Not By Works

[mailmandan]

You can't have one without the other.
James says it brings death to faith if it has no works.
Besides that, these works have nothing to do with the 'works of the Law'.

In James 2:14, we read of one who says-claims he has faith but has no works (to back up his claim). This is not genuine faith, but a bare profession of faith. So when James asks, "Can that faith save him?" He is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an empty profession of faith/dead faith.

These works are part of the MORAL aspect of the law. In Matthew 22:37-40, we read: Jesus said to him, 'You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.' This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like it: 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets. These works cannot be dissected from the two great commandments (Matthew 22:37-40) which are found in the law of Moses (Deuteronomy 6:5; Leviticus 19:18).

In James 2:15-16, the example of a "work" that James gives is: "If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, and one of you says to them, "Depart in peace, be warmed and filled," but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit?" To give a brother or sister these things needed for the body would certainly be a "good work" yet to neglect such a brother or sister and not give them the things needed for the body is to break the second great commandment "love your neighbor as yourself" (Matthew 22:39) as found written in the law of Moses (Leviticus 19:18).

 

[PHart]

Galatians 2:16-21 (ASV)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] yet knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, even we believed on Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ, and not by the works of the law: because by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] But if, while we sought to be justified in Christ, we ourselves also were found sinners, is Christ a minister of sin? God forbid.
[SUP]18 [/SUP] For if I build up again those things which I destroyed, I prove myself a transgressor.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] For I through the law died unto the law, that I might live unto God.
[SUP]20 [/SUP] I have been crucified with Christ; and it is no longer I that live, but Christ living in me: and that life which I now live in the flesh I live in faith, the faith which is in the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself up for me.
[SUP]21 [/SUP] I do not make void the grace of God: for if righteousness is through the law, then Christ died for nought.

Where in this passage does it say that continued believing is a work of the damnable works gospel?

 

[PHart]

"You have to continue to believe to continue to be protected by the sacrifice of Christ for the Day of Salvation."


what would you say it means in more detail to " continue believing" ? what is it we need to continue to Believe?

We need to continue to rely and trust on the blood of Christ for the forgiveness of sin. It's the exact same believing that started on the first day we were saved. We must endure in that trust to the very end to remain in God's forgiveness to be saved in the end.

 

[mailmandan]

"You have to continue to believe to continue to be protected by the sacrifice of Christ for the Day of Salvation."

what would you say it means in more detail to " continue believing" ? what is it we need to continue to Believe?

Exactly what do you believe IN as the means of your salvation? Christ's finished work of redemption or your works? What exactly are you trusting IN for salvation? We need to Believe the gospel by trusting in the death, burial and resurrection of Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation in order to become and remain saved (1 Corinthians 15:1-4; Romans 1:16). Saving belief in Christ continues and is not some shallow, temporary belief that has no root, produces no fruit and withers away.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You have no substance. Give it up. Unsupported rhetoric doesn't prove anything. I showed you that Hebrews 10 is talking about sanctified believers. You have not been able to refute that. I used the passage itself to prove my point. You? What do you have? Your interpretation of 1 John 2:19 NULLIFIES Hebrews 10. My interpretation of Hebrews 10 does NOT nullify 1 John 2. Put 'em side by side. I'll show you. I'll do that with any of your suppossed OSAS passages. You will see that in your supposed OSAS passages you are ignoring the fact that the promise of eternal life is conditioned on continued believing.

It has been shown to you over and over, Just because you can not see it is not my problem.

Your problem is your fighting OSAS. Your not trying to understand what people bel;iebve. Your spoon fed what people believe, or you hae come to your own conclusions, and sadly you are wro0ng, Until you understand that. You will never come to an agreement with people who disagree with you about the gospel.

Continue to try to save yourself and prove your lack of faith in God. And continue thinking you know what people believe and what their motives are. You will be wrong in both cases and continue to be unreliable.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Law keepers believe in the forgiveness of God. At any point they fail they have Christ's blood to cover them JUST AS YOU DO WHEN YOU DO NOT KEEP ALL OF GOD'S COMMANDS.

If they did they would not be teaching salvation by the law. And that failure to keep it could result in loss of salvation.

Theyt believe they have to EARN Gods forgiveness. The fact you fail to see this just proves your right their with them.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

This is why I no longer listen to Phart's counterfeit gospel. "Today is the day of Salvation", Phart's gospel is wrong with every word he speaks. He continually twists the scriptures to fit his fake gospel day after day. Counterfeit gospel = Counterfeit Christ

"For he says, "In the time of my favor I heard you, and in the day of salvation I helped you." I tell you, now is the time of God's favor, now is the day of salvation." 2Cor6:2

Absolute nonsense

Originally Posted by PHart

"You have to continue to believe to continue to be protected by the sacrifice of Christ for
the Day of Salvation."

