The Rapture

[Roadkill]

"How miserable those days will be for pregnant and nursing mothers! Pray that your flight will not occur in the winter or on the Sabbath. For at that time there will be great tribulation, unmatched from the beginning of the world until now, and never to be seen again."

The scripture above reveals that the time of pregnant and nursing mothers is directly related to the great tribulation period and the setting up of the abomination. You can't get away with a two part apologetic.



My original contention was not about children suffering during the wrath of God. The fact is that, there is simply no scriptural information one way or another. The only information that we do have is what I've listed above, which demonstrates without a doubt that when that abomination is set up in the middle of the seven and Israel flees, there will be pregnant women and nursing mothers. You're just avoiding the obvious.



I'm in the Greek every day, looking up the words, Their parsing keys, etc. So I am rightly translating the scriptures.



You are misquoting me, as I did not say that the dead and the living transfigure at once. What I did say was that the word used to describe the living being changed is the Greek "atomos" which is defined as a: not and tomos: to cut, properly, "not to cut, i.e. too short of a time to divide. It is by the use of this word that I am proclaiming is that the time between the dead being resurrected and the living being changed and caught up, will take be in close proximity, almost as one event. And speaking of adding, that is exactly what you have done in stating that the resurrection of the dead and the changing of the living is going to take place over a period of three days, when there is zero scripture to support that.


I don't need to try again, as I have scripturally proved my point.

Yes I can. The Siege of 70 AD ended in AUGUST. The other Siege of Jerusalem that Jesus also speaks of happens in WINTER. Therefor a 2 part prophecy.

Have not avoided the obvious. Have flatly stated that in the last 3 and 1/2 years there will be no pregnant women or children or innocents that will suffer GOD'S Wrath. They that suffer prior to God pouring out his wrath upon earth will suffer from the wrath of MEN.

You are right in that it was Endoscopy that tried this with me. You are wrong in that you did not call him out on it. Seems to me you are playing favorites here when one interpretation of the English bible clearly contradicts the Earlier and most reliable one. As far as Greek bibles are concerned, I'm sure they have as many, if not more, variations of their Bible as we do ours in our English language. I can not debunk theirs as I am not privy to that Language. To use it on me is like trying to talk to a Moose. I'm just going to ignore you. KJV only and I will listen.

Not adding to scripture. I am plainly stating something that is NOT IN SCRIPTURE. Now here you are trying to use scripture to debunk it, strange? I am touching on the Rapture, describing the event itself, then I gave the date for Revelation chapter 12 verse 1 as November 22,2065. Did I contradict it? No I did not. Just some more detailed information.

There is zero scripture to debunk it. Wait for your sign in May and see.

 

[Roadkill]

Hints at it? I'd say that it is very direct, since Paul gave a detailed account of it in 1 Thes.4:13-18. And in 1 Cor.15:51-53, which is the same event, he referred to it as a mystery, i.e. hidden, previously unknown.

I agree that the gathering of the church and the Lord's return to the earth as being two separate events, as I have always maintained this fact. At the rapture, the church is being removed from the earth. At the second coming, the glorified church is returning with the Lord to the earth.

I agree with all you have said here except where you say Paul gave a detailed account of the Rapture. He gave some info but not specifics.

 

[Roadkill]

Why do you assume those as "innocent"? Do you also understand that those who reject the Gospel and reject the Lord Jesus Christ are already subject to wrath?

The Bible clearly teaches that God recognizes the innocence of children before they come of the age to know sin. There are also the innocent which are those who have simple minds. Do they still have the curse of sin? Of course they do, they die don't they? But we are talking about God's wrath here.

 

[Nehemiah6]

But we are talking about God's wrath here.

Indeed. So rest assured that God's wrath is for the wicked, the unbelieving and the ungodly. Also remember that there are many recorded instances in Scripture where God's wrath came upon entire populations -- men, women, and children. You can start with the Flood, and take it from there. When God's wrath is poured out on the earth during those 3 1/2 years, rest assured that it will be just. In the meantime, do your job.

