Some common misconceptions about God;
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we must Love and forgive jonie, for she is a designed 'planter', deceived and willing
to deceive others, and we pray with all of our hearts, that she is doing such things out
of a totally deceived heart...else, she is in agreement with her deceivers...
may Jesus/God have mercy upon her and those whom she has chosen to abide/live with...
to deceive others, and we pray with all of our hearts, that she is doing such things out
of a totally deceived heart...else, she is in agreement with her deceivers...
may Jesus/God have mercy upon her and those whom she has chosen to abide/live with...
D
Depleted
Guest
If you are totally deceived, wouldn't, just by the nature of that, be deceiving others?
Until this thread, I thought she just didn't understand. I thought she was just stuck in some funky theology -- bad teachings. But now that I see how well crafted she is in deception, how she simply skipped my one very simple question or over-flowed with totally unrelated babbling and pretended that was some kind of answer more than once, I no longer think this. I think she is out to try and pull people away from the real Lord and have them join her with lord-of-self.
This isn't a child being lured by candy, this is a con game. She is holding the candy and doing the luring.
And, I'm no longer trying to reach her. I'm trying to save the people in pain that might be fooled by this gobbledygook into believing if they live just right, God owes them health.
Sorry I didn’t notice these Bible addresses before. Let’s look at them.
James 4:7 in context. More could be added, feel free to read it in James.
”You adulterous people! Do you not know that friendship with the world is enmity with God? Therefore whoever wishes to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God. 5 Or do you suppose it is to no purpose that the Scripture says, “He yearns jealously over the spirit that he has made to dwell in us”? 6 But he gives more grace. Therefore it says, “God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble.”7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.8 Draw near to God, and he will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you double-minded. 9 Be wretched and mourn and weep. Let your laughter be turned to mourning and your joy to gloom. 10 Humble yourselves before the Lord, and he will exalt you.”
Wow! This is a strong passage! Friendship with the world is enmity with God? Friend of the world an enemy of God. God opposes the proud! (Maybe those who think they are little gods??)
Then the oft misquoted James 4:7. For fun, I’m going to post it the way the Word Faith likes to post this verse just the other half.
”Submit yourself therefore to God.” James 4:7. Great verse, right? Falls in with the rest of the passage about resisting the proud, humbling yourself. I’m going to call this verse pulled out of context the “submit to God” verse. So, next time someone comes up with James 4:7, I will wax eloquent about the “submits to God” verse.
I wouldn’t actually be far wrong. The only way to resist the devil, is to be humble and submit to God. There is no pulling Satan down with your proud, arrogant barehands, as Paul Ellis seems to suggest.
Then there is 1 Sam. 30:6 in which David does indeed strengthen himself in the Lord.
”And David was greatly distressed, for the people spoke of stoning him, because all the people were bitter in soul, each for his sons and daughters. But David strengthened himself in the Lord his God.” 1 Sam. 30:6
Except David did NOT just go out and fight. He first, inquired of the Lord. Meaning, he wanted to know what God’s will and plan was.
”And David said to Abiathar the priest, the son of Ahimelech, “Bring me the ephod.” So Abiathar brought the ephod to David. 8 And David inquired of the Lord, “Shall I pursue after this band? Shall I overtake them?” He answered him, “Pursue, for you shall surely overtake and shall surely rescue.” 1 Sam 30:7-8
So, no, David didn’t just strengthen himself, he made sure of God’s will for him. Word Faith gives so much power to mere mortals, that they don’t inquire of the Lord, they just scream “I’m casting this mountain into the sea” even though that isn’t what that verse is about.
I didn’t really discuss #2 back on page 1, because, I confess, I just didn’t have a clue what Ellis was talking about (Can’t say “Joanie’s post” since she didn’t write it!)
Anyway, here is the verse. Not too sure what God using Satan has to do with believer’s not worshiping at false altars, seeing as we are the temple of the Holy Spirit, the content of this passage.
”Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership has righteousness with lawlessness? Or what fellowship has light with darkness?”
Part three, another out of context verse! Bless my soul! Seriously, these days, I don’t even have to double check first with the Word Faith/hypergrace false teachers post. I can assume immediately the verses are out of context, then post why!
“So Peter opened his mouth and said: “Truly I understand that God shows no partiality, 35 but in every nation anyone who fears him and does what is right is acceptable to him. 36 As for the word that he sent to Israel, preaching good news of peace through Jesus Christ (he is Lord of all), 37 you yourselves know what happened throughout all Judea, beginning from Galilee after the baptism that John proclaimed: 38 how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power. He went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with him. 39 And we are witnesses of all that he did both in the country of the Jews and in Jerusalem. They put him to death by hanging him on a tree, 40 but God raised him on the third day and made him to appear, 41 not to all the people but to us who had been chosen by God as witnesses, who ate and drank with him after he rose from the dead.” Acts 10:34-41
So, what is this passage about? Is it Peter giving all believers unrestricted rights to heal like Jesus? Or is this a passage when God sent Peter to Cornelius to tell him the gospel - that is - what Jesus said and did, so that Cornelius might be saved? I think the latter. Context, context, context. We are not Jesus. Yes, Jesus did this - he healed as part of his ministry, to fulfill the Scriptures. Not a clue what this has to do with character??