Fake gospel = fake christ

I agree, it is time he rejoined peter. I had him there once, should have left him there.

 

[blue_ladybug]

.................

 

[preacher4truth]

PHart's wording is off, which shows just how easy it is to have a false gospel message.

It isn't that a person MUST CONTINUE to believe, as if this were some effort on their part. Faith is first God's gift. Secondly, salvation in all of its phases is secured and irrevocable as per Romans 8:28-39. To believe in vain is not to have truly believed.

That a believer believes until the end is redundant, it is what a true convert does, it is what God does in them and through them, Philippians 1:6 &c. There is not one verse of Scripture that shows any person ever lost salvation. Depart from the faith? Yes. That is not loss of salvation.

PHart makes all this about what a person must do with effort or the person will not make it into heaven. Frankly, his asinine obsession with this effort is disturbing. It is to the point of being mental.

The workers have tricked themselves by misinterpretation into believing their efforts are not works. It's like:

"Concentrate really hard now, today, keep believing! Don't stop! Concentrate! CAREFUL!!!!!!!!! Do you believe now? Right now? In 5 minutes? Tomorrow????? CAREFUL!!! Hey, don't stop believing!!!!! Are you sure you believe????? Did you STOP? Watch out!!!!! Careful!!! Do you believe like RIGHT NOW????? 2018 is coming, better make a RESOLUTION to NOT STOP BELIEVING the WHOLE year!!! 2018 could be the year you STOP believing and then you're going to HELL pal!!! If you wake up tomorrow and don't believe, it is hell for you!!!!"

Not to mention the person also has to do something "really stupid" according to PHart's PHalse gospel.

Just imagine the "freedom" in the above paranoia and misunderstanding of texts such as 1 Corinthians 15:2 to which he has misused to arrive where he is. No thanks, I'll pass on that PHalse gospel.

Yep. PHart; perpetually trying to sift the wheat from the wheat and divide the sheep from the sheep.

 

[PennEd]

We need to continue to rely and trust on the blood of Christ for the forgiveness of sin. It's the exact same believing that started on the first day we were saved. We must endure in that trust to the very end to remain in God's forgiveness to be saved in the end.

How can you continually say you trust in Christ, yet in the next breath proclaim YOU need to endure?

Your statement proves you are not trusting Jesus for Salvation, but rather YOUR WORK OF ENDURING. Is it YOUR work of enduring that saves you, or Jesus death, and resurrection? It CAN'T be both? THAT is indeed a false gospel.
Accept Jesus in your heart. Be sealed by the Holy Spirit, and enter His rest!

 

[LoveGodForever]

Exactly what do you believe IN

Hi MMD,

Some posts for you but no reply? (See the linked posts here for your convenience #'s 3956; 39680; 39682; 39683; 39684; 39685; and 39686.) Just in case you did not see them. If you did see them why do you not reply? Who should we follow the traditions and teachings of man or the Word of God? Only God's Word is true so let's talk scripture. Do you believe God's Word?

 

[mailmandan]

Hi MMD,

Some posts for you but no reply? (See the linked posts here for your convenience #'s 3956; 39680; 39682; 39683; 39684; 39685; and 39686.) Just in case you did not see them. If you did see them why do you not reply? Who should we follow the traditions and teachings of man or the Word of God? Only God's Word is true so let's talk scripture. Do you believe God's Word?

I'm not replying because your arguments have already been refuted on Christian Chat and on the Christian Forums website as well by multiple people (some which are former SDA's).

Your teachings on your website - "The BeastsMark is coming!" is very similar to the false teachings of the SDA church -

Bible Truth Versus Adventist Truth - Mark of the Beast

It's painfully obvious to me that you are deeply indoctrinated and unreachable, are puffed up on your flawed knowledge and you also refuse to answer questions, so I see no point in continuing to waste anymore of my time beating a dead horse. It's also obvious that you are mixed up in a dangerous cult and you are not fooling me for one second with your false doctrine and repeated rhetoric.

I sincerely hope and pray that you find your way out whatever cult you are mixed up in and into the light of the glorious gospel of Christ which is the power of God unto salvation to everyone that BELIEVES.. (Romans 1:16).

 

[LoveGodForever]

I'm not replying because your arguments have already been refuted on Christian Chat and on the Christian Forums website as well by multiple people (some which are former SDA's).