 

[Roadkill]

Indeed. So rest assured that God's wrath is for the wicked, the unbelieving and the ungodly. Also remember that there are many recorded instances in Scripture where God's wrath came upon entire populations -- men, women, and children. You can start with the Flood, and take it from there. When God's wrath is poured out on the earth during those 3 1/2 years, rest assured that it will be just. In the meantime, do your job.

In those instances that you have listed God did those children a mercy. Those children died in innocence and therefor went to be with Jesus in Heaven. They would have otherwise grown up in those heathen societies and believed just as they did and went to hell. He surely did those children a mercy. This punishment in the end times is going to be pure misery. He is even going to deny man death at one point when they are suffering so bad they want to die. The flood was quick and what Israel did to the Canaanite tribes was a mercy compared what is to come.

 

[Roadkill]

Hints at it? I'd say that it is very direct, since Paul gave a detailed account of it in 1 Thes.4:13-18. And in 1 Cor.15:51-53, which is the same event, he referred to it as a mystery, i.e. hidden, previously unknown.

I agree that the gathering of the church and the Lord's return to the earth as being two separate events, as I have always maintained this fact. At the rapture, the church is being removed from the earth. At the second coming, the glorified church is returning with the Lord to the earth.

I have couple of more things to write to you.
First, the reference to Knuckleheads is not meant to be an insult to you or any one else's intelligence. I Apologize for that if I did come across that way. It is a reference to Hard Headiness that I used this as in very difficult to argue with.

Second, I know I can't use the Bible to justify what I have said. That's not what I'm trying to do. What I'm trying to do is show you the gaps in the verses where this fits without contradiction. I'm not trying to rewrite the New Testament or Revelations.

Remember this. Jesus spoke of many new things about the spiritual world and events that were not written in the Torah. They jumped all over him for it and argued constantly about it. I am no where near Jesus' intellect to do so now. I am a layman with no college and no Greek Theological doctorate to my name. I am simply convey to the best of my ability what I was told.

They raked Jesus over the coals for what he taught and I should expect no less than what my master got from the world. I am not going to recant and May will come to prove what was said but even then you can not receive it if you go at this like a Pharisee and all legalistic. Keep an open mind and remember I am just a humble mechanic trying to get this right.

I apologize for any errors on my part in relating this but what I have written is what I was told. That's the end of it for me. I don't go around challenging 14 foot tall cherubim angels and they are quite intimidating to behold. I was lucky to just remember 1st John chapter 4 verses 1-3 to challenge him. But beyond this I do not think it wise to do as the gospels have demonstrated examples of this happening.
I have to wait till May to see what happens too.

 

[Endoscopy]

Yes I can. The Siege of 70 AD ended in AUGUST. The other Siege of Jerusalem that Jesus also speaks of happens in WINTER. Therefor a 2 part prophecy.

Have not avoided the obvious. Have flatly stated that in the last 3 and 1/2 years there will be no pregnant women or children or innocents that will suffer GOD'S Wrath. They that suffer prior to God pouring out his wrath upon earth will suffer from the wrath of MEN.

You are right in that it was Endoscopy that tried this with me. You are wrong in that you did not call him out on it. Seems to me you are playing favorites here when one interpretation of the English bible clearly contradicts the Earlier and most reliable one. As far as Greek bibles are concerned, I'm sure they have as many, if not more, variations of their Bible as we do ours in our English language. I can not debunk theirs as I am not privy to that Language. To use it on me is like trying to talk to a Moose. I'm just going to ignore you. KJV only and I will listen.

Not adding to scripture. I am plainly stating something that is NOT IN SCRIPTURE. Now here you are trying to use scripture to debunk it, strange? I am touching on the Rapture, describing the event itself, then I gave the date for Revelation chapter 12 verse 1 as November 22,2065. Did I contradict it? No I did not. Just some more detailed information.