Finally part 4:
“Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned— 13 for sin indeed was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not counted where there is no law. 14 Yet death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those whose sinning was not like the transgression of Adam, who was a type of the one who was to come.15 But the free gift is not like the trespass. For if many died through one man's trespass, much more have the grace of God and the free gift by the grace of that one man Jesus Christ abounded for many. 16 And the free gift is not like the result of that one man's sin. For the judgment following one trespass brought condemnation, but the free gift following many trespasses brought justification. 17 For if, because of one man's trespass, death reigned through that one man, much more will those who receive the abundance of grace and the free gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man Jesus Christ.
18 Therefore, as one trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one act of righteousness leads to justification and life for all men. 19 For as by the one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, so by the one man's obedience the many will be made righteous. 20 Now the law came in to increase the trespass, but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more,21 so that, as sin reigned in death, grace also might reign through righteousness leading to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.” Romans 5:12-21 ESV
An entire passage, (also the first part of Romans 5) about the entire plan of salvation and Jesus’s coming to redeem us so that we might be made righteous. Nothing at all to do with healing, naming and claiming it - just the way Jesus redeemed us from Adam’s sin and from death.
Because we are following Jesus not Job? Well, I have always followed Jesus, and he has spoken to me about the lessons to be learned from Job. Which sadly, Paul Ellis and his followers will never know.
“Receive the abundance of grace and righteousness” INSTEAD of death, as we deserve.
Please do not post these hacked up posts anymore Joanie. It just shows everyone how totally deluded you are, in following such a Scripture twisting lying false teacher.
Did you even look up any of these addresses, Joanie? Because Paul Ellis doesn’t mean for you to do that. You might realize what a deceiver he is, and the way he has no clue what the Bible says. Finally, if you want to discuss this, stop giving your interpretations, and post the Bible. You want feelings, not truth and it has bound you into a deep, and horrendous lie about who God is, and who Jesus is, and what he came to do.
The Word of God is awesome! It has all the power we will ever need for every situation in our lives (Heb. 4:12). (Heb. 4:2)!
Many say; It isn’t that easy. I believe the Word and I’m doing everything I know to do, yet things still haven’t worked out. I have experienced that too—personally and with many people I’ve ministered to. So, what’s the problem? Actually, there are many problems, but I think most of them can be summed up by what Jesus said in Mark 7:13:
“Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition.”
What a startling statement! Wrong teaching—specifically religious doctrines—makes God’s Word of no effect. The most significant revelations I’ve received from the Lord all have to do with renewing my mind from old ways of thinking that I learned in church. As I was freed from the traditions, the simplicity of God’s Word set me free.
At a recent Gospel Truth Seminar, the Lord led me to counter a number of traditions that void God’s Word. It was heavy stuff that was hard on even many full-Gospel fanatics. I tried to be as gentle as possible, but there isn’t a gentle way to kill a sacred cow.
It’s like the man who saw a cow with a wooden leg. He was so shocked, he stopped his car and asked the farmer about the cow. The farmer said this was a very special cow. He told stories of how the cow saved him and his kids’ lives more than once. The man was impressed, but that still didn’t explain why the cow had a wooden leg. Finally, the farmer yelled, “You can’t eat a special cow like that all at once!”
Unlike that farmer’s cow, sacred cows cannot be done away with gradually. You just need to kill them and deal with the fallout. So that’s what I did. It was powerful. I dealt with a lot of things in the seminar, but only have space to mention a few in this letter.
I think one of the worst doctrines in the body of Christ today is the belief that God controls everything or, as the religious terminology states, “God is sovereign.” It’s usually presented in one of two ways: One, God originates everything, or two, Satan originates the evil things but has to get God’s approval before he can do His “dirty work.”
This doctrine seems to be dominant in the body of Christ today. It’s so entrenched that many people will just discount what I have to say before hearing me out. To them, this has become a sacred cow. But this old cow needs to die. They need to kill that sacred cow, or it will kill the power of God’s Word in their lives.
On the surface, it makes perfect sense that God controls everything. After all, He is God. He is all powerful. He can do whatever He wants to do. He is sovereign.
I agree that God is sovereign if the word sovereign is used as it’s defined in the dictionary. The American Heritage Dictionary defines “sovereign” as “1. Independent. 2. Having supreme rank or power. 3. Paramount; supreme.” “Sovereign” comes from a Latin word that means “super, above.” I agree with all of those definitions. God is all of that and more.
But religious tradition has redefined “sovereign” to mean God has and does exercise “absolute control.” I totally disagree with that!
At one time, God was in absolute control of everything, but then He made man and gave him unrestricted power and authority over the earth. Man knowingly gave that power and authority to Satan. And Satan has been messing things up ever since (with our help, I might add).
You might say, “God could stop Satan if He wanted to. Therefore, the devil only does what God allows Him to do.” That’s not true. That’s a religious tradition that will render you passive and prey to the devil.
