Not By Works

[Studyman]

The Gospel remains under attack by works-salvationists who play the same game in salvation as every other false movement of Christendom. They profess to teach that salvation is by grace through faith, but then redefine this in a way that is contrary to the Truth. Even though they may deny this, they teach that salvation is by "grace plus law, faith plus works."

I am not attacking the Gospel. The Gospel doesn't teach us to create images of God in the likeness of some long haired men's hair shampoo model, religious tradition does.

The Gospel doesn't teach we are to create our own Sabbath and reject the one Jesus created for man, religious tradition does.

The gospel doesn't teach to create your own High Days and "Feasts unto the Lord", it teach against such wickedness. But religious tradition does it any way.

The Gospel doesn't teach that the Pharisees were trying to please God by obeying Him, mainstream preachers tell this lie.

The Gospel doesn't teach that Jesus nailed His Fathers Word's to the cross, mainstream preachers forward this falsehood.

No Dan, it isn't the Gospel that you defend, it's your religious traditions. It is the ancient religious traditions and doctrines that cause those who are in them to transgress the Commandments of God that you defend and preach.

My problem isn't with the Gospel, it is with religious tradition of man that Jesus preached AGAINST.

I know how angry it makes a person when God exposes their sins, but don't be a Pharisee and take your anger out on a brother who did nothing but try and help you.

 

[Ralph-]

May He rescue you from your body of death, and give you a NEW, LIVING heart, as the New Wine (Holy Spirit) CANNOT inhabit an old wineskin. (your dead heart).

...and which makes it so you can be disobedient and can remain that way and it will be okay when Jesus comes back because salvation is not by being obedient.

A new living heart is not one that says it's okay to languish in disobedience because salvation is not by obedience.

This little glee club in this thread is pushing Hypergrace, freegrace doctrine and the mods don't even know it. I'm not blaming them. It's going to take time for it to be recognized for what it is in the church. It's a subtle, deceptive twist on the traditional once saved always saved teaching.

The old gospel of once saved always saved: truly saved people are obedient and persevere to the end. If you are living in disobedience it shows you were never saved to begin with. This is the old Calvinist teaching.

The new gospel of once saved always saved: you don't have to persevere to the end to be saved because salvation is not by obedience. Obedience or disobedience doesn't mean anything either way, just as long as you believe. This is called hypergrace.

This is why you people keep bringing once save always saved into the conversation. It's your misguided excuse for remaining in your old unchanged ways and thinking you're saved at the same time. And they call that having a new heart. That right there says a lot.

 

[Inquistor]

I just posted this in another... Abraham believed was Counted righteousness then did a work to show or prove his faith... Circumcisions.. You can't throw out works.. they prove your faith

OF COURSE Abraham then "did a work" . . . because FAITH WITHOUT WORKS IS DEAD!!! So everyone who actually STUDIES their bible(s) should conclude that DEAD FAITH has no power at all . . . BECAUSE IT'S DEAD!!!

Bible Search: faith without works

 

[eternally-gratefull]

As a New Year's resolution let us stop posting here and let the little glee club that wears the 'like' button out on each other's posts here encourage each other in their disobedience and blindness.

...and which makes it so you can be disobedient and can remain that way and it will be okay when Jesus comes back because salvation is not by being obedient.

A new living heart is not one that says it's okay to languish in disobedience because salvation is not by obedience.

This little glee club in this thread is pushing Hypergrace, freegrace doctrine and the mods don't even know it. I'm not blaming them. It's going to take time for it to be recognized for what it is in the church. It's a subtle, deceptive twist on the traditional once saved always saved teaching.

The old gospel of once saved always saved: truly saved people are obedient and persevere to the end. If you are living in disobedience it shows you were never saved to begin with. This is the old Calvinist teaching.

The new gospel of once saved always saved: you don't have to persevere to the end to be saved because salvation is not by obedience. Obedience or disobedience doesn't mean anything either way, just as long as you believe. This is called hypergrace.