There is zero scripture to debunk it. Wait for your sign in May and see.

You keep ignoring that Daniel and Revelation are end times prophecies. Part of the prophecies is the return of Jesus and his setting up his throne in Jerusalem. Where is He?

KJV is a flawed translation today. Language changes over time and 400 years have passed. Kill in 1611 meant murder today. Without understanding that if you were in an accident where you were ticketed and a person died would you be guilty of premeditated murder as implied by the KJV. Here are sites discussing the problems of the KJV.

KJV Issues

https://ehrmanblog.org/problems-with-the-language-of-the-king-james-version/

https://newrepublic.com/article/107222/making-it-new

King James Version issues

Is Your Modern Translation Corrupt? - Christian Research Institute

Why the KJV CANNOT be the only true and correct translation of God's Word.

https://www.gotquestions.org/different-gospel.html

The Use and Misuse of the King James Bible: An Interview with Mark Ward
Jonathan Petersen
March 13, 2018

https://www.biblegateway.com/blog/2...pJobID=1362532267&spReportId=MTM2MjUzMjI2NwS2

 

[Roadkill]

You keep ignoring that Daniel and Revelation are end times prophecies. Part of the prophecies is the return of Jesus and his setting up his throne in Jerusalem. Where is He?

KJV is a flawed translation today. Language changes over time and 400 years have passed. Kill in 1611 meant murder today. Without understanding that if you were in an accident where you were ticketed and a person died would you be guilty of premeditated murder as implied by the KJV. Here are sites discussing the problems of the KJV.

KJV Issues

https://ehrmanblog.org/problems-with-the-language-of-the-king-james-version/

https://newrepublic.com/article/107222/making-it-new

King James Version issues

Is Your Modern Translation Corrupt? - Christian Research Institute

Why the KJV CANNOT be the only true and correct translation of God's Word.

https://www.gotquestions.org/different-gospel.html

The Use and Misuse of the King James Bible: An Interview with Mark Ward
Jonathan Petersen
March 13, 2018

https://www.biblegateway.com/blog/2...pJobID=1362532267&spReportId=MTM2MjUzMjI2NwS2

No I am not. November 22 2065 is a is 47 years and about 6 months from today. I am not saying the Rapture happens this year. It happens within a time frame of 60 days before this date. How does this ignore Daniel and Revelations? A lot can happen in 47 years friend.

The KJV is not perfect. I have stated this. But to insert something that is directly contradictory to it is not correct either. There are plainer forms of the Bible, not any of them are correct 100 percent.
But to use any other Bible to rebuke me is not going to work either because the only one I recognize at authoritative is the KJV. Greek is not 100 percent either and even Hebrew bibles have problems as the Ancient Hebrew is different than modern Hebrew.
So only KJV will I recognize to spar with.
Not perfect but the version I know.

 

[Ahwatukee]

1st Day
All the dead in Christ will burst from the graves transfigured and will ascend to heaven. This event will cause many to believe on Jesus Christ.

2nd Day
Everyone living 25 years and down who believe on Jesus Christ, will transfigure in full view of mankind and ascend to Heaven. This includes those 25 year olds and on down who came to believe because of the previous day of the dead arising in Christ.

Hello Roadkill,

I was rereading your post and I realized something else terribly wrong with your claim of the event of the gathering of the church taking place over a 3 day period, with the first being the resurrection of all of the righteous dead, who will do so in full view of mankind and that for the purpose of causing many to believe in Jesus for salvation, which is my reason for this contention.

Regarding this, Jesus warns believers over and over again throughout scripture, to be watching and ready for His return:

"Therefore keep watch, because you do not know the day on which your Lord will come. But understand this: If the owner of the house had known in which watch of the night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. For this reason, you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect Him."

