Not By Works

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
70,869
9,601
113
How about trusting GOD when HE says that we are saved by grace through faith? Works are not needed in order to keep or maintain salvation.. NONE of us deserves salvation. It is because we DO trust, that we are granted it by God.


And neither do you. Trust only regeneration theology teaches that the person's act of trusting is the claim of salvation, not grace. This is your work, this is your claim, you deserve salvation because you did this act.

Do not act as if you are not professing a faith plus works theology. The act of falling backwards into someone else's arms is most certainly an action that takes effort.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
If you push trust only regeneration theology you most certainly do.

Only universal reconciliation theology can truly hold claim to salvation by grace alone.
Nope that is false. If that was true, no one would have to trust God. Repent and call out on the name of Jesus to be saved.

Regeneration theology is biblical.

In Pauls own words..

Not by works of righteousness (things such was water baptism, churhc membership, obeying laws) which we have done, but by HIS MERCY HE SAVED US by the washing of REGENERATION and renewal of the HS.


 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
No, just a question.

It seems to me that God saw something in Abraham. Same goes for David, King Saul, Solomon etc.
Yeah he did see something in them, Sin, and death, And he saw his son pay for their sins on the cross. And because of it, and because THEY HAD GREAT FAITH IN GOD, he saved them, and then empowered them to do mighty works for him. (And also commit some pretty heinous sins in the process)
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
25,034
13,041
113
58
And neither do you. Trust only regeneration theology teaches that the person's act of trusting is the claim of salvation, not grace. This is your work, this is your claim, you deserve salvation because you did this act.
Let the straw man arguments begin. :rolleyes:

Choosing to trust in Christ's finished work of redemption as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation is not a work that merits salvation. Through BELIEVING, we are trusting in Another's work (Christ's finished work of redemption). Jesus still gets 100% credit for the salvation of BELIEVERS. The FREE GIFT of eternal life is not deserved or earned, but is freely accepted (Romans 3:22-26; 6:23).

Do not act as if you are not professing a faith plus works theology.
Faith in Christ is the instrumental means by which we receive the free gift of eternal life and Christ's finished work of redemption is the actual means by which we are saved. That is not faith plus works, but faith in Christ ALONE.

The act of falling backwards into someone else's arms is most certainly an action that takes effort.
When you receive a free gift at Christmas time, did you do anything to deserve or earn that free gift? Did you work for the free gift or did you freely accept it? Do you take credit for the free gift?
 

DJ2

Senior Member
Apr 15, 2017
1,660
57
48
How about trusting GOD when HE says that we are saved by grace through faith? Works are not needed in order to keep or maintain salvation.. NONE of us deserves salvation. It is because we DO trust, that we are granted it by God.
NONE of us deserves salvation. It is because we DO trust, that we are granted it by God.
You are speaking out of both sides of your mouth.

We don't deserve it but we deserve it because we DO trust?
 

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
70,869
9,601
113
And you are a false teacher.. We don't deserve salvation, because we are all sinners who would die in our sins, were it not for God's grace. However, God loves us so much that He sent Jesus to die for our sins so that we may have eternal life. It is by grace, through our faith AND trust in God, that we are saved. :)

It's rather simple really. If we DON'T have trust in God, then we have nothing. We certainly cannot save ourselves. God Himself says that if we don't have Him, then we are nothing and can do nothing.

Faith and trust in God are essential to getting saved. Faith without works is dead, but so are works that are done with the wrong intent in mind..

You are speaking out of both sides of your mouth.

We don't deserve it but we deserve it because we DO trust?
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
You are speaking out of both sides of your mouth.

We don't deserve it but we deserve it because we DO trust?
No one ever took pride in trusting in someone else. No one thought they were so great because they had nothing to give, but had to rely on someone else for all things.


 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
25,034
13,041
113
58
No one ever took pride in trusting in someone else. No one thought they were so great because they had nothing to give, but had to rely on someone else for all things.
Galatians 6:14 - But God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.
 

tourist

Senior Member
Mar 13, 2014
41,304
16,297
113
69
Tennessee
You are speaking out of both sides of your mouth.

We don't deserve it but we deserve it because we DO trust?
She did not say that we deserve salvation because we trust, but rather we are granted salvation by God because we trust. You twist words to suit your own narrative by speaking out of both sides of your mouth.
 

DJ2

Senior Member
Apr 15, 2017
1,660
57
48
Yeah he did see something in them, Sin, and death, And he saw his son pay for their sins on the cross. And because of it, and because THEY HAD GREAT FAITH IN GOD, he saved them, and then empowered them to do mighty works for him. (And also commit some pretty heinous sins in the process)
Still does't answer the question.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
Still does't answer the question.
yeah it does, you just can’t see it, because you think god looks at you and sees a righteous person. If you cant see your sin, you will never see God, only a made up god that ignores sin
 

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
70,869
9,601
113
Your question was, why Abraham, out of all the people on earth. And EG gave you the answer, if you'd bother to read what he wrote. God saw that Abraham had great faith in Him and that is why He saved Abraham, as well as the others mentioned.. God empowers the faithful to do awesome works for Him, but I guess you don't realize that..


Why Abraham? Why of all the people on Earth would God pick Abraham? Did God see something special in Abraham or was it just a random pick?
Yeah he did see something in them, Sin, and death, And he saw his son pay for their sins on the cross. And because of it, and because THEY HAD GREAT FAITH IN GOD, he saved them, and then empowered them to do mighty works for him. (And also commit some pretty heinous sins in the process)
Still does't answer the question.
 

