Not By Works

LW97 · Apr 12, 2018

VCO said:

I had a lady in the Church that I attended, years ago, actually say in response to that question, "Why should I go the speed limit, as long as there is no State Patrol car in my review mirror?"

Haha, good one

LW97 · Apr 12, 2018

VCO said:

YOU STILL DO NOT GET IT, DO YOU?

He is SAYING:

Romans 4:3-5 (HCSB)
[SUP]3 [/SUP] For what does the Scripture say? Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him for righteousness.

{UNEARNED, NO WORKS, it was JUST PURE FAITH the INSTANT HE BELIEVED.}

[SUP]4 [/SUP] Now to the one who works, pay is not considered as a gift, but as something owed.

{There for it is NOT SALVATION, because the ONLY SALVATION is a result of GOD MERCY AND GRACE, NOT SOMETHING TO BE EARNED. NO ONE CAN EARN SALVATION, IF YOU THINK HE OWES YOU SALVATION, YOU WILL BE WRONG, BUT IF YOU THINK YOUR GOOD WORKS WILL BE REWARDED WITH SOMETHING ELSE OTHER THAN SALVATION, YOU WILL BE RIGHT. Personally, I only long to hear the words from HIM, "Well done, my good and faithful servant." WORKS ARE NOT REWARDED WITH SALVATION, IT IS AVAILABLE AS ONLY A FREE GIFT OF GOD.}

[SUP]5 [/SUP] But to the one who does not work, but believes on Him who declares the ungodly to be righteous, his faith is credited for righteousness.

{WORKING FOR SALVATION IS IN IMPURE MOTIVE, WHILE WORKING BECAUSE YOU LOVE HIM, IS THE ONLY PURE MOTIVE THERE IS. HAVE YOU RECEIVED YOUR FREE GIFT FROM GOD?}

John 4:10 (NCV)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] Jesus said, “If you only knew the free gift of God and who it is that is asking you for water, you would have asked him, and he would have given you living water.“

Romans 5:15 (NASB)
[SUP]15[/SUP] But the free gift is not like the transgression. For if by the transgression of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, abound to the many.

Romans 6:23 (NASB)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Romans 3:23-24 (NKJV)
[SUP]23 [/SUP] for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
[SUP]24 [/SUP] being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,

Ephesians 1:6 (NJB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] to the praise of the glory of his grace, his free gift to us in the Beloved,

Revelation 22:17 (NCV)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] The Spirit and the bride say, “Come!“ Let the one who hears this say, “Come!“ Let whoever is thirsty come; whoever wishes may have the water of life as a free gift.

Romans 5:10 (HCSB)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] For if, while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, ⌊then how⌋ much more, having been reconciled, will we be saved by His life!

YOU CAN NOT DO ENOUGH GOOD WORKS TO EVEN BEGIN TO EARN YOUR SALVATION!

TRUE STORY!

dcontroversal · Apr 12, 2018

Budman said:

Exactly.........there are a few anomalies for sure and or exceptions.......Moses killing the Egyptian who was abusing Hebrew slaves is another.....

dcontroversal · Apr 12, 2018

How can anyone say works save, keep saved or top off salvation when the bible states the following...

NOT by WORKS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH WE HAVE DONE, but ACCORDING to his MERCY HAS HE SAVED US.

POINTS of TRUTH.

a. HE HAS SAVED US is PAST TENSE which means is is a PRESENTLY HELD position
b. IT was and is ACCORDING to HIS MERCY
c. IT IS NOT BY WORKS of RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH WE HAVE DONE<--THIS TO is PAST TENSE

SALVATION is NOT based upon ANYTHING which WE HAVE DONE....it is GRANTED and GIVEN as a FREE GIFT based UPON MERCY....totally UNDESERVED by MAN!

VCO · Apr 12, 2018

LW97 said:

Yeah, I guess that lady thought it was okay to break the law, as long as you did not get caught.

LW97 · Apr 12, 2018

dcontroversal said:

How can anyone say works save, keep saved or top off salvation when the bible states the following...

NOT by WORKS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH WE HAVE DONE, but ACCORDING to his MERCY HAS HE SAVED US.

POINTS of TRUTH.

a. HE HAS SAVED US is PAST TENSE which means is is a PRESENTLY HELD position
b. IT was and is ACCORDING to HIS MERCY
c. IT IS NOT BY WORKS of RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH WE HAVE DONE<--THIS TO is PAST TENSE

SALVATION is NOT based upon ANYTHING which WE HAVE DONE....it is GRANTED and GIVEN as a FREE GIFT based UPON MERCY....totally UNDESERVED by MAN!

And if we do wrong, God corrects us.

dcontroversal · Apr 12, 2018

LW97 said:

Absolutely....and he uses numerous tools to do such...sometimes he shames us, whips us, puts us in the wilderness a while, may yank blessings and or if need be....bring us home........

