For Calvinists: Do you skip evangelizing because God chooses?

[Muzungu256]

This is getting a little too silly y'all...

Just saying...Free will or free choice whatever you want to call it...is free so it can't be forced upon you...It's your choice do with it as you will...

How much simpler can it get? Everyone can choose to accept or reject... it's on them and to each their own, right.

if u are born without legs can u choose to walk????? u see.

 

[1ofthem]

God gave you some free will? When? At birth?

Come on now...duh...He gave everyone freewill or choice....

Read the Bible from the Beginning to the end and see how many times he gave people choices to accept or reject him...I'm pretty sure it's all the way through it from Genesis to Revelations...

 

[1ofthem]

if u are born without legs can u choose to walk????? u see.

Physical and spiritual are two different things folks...So why is that so hard to understand? Really just asking here.

 

[trofimus]

Physical and spiritual are two different things folks...So why is that so hard to understand? Really just asking here.

If spiritual was also created, its dependent on God in the same way as physical and there is no difference regarding predetermination.

 

[Muzungu256]

Physical and spiritual are two different things folks...So why is that so hard to understand? Really just asking here.

i overstand perfectly where u come from. but its like that for us. man is dead in trespasses and sins. so spiritually its the same u see.
only God can save from it

 

[1ofthem]

If spiritual was also created, its dependent on God in the same way as physical and there is no difference regarding predetermination.

Two totally different things...Nowhere does God promise that he will always heal and save us physically if we choose for him too...

But to be spiritually saved... he does promise that any and all that have faith in him, accept him, and call upon him will be saved.

John 3:16 for starters but that's just one verse...there's many many more that state the same thing though...I'm just a little too busy to repost them all at the moment.

Anyhow good day to all y'all.

 

[trofimus]

Two totally different things...Nowhere does God promise that he will always heal and save us physically if we choose for him too...

But to be spiritually saved... he does promise that any and all that have faith in him, accept him, and call upon him will be saved.

John 3:16 for starters but that's just one verse...there's many many more that state the same thing though...I'm just a little too busy to repost them all at the moment.

Anyhow good day to all y'all.

J 3:16 says that "All believing ones will not die but will have the eternal life".

This verse is irrelevant to the issue of predetermination, predestination or election.

Sentence "All who walk in the rain will get wet" is irrelevant to the issue of why some walk in the rain and some not, who sent them to walk there etc.

 

[1ofthem]

J 3:16 says that "All believing ones will not die but will have the eternal life".

This verse is irrelevant to the issue of predetermination, predestination or election.

Sentence "All who walk in the rain will get wet" is irrelevant to the issue of why some walk in the rain and some not, who sent them to walk there etc.

Why is it so unclear? I really don't see how plainer it could get especially when taken with all the other scriptures that say whosoever will call upon God will be saved. I just can't see where people don't get the Whomsoever will...part of that.... as an invitation to all...

And I know some will say its whoever God draws, but we know Jesus said that if I be lifted up I will draw all men to myself...Now no, not all will accept...but it's their own choice...All men have a chance but it's up to them to accept it or not...

I seriously gotta go know...Have a good day and God Bless y'all

 

[trofimus]

Why is it so unclear? I really don't see how plainer it could get especially when taken with all the other scriptures that say whosoever will call upon God will be saved. I just can't see where people don't get the Whomsoever will...part of that.... as an invitation to all...

And I know some will say its whoever God draws, but we know Jesus said that if I be lifted up I will draw all men to myself...Now no, not all will accept...but it's their own choice...All men have a chance but it's up to them to accept it or not...

I seriously gotta go know...Have a good day and God Bless y'all

It is clear, you just use a wrong logic as I demonstrated with the sentence about raining.

There is no logical conclusion about us not being predetermined from the verses you use.

And in this new post you are ignoring that in English, the word "will" has more meanings. Its used as a future tense verb in these verses. Its quite strange that I, from the Czech Republic, must remind you that

 

[Muzungu256]

what convinced me to the reformed position u see........ is the consistensy..... binding it all together. nothing sticks out like a sore thumb

 

[SovereignGrace]

Come on now...duh...He gave everyone freewill or choice....

Read the Bible from the Beginning to the end and see how many times he gave people choices to accept or reject him...I'm pretty sure it's all the way through it from Genesis to Revelations...

Jesus said no one can come to EXCEPT...theres a restriction to coming to the Christ...they be drawn. If there's a restriction to coming to the Christ, then there's no freedom of the will. We had to be drawn before we could approach Him, seeking His salvation.

 

[1ofthem]

It is clear, you just use a wrong logic as I demonstrated with the sentence about raining.