Your 3 day scenario, gets rid of the need to watch for the Lord's coming. And that because according to you, we wouldn't have to watch, because we could just wait until the dead are resurrected which alerts us that it has taken place. No need to watch. And second, it gives unbelievers the opportunity to be saved via the sign of the dead resurrecting, and that after continuously rejecting Christ. Below is another example:

"Be careful, or your hearts will be weighed down with carousing, drunkenness and the anxieties of life, and that day will close on you suddenly like a trap. For it will come on all those who live on the face of the whole earth. Be always on the watch, and pray that you may be able to escape all that is about to happen, and that you may be able to stand before the Son of Man.”

You see the Lord's warning above which says: "that day will close on you like a trap?" That means that for those believers who have gone back to living according to the sinful nature, i.e weighed down with carousing, drunkenness, etc., that if the believer is in the state mentioned above, that day, the day of His appearing to gather the church, followed by His wrath, will close on you like a trap. This does not leave any room for believers or unbelievers to get a free two day sign of those resurrected and caught up as proof of the Lord's coming for His church. That'd be like Jesus going down to Hades and saying, "Do you want to stay down in torment in flame, or would you like to be saved and have eternal life?" If the case, then Hades would at that time become empty. Likewise, if you have the dead resurrection for the whole world to see, I'm pretty sure that the majority of people on the earth would believe and except the offer to be changed and caught up too.

Your claim also pretty much undermines the parable of the need for the five foolish virgins to have the oil or readiness and having the door shut on them when they are not.

But I'm sure that you will have some lame apologetic for this, as you and others usually do.

 

[Ahwatukee]

Hello FollowJesus,

rvelation 17 " The beast that thou sawest was, <( past) and is not; <( present) and( future) > shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.9And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. 10And there are seven kings: five are fallen, <( past) and one is,< ( present) and the other is not yet come; ( future) and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. "

I don't post anything that I am not sure of. Here is the problem with your claim:

The beast that thou sawest was

But the above, I'm assuming that because the angel says "that thou sawest was," the key word being "was," meaning in the past, not future. Your error is not recognizing that the beast that John was shown is a vision from the future and is therefore not referring to the past from John's time frame, but the beast that will be revealed in the future.

Also, the phrase the beast who "once was, now is not and yet come" is referring to the fact that this demonic entity (the angel of the Abyss) was at one time in the word as the power behind another world leader.

Now is not = infers that fallen angel, from John's time frame, is not in the world, but is currently in the Abyss."

And yet will come = At some time in the future this fallen angel will come back up out of the Abyss

Therefore, I maintain that everything from Rev.4 onwards is yet future. And the reason for this is because of what Jesus told John to write:

What you have seen = Everything that John wrote from Rev.1:1 thru 1:19

What is now = represented by the letters to the churches and also prophetically represents the church period

What will take place later = what takes place after the "what is now" i.e. after the church period

The "what will take place later" is synonymous with "what will take place after this" revealed in Rev.4:1-2, ergo, everything that will take place after the "what is now" or what will take place after the church period.

 

[Endoscopy]

No I am not. November 22 2065 is a is 47 years and about 6 months from today. I am not saying the Rapture happens this year. It happens within a time frame of 60 days before this date. How does this ignore Daniel and Revelations? A lot can happen in 47 years friend.

The KJV is not perfect. I have stated this. But to insert something that is directly contradictory to it is not correct either. There are plainer forms of the Bible, not any of them are correct 100 percent.
But to use any other Bible to rebuke me is not going to work either because the only one I recognize at authoritative is the KJV. Greek is not 100 percent either and even Hebrew bibles have problems as the Ancient Hebrew is different than modern Hebrew.
So only KJV will I recognize to spar with.
Not perfect but the version I know.

