Not By Works
- Thread starter dcontroversal
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Unfortunately too many of this audience confess they sin continuously, and at various
points are happy to list their on going daily sins. This is condemnation of ones self, as
it means it is admiting walking in the flesh and will inherit death and not life.
Secondly if you believe you are not Holy, clean and pure, you have a reason for believing
this which means you are condemning yourself for defilement. That is what self condemnation
means. If God has forgiven you, you are clean, and if He is not condemning you, why are you
condemning yourself.
There is a simple logic here.
It is like taking an exam and saying you failed. You get the results which say you passed,
yet you still believe you failed. That is self condemnation.
I do not expect you to understand, because it appears this is beyond some, but I do not
know why, because when I work through this, it seems obvious.
points are happy to list their on going daily sins. This is condemnation of ones self, as
it means it is admiting walking in the flesh and will inherit death and not life.
Secondly if you believe you are not Holy, clean and pure, you have a reason for believing
this which means you are condemning yourself for defilement. That is what self condemnation
means. If God has forgiven you, you are clean, and if He is not condemning you, why are you
condemning yourself.
There is a simple logic here.
It is like taking an exam and saying you failed. You get the results which say you passed,
yet you still believe you failed. That is self condemnation.
I do not expect you to understand, because it appears this is beyond some, but I do not
know why, because when I work through this, it seems obvious.
Because God says that NONE of us are righteous (holy), not a single one of us. He also says that ALL HAVE SINNED, and fallen short of His glory. As far as people here confessing their sins, well God also says "confess thy sins to one another".. So HOW can we be holy, or sinless, or whatever, when God clearly says that we aren't??
Here is the dilemma. We are born sinners, we sin because we are not in communion
with God, we are lost, in darkness. None of us is righteous, or right with God.
We come to faith. We are cleansed and forgiven, washed, purified and made Holy.
We are told we have been forgiven, God accepts us as not guilt as righteous.
That is what it means to be a believer, what Christ has made us.
If we are not righteous after the work of the cross there is no hope.
with God, we are lost, in darkness. None of us is righteous, or right with God.
We come to faith. We are cleansed and forgiven, washed, purified and made Holy.
We are told we have been forgiven, God accepts us as not guilt as righteous.
That is what it means to be a believer, what Christ has made us.
If we are not righteous after the work of the cross there is no hope.
To all in Rome who are loved by God and called to be his holy people: Grace and peace to you from God our Father and from the Lord Jesus Christ.
Rom 1:1
We called to be His Holy People.
together with all His holy people throughout Achaia
2 Cor 1:1
Paul is calling the believers "His Holy people" in the present tense of
writing.
It has always been a problem for believers to grasp what God has done in our
lives, taking us from death to life, openning our eyes so we can see, giving us
love and life to actually reach out and interact in a loving way with others.
This is the gift of new life in Christ. As John says
Anyone who loves their brother and sister lives in the light, and there is nothing in them to make them stumble.
1 John 2:10
It is this love that shows us God has changed us and lives within us.
Some know this truth in their daily life with God, and some it appears do not.
I just wish to encourage you in the Lord, because this love is the gift of God
alive in us, amen.
Rom 1:1
We called to be His Holy People.
together with all His holy people throughout Achaia
2 Cor 1:1
Paul is calling the believers "His Holy people" in the present tense of
writing.
It has always been a problem for believers to grasp what God has done in our
lives, taking us from death to life, openning our eyes so we can see, giving us
love and life to actually reach out and interact in a loving way with others.
This is the gift of new life in Christ. As John says
Anyone who loves their brother and sister lives in the light, and there is nothing in them to make them stumble.
1 John 2:10
It is this love that shows us God has changed us and lives within us.
Some know this truth in their daily life with God, and some it appears do not.
I just wish to encourage you in the Lord, because this love is the gift of God
alive in us, amen.
The problem with sin, our reactions and responses is they are founded on our life
histories and lessons learnt while growing up and going through life.
Jesus changes these, as we listen and obey and work through sin and attitudes.
It takes time to change and work through these things, to build the new creation
God has started in us, to let His words mold and make us new.
We react instantly to things based on our past lessons and emotional history.
It takes 10 times longer to be changed and work through a different way.
But that is our vision to become like Christ.
I hope like me, this is your vision and desire. Let us encourage each as we
progress, for we see the gates of the Kingdom and our Lord walking with us.
Amen.
histories and lessons learnt while growing up and going through life.
Jesus changes these, as we listen and obey and work through sin and attitudes.
It takes time to change and work through these things, to build the new creation
God has started in us, to let His words mold and make us new.
We react instantly to things based on our past lessons and emotional history.
It takes 10 times longer to be changed and work through a different way.
But that is our vision to become like Christ.
I hope like me, this is your vision and desire. Let us encourage each as we
progress, for we see the gates of the Kingdom and our Lord walking with us.
Amen.
J
I understand what you are driving at but there is a difference,when the Israelites are spoken of or others of God they are sometimes known as God's holy people but this is speaking more on once again that those who follow and strive to do right by God are his and he thinks well of them and in calling them "Holy" he is establishing that they are blessed and will be blessed and God is holy so it's referring to God's leadership of such people,it's not a literal statement of them actually being holy but rather that they serve and are God's who is Holy.
Last edited by a moderator:
Joe - here is the problem. Most church going people will agree with you.
We know the difference between ambition, we will do the right thing, and delivery,
we fail. The church has lots of language, but often does not go very deep in peoples
lives. So convinced was I, did not think of myself as Holy.
But Paul did. He writes about it a lot, so did the Jews in the temple, so did Peter but
in church history holy became building and ceremonies, the sacraments etc.
So I started asking what is Holy, how is it described and worked through in scripture,
and also in my life.
Now if you want the answer study scripture and listen to Jesus. Part of the HG
movement is realising we are Holy. It is hard to see and know God moving in power
and holiness, people responding, and slowly sin and defilement creep in and things
return. God works through the impossible and brings blessing.
We limit God by what we have known, not by what He declares. Little wonder so little
occurs because we often dwell so far from His will and ways. When people start
reaching out and sharing His love, great things start happening.
Over 3 years God took fishermen and changed the future of world history.
Today we have so much more opportunity, but do we have the faith and wisdom
to walk in it? I would pray and hope so. God bless you.
We know the difference between ambition, we will do the right thing, and delivery,
we fail. The church has lots of language, but often does not go very deep in peoples
lives. So convinced was I, did not think of myself as Holy.
But Paul did. He writes about it a lot, so did the Jews in the temple, so did Peter but
in church history holy became building and ceremonies, the sacraments etc.
So I started asking what is Holy, how is it described and worked through in scripture,
and also in my life.
Now if you want the answer study scripture and listen to Jesus. Part of the HG
movement is realising we are Holy. It is hard to see and know God moving in power
and holiness, people responding, and slowly sin and defilement creep in and things
return. God works through the impossible and brings blessing.
We limit God by what we have known, not by what He declares. Little wonder so little
occurs because we often dwell so far from His will and ways. When people start
reaching out and sharing His love, great things start happening.
Over 3 years God took fishermen and changed the future of world history.
Today we have so much more opportunity, but do we have the faith and wisdom
to walk in it? I would pray and hope so. God bless you.