Why would he say this, if there is now no condemnation and we are not to think of the weight of sin?
There is no condemnation to those who walk in Spirit. How can one walk in Spirit if one thinks they are flesh? That's the very first step that we need to know. We are now Spirit. No longer flesh. Condemnation paralyzes one that they can't move forward to receive forgiveness. Mercy and love through forgiveness is restoration.
He has forgiven all sins. The sins of the world He has died for. That is all sin. The very nature of sin is struck down by the Cross. That is the gospel.
Even Paul said to be wise in what is good, and innocent in what is evil.
Romans 16:19
This is discernment. Going beyond what men can see with natural eyes, hearing of ears, but seeing in the Spirit.
You do seem to contradict Paul...
He is saying that if we LOVE, we WILL obey every Law God ever gave us.
Only in your head Fran.
Romans 13:8-14 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
8 Owe nothing to anyone except to love one another; for he who loves [a]his neighbor has fulfilled the law.
9 For this, “You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, it is summed up in this saying, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”
10 Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
11 Do this, knowing the time, that it is already the hour for you to awaken from sleep; for now [c]salvation is nearer to us than when we believed.
12 The night is almost gone, and the day is near. Therefore let us lay aside the deeds of darkness and put on the armor of light.
13 Let us [d]behave properly as in the day, not in carousing and drunkenness, not in sexual promiscuity and sensuality, not in strife and jealousy. 14 But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh in regard to its lusts.
My original post has quotes on yours and then my answers.
You trying to confuse me?
What makes you think I'm opposed to Greek?
I love all foreign languages.
Especially the ones I know well, and don't need Google to look up what something means.
If I have to look it up, it means I don't know the Language really well.
This I know for sure.
If people want to use Lexicons and Strong's, I'm good with that.
I'm able to asnwer to that too...
Know why?
Because it's not necessary to know any Greek to read the bible at the level we do.
All we need is to understand what is written.
Plain and simple.
Without adding or subtracting anything from it.
Without putting into the writings ideas that came about 1,500 years after Jesus died.
I think the English is just fine.
I love all foreign languages.
Especially the ones I know well, and don't need Google to look up what something means.
If I have to look it up, it means I don't know the Language really well.
This I know for sure.
If people want to use Lexicons and Strong's, I'm good with that.
I'm able to asnwer to that too...
Know why?
Because it's not necessary to know any Greek to read the bible at the level we do.
All we need is to understand what is written.
Plain and simple.
Without adding or subtracting anything from it.
Without putting into the writings ideas that came about 1,500 years after Jesus died.
I think the English is just fine.
Readers will judge for themselves if what I said was snarky.
I think it's a serious comment.
Re the academy awards...
You were thanking everyone and were afraid that you were forgetting someone.
I said it reminded me of Academy Awards.
You are very sensitive....!
It was a joke.
I'll try to avoid you in the future.
I think it's a serious comment.
Re the academy awards...
You were thanking everyone and were afraid that you were forgetting someone.
I said it reminded me of Academy Awards.
You are very sensitive....!
It was a joke.
I'll try to avoid you in the future.
Sheep make it, but dogs and pigs don't make it. 
Compare 2 Peter 1:4 - "partakers of the divine nature," having escaped the corruption - Strongs #5356 that is in the world through lust with 2 Peter 2:20 - they escaped the pollutions - Strongs #3356 (different Greek word) of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, yet they are again entangled therein, and overcome. Notice that 2 Peter 2:20 did not mention them being "partakers of the divine nature."
Corruption (Strongs #5356) (to shrivel or wither, spoil , ruin , deprave, corrupt , defile, to destroy by means of corrupting, to spoil as does milk). Corruption - describes decomposition or rotting of an organism and the accompanying stench. The utter depravity of the fallen flesh and the resultant moral decomposition of the world opposed to God is driven by it sinful lusts or evil desires. Internal corruption.
Pollutions/Defilements (Strongs #3393) ("pollutions", "filthy things", "contaminations", "world's filth") describes the state of being tainted or stained by evil and refers to impurity, impure, tainted, defilement, foulness or pollution. Pollutions/Defilement refers to what is on the outside (2 Peter 2:20). But true believers have escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust (2 Peter 1:4).
Corruption is deeper than pollutions/defilements on the outside: it is decay on the inside. True believers have received a new nature, a divine nature, and they have new and different appetites and desires. They have been transformed from pigs and dogs into sheep. The change is more than just cosmetic, as in 2 Peter 2:20.
