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Seeing Jesus changes everything, Job Saw the Lord and misplaced his arguments, they were lost in his old mind, seeing the mind of God. God took the blame for His creation, He doesn't have trouble taking blame. He knew before creating that we would fail and died for us before creating, out of Love to the point of folly for His bride. "The foolishness of God is wiser than the wisdom of the wise if this world. "The Lamb slain before the foundation of the world. If you value this life as treasure. God killing children as if it's final, not considering the possibility that He is sparing them hell. Did you notice He even takes the blame for the time of trouble such as never was, in the book of revelation when it looks like a nuclear war. Does blaming God help you, or does letting Him take your blame help you? "For as much as you have done it to the least of these My children, you have done it to Me." We will all be rewarded according to our labour, whether it be of God or of the enemies of God.
Instead of "argument" just believe Scripture -- the God-breathed Word of God. Notice carefully what Paul says:
14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, [the Tanakh = the Hebrew Bible = the Old Testament] which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
So what do we learn from this passage:
1. Christians are to "continue" in the things which they have been taught from the Holy Bible.
2. The Old Testament is an important and integral part of the Holy Bible and can lead sinners to salvation by grace through faith.
3. All Scripture (both the Old and the New Testaments) is God-breathed and critical and vital for:
a) doctrine -- Bible truth
b) reproof -- rebuking heretics and gainsayers
c) correction -- setting us straight when we are mistaken
d) instruction in righteousness -- how to live soberly, righteously, and godly in this present world.
e) It is Scripture that "perfects" or completes and matures Christians, nothing else.
Now that you have seen the Scriptures pertaining to this, I trust you will repent of your disdain for the Old Testament and tell God that you will believe His whole Word from Genesis to Revelation.
A true Christian should have very serious issues with homosexuality once he has read and digested Romans chapter 1.
14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, [the Tanakh = the Hebrew Bible = the Old Testament] which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
So what do we learn from this passage:
1. Christians are to "continue" in the things which they have been taught from the Holy Bible.
2. The Old Testament is an important and integral part of the Holy Bible and can lead sinners to salvation by grace through faith.
3. All Scripture (both the Old and the New Testaments) is God-breathed and critical and vital for:
a) doctrine -- Bible truth
b) reproof -- rebuking heretics and gainsayers
c) correction -- setting us straight when we are mistaken
d) instruction in righteousness -- how to live soberly, righteously, and godly in this present world.
e) It is Scripture that "perfects" or completes and matures Christians, nothing else.
Now that you have seen the Scriptures pertaining to this, I trust you will repent of your disdain for the Old Testament and tell God that you will believe His whole Word from Genesis to Revelation.
A true Christian should have very serious issues with homosexuality once he has read and digested Romans chapter 1.
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"To the elect Lady and her children."
Hi Still a Lady but not a woman, "In Christ there is neither male nor female but a new creature."
His old mind won't last long, "We are a vapour that will disappear," doesn't mean he wont turn to the Lord for the mind of Christ.
Forgot what I was going to say, must of been from the old mind.
How is everyone? I've been tempted to go back to the world for help when there is no help, I meant in there in the world. and the only Help is "In standing still and returning to the Lord." "To suffer the lost of all things that we may gain Christ."
Hi Still a Lady but not a woman, "In Christ there is neither male nor female but a new creature."
His old mind won't last long, "We are a vapour that will disappear," doesn't mean he wont turn to the Lord for the mind of Christ.
Forgot what I was going to say, must of been from the old mind.
How is everyone? I've been tempted to go back to the world for help when there is no help, I meant in there in the world. and the only Help is "In standing still and returning to the Lord." "To suffer the lost of all things that we may gain Christ."
Hi Theo,
Welcome to CC.
I'm curious as to who you are following. What books, what teacher are you listening to?
Jesus said we must be born of the Spirit. When you are, you will see the truth of scripture. There's a lot of the OT quoted in the NT. So we're Jewish when we read those scriptures from the OT that are in the NT?
The prophets in the OT told of the coming of Jesus. Can I read that part of the OT and not be Jewish? Do you see how ridiculous this teaching is?
Jesus spoke of judgement.