When God gave Adam unconditional authority over the earth, He gave him His word (Ps. 89:34). There were no strings attached. He didn’t say, “If you blow it, I’ll take back My power and authority.” No! God had to allow what man allowed. The Lord had given man total control over the earth. It was his to govern as he saw fit. Adam then yielded to Satan the power and authority God intended for man.
God is a good God. If it was only up to Him, we would all be blessed (James 1:17). That can be seen in the life of Job. God blessed Job abundantly. He was the greatest man in wealth and integrity of all the people of his day. But Job didn’t have a covenant with God. Job was a sinner and therefore under Satan’s control. So Satan pressed his case because Job legally came under Satan’s jurisdiction.
This is why the Lord started making covenants with people like Abraham and, eventually, the whole nation of Israel. If they would comply, then the Lord could legally bless them. This worked, to a degree. The problem was, no one could live up to God’s standard for very long. So, instead of the blessing He desired to give, the curse eventually came upon them because “all have sinned” (Rom. 3:23).
People have seen many scriptural examples of God’s judgment upon man in the Old Testament and have taken from that that judgment is God’s way of correcting us. Under the New Covenant, that is no longer the case, and a number of scriptures will kill that sacred cow.
Deuteronomy 28 lists the blessings and curses that would come upon the Israelites depending on their obedience or disobedience to God’s commands. Notice the things listed in verses 15-68: sickness, poverty, grief, and every other trouble imaginable. They are curses, not blessings, as many religious people are trying to make them out to be today.
People will say, “This cancer was really a blessing in disguise because it made me turn to the Lord for help.” No! It’s not a blessing; it’s a curse. God didn’t put that cancer on them or allow it. The fact that they turned to the Lord is good, but they shouldn’t blame God for causing that problem.
God never uses evil to correct or draw us to Him. Romans 2:4 says it’s the goodness of God that leads us to repentance. Second Timothy 3:16 says that God’s Word—not problems—is given to correct and reprove us. Afflictions are what Satan uses to steal away God’s Word (Mark 4:16-17).
“But don’t all things work together for good?” No! That’s not what God’s Word says. That’s another sacred cow. Look at Paul’s actual statement in Romans 8:28:
“And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.”
Taken in context, that verse says something totally different from what religion has taught us. The two preceding verses say,
“Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.”
First, the Greek word for “helpeth” is a compound word that means “to take hold of opposite together, i.e. co-operate” (Strong’s Concordance). The Holy Spirit does not intercede for us automatically; we must participate, and as we do, He energizes and quickens and empowers our prayers. When He takes hold with us, things begin to work together for good.
Second, in verse 28, there are qualifications that most people ignore. The first is to love God. Did you know that not everybody loves God? Not even all who are born again truly love God. For those who do not, things don’t work together for good.
The next part says you must be called according to His purpose. What is His purpose? First John 3:8 says that the purpose of Jesus’ coming was to destroy the works of the devil. So, if you are functioning according to the purpose of Jesus, you should be out to destroy the works of the devil.
Therefore, this passage of Scripture applies to people who are not passive, but they are interceding and letting the Holy Spirit supernaturally energize and take intercession to a level where it’s not just human. That eliminates the majority of people right there. Add loving God to that and resisting and destroying the works of the devil, and you can see how that scripture has been misunderstood and misused.
God is not the one who makes our lives a mess. We have a choice.
Deuteronomy 30:19 says,
“I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live.”
To say we don’t have a choice is another way of saying we aren’t willing to take personal responsibility for our situations. When we believe we’re not responsible, it invalidates the Word of God. The Word tells us to make a choice between life and death, so we do have a choice. God even helped us out by telling us which one to choose: He said to choose life.
The slickest deception Satan has ever put across, primarily through the church, is to get people to embrace his work as the work of God. In my estimation, this is the worst doctrine in the body of Christ. If you really believe God controls everything, why do anything? Why pray? Why study the Word? Why resist? Just eat, drink, and be merry for tomorrow you die, and whatever God wills will happen.
However, James 4:7 says,
“Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.”
Notice that there are things from God that we submit to and things from the devil that we resist. God does not control everything.
Religion has played into the victim mentality because it’s the easiest way to explain away failure. The church has not been effective in helping people overcome things like sickness and financial problems, so they fall into the sacred cow belief that God is allowing this for a reason.
God isn’t allowing the bad things in your life. The same power that raised Christ from the dead lives on the inside of every believer, and He is waiting on you to resist the devil and appropriate what He has already provided through Jesus.
(taken from Andrew Wommack article)
Many say; It isn’t that easy. I believe the Word and I’m doing everything I know to do, yet things still haven’t worked out. I have experienced that too—personally and with many people I’ve ministered to. So, what’s the problem? Actually, there are many problems, but I think most of them can be summed up by what Jesus said in Mark 7:13:
“Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition.”
What a startling statement! Wrong teaching—specifically religious doctrines—makes God’s Word of no effect. The most significant revelations I’ve received from the Lord all have to do with renewing my mind from old ways of thinking that I learned in church. As I was freed from the traditions, the simplicity of God’s Word set me free.
At a recent Gospel Truth Seminar, the Lord led me to counter a number of traditions that void God’s Word. It was heavy stuff that was hard on even many full-Gospel fanatics. I tried to be as gentle as possible, but there isn’t a gentle way to kill a sacred cow.