Having the knowledge of Jesus Christ, even the more intimate knowledge of "epignosis," does not save a person if there is no heart submission to that knowledge. For epignosis to be of any spiritual value, there must be a heart submission to that knowledge. A person who rejects this knowledge will be more accountable at the judgment. Peter did not mention that those who escaped the "pollutions of the world" through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, were "partakers of the divine nature," "born again" or "saved."
Compare 2 Peter 1:4 - "partakers of the divine nature," having escaped the corruption - Strongs #5356 that is in the world through lust with 2 Peter 2:20 - they escaped the pollutions - Strongs #3356 (different Greek word) of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, yet they are again entangled therein, and overcome. Notice that 2 Peter 2:20 did not mention them being "partakers of the divine nature."
Corruption (Strongs #5356) (to shrivel or wither, spoil , ruin , deprave, corrupt , defile, to destroy by means of corrupting, to spoil as does milk). Corruption - describes decomposition or rotting of an organism and the accompanying stench. The utter depravity of the fallen flesh and the resultant moral decomposition of the world opposed to God is driven by it sinful lusts or evil desires. Internal corruption.
Pollutions/Defilements (Strongs #3393) ("pollutions", "filthy things", "contaminations", "world's filth") describes the state of being tainted or stained by evil and refers to impurity, impure, tainted, defilement, foulness or pollution. Pollutions/Defilement refers to what is on the outside (2 Peter 2:20). But true believers have escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust (2 Peter 1:4).
Corruption is deeper than pollutions/defilements on the outside: it is decay on the inside. True believers have received a new nature, a divine nature, and they have new and different appetites and desires. They have been transformed from pigs and dogs into sheep. The change is more than just cosmetic, as in 2 Peter 2:20.
Having the knowledge of Jesus Christ, even the more intimate knowledge of "epignosis," does not save a person if there is no heart submission to that knowledge. For epignosis to be of any spiritual value, there must be a heart submission to that knowledge. A person who rejects this knowledge will be more accountable at the judgment. Peter did not mention that those who escaped the "pollutions of the world" through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, were "partakers of the divine nature," "born again" or "saved."
Hi SOF,
I appreciated your thoughts but the bible is very clear and of course I do not say this without studying the Word of God. You should know me by now
The facts are these;
1. Judas was one of the 12 disciples. You cannot be one of the 12 disciples without being a believer
2. He for a time was following Jesus and put in a responsibility of trust.
3. He was given the Holy Spirit and went out preaching the Gospel
3. He believed Jesus then he betrayed and fell away from Jesus and went back into the world. He was a believer that left God.
Scripture proof line upon line:
Matt 10:1-5; Matt 26:14; Luke 22:48; 23:3; Heb 6:4-8; Heb 10:26-27; John 15:1-10; John 14:15
God bless
I appreciated your thoughts but the bible is very clear and of course I do not say this without studying the Word of God. You should know me by now
The facts are these;
1. Judas was one of the 12 disciples. You cannot be one of the 12 disciples without being a believer
2. He for a time was following Jesus and put in a responsibility of trust.
3. He was given the Holy Spirit and went out preaching the Gospel
3. He believed Jesus then he betrayed and fell away from Jesus and went back into the world. He was a believer that left God.
Scripture proof line upon line:
Matt 10:1-5; Matt 26:14; Luke 22:48; 23:3; Heb 6:4-8; Heb 10:26-27; John 15:1-10; John 14:15
God bless
The same Greek word KNEW in Matt 7.23 is from the same word KNOW in John 17.3 and it means to be one with....
[SUP]3 [/SUP]This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.
Which means covenant relationship...
Jesus was saying depart from me, because you were not one with me....it's one thing to know Jesus as so many here say...it is quite another for him to know you....
[SUP]3 [/SUP]This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.
Which means covenant relationship...
Jesus was saying depart from me, because you were not one with me....it's one thing to know Jesus as so many here say...it is quite another for him to know you....
no martin is fallible. But If you know what part of Martin teaching not inline with the Bible, let us know. Not only church father, even apostle, or angel, subject to be test
Galatians. 1:
8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God’s curse!
Galatians. 1:
8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be under God’s curse!
Are you SERIOUS!!
1. If this were a smaller thread I'd go back and get them.
2. Are you kidding????
Persons here have said that it's AN INSULT to God to say that we need to work because Jesus has already done everything.
Persons here have said that the Kingdom has rules but they are not meant to be kept.
Post after post of insinuations that there is no condemnation for sinning. What does that tell a new Christian?
Maybe persons that remember this could say so?
I REMEMBER THESE COMMENTS VERY WELL...
Know why?
THEY'RE SHOCKING!