It is obvious that you ignore the problems using older translations of the Bible being caused by the inevitable changes in any language. Given evidence of this you reject the facts out of hand in order to keep your emotion driven beliefs. Doing this you allow yourself to ignore reality to prevent the pain of cognitive dissonance of having 2 opposing views in your mind when one opposes your emotionally held belief. The KJV was a very accurate translation in 1611. However today it contains words that cease to exist and many words that have changed their meaning. For example back then the word smell was a compliment. Today if you say, "you smell" it is an insult. Try reading Choucer. It is somewhat older English.

Why do you deliberately blind yourself to the facts of language changing over the years? 2000 years ago there was Latin. Today it became all of the Romance languages, French, Spanish, Rumanian, Portuguese, etc. This happened slowly over time. Please use your thinking ability to take these facts and use them to look at reality. KJV suffers from the language changing issue.

 

[Endoscopy]

No I am not. November 22 2065 is a is 47 years and about 6 months from today. I am not saying the Rapture happens this year. It happens within a time frame of 60 days before this date. How does this ignore Daniel and Revelations? A lot can happen in 47 years friend.

The KJV is not perfect. I have stated this. But to insert something that is directly contradictory to it is not correct either. There are plainer forms of the Bible, not any of them are correct 100 percent.
But to use any other Bible to rebuke me is not going to work either because the only one I recognize at authoritative is the KJV. Greek is not 100 percent either and even Hebrew bibles have problems as the Ancient Hebrew is different than modern Hebrew.
So only KJV will I recognize to spar with.
Not perfect but the version I know.

Jesus plainly stated no one knows the time but the Father. At 73 years old I have read a few documents saying Jesus would return in a specific time frame. Those times came and went. Your assertion of your time frame matches the format of these previous versions that failed. Therefore I reject your assertions.

 

[Roadkill]

Hello Roadkill,

I was rereading your post and I realized something else terribly wrong with your claim of the event of the gathering of the church taking place over a 3 day period, with the first being the resurrection of all of the righteous dead, who will do so in full view of mankind and that for the purpose of causing many to believe in Jesus for salvation, which is my reason for this contention.

Regarding this, Jesus warns believers over and over again throughout scripture, to be watching and ready for His return:

"Therefore keep watch, because you do not know the day on which your Lord will come. But understand this: If the owner of the house had known in which watch of the night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. For this reason, you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect Him."

Your 3 day scenario, gets rid of the need to watch for the Lord's coming. And that because according to you, we wouldn't have to watch, because we could just wait until the dead are resurrected which alerts us that it has taken place. No need to watch. And second, it gives unbelievers the opportunity to be saved via the sign of the dead resurrecting, and that after continuously rejecting Christ. Below is another example:

"Be careful, or your hearts will be weighed down with carousing, drunkenness and the anxieties of life, and that day will close on you suddenly like a trap. For it will come on all those who live on the face of the whole earth. Be always on the watch, and pray that you may be able to escape all that is about to happen, and that you may be able to stand before the Son of Man.”

You see the Lord's warning above which says: "that day will close on you like a trap?" That means that for those believers who have gone back to living according to the sinful nature, i.e weighed down with carousing, drunkenness, etc., that if the believer is in the state mentioned above, that day, the day of His appearing to gather the church, followed by His wrath, will close on you like a trap. This does not leave any room for believers or unbelievers to get a free two day sign of those resurrected and caught up as proof of the Lord's coming for His church. That'd be like Jesus going down to Hades and saying, "Do you want to stay down in torment in flame, or would you like to be saved and have eternal life?" If the case, then Hades would at that time become empty. Likewise, if you have the dead resurrection for the whole world to see, I'm pretty sure that the majority of people on the earth would believe and except the offer to be changed and caught up too.

Your claim also pretty much undermines the parable of the need for the five foolish virgins to have the oil or readiness and having the door shut on them when they are not.

But I'm sure that you will have some lame apologetic for this, as you and others usually do.

Hello Ahwatukee

Once again, The Resurrection at the 2nd coming of Jesus and The Rapture of the Church at the end of the Church Age are 2 separate events. I have written nothing of the 2nd coming of Jesus( in which he places his foot on the Mt. of Olives ) and of the Resurrection at that time. I know only what you know in what the Bible has said about it.