It’s like the man who saw a cow with a wooden leg. He was so shocked, he stopped his car and asked the farmer about the cow. The farmer said this was a very special cow. He told stories of how the cow saved him and his kids’ lives more than once. The man was impressed, but that still didn’t explain why the cow had a wooden leg. Finally, the farmer yelled, “You can’t eat a special cow like that all at once!”
Unlike that farmer’s cow, sacred cows cannot be done away with gradually. You just need to kill them and deal with the fallout. So that’s what I did. It was powerful. I dealt with a lot of things in the seminar, but only have space to mention a few in this letter.
I think one of the worst doctrines in the body of Christ today is the belief that God controls everything or, as the religious terminology states, “God is sovereign.” It’s usually presented in one of two ways: One, God originates everything, or two, Satan originates the evil things but has to get God’s approval before he can do His “dirty work.”
This doctrine seems to be dominant in the body of Christ today. It’s so entrenched that many people will just discount what I have to say before hearing me out. To them, this has become a sacred cow. But this old cow needs to die. They need to kill that sacred cow, or it will kill the power of God’s Word in their lives.
On the surface, it makes perfect sense that God controls everything. After all, He is God. He is all powerful. He can do whatever He wants to do. He is sovereign.
I agree that God is sovereign if the word sovereign is used as it’s defined in the dictionary. The American Heritage Dictionary defines “sovereign” as “1. Independent. 2. Having supreme rank or power. 3. Paramount; supreme.” “Sovereign” comes from a Latin word that means “super, above.” I agree with all of those definitions. God is all of that and more.
But religious tradition has redefined “sovereign” to mean God has and does exercise “absolute control.” I totally disagree with that!
At one time, God was in absolute control of everything, but then He made man and gave him unrestricted power and authority over the earth. Man knowingly gave that power and authority to Satan. And Satan has been messing things up ever since (with our help, I might add).
You might say, “God could stop Satan if He wanted to. Therefore, the devil only does what God allows Him to do.” That’s not true. That’s a religious tradition that will render you passive and prey to the devil.
When God gave Adam unconditional authority over the earth, He gave him His word (Ps. 89:34). There were no strings attached. He didn’t say, “If you blow it, I’ll take back My power and authority.” No! God had to allow what man allowed. The Lord had given man total control over the earth. It was his to govern as he saw fit. Adam then yielded to Satan the power and authority God intended for man.
God is a good God. If it was only up to Him, we would all be blessed (James 1:17). That can be seen in the life of Job. God blessed Job abundantly. He was the greatest man in wealth and integrity of all the people of his day. But Job didn’t have a covenant with God. Job was a sinner and therefore under Satan’s control. So Satan pressed his case because Job legally came under Satan’s jurisdiction.
This is why the Lord started making covenants with people like Abraham and, eventually, the whole nation of Israel. If they would comply, then the Lord could legally bless them. This worked, to a degree. The problem was, no one could live up to God’s standard for very long. So, instead of the blessing He desired to give, the curse eventually came upon them because “all have sinned” (Rom. 3:23).
People have seen many scriptural examples of God’s judgment upon man in the Old Testament and have taken from that that judgment is God’s way of correcting us. Under the New Covenant, that is no longer the case, and a number of scriptures will kill that sacred cow.
Deuteronomy 28 lists the blessings and curses that would come upon the Israelites depending on their obedience or disobedience to God’s commands. Notice the things listed in verses 15-68: sickness, poverty, grief, and every other trouble imaginable. They are curses, not blessings, as many religious people are trying to make them out to be today.
People will say, “This cancer was really a blessing in disguise because it made me turn to the Lord for help.” No! It’s not a blessing; it’s a curse. God didn’t put that cancer on them or allow it. The fact that they turned to the Lord is good, but they shouldn’t blame God for causing that problem.
God never uses evil to correct or draw us to Him. Romans 2:4 says it’s the goodness of God that leads us to repentance. Second Timothy 3:16 says that God’s Word—not problems—is given to correct and reprove us. Afflictions are what Satan uses to steal away God’s Word (Mark 4:16-17).
“But don’t all things work together for good?” No! That’s not what God’s Word says. That’s another sacred cow. Look at Paul’s actual statement in Romans 8:28:
“And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.”
Taken in context, that verse says something totally different from what religion has taught us. The two preceding verses say,
“Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.”
First, the Greek word for “helpeth” is a compound word that means “to take hold of opposite together, i.e. co-operate” (Strong’s Concordance). The Holy Spirit does not intercede for us automatically; we must participate, and as we do, He energizes and quickens and empowers our prayers. When He takes hold with us, things begin to work together for good.
Second, in verse 28, there are qualifications that most people ignore. The first is to love God. Did you know that not everybody loves God? Not even all who are born again truly love God. For those who do not, things don’t work together for good.
The next part says you must be called according to His purpose. What is His purpose? First John 3:8 says that the purpose of Jesus’ coming was to destroy the works of the devil. So, if you are functioning according to the purpose of Jesus, you should be out to destroy the works of the devil.