DJ2

Senior Member
Apr 15, 2017
1,660
57
48
She did not say that we deserve salvation because we trust, but rather we are granted salvation by God because we trust. You twist words to suit your own narrative by speaking out of both sides of your mouth.
And neither do we deserve salvation because we are baptized. Faith is not an act of merit and neither is baptism but a necessary act nevertheless.

This is my point.
 

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
70,869
9,601
113
He must not realize that NO ONE is righteous. He also doesn't realize that God deals harshly with false teachers..


yeah it does, you just can’t see it, because you think god looks at you and sees a righteous person. If you cant see your sin, you will never see God, only a made up god that ignores sin
 

Studyman

Senior Member
Oct 11, 2017
3,570
516
113
=mailmandan;3405054]Create images of God in the likeness of some long haired men's har shampoo model? Maybe you have been watching too much TBN.
Who said that was my religious tradition and what does that have to do with the death, burial and resurrection of Christ? (1 Corinthians 15:1-4).


Sorry Dan, I not buying your story that you don't have a clue what Images I am referring to, but I expected nothing more..

Create our own Sabbath? The Sabbath has always been Saturday and not Sunday, yet
Sabbath keeping with all it's rules and regulations (Exodus 16:23; 31:12-18; 35:3; Leviticus 23:32; Jeremiah 17:21; 19:30; 23:2-3; Numbers 15:32-36; 28:1-10; 29:39-40; I Chronicles. 23:30-31; II Chronicles 31:2-4; Isaiah 1:13) was part of a covenant with Israel that is not applicable to The Church/Christians under the New Covenant. (Colossians 2:16,17)


I don't care about why you created your own Sabbath. Everyone has excuses. The point is you have, the Pharisees have, but Jesus and Paul didn't, and the Gospel doesn't teach us to do this. Religious tradition does.

*I am not Roman Catholic, so your argument here is moot.


What High Days and "Feasts unto the Lord" have I created? You are so focused on rules and regulations that you have lost sight of the CROSS (1 Corinthians 1:18-21).


Again, I'm just not buying your story that you don't know anything about the greatest High Day ever created by mankind. (A Catholic traditions) Especially given the number of posts you have made defending this great religious tradition that the Bible says nothing about, except, don't create your own "Feast unto the Lord". The Gospel of Christ does not condone such behavior. Religious traditions does.


The Gospel is the "good news" of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ (1 Corinthians 15:1-4) and is the power of God unto salvation to everyone that BELIEVES.. (Romans 1:16). The Gospel is not about whether or not the Pharisees were trying to please God. 1 Corinthians 1:21 - For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.
The Gospel of Christ is also about "TRUTH" Dan. In it we are warned about "MANY" people, who come in Christ's Name (Christians) who preach lies about His Gospel. One such lie, is the lie that the Pharisees were trying to "earn" Salvation by following God's Laws. This is not true. They had created their own Laws, their own versions of God's Sabbaths, their own High Days and their own "righteousness". This lie then fuels another lie preached by the MCC that God's Laws are a burden and scourge of the world and that Jesus had to come back and save us, not from death or deception, but from the instructions of God. I am pointing out that the "Gospel" doesn't teach that the Pharisees were trying to please God with obedience to him, this is a lie. Preaching a lie about the Gospel is a sin, even when you place Jesus name on it, it is still a sin. The Gospel doesn't preach this lie, religious man does.

I know you CAN'T accept this, but there are some who are reading along which will see the point.

 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
25,034
13,041
113
58
yeah it does, you just can’t see it, because you think god looks at you and sees a righteous person. If you cant see your sin, you will never see God, only a made up god that ignores sin
Until we get to the end of the creature, we will not get to the beginning of the Creator.

We learn this from the parable of the Pharisee and the Tax Collector:

Luke 18:9 - Also He spoke this parable to some who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others: 10 “Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. 11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, ‘God, I thank You that I am not like other men—extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this tax collector. 12 I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I possess.’ 13 And the tax collector, standing afar off, would not so much as raise his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, ‘God, be merciful to me a sinner!’ 14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other; for everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted.”
 

DJ2

Senior Member
Apr 15, 2017
1,660
57
48
Your question was, why Abraham, out of all the people on earth. And EG gave you the answer, if you'd bother to read what he wrote. God saw that Abraham had great faith in Him and that is why He saved Abraham, as well as the others mentioned.. God empowers the faithful to do awesome works for Him, but I guess you don't realize that..
Okay ladybug where did EG answer the question. Why did God pick Abraham? I reread his response still don't see it.
 

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
70,869
9,601
113
Baptism isn't necessary to get saved. Getting dunked in water does not save us. It is our FAITH AND TRUST, and God's grace that saves us. Faith is an act of trust in the One who loved us enough to die for us and save us from ourselves..


And neither do we deserve salvation because we are baptized. Faith is not an act of merit and neither is baptism but a necessary act nevertheless.

This is my point.
 

blue_ladybug

Senior Member
Feb 21, 2014
70,869
9,601
113
Because Abraham had GREAT FAITH IN GOD, and trusted in Him and was willing to obey Him.. That's what happens when we trust God, He picks us for great works. :)

Okay ladybug where did EG answer the question. Why did God pick Abraham? I reread his response still don't see it.