This is why you people keep bringing once save always saved into the conversation. It's your misguided excuse for remaining in your old unchanged ways and thinking you're saved at the same time. And they call that having a new heart. That right there says a lot.

That resolution did not last a few hours,

Yet he wants to attack DC for keeping the thread going.. .lol Ya just got to laugh.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

OF COURSE Abraham then "did a work" . . . because FAITH WITHOUT WORKS IS DEAD!!! So everyone who actually STUDIES their bible(s) should conclude that DEAD FAITH has no power at all . . . BECAUSE IT'S DEAD!!!

Bible Search: faith without works

I agree with you, The issue is that people want to focus on works, and not on faith.

True faith works, there is not a question about it, the only ones questioning it are those focused on works

If a dead faith has no power to save (and it does not have that power!!!!) it’s definitely has no power to work. Now will it.

 

[Ralph-]

That resolution did not last a few hours,

Yet he wants to attack DC for keeping the thread going.. .lol Ya just got to laugh.

this kind of stuff reveals what you really are. We know.

I'm looking for a consensus. If we can get that we will leave you Hypergrace 'believers' to yourselves to encourage and build up each other in your disobedient dead 'faith'. If we don't get a concensus I will continue to expose your hypergrace teaching here.

If you say obedience does not matter then you are hypergrace.

If you say obedience matters because that's the proof of faith then you are not hypergrace.

You can't have it both ways. you can't say obedience doesn't matter and then say it does matter because that's what faith does. Make up your mind people. Which is it?

 

[TruthTalk]

For the op, not responding to the post, Refuse to response to silly nonsense anymore with people who continue to lie about others)

The fact is, is is posts like this right here is why this thread, and threads like it will never die. (I am beginning to think they do it on purpose to get a rise out of us which is why I think it is best we stop responding to this nonsense anymore)

1. False accusations based on false truths about what others are saying or teaching.
2. Just like Cain attacked Abel, The works people will attack the grace people. Because the same reason the pharisee attacked christ. Because of pride. The4y think because we REJECT the fact that obedience will save us, but is the RESULT of being saved, we are attacking obedience.
3. And then your final lie. This fight has been going on since Cain and even. The one who is resisting the spirit are the ones trying to do what religion has done since the beginning, Saying obedience is REQUIRED. Not that obedience is RESULT (it boasts in self) yet you say only in the last couple years? You must have been isolated.

Hi E-g, and Amen! Here is one post that I think crossed way over the line for human decency, Cain and Able.

Look, dcontroversial. I'm not going to beat your face in for being an unbeliever.

 

[Magenta]

What you're seeing is I had some free time over the holiday weekend to post. You watch. When this 'thing' starts dying and falls down in the list he'll bump it up. That's what he's been doing.

What I am seeing is you continuing to lie. The post stream went back more than over a weekend. Your posts in this thread over that period of time amounted to greater than 25% above David's post count in this thread. It seems you post hardly anywhere else, in fact, except here where you would like to see people stop posting. What can be seen is that you will go to any length to try to rationalize and justify your contentious spirit.

 

[Ralph-]

Hi E-g, and Amen! Here is one post that I think crossed way over the line for human decency, Cain and Able.

Hypergrace 'believers' are false believers. you are a false believer.

I will expose you for what you are. you're trying to protect yourself under traditional church teaching while pushing this new 'nothing matters' hypergrace salvation. You can't have it both ways. I will expose this for what it is. Unless we get a consensus among those of us who aren't a part of your little glee club 'liking' each others posts making yourselves feel better that way then we will leave you to the condemnation of the disobedient unbelieving.

 

[Ralph-]

What I am seeing is you continuing to lie. The post stream went back more than over a weekend. Your posts in this thread over that period of time amounted to greater than 25% above David's post count in this thread. It seems you post hardly anywhere else, in fact, except here where you would like to see people stop posting. What can be seen is that you will go to any length to try to rationalize and justify your contentious spirit.

You don't even realize we can see right through you. your defensiveness about obedience betrays you.