Therefore, this passage of Scripture applies to people who are not passive, but they are interceding and letting the Holy Spirit supernaturally energize and take intercession to a level where it’s not just human. That eliminates the majority of people right there. Add loving God to that and resisting and destroying the works of the devil, and you can see how that scripture has been misunderstood and misused.
God is not the one who makes our lives a mess. We have a choice.
Deuteronomy 30:19 says,
“I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live.”
To say we don’t have a choice is another way of saying we aren’t willing to take personal responsibility for our situations. When we believe we’re not responsible, it invalidates the Word of God. The Word tells us to make a choice between life and death, so we do have a choice. God even helped us out by telling us which one to choose: He said to choose life.
The slickest deception Satan has ever put across, primarily through the church, is to get people to embrace his work as the work of God. In my estimation, this is the worst doctrine in the body of Christ. If you really believe God controls everything, why do anything? Why pray? Why study the Word? Why resist? Just eat, drink, and be merry for tomorrow you die, and whatever God wills will happen.
However, James 4:7 says,
“Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.”
Notice that there are things from God that we submit to and things from the devil that we resist. God does not control everything.
Religion has played into the victim mentality because it’s the easiest way to explain away failure. The church has not been effective in helping people overcome things like sickness and financial problems, so they fall into the sacred cow belief that God is allowing this for a reason.
God isn’t allowing the bad things in your life. The same power that raised Christ from the dead lives on the inside of every believer, and He is waiting on you to resist the devil and appropriate what He has already provided through Jesus.
(taken from Andrew Wommack article)
There are millions of born again Christians like me who believe differently than some on this thread and their different denominations. We do not agree on everything. One major topic is once saved always saved., I hold to the security of the believer but many here do not. Speaking in tongues., healing., the gifts for today... I hold to those Bible truths along with many other born again Christians but some here on this thread don't agree.
There are more than a few other interpretations of certain Bible truths that we all do not believe the same about. Yet we do agree on the foundation which is Jesus Christ and Him crucified. The main doctrines of the Christian faith we all hold to.
For those who want to call the other millions of Christians heretics you will be draining your own resources in the family of Christ. satan wants that and we should not fall into his trap. We need to be aware of his many tricks and be able to resist him with the truth in the Bible.
[h=2]Statement of Faith[/h]1. We believe the Bible is inspired and empowered by God, infallible and authoritative.
2. We believe in one eternal God who exists as three separate persons; the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
3. We believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God, born of a virgin, lived a sinless life as He walked among men, demonstrated the authority and power of God in works and speech, died on the cross, rose from the dead on the third day, and is now seated at the right hand of God having accomplished all that is necessary for man’s salvation.
4. We believe it is essential for man to repent of sin and by faith receive the finished work of Christ by confessing Him as Lord with his mouth and believing in his heart resulting in regeneration by the Holy Spirit.
5. We believe the Holy Spirit is continuing the work He started at Pentecost empowering believers to live a godly life and continue in all the works of Jesus.
6. We believe in the imminent return of Jesus and that those who have believed in Him will be resurrected to a heavenly dwelling in an incorruptible body, and those who do not believe will join Satan and his host in everlasting punishment.
7. We believe the true Church is composed of all born-again believers in Christ, regardless of denominational affiliation.
8. We believe all born-again believers have been commissioned to share the complete Gospel to all the world.
There are more than a few other interpretations of certain Bible truths that we all do not believe the same about. Yet we do agree on the foundation which is Jesus Christ and Him crucified. The main doctrines of the Christian faith we all hold to.
For those who want to call the other millions of Christians heretics you will be draining your own resources in the family of Christ. satan wants that and we should not fall into his trap. We need to be aware of his many tricks and be able to resist him with the truth in the Bible.
[h=2]Statement of Faith[/h]1. We believe the Bible is inspired and empowered by God, infallible and authoritative.
2. We believe in one eternal God who exists as three separate persons; the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
3. We believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God, born of a virgin, lived a sinless life as He walked among men, demonstrated the authority and power of God in works and speech, died on the cross, rose from the dead on the third day, and is now seated at the right hand of God having accomplished all that is necessary for man’s salvation.
4. We believe it is essential for man to repent of sin and by faith receive the finished work of Christ by confessing Him as Lord with his mouth and believing in his heart resulting in regeneration by the Holy Spirit.
5. We believe the Holy Spirit is continuing the work He started at Pentecost empowering believers to live a godly life and continue in all the works of Jesus.
6. We believe in the imminent return of Jesus and that those who have believed in Him will be resurrected to a heavenly dwelling in an incorruptible body, and those who do not believe will join Satan and his host in everlasting punishment.
7. We believe the true Church is composed of all born-again believers in Christ, regardless of denominational affiliation.
8. We believe all born-again believers have been commissioned to share the complete Gospel to all the world.
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That statement of faith is what I hold to as do ALL of those who I share here., and many other believers who come to this chat site. So if those who have come to this thread and who have called your brothers and sisters in Christ heretics for disagreeing with your other secondary beliefs., than do it with a clear understanding of these facts. God bless all who come to this chat site.
So, throwing in a few addresses is the new way Word Faith false teachers PRETEND they are using the Bible? So they can pay lip service to the Bible without knowing it or following it? So they can make up pure garbage based on feelings and experiences to deceive gullible women like you?