Luke 10:13-15
“Woe to you, Chorazin! Woe to you, Bethsaida! For if the miracles had been performed in Tyre and Sidon which occurred in you, they would have repented long ago, sitting in sackcloth and ashes. But it will be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon in the judgment than for you. And you, Capernaum, will not be exalted to heaven, will you? You will be brought down to Hades!
Luke 12:4, 5
I say to you, My friends, do not be afraid of those who kill the body and after that have no more that they can do. But I will warn you whom to fear: fear the One who, after He has killed, has authority to cast into hell; yes, I tell you, fear Him!
Luke 16:19-31
Now there was a rich man, and he habitually dressed in purple and fine linen, joyously living in splendor every day. And a poor man named Lazarus was laid at his gate, covered with sores, and longing to be fed with the crumbs which were falling from the rich man’s table; besides, even the dogs were coming and licking his sores. Now the poor man died and was carried away by the angels to Abraham’s bosom; and the rich man also died and was buried. In Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and *saw Abraham far away and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried out and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool off my tongue, for I am in agony in this flame.’ But Abraham said, ‘Child, remember that during your life you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus bad things; but now he is being comforted here, and you are in agony. And besides all this, between us and you there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and that none may cross over from there to us.’ And he said, ‘Then I beg you, father, that you send him to my father’s house— for I have five brothers—in order that he may warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’ But Abraham *said, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them.’ But he said, ‘No, father Abraham, but if someone goes to them from the dead, they will repent!’ But he said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be persuaded even if someone rises from the dead.’”
Matthew 25:41-46
“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.’ 44 Then they also will answer, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to you?’ 45 Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’ 46 And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”
Jesus spoke against homosexuality when he spoke of the marriage being between a man and a woman.
Matthew 19:4-6
And He answered and said, “Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘For this reason A man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate.”
Welcome to CC.
I'm curious as to who you are following. What books, what teacher are you listening to?
Jesus said we must be born of the Spirit. When you are, you will see the truth of scripture. There's a lot of the OT quoted in the NT. So we're Jewish when we read those scriptures from the OT that are in the NT?
The prophets in the OT told of the coming of Jesus. Can I read that part of the OT and not be Jewish? Do you see how ridiculous this teaching is?
Jesus spoke of judgement.
Luke 10:13-15
“Woe to you, Chorazin! Woe to you, Bethsaida! For if the miracles had been performed in Tyre and Sidon which occurred in you, they would have repented long ago, sitting in sackcloth and ashes. But it will be more tolerable for Tyre and Sidon in the judgment than for you. And you, Capernaum, will not be exalted to heaven, will you? You will be brought down to Hades!
Luke 12:4, 5
I say to you, My friends, do not be afraid of those who kill the body and after that have no more that they can do. But I will warn you whom to fear: fear the One who, after He has killed, has authority to cast into hell; yes, I tell you, fear Him!
Luke 16:19-31
Now there was a rich man, and he habitually dressed in purple and fine linen, joyously living in splendor every day. And a poor man named Lazarus was laid at his gate, covered with sores, and longing to be fed with the crumbs which were falling from the rich man’s table; besides, even the dogs were coming and licking his sores. Now the poor man died and was carried away by the angels to Abraham’s bosom; and the rich man also died and was buried. In Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and *saw Abraham far away and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried out and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool off my tongue, for I am in agony in this flame.’ But Abraham said, ‘Child, remember that during your life you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus bad things; but now he is being comforted here, and you are in agony. And besides all this, between us and you there is a great chasm fixed, so that those who wish to come over from here to you will not be able, and that none may cross over from there to us.’ And he said, ‘Then I beg you, father, that you send him to my father’s house— for I have five brothers—in order that he may warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.’ But Abraham *said, ‘They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them.’ But he said, ‘No, father Abraham, but if someone goes to them from the dead, they will repent!’ But he said to him, ‘If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be persuaded even if someone rises from the dead.’”
Matthew 25:41-46
“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.’ 44 Then they also will answer, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to you?’ 45 Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’ 46 And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”
Jesus spoke against homosexuality when he spoke of the marriage being between a man and a woman.
Matthew 19:4-6
And He answered and said, “Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘For this reason A man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate.”
Then you haven't read much of the NT, or at least, haven't taken in what you've read.
You also don't understand the term "jealous" in reference to God, and it is quite apparent you've created your own god, a domesticated version of YHWH.
Bottom line is your beliefs aren't Christian. 2 John.