What I have written was the date for the sign in the Heavens of Revelation 12:1 ( the MID POINT of the last 7 years of Israel as a Nation. The Last 3 and a half years of which is the GREAT TRIBULATION period.

What I have written is the RAPTURE of the Church Age is in a 60 day time period before this date. I Know the Season and the Year. Not the Day or the Hour. Do you see the loophole here yet? The Word of God is designed like this so that those who question with a mind of a child will dig deeper for more. A Legalist will never do this.

The Parable of the 5 foolish virgins has another meaning that you have not been able to grasp as of yet. It would hinder your spiritual growth for me to answer this for you . You'll have to dig a lot deeper for the answer to this parable.
To use it against me is your option.

Do you not think that I'm not aware that if I add to Revelation what is not true or take away from it any part of it that my Soul can be damned for this offense? I'm well aware of this. I have a more detailed account of what Hell is from a Cherubim Angel, believe me I FEAR ever setting foot in that place!

Like I said before, even when May comes and the events unfold as I was told some will still discredit this account. So if Christians can't accept or receive this, how in the world do you think Sinners are going to be able to receive it? If they do it is by the work of the Holy Spirit not me.

The purpose for this, and I just went through a sunrise service in a graveyard with my Church for Easter, is that when living Christians at the time don't go immediately after the Resurrection of the Dead they won't FREAK out and lose hope. That they may know that their time is yet to come.

 

[Roadkill]

It is obvious that you ignore the problems using older translations of the Bible being caused by the inevitable changes in any language. Given evidence of this you reject the facts out of hand in order to keep your emotion driven beliefs. Doing this you allow yourself to ignore reality to prevent the pain of cognitive dissonance of having 2 opposing views in your mind when one opposes your emotionally held belief. The KJV was a very accurate translation in 1611. However today it contains words that cease to exist and many words that have changed their meaning. For example back then the word smell was a compliment. Today if you say, "you smell" it is an insult. Try reading Choucer. It is somewhat older English.

Why do you deliberately blind yourself to the facts of language changing over the years? 2000 years ago there was Latin. Today it became all of the Romance languages, French, Spanish, Rumanian, Portuguese, etc. This happened slowly over time. Please use your thinking ability to take these facts and use them to look at reality. KJV suffers from the language changing issue.

First of all, don't appreciate you insinuating that I am insane. I'm fully aware that this is crazy to even put out here. Do I keep my mouth shut? Would that please God that I keep silent or that I tell the truth and look like a fool? I'll please God the best I can thank you very much.

Now as for Languages, have you ever read where God has rescinded the Tower of Babel Decree? I haven't. So no matter what you try and how perfect you think your translation is, it's still open to interpretation because of this. We have problems just translating our old English to Modern English for crying out loud!

 

[Roadkill]

Jesus plainly stated no one knows the time but the Father. At 73 years old I have read a few documents saying Jesus would return in a specific time frame. Those times came and went. Your assertion of your time frame matches the format of these previous versions that failed. Therefore I reject your assertions.

I fully agree that these things have been said before. They always ignored the context of Revelations. Certain things have to line up for a prediction to work out.

I have been given the Sign of May to prove to you that I'm telling the truth. Is a little under 60 days too long a time frame to wait and see?

 

[Roadkill]

It is obvious that you ignore the problems using older translations of the Bible being caused by the inevitable changes in any language. Given evidence of this you reject the facts out of hand in order to keep your emotion driven beliefs. Doing this you allow yourself to ignore reality to prevent the pain of cognitive dissonance of having 2 opposing views in your mind when one opposes your emotionally held belief. The KJV was a very accurate translation in 1611. However today it contains words that cease to exist and many words that have changed their meaning. For example back then the word smell was a compliment. Today if you say, "you smell" it is an insult. Try reading Choucer. It is somewhat older English.