Andrew Wommack, another heretic more worried about dispelling traditions instead of preaching the true Word.
Joanie Marie, I beg you to forget about your abusive RCC and fundamentalist Baptist background, and read the Bible for yourself. Do you realize, by allowing men like Prince, Ellis and Wommack to mediate the Bible for you, you have fallen into exactly the same trap the RCC and independent Baptist churches set? They come between you and God! You need to find the real Jesus, instead of the lies these address droppers are substituting for what the Bible really says!
Andrew Wommack, another heretic more worried about dispelling traditions instead of preaching the true Word.
Joanie Marie, I beg you to forget about your abusive RCC and fundamentalist Baptist background, and read the Bible for yourself. Do you realize, by allowing men like Prince, Ellis and Wommack to mediate the Bible for you, you have fallen into exactly the same trap the RCC and independent Baptist churches set? They come between you and God! You need to find the real Jesus, instead of the lies these address droppers are substituting for what the Bible really says!
Angela., I'm not sure it is even prudent of me to try to answer you but I'll say it again., When other Christians don't see the Bible exactly the same way you do it doesn't mean we are heretics. It simply means millions of other Christians see things differently than Angela53510 from Canada.
[FONT="]This statement of faith is what I hold to as do ALL of those who I share here., and many other believers who come to this chat site. So if those who have come to this thread and who have called your brothers and sisters in Christ heretics for disagreeing with your other secondary beliefs., than do it with a clear understanding of these facts. God bless all who come to this chat site.[/FONT]
I'll re post the statement of faith.
Statement of Faith
1. We believe the Bible is inspired and empowered by God, infallible and authoritative.
2. We believe in one eternal God who exists as three separate persons; the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
3. We believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God, born of a virgin, lived a sinless life as He walked among men, demonstrated the authority and power of God in works and speech, died on the cross, rose from the dead on the third day, and is now seated at the right hand of God having accomplished all that is necessary for man’s salvation.
4. We believe it is essential for man to repent of sin and by faith receive the finished work of Christ by confessing Him as Lord with his mouth and believing in his heart resulting in regeneration by the Holy Spirit.
5. We believe the Holy Spirit is continuing the work He started at Pentecost empowering believers to live a godly life and continue in all the works of Jesus.
6. We believe in the imminent return of Jesus and that those who have believed in Him will be resurrected to a heavenly dwelling in an incorruptible body, and those who do not believe will join Satan and his host in everlasting punishment.
7. We believe the true Church is composed of all born-again believers in Christ, regardless of denominational affiliation.
8. We believe all born-again believers have been commissioned to share the complete Gospel to all the world.
[FONT="]This statement of faith is what I hold to as do ALL of those who I share here., and many other believers who come to this chat site. So if those who have come to this thread and who have called your brothers and sisters in Christ heretics for disagreeing with your other secondary beliefs., than do it with a clear understanding of these facts. God bless all who come to this chat site.[/FONT]
I'll re post the statement of faith.
Statement of Faith
1. We believe the Bible is inspired and empowered by God, infallible and authoritative.
2. We believe in one eternal God who exists as three separate persons; the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
3. We believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God, born of a virgin, lived a sinless life as He walked among men, demonstrated the authority and power of God in works and speech, died on the cross, rose from the dead on the third day, and is now seated at the right hand of God having accomplished all that is necessary for man’s salvation.
4. We believe it is essential for man to repent of sin and by faith receive the finished work of Christ by confessing Him as Lord with his mouth and believing in his heart resulting in regeneration by the Holy Spirit.
5. We believe the Holy Spirit is continuing the work He started at Pentecost empowering believers to live a godly life and continue in all the works of Jesus.
6. We believe in the imminent return of Jesus and that those who have believed in Him will be resurrected to a heavenly dwelling in an incorruptible body, and those who do not believe will join Satan and his host in everlasting punishment.
7. We believe the true Church is composed of all born-again believers in Christ, regardless of denominational affiliation.
8. We believe all born-again believers have been commissioned to share the complete Gospel to all the world.
You forgot this on the end:
[h=3]Statement of Faith - Andrew Wommack Ministries[/h]
BTW, statements of faith aren't worth the paper they're written on if the preacher is teaching false doctrine all around it.
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Jesus spoke and Jesus healed quite often, so many followed. And then he said something that turned away 90% of those following him -- the gospel.
You've proved you do not even believe God's word. You proved you don't like it because you "interpret differently" or "believe differently." You cannot be born-again if you don't even know who your father is. And given you do not trust the God of the Bible enough to take him at HIS WORDS, you really do NOT know God, so no! You are NOT born-again, no matter how many times you make that claim. We are not siblings. You have a different parent. You are of the 90%ers. The ones who heard, but walked away to another belief.
Strangely, you have done one thing since this post started -- united the different factions within the true Church. You've given the entire spectrum, from strict Arminians to strict Calvinists (and everyone in-between), a united front. To shout against this false gospel.
And you've also united all the thornapples too. Who is listening to you? Your kind of people -- those who also have a grudge against God and his people. Thornapples come from a poisonous plant appropriately named to describe you all -- "Devil's Trumpet." It too is a beautiful looking plant, and yet every part of it is poisonous.