 

[PennEd]

...and which makes it so you can be disobedient and can remain that way and it will be okay when Jesus comes back because salvation is not by being obedient.

A new living heart is not one that says it's okay to languish in disobedience because salvation is not by obedience.

This little glee club in this thread is pushing Hypergrace, freegrace doctrine and the mods don't even know it. I'm not blaming them. It's going to take time for it to be recognized for what it is in the church. It's a subtle, deceptive twist on the traditional once saved always saved teaching.

The old gospel of once saved always saved: truly saved people are obedient and persevere to the end. If you are living in disobedience it shows you were never saved to begin with. This is the old Calvinist teaching.

The new gospel of once saved always saved: you don't have to persevere to the end to be saved because salvation is not by obedience. Obedience or disobedience doesn't mean anything either way, just as long as you believe. This is called hypergrace.

This is why you people keep bringing once save always saved into the conversation. It's your misguided excuse for remaining in your old unchanged ways and thinking you're saved at the same time. And they call that having a new heart. That right there says a lot.

We are either obedient to THE Gospel, which relies TOTALLY on the shed Blood, death, and subsequent resurrection of Jesus Christ, OR we are to be TOTALLY obedient to the Law. Those are the ONLY 2 ways to have eternal life.

You CANNOT mix the 2. That is what you are attempting to do. It calls into question whether you have received Jesus and been born again.

Read this Scripture, and please try and understand, it applies exactly to you, when you slander the Brethren in saying we preach that it is ok to sin because we are saved.

Romans 3:8
And not rather, (as we be slanderously reported, and as some affirm that we say,) Let us do evil, that good may come? whose damnation is just.

 

[hardsell]

So what does the saved life look like after you have been saved and are a new man?

Anyone?

 

[Magenta]

That resolution did not last a few hours,

Yet he wants to attack DC for keeping the thread going.. .lol Ya just got to laugh.

Yes, it is quite contradictory to encourage others to stop posting in this thread while at the same time posting in this thread continuously. We have seen it before, too. Are these people double minded? Or just forked tongued? Perhaps both

 

[Chester]

I agree with you, The issue is that people want to focus on works, and not on faith.

True faith works, there is not a question about it, the only ones questioning it are those focused on works

If a dead faith has no power to save (and it does not have that power!!!!) it’s definitely has no power to work. Now will it.

This thread makes interesting reading! True faith works! Yes, indeed!

A dead faith has no power to save! Right on!

A living faith will produce works (of differing levels in different people).

We are saved by the grace of God through our response in faith! Amen!

 

[Chester]

So what does the saved life look like after you have been saved and are a new man?

Anyone?

Oh, what joy and peace and power to live in the new man by the Holy Spirit living in us! We cannot produce good works on our own strength - but we become HIS workmanship! Oh what joy and blessing!

 

[Tommy379]

You don't even realize we can see right through you. your defensiveness about obedience betrays you.

You just lost the argument.

 

[hardsell]

Oh, what joy and peace and power to live in the new man by the Holy Spirit living in us! We cannot produce good works on our own strength - but we become HIS workmanship! Oh what joy and blessing!

Thanks for posting. I agree. Moving from saving grace and the cross to empowering grace and the tomb where we are raised into newness of life is a joy and blessing.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Yes, it is quite contradictory to encourage others to stop posting in this thread while at the same time posting in this thread continuously. We have seen it before, too. Are these people double minded? Or just forked tongued? Perhaps both

Justlook at him, how many more posts?

Blame shift, Lie, and continue, while he says this thread has gone on too long.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Hi E-g, and Amen! Here is one post that I think crossed way over the line for human decency, Cain and Able.

Wow. That is why most of his buddies are no longer here. His true spirituality is showing its self (or should I say lack of)

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Yes, it is quite contradictory to encourage others to stop posting in this thread while at the same time posting in this thread continuously. We have seen it before, too. Are these people double minded? Or just forked tongued? Perhaps both

It just goes to show his true self, and purpose. To attack others and try to make them look bad. While trying to act all righteous himself.

Its phariseeism/cainism at its best.