You also don't understand the term "jealous" in reference to God, and it is quite apparent you've created your own god, a domesticated version of YHWH.
Bottom line is your beliefs aren't Christian. 2 John.
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Yes, and Jesus said, that he has revealed God the father, the same God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. And he said that he was sent from the same God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. And if you read the chapters od John 14-17 you will find that Jesus is in Gode the father and God the father is in Jesus. Do you believe that the jews believed in different OT Gods?
Is the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob the Creator? Ore not? Is the creator the same God from whom Jesus is talking?
Is the God of Abraham, Issac and Jacob the Creator? Ore not? Is the creator the same God from whom Jesus is talking?
You are in grave error.. you discount much Truth preferring to create or adhere to another's theology.
You have not the Messiah Son of GOD because you are in unbelief.
May you come to believe the Truth and be set free by GOD's Grace through Faith in His Son's Testimony.
No despise but I reject what you say.
You have not the Messiah Son of GOD because you are in unbelief.
May you come to believe the Truth and be set free by GOD's Grace through Faith in His Son's Testimony.
No despise but I reject what you say.
Hi Theo,
Welcome to CC.
Jesus spoke of judgement.
Luke 12:4, 5
I say to you, My friends, do not be afraid of those who kill the body and after that have no more that they can do. But I will warn you whom to fear: fear the One who, after He has killed, has authority to cast into hell; yes, I tell you, fear Him!
Matthew 25:41-46
“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.’ 44 Then they also will answer, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to you?’ 45 Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’ 46 And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”
Jesus spoke against homosexuality when he spoke of the marriage being between a man and a woman.
Matthew 19:4-6
And He answered and said, “Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘For this reason A man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate.”
Welcome to CC.
Jesus spoke of judgement.
Luke 12:4, 5
I say to you, My friends, do not be afraid of those who kill the body and after that have no more that they can do. But I will warn you whom to fear: fear the One who, after He has killed, has authority to cast into hell; yes, I tell you, fear Him!
Matthew 25:41-46
“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not welcome me, naked and you did not clothe me, sick and in prison and you did not visit me.’ 44 Then they also will answer, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to you?’ 45 Then he will answer them, saying, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’ 46 And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”
Jesus spoke against homosexuality when he spoke of the marriage being between a man and a woman.
Matthew 19:4-6
And He answered and said, “Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘For this reason A man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate.”
"Fear not them that can kill the body"... Better let you, say it like a rose.
T
Not really, I have been struggling to reply to all questions, and I am on my phone. Desert Rose has a great few points. And I suppose I am picking the best bits from a whole Canon. But I just can't reconcile Jesus's word of love, with anything said by anyone else, even if it is supposed to be as holy as Christ words.
Act 11:25-26
(25) Then departed Barnabas to Tarsus, for to seek Saul:
(26) And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.
The disciples were preaching Christ from the Old Testament and they were not called Judeo-Christians, but simply Christians.
Only they were not of the same Christian mind that you speak by since they upheld the law and the testimony of the prophets, persuading the Jews and all the people that Jesus was the one Moses and all the prophets wrote of; and that he should come through the tribe of Judah, the son of David, from the town of Bethlehem.
Joh 7:40-42
(40) Many of the people therefore, when they heard this saying, said, Of a truth this is the Prophet.
(41) Others said, This is the Christ. But some said, Shall Christ come out of Galilee?
(42) Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David, and out of the town of Bethlehem, where David was?
Jesus came unto his own, where homosexuality was clearly an abomination as says the law, and where the death penalty could be swiftly carried out by two or more witnesses. So it makes logical sense that he wouldn't have had to say much about such an abomination see such acts were still in the closet in those days.
If you truly seek Jesus Christ, His Kingdom and His Righteousness, then you will be able to clearly see from the majority of posts on this thread, that your current understanding is directly opposed to the Gospel of Christ and the Gospel of the Kingdom of God. Which if you hear and believe Christ's first preaching recorded in the bible then you will Repent.
Mat 4:17
From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.
Mat 6:33
Jesus said, "But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you."
You seem very young and I pray that you will be guided to READ and hear the entire Revelation of what the Holy Spirit speaks unto the churches.
Rev 1:1-3
(1) The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
(2) Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.
(3) Blessed is he that reads, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.