I'm not letting you continue to spew your poison in silence anymore.
Some common misconceptions of God....
a. He is too weak to keep a man saved
b. He cannot keep his promise to never leave or forsake a man he has saved
c. He cannot keep a man sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise unto the day of redemption
d. He cannot finish and complete the good work of faith he began in a believer
e. He cannot keep and raise up that which he said he would never lose
f. He needs our help to save us or keep us saved
g. He holds sin against us even though is has been paid for
I. His blood does not cover all sin only some sins
J. He will not leave the 99 to go find the one that wandered off
k. His is weak and inept and his power is limited
l. He can compromise his word
m. The God of the O.T. is not the God of the N.T.
etc...............
a. He is too weak to keep a man saved
b. He cannot keep his promise to never leave or forsake a man he has saved
c. He cannot keep a man sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise unto the day of redemption
d. He cannot finish and complete the good work of faith he began in a believer
e. He cannot keep and raise up that which he said he would never lose
f. He needs our help to save us or keep us saved
g. He holds sin against us even though is has been paid for
I. His blood does not cover all sin only some sins
J. He will not leave the 99 to go find the one that wandered off
k. His is weak and inept and his power is limited
l. He can compromise his word
m. The God of the O.T. is not the God of the N.T.
etc...............
Was doing a word study this morning on the words, afflict, afflicted, and affliction. So far, I've only found one instance where it has to do with sickness, and that's in Job. 1 verse.
But, I did come across this and thought of you Joanie.
Psa 116:10 I believed, H539 therefore H3588 have I H589 spoken: H1696 I was greatly H3966 afflicted: H6031 This is the English, browbeaten.
Being browbeaten for ones belief. Then I thought about David and Absalom. His own turned against him.
Psa 116:11 I H589 said H559 in my haste, H2648 All H3605 men H120 are liars. H3576 liars in English is deceived.
Psa 116:12 What H4100 shall I render H7725 unto the LORD H3068 for all H3605 his benefits H8408 toward H5921 me?
Psa 116:13 I will take H5375 the cup H3563 of salvation, H3444 and call H7121 upon the name H8034 of the LORD. H30
What these last two verses are saying...I will hold together all the benefits of my salvation, and drink from that cup. And I thought about Jesus saying to one of his disciples, yes you shall drink of my cup.
How many times we think this is suffering with diseases, weaknesses, minds in torment? That those things covered in the atonement is our due?
The narrow way is our suffering. The affliction of the NT is being under pressure. This will cause those things that once held us captured to fall off.
Theres another scripture i saw in Exodus 1 today, that caused me to laugh at the devil. The Israelites were greatly afflicted or browbeaten, but that just caused them to multiply. Lol
You all that have vicious tongues....I don't think this is the tongues of Holy Spirit. Selah
But, I did come across this and thought of you Joanie.
Psa 116:10 I believed, H539 therefore H3588 have I H589 spoken: H1696 I was greatly H3966 afflicted: H6031 This is the English, browbeaten.
Being browbeaten for ones belief. Then I thought about David and Absalom. His own turned against him.
Psa 116:11 I H589 said H559 in my haste, H2648 All H3605 men H120 are liars. H3576 liars in English is deceived.
Psa 116:12 What H4100 shall I render H7725 unto the LORD H3068 for all H3605 his benefits H8408 toward H5921 me?
Psa 116:13 I will take H5375 the cup H3563 of salvation, H3444 and call H7121 upon the name H8034 of the LORD. H30
What these last two verses are saying...I will hold together all the benefits of my salvation, and drink from that cup. And I thought about Jesus saying to one of his disciples, yes you shall drink of my cup.
How many times we think this is suffering with diseases, weaknesses, minds in torment? That those things covered in the atonement is our due?
The narrow way is our suffering. The affliction of the NT is being under pressure. This will cause those things that once held us captured to fall off.
Theres another scripture i saw in Exodus 1 today, that caused me to laugh at the devil. The Israelites were greatly afflicted or browbeaten, but that just caused them to multiply. Lol
You all that have vicious tongues....I don't think this is the tongues of Holy Spirit. Selah
I pictured like the expansion of the universe itself as the Lord's Good will, as the people are scattered so is his Word. And even more so his Word is Life in abundance to all the tribes and families who multiply.
And So as the Lord's people multiply more and more stars are increasing the Light to this world.
I ask for actual Bible verses, you give me a generic statement of faith, with no clue who it belongs to! (Thanks to Speak2Me for posting the link!)
I really don’t care what the statement of faith says. We have a very traditional and ordinary statement of faith in our church. However, our latest pastor, who didn’t reveal this to the church or in his interview with the search committee is an Open Theist. Look it up, if you want to know what that means. Point being - despite the statement of faith, he is not preaching the gospel. For all I know, AW might have started out orthodox, when the Statement of Faith was written, and veered off course.
What I see is that none of this touches on how he doesn’t believe God is sovereign. Which is actually Open Theism, come to think of it! However, AW is heterodox on a lot more than just Open Theism, judging from all the things you have posted by him.