Your teachings on your website - "The BeastsMark is coming!" is very similar to the false teachings of the SDA church -

Bible Truth Versus Adventist Truth - Mark of the Beast

It's painfully obvious to me that you are deeply indoctrinated and unreachable, are puffed up on your flawed knowledge and you also refuse to answer questions, so I see no point in continuing to waste anymore of my time beating a dead horse. It's also obvious that you are mixed up in a dangerous cult and you are not fooling me for one second with your false doctrine and repeated rhetoric.

I sincerely hope and pray that you find your way out whatever cult you are mixed up in and into the light of the glorious gospel of Christ which is the power of God unto salvation to everyone that BELIEVES.. (Romans 1:16).

Yep, I did not think you would reply because you do not know him that loves all and the truth is not in you. Only God's Word is true. You follow the word of website and the traditions and teachings of man over the Word of God and when the Word if God comes you are silent. It is ok I do not judge you. Jesus says, If any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. He that rejects me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judges him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

He who sees, sees all. How can you being evil do good things? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. Those that be whole do not need a physician but those that are sick. By their fruits you will know them. Love is a fruit. Those that love have met the physician. The mirror shows the way that all must look into it and see themselves. Then we can see the one who loves us and know the one who is calling us. It is the small voice behind us saying this is the way walk you in it. It is hard to kick against the pricks…. If the blind shall lead the blind both shall fall into a ditch

 

[preacher4truth]

Yep, I did not think you would reply because you do not know him that loves all and the truth is not in you.

You've just called my brother lost, yet you are the one preaching a false gospel.

It is ok I do not judge you.

Too late friend, you've already done so.

I've taken a brief look at your cult website. The reason you do not claim denominational affiliation is due to an feeble attempt to be properly labelled a cult, of which you and your teachings are.

You have not trusted nor have you believed in the Gospel of Christ.

By the way, there is no book of "Revelations" as per your cult website.

 

[mailmandan]

You've just called my brother lost, yet you are the one preaching a false gospel.

Too late friend, you've already done so.

I've taken a brief look at your cult website. The reason you do not claim denominational affiliation is due to an feeble attempt to be properly labelled a cult, of which you and your teachings are.

You have not trusted nor have you believed in the Gospel of Christ.

By the way, there is no book of "Revelations" as per your cult website.

Thank you brother! You hit the nail on the head! He is not fooling us.

 

[LoveGodForever]

I'm not replying because your arguments have already been refuted on Christian Chat and on the Christian Forums website

It's painfully obvious to me that you are deeply indoctrinated and unreachable, are puffed up on your flawed knowledge and you also refuse to answer questions

Is your way of refuting someone ignoring their posts? Also, what questions have you asked that I have not answered? I think it is you that is the one that does not answer any questions my friend. Please show me how you or anyone has refuted anything I have provided? I only share the Word of God and when you see God's Word you ignore it because you do not know him who loves all.. by their fruits you shall know them and you do not know him. He that says I know him and keeps not his commandments is a liar and the truth is not in him... Only God's Word is true. If we follow the traditions and teachings of man over the Word of God we are not following God. Who of you all can show me I am not following God's Word and if you can't why do you not believe God when it is only God's Word that is written? You indeed post pictures of yourself because you do not know him who loves all and are not following him

 

[LoveGodForever]

You've just called my brother lost, yet you are the one preaching a false gospel.
Too late friend, you've already done so. I've taken a brief look at your cult website. The reason you do not claim denominational affiliation is due to an feeble attempt to be properly labelled a cult, of which you and your teachings are.
You have not trusted nor have you believed in the Gospel of Christ. By the way, there is no book of "Revelations" as per your cult website.

I judge no man. God's Word is the judge and is true. God's Word alone is righteous judgement and says you shall know them by their fruits. It is God's Word that says he that says I know him and does not keep His commandments is a liar and the truth is not in him. Judge righteous judgment. The natural man receives not the things of the Spirit of God neither can he know then because they are foolishness unto him.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You've just called my brother lost, yet you are the one preaching a false gospel.



Too late friend, you've already done so.

I've taken a brief look at your cult website. The reason you do not claim denominational affiliation is due to an feeble attempt to be properly labelled a cult, of which you and your teachings are.

You have not trusted nor have you believed in the Gospel of Christ.

By the way, there is no book of "Revelations" as per your cult website.

thats two sent to the black hole of iggyland in one morning. Might be a record

 

[preacher4truth]

I judge no man.

Oh shut it with your rhetoric, you've already judged in addition to your improper usage of Scripture and disbelief in the Gospel. John 3:7.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Oh shut it with your rhetoric, you've already judged in addition to your improper usage of Scripture and disbelief in the Gospel. John 3:7.

Lol, He judged MMD did not have god. Then claims he does not judge.

He can;t even resolve his own issue of contradictory statements Its no wonder he can not resolve his issue of making the Bible contradict itself.