Why do you deliberately blind yourself to the facts of language changing over the years? 2000 years ago there was Latin. Today it became all of the Romance languages, French, Spanish, Rumanian, Portuguese, etc. This happened slowly over time. Please use your thinking ability to take these facts and use them to look at reality. KJV suffers from the language changing issue.

It's also obvious that you inserted a word from a different version that totally disagreed with the verse from the KJV just to try and justify your argument. Translations ought to compliment one another, not contradict.

 

[Ahwatukee]

Once again, The Resurrection at the 2nd coming of Jesus and The Rapture of the Church at the end of the Church Age are 2 separate events.

According to scripture, your claim above is already not in agreement with the word of God. Both the resurrection of the dead in Christ and the living being changed and caught up, are apart of the same event. The dead rise first, then immediately after that, the living in Christ are "caught up" with them and that prior to the revealing of the antichrist and the wrath of God.

Furthermore, the resurrection of the dead and the living being caught up (rapture) takes place at least seven years prior to when Christ returns to the earth to end the age, which is the second coming. The only resurrection that takes place at the second coming, will be of those great tribulation saints who will have died during that last 3 1/2 years of that seven year period, revealed in Rev.20:4-6.

* We are here

* Resurrection of the dead and the changing and catching up of the living

* Antichrist revealed establishing a seven year covenant/treaty with Israel

* Seals, trumpets and bowl judgments take place throughout the entire seven years

* Abomination set up in the middle of the seven years

* The woman/Israel flees and is cared for out in the wilderness during that last 3 1/2 years

* Christ returns and the previously resurrected and caught up will be returning with Him to end the age

* Beast and false prophet thrown alive into the lake of fire

* Satan seized and thrown into the Abyss for a thousand years

* Great tribulation saints resurrected

That's an overview of the chronological order according to scripture.

What I have written was the date for the sign in the Heavens of Revelation 12:1 ( the MID POINT of the last 7 years of Israel as a Nation. The Last 3 and a half years of which is the GREAT TRIBULATION period.

Revelation 12 has nothing to do with literal cosmic signs. The reference to the sun, moon and stars are symbolisms which God used from Genesis 37:9-10 to reveal who the woman of Revelation 12 is and has nothing to do with the literal cosmos.

Once again, your claim does not fit with scripture, because scripture reveals that the resurrection of the dead is closely linked with when the living are changed and caught up. The entire event will take place so quickly, that they will almost seem simultaneous. In support of this, in Paul's second letter to the Thessalonians, he is responding to the a previous letter that the Thessalonians had written to Paul regarding some who were among them teaching that the resurrection had already taken place. Since the Thessalonians knew Paul's teaching of the dead rising first with the living believers being changed and caught up immediately after that, they were concerned because, if it was true that the resurrection had already taken place, then they were concerned because they had not been caught up after the dead had been raised. There other concern was that if the resurrection had actually taken place, then according to Paul's teaching, the wrath of God was to follow, which would mean that since they had not been caught up, that they were going to have to go through God's wrath. This demonstrates that the Thessalonians also knew and believed what I have been telling you.

What you should be thinking about, is what you are going to think and do regarding this so-called 14' angel who has giving you this information. Because one May comes and goes with a ground breaking for the temple, it means that nothing that he has told you has any validity. It would mean that you have been conversing with a fallen angel/demonic being.

The purpose for this, and I just went through a sunrise service in a graveyard with my Church for Easter, is that when living Christians at the time don't go immediately after the Resurrection of the Dead they won't FREAK out and lose hope. That they may know that their time is yet to come.

I have addressed your claim above many times before with others. No true believer in Christ who has done in depth studies on end-time events, is going "FREAK OUT!" I will use myself as an example. Because have and do study end-time events extensively, if the changing and catching up of the living in Christ did not take place immediately after the dead had been resurrected, I would simply go to God in prayer and begin to pray for strength to go through the time of His wrath and the kingdom of the beast, knowing what that entails. Being one who studies, I would know the antichrist and the time period that I had entered into and what would be coming. It wouldn't cause me to freak out and lose hope!