Bible! You and all your cult leaders do not use the Bible. They do not know the Bible! They have replaced the written revelation with personal revelation which conflicts with the Bible. They have seduced people like you who do not know the Bible.
The Bible is our starting and middle and ending point. Disagree with it, and you have walked away from God. Each cult leader you post deviates dramatically from the Bible, using scraps and bits to prove wrong theology. Using out of context verses to construct an extra-Biblical world view, and another gospel.
You are deceived, as they are deceived. When you start posting the Bible to support your “opinions” as you rightly call them, we can talk. Until that day comes, you are just someone who does not know what God says in his Word, and are deceived by deceivers and trying to deceive others. I pity you! But more, I pity anyone who reads these worthless devotions, and thinks they have even an element of truth.
God is in control!
(By the way, I disagree with #4. Repentance and confession come after God saves us, it does not “result” in salvation! BUT, #4, is well within the bounds of orthodox Christianity. Doesn’t mean that AW is a false or true teacher. It just means he is Arminian, which I disagree with!)
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7seasrekeyed
Guest
that's quite a tongue lashing you have going on there
an emotional appeal does not make the false teaching posted any better
please illustrate from scripture where believers who actually know and study scripture should support heresy, doctrines of demons and scripture twisting with love for the one doing those things?
you are right when you state this sure is not Christianity...Christ did not die for the pig wash being posted as truth
as far as joanie goes, I gave up trying to persuade her of the error she follows a long time ago and interestingly, I am seeing, reading this thread, that others are falling suit. I have no contact with anyone here apart from the forum...I do not pm or see people outside of this forum nor exchange personal emails...so, whatever I say I say it openly so I have not persuaded anyone of anything but still they come to the same conclusion
there has been a marked evolution of the way these posts are done which almost makes me think someone outside the forum is helping her but that is speculation on my part, but the differences in posting style are there nonetheless
that's fine. there is a developing backlash to NAR and WOF and hyper Charismania and I pray it continues. the rotten fruit of those sects is falling from the trees and creating a bad harvest
your appeal to supposed lack of Christian love is not what is actually going on here however. I would truly not desire anyone to fall to these false teachings and act out of concern and a love for the truth as, I suspect, most here do.
I would not worry about joanie. she seems well able to continue on and in fact, seems to thrive on it.
her constant references to believers who lack faith, or do not understand God or His love are most likely garnered from her own experiences and simply underscore her own development
it is unfortunate she does not see that and lumps all who disagree with her as those who may live where she once came from
as has been said many times though, she still has not arrived in the place of actual biblical truth as revealed by the provocative and unhelpful nature of her posts.
Hi decon., This brings up another topic that also needs to be considered. .........Covenants....... Job was not in a covenant nor did Job HAVE an Advocate. Job was not "sealed" He looked forward to the Advocate promised but like Adam., was still under the judgment that needed a blood sacrifice.
Job got mercy but the grace (unmerited unearned favor of God) that we have today was not yet paid for by Jesus. People looked "forward to" it. This was already stated in one of the posts above about how the earth was handed over to the devil by the first man Adam...who was made in God's image and yet who failed to obey the 1 thing God told them not to do. Adam didn't have the Holy Spirit either.
I don't have all the answers about covenants but do know that we are in the new covenant so those who have Jesus have life. Those who do not have Jesus have not life but the wrath of God abides on them because they do not believe. Because they do not have the blood of Christ for the forgiveness of sins. God is able to save to the uttermost but there IS a condition and His name is Jesus., the answer for the sin problem. All people who do not have Jesus are under God's judicial and righteous wrath for sin. Thus the need for covenants until the time Jesus came to be the perfect Lamb of God.
We are not in the old covenant of law., we do not have to follow the law to be saved because the law is no longer our school master. We who are in the new covenant...post cross., We walk in the Spirit., No longer under the law of sin and death....we have been born again., made new creations....old things have passed away behold all things have become new.... we have the Holy Spirit living in us 24/7 who has promised never to leave us.
Job had no such sacrifice yet... Job was not born again... Job looked forward to the coming Advocate.. who is Jesus. The Holy Spirit came on these men and also left these men. They had to pray that God take not His Holy Spirit from them when they sinned. These are all considerations we have to look into to see where we are today in this new covenant of grace. God cannot overlook sin. He had to send the perfect sacrifice (His Son) to save His people from their sins. And until that time., He showed a lot of mercy and also grace but nothing like today under this new and living way that Jesus brought in... grace and truth.
As with the old Testament saints., the Holy Spirit did not stay with them 24/7. They had to meet the requirements of the covenants they were in that God made for them at the time they were here on earth. Before Christ., they died and were in Abraham's bosom awaiting Jesus to come get them out so they could go before God the Father...no more veil separating them from a Holy Righteous God.
Ask yourself "why all these covenants?" I'd suggest we all take an honest view of what IS really being said here... and also what is NOT being said. Presumption is not a good path for any of us Christians to be on. I don't have all the answers but I do know what I have in this new covenant that Jesus has brought in.
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I guess one can make up anything about the Word when they don't hold to what is actually being said Pin.
What you just said has has nothing to do with the actual scripture.