(25) Then departed Barnabas to Tarsus, for to seek Saul:
(26) And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.
The disciples were preaching Christ from the Old Testament and they were not called Judeo-Christians, but simply Christians.
Only they were not of the same Christian mind that you speak by since they upheld the law and the testimony of the prophets, persuading the Jews and all the people that Jesus was the one Moses and all the prophets wrote of; and that he should come through the tribe of Judah, the son of David, from the town of Bethlehem.
Joh 7:40-42
(40) Many of the people therefore, when they heard this saying, said, Of a truth this is the Prophet.
(41) Others said, This is the Christ. But some said, Shall Christ come out of Galilee?
(42) Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David, and out of the town of Bethlehem, where David was?
Jesus came unto his own, where homosexuality was clearly an abomination as says the law, and where the death penalty could be swiftly carried out by two or more witnesses. So it makes logical sense that he wouldn't have had to say much about such an abomination see such acts were still in the closet in those days.
If you truly seek Jesus Christ, His Kingdom and His Righteousness, then you will be able to clearly see from the majority of posts on this thread, that your current understanding is directly opposed to the Gospel of Christ and the Gospel of the Kingdom of God. Which if you hear and believe Christ's first preaching recorded in the bible then you will Repent.
Mat 4:17
From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.
Mat 6:33
Jesus said, "But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you."
You seem very young and I pray that you will be guided to READ and hear the entire Revelation of what the Holy Spirit speaks unto the churches.
Rev 1:1-3
(1) The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
(2) Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.
(3) Blessed is he that reads, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.
Just to comment that we are not saved by understanding mysteries, "If I understand all mysteries and have not Love, I am nothing. Love is the answer, "God is Love" God had to make a way through death and resurrection, before the beginning of creation. Understanding the Mystery of God, see the necessity for Jesus to die and become a creature, to create us in His image and that this was for Him to have a bride. In the same way that Adam was put in a deep sleep and woman taken out of Him. "Let us make man in our image: Is Jesus put in a deep sleep and the Bride taken out of Him. This happened twice, before creation and at the cross. Again to bad it doesn't help us walk in Love, to know about what He did in our understanding. And since we are saved by God's influence through faith and that it's both present and future, being saved: "Believe on the Lord and you "shall be" (future). God calls those things witch be not as though they are. So it's ok to be like Him and call it as though we are saved. "Let us not judge one another anymore but judge this: that no one put an occasion to stumble before another." This applies to all. I have as well, we are slow learners, "Slow of heart to believe."
we pray that Yeshua teaches you how to Love Him and to Forgive...
you should pray for understanding, much proof and knowledge has been shared
with you but don't have 'ears' to understand...
JOHN 5:46.
For had you believed Moses, you would have believed Me: for he wrote of Me.
LUKE 13:28.
There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob,
and all the prophets, in The Kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.
LUKE 4:4.
And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone,
but by every Word of God.
apparently JESUS believed the OT, for He used the scriptures in IT to 'defeat satan'...
you should pray for understanding, much proof and knowledge has been shared
with you but don't have 'ears' to understand...
JOHN 5:46.
For had you believed Moses, you would have believed Me: for he wrote of Me.
LUKE 13:28.
There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob,
and all the prophets, in The Kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.
LUKE 4:4.
And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone,
but by every Word of God.
apparently JESUS believed the OT, for He used the scriptures in IT to 'defeat satan'...
If you do not accept the entire Bible as God's inspired Word; then there is no basis for discussion.
Jesus refers to Himself as the Word of God.
Scripture refers to itself as God's Word
I believe that the Bible, in its entirety is the visible representation of Jesus until His return.
I don't believe that it is possible to be a true Christian without accepting the authority of Scripture.
Jesus refers to Himself as the Word of God.
Scripture refers to itself as God's Word
I believe that the Bible, in its entirety is the visible representation of Jesus until His return.
I don't believe that it is possible to be a true Christian without accepting the authority of Scripture.
I really hope the man comes to see GOD's love through the Old and New Testament. I read GOD trying and pleading with the disobedient people.. trying to protect them but they believed not and their hearts hardened and much came to pass. And even so GOD sent His Son in to the world to show us His love and mercy hoping we will believe and be Saved.
We can not say we have the Son without the Father or the Father without the Son. They are One.
We can not know GOD's ways.. Only Love and Trust Him always.