There is no logical conclusion about us not being predetermined from the verses you use.

And in this new post you are ignoring that in English, the word "will" has more meanings. Its used as a future tense verb in these verses. Its quite strange that I, from the Czech Republic, must remind you that

LOL...Well thanks for the English lesson...But you can go ahead and put your dictionary away now... because what I am really dumbfounded about and would like to know the answer to is... How or why a group of people want to shut the gospel down to some people when God opened it up for all and said whosoever will choose to believe will be saved...So maybe you can answer that one for me wiseguy

 

[SovereignGrace]

Why is it so unclear? I really don't see how plainer it could get especially when taken with all the other scriptures that say whosoever will call upon God will be saved. I just can't see where people don't get the Whomsoever will...part of that.... as an invitation to all...

And I know some will say its whoever God draws, but we know Jesus said that if I be lifted up I will draw all men to myself...Now no, not all will accept...but it's their own choice...All men have a chance but it's up to them to accept it or not...

I seriously gotta go know...Have a good day and God Bless y'all

If I preach to 523 lost ppl and 28 of them are saved, whosoever called upon Him were saved. That's the context of whosoever. I agree that whosoever calls upon Him will be saved, and whosoever does not, will not be saved.

 

[1ofthem]

Jesus said no one can come to EXCEPT...theres a restriction to coming to the Christ...they be drawn. If there's a restriction to coming to the Christ, then there's no freedom of the will. We had to be drawn before we could approach Him, seeking His salvation.

Yes, thanks, I know that...but he draws all men at some point in their lives.. when he is ready to do so...Now they can accept or reject him but he does give all that chance.

If I be lifted up will draw all men unto me...God is no respecter of persons...

 

[SovereignGrace]

LOL...Well thanks for the English lesson...But you can go ahead and put your dictionary away now... because what I am really dumbfounded about and would like to know the answer to is... How or why a group of people want to shut the gospel down to some people when God opened it up for all and said whosoever will choose to believe will be saved...So maybe you can answer that one for me wiseguy

We are not shutting down the gospel to anyone. We are to preach it to all indiscriminantly. We are to preach to all ppl in all nations. Its ppl's wicked hearts that reject it. Unless God wroughts a work of grace in ppl's hearts, they can not and will not believe.

 

[SovereignGrace]

Yes, thanks, I know that...but he draws all men at some point in their lives.. when he is ready to do so...Now they can accept or reject him but he does give all that chance.

If I be lifted up will draw all men unto me...God is no respecter of persons...

How does He draws those who never hear the gospel? Many in today's world still have not heard it. In Turkey, its against the law, punishable by death, to be a christian.

 

[1ofthem]

If I preach to 523 lost ppl and 28 of them are saved, whosoever called upon Him were saved. That's the context of whosoever. I agree that whosoever calls upon Him will be saved, and whosoever does not, will not be saved.

Ok sounds like were saying the same thing here on this...but the ones that called upon him...wasn't that their choice to do so or did someone force them to do it? Same as the ones who didn't accept wasn't that their own choice?

 

[1ofthem]

How does He draws those who never hear the gospel? Many in today's world still have not heard it. In Turkey, its against the law, punishable by death, to be a christian.

I'm not saying that the circumstances are the same for everyone...but all will have a chance...Yeah, its alot easier for me living in the Bible belt to accept him when he calls, but that doesn't mean that he loves me more than he does anyone in Turkey or anywhere else...All have a chance and yeah it may be harder for some but God gives all a chance just like scripture says he does...

 

[preacher4truth]

We are not shutting down the gospel to anyone. We are to preach it to all indiscriminantly. We are to preach to all ppl in all nations. Its ppl's wicked hearts that reject it. Unless God wroughts a work of grace in ppl's hearts, they can not and will not believe.

Gotta love her false accusations and seeing things that aren't there. Since they can't beat us with facts or truth they just throw in some falsities. It amazes me that professing believers behave this way.

 

[SovereignGrace]

Ok sounds like were saying the same thing here on this...but the ones that called upon him...wasn't that their choice to do so or did someone force them to do it? Same as the ones who didn't accept wasn't that their own choice?

We are not talking about force, as in coersion here, but raising the dead to life. The physically dead are in the same state the spiritually dead are. The lost have a corpse for a spirit that is within them.

Look at Ezekiel 37. Those very dry bones could not will themselves to life. A sovereign God sovereignly brought them to life and they acted accordingly. When we witness to the lost, they are, inwardly, a pile of jumbled up very dry bones. As we give them the gospel, when God moves through the gospel, He quickens them to live, the respond in faith & repentance, and are saved. All this happens simultaenously. They choose to respond after God has quickened them.