Metternich · Apr 12, 2018

Faith comes as a free gift of grace. No work of ours can merit it. But after Faith works become very important for our sanctification and those works are done with the help of God's grace also. If we resist that grace we may end up like the servant below.
24 He also who had received the one talent came forward, saying, ‘Master, I knew you to be a hard man, reaping where you did not sow, and gathering where you did not winnow; 25 so I was afraid, and I went and hid your talent in the ground. Here you have what is yours.’ 26 But his master answered him, ‘You wicked and slothful servant! You knew that I reap where I have not sowed, and gather where I have not winnowed? 27 Then you ought to have invested my money with the bankers, and at my coming I should have received what was my own with interest. 28 So take the talent from him, and give it to him who has the ten talents.

dcontroversal · Apr 12, 2018

Metternich said:

The bolded is false.........works do not sanctify.....sanctification in our daily life is the direct result of growth and maturity.....said growth and maturity results in sanctification WHICH in turn will bear fruitful works for the Lord.....

LW97 · Apr 12, 2018

dcontroversal said:

CORRECT! I will soon show a sermon about this topic.

eternally-gratefull · Apr 12, 2018

VCO said:

sounds like alot of religious pharisee type people I know.

LW97 · Apr 12, 2018

[video=youtube;msWsC0srUas]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msWsC0srUas[/video]

Metternich · Apr 12, 2018

dcontroversal said:

Here is what Merriam-Websters says. Do you have any problem with this?

sanc•ti•fy \-ˌfī\ verb transitive
-fied; -fy•ing [Middle English seintefien, sanctifien, from Anglo-French seintefier, sanctifier, from Late Latin sanctificare, from Latin sanctus sacred—more at SAINT] 14th century
1: to set apart to a sacred purpose or to religious use: CONSECRATE
2: to free from sin: PURIFY
3 a: to impart or impute sacredness, inviolability, or respect to
b: to give moral or social sanction to
4: to make productive of holiness or piety 〈observe the day of the sabbath, to sanctify it—Deut 5:12 (Douay Version)〉

Merriam-Webster, I. (2003). Merriam-Webster’s collegiate dictionary. (Eleventh ed.). Springfield, MA: Merriam-Webster, Inc.

dcontroversal · Apr 12, 2018

Metternich said:

Here is what Merriam-Websters says. Do you have any problem with this?

sanc•ti•fy \-ˌfī\ verb transitive
-fied; -fy•ing [Middle English seintefien, sanctifien, from Anglo-French seintefier, sanctifier, from Late Latin sanctificare, from Latin sanctus sacred—more at SAINT] 14th century
1: to set apart to a sacred purpose or to religious use: CONSECRATE
2: to free from sin: PURIFY
3 a: to impart or impute sacredness, inviolability, or respect to
b: to give moral or social sanction to
4: to make productive of holiness or piety 〈observe the day of the sabbath, to sanctify it—Deut 5:12 (Douay Version)〉

Merriam-Webster, I. (2003). Merriam-Webster’s collegiate dictionary. (Eleventh ed.). Springfield, MA: Merriam-Webster, Inc.

So what..the bible trumps Websters dictionary and what I said is correct...just take the correction like a man of God would....

BillG · Apr 12, 2018

Metternich said:

Is faith a free gift?
Not sure I get that but I'm sure more learned people will explain it to me.

I would not say that works are important for our sanctification.

We have been sanctified as a result of Jesus and us placing our faith in him.

To be sanctified is effectively to be declared Holy and set apart to be Holy.

Therefore having been set apart we do what?
Walk like Jesus did and wants us to.
Its sanctification, becoming more like Jesus and wanting to.

Nehemiah6 · Apr 12, 2018

dcontroversal said:

So good works are a part of sanctification.

I think there is no discrepancy in what was said here: But after Faith works become very important for our sanctification and those works are done with the help of God's grace also" and what you have stated.

dcontroversal · Apr 12, 2018

Nehemiah6 said:

Sure there is....semantics means everything and one word changes context and truth....

Good works are a part of

Good works are a result of

The two above say entirely different things...........and the bible teaches the latter not the former!

NoNameMcgee · Apr 12, 2018

sanctification comes from Jesus

" wherefore Jesus also that He might sanctify the people with His own blood"

this isnt physical.....

“But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:”

this is for ALL of His children

"Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified"

works are a product of sanctification

not a requirement for.....

37. hagiazó ►
Strong's Concordance
hagiazó: to make holy, consecrate, sanctify
Original Word: ἁγιάζω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: hagiazó
Phonetic Spelling: (hag-ee-ad'-zo)
Short Definition: I make holy, sanctify
Definition: I make holy, treat as holy, set apart as holy, sanctify, hallow, purify.

what He has done to us spiritually through His blood

38. hagiasmos ►
Strong's Concordance
hagiasmos: consecration, sanctification
Original Word: ἁγιασμός, οῦ, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: hagiasmos
Phonetic Spelling: (hag-ee-as-mos')
Short Definition: sanctification, holiness
Definition: the process of making or becoming holy, set apart, sanctification, holiness, consecration.

(this comes by grace through faith...... we dont "become holy" from works....)

Metternich · Apr 12, 2018

dcontroversal said:

So I will take that as a you do not think much of it. What exactly do you mean by growth? Growth in what? And maturity.
maturing in what way? Not trying to start a fight. Just trying to understand.

LW97 · Apr 12, 2018

Yeah, we shouldn't be too legalistic.

Not By Works

Senior Member

Senior Member

Banned

Banned

Senior Member

Senior Member

Banned

Senior Member

Banned

Senior Member

eternally-gratefull

Guest

Senior Member

Senior Member

Banned

Senior Member

Senior Member

Banned

NoNameMcgee

Guest

Senior Member

Senior Member