I would be thinking about what you are going to do with May comes and goes without and event, as well as what you are going to do about this so-called angel proclaiming to be of God.

 

[preston39]

Hints at it? I'd say that it is very direct, since Paul gave a detailed account of it in 1 Thes.4:13-18. And in 1 Cor.15:51-53, which is the same event, he referred to it as a mystery, i.e. hidden, previously unknown.

I agree that the gathering of the church and the Lord's return to the earth as being two separate events, as I have always maintained this fact. At the rapture, the church is being removed from the earth. At the second coming, the glorified church is returning with the Lord to the earth.

A....,
I believe you have it correct here.

Just for clarification;.... when Christ returns...2nd advent...the .."church"...has been converted at the marriage supper and is the saved from all ages.

 

[tanakh]

Yes I can. The Siege of 70 AD ended in AUGUST. The other Siege of Jerusalem that Jesus also speaks of happens in WINTER. Therefor a 2 part prophecy.

Have not avoided the obvious. Have flatly stated that in the last 3 and 1/2 years there will be no pregnant women or children or innocents that will suffer GOD'S Wrath. They that suffer prior to God pouring out his wrath upon earth will suffer from the wrath of MEN.

You are right in that it was Endoscopy that tried this with me. You are wrong in that you did not call him out on it. Seems to me you are playing favorites here when one interpretation of the English bible clearly contradicts the Earlier and most reliable one. As far as Greek bibles are concerned, I'm sure they have as many, if not more, variations of their Bible as we do ours in our English language. I can not debunk theirs as I am not privy to that Language. To use it on me is like trying to talk to a Moose. I'm just going to ignore you. KJV only and I will listen.

Not adding to scripture. I am plainly stating something that is NOT IN SCRIPTURE. Now here you are trying to use scripture to debunk it, strange? I am touching on the Rapture, describing the event itself, then I gave the date for Revelation chapter 12 verse 1 as November 22,2065. Did I contradict it? No I did not. Just some more detailed information.

There is zero scripture to debunk it. Wait for your sign in May and see.

A large number of people followed him including women who mourned and wailed for him. Jesus turned and said to them ''Daughters of Jerusalem do not weep for me , weep for yourselves and for your children For the time will come when you will say Blessed are the barren women the wombs that never bore and the breasts that never nursed then they will say to the mountains fall on us and to the Hills cover us. For if men do these things when the Tree is green what will happen when it is dry?

Luke 23:27-30 NIV

Here Jesus was on his way to be Crucified when he came to these wailing women. By reading the plain English text its obvious that he wasn't entering into an eschatological debate with them as to what will happen in the 21st Century He was warning them of what will happen in their lifetime and it did in AD 70. Josephus goes into horrific detail of how a woman ate her own baby due to starvation.

Much of what Jesus said concerning the last days had a double application and this is an example. There appears to be a kind of mental block when it comes to the events surrounding AD70. I get the impression that if it were possible to kind of 'Photoshop' out anything to do with Christs prophecies, the Josephus writings or anything else connected with those events some on site would jump at the chance because they upset their ''perfect'' understanding of end time events.

As for the wailing women if only they had the likes of Awatukee there to explain it all to them they would go home a lot happier.

 

[Nehemiah6]

Just for clarification;.... when Christ returns...2nd advent...the .."church"...has been converted at the marriage supper and is the saved from all ages.

This is not clarification at all. It adds to the confusion.

Here is clarity:

1. The Resurrection/Rapture

2. The Judgment Seat of Christ

3. The Marriage of the Lamb

4. The Second Coming of Christ

Christians are saved (converted) the moment they repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ. However, their salvation is completed at the Resurrection/Rapture, not at the Second Coming.