The Rapture
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No, the KJV tells you it's over. I don't read or write "new age" stuff. The "age to come" is Biblical, See Heb 6:5. Everyone wants to claim the KJV as the purest translation. It is not. Young's Literal Translation is a word-for-word translation without any translator putting their spin on what they thought the author was trying to say.
YLT makes it very clear that Christ was to return very soon after He left (40 years to be exact) and the KJV agrees. But here, read the proof in the YLT:
2 Tim 4:1
Mat 10:23
Mat 16
Mat 24: 34
Mat 26:64
1 Thes 1:10
Mat 23
So, who was Christ angry at, the first century religious leaders who put Him to death or is He mad at some 21st century dudes?[SUB][/SUB]
YLT makes it very clear that Christ was to return very soon after He left (40 years to be exact) and the KJV agrees. But here, read the proof in the YLT:
2 Tim 4:1
I do fully testify, then, before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who is about to judge living and dead at his manifestation and his reign
.Mat 10:23
And whenever they may persecute you in this city, flee to the other, for verily I say to you, ye may not have completed the cities of Israel till the Son of Man may come.
Mat 16
`For, the Son of Man is about to come in the glory of his Father, with his messengers, and then he will reward each, according to his work.
[SUP]28 [/SUP]Verily I say to you, there are certain of those standing here who shall not taste of death till they may see the Son of Man coming in his reign.'
[SUP]28 [/SUP]Verily I say to you, there are certain of those standing here who shall not taste of death till they may see the Son of Man coming in his reign.'
Mat 24: 34
Verily I say to you, this generation may not pass away till all these may come to pass.
Mat 26:64
Jesus saith to him, `Thou hast said; nevertheless I say to you, hereafter ye shall see the Son of Man sitting on the right hand of the power, and coming upon the clouds, of the heaven.'
1 Thes 1:10
and to wait for His Son from the heavens, whom He did raise out of the dead -- Jesus, who is rescuing us from the anger that is coming.
Rev 1:7
Rev 1:7
Lo, he doth come with the clouds, and see him shall every eye, even those who did pierce him, and wail because of him shall all the tribes of the land. Yes! Amen!
Mat 23
`Serpents! brood of vipers! how may ye escape from the judgment of the gehenna?
[SUP]34 [/SUP]`Because of this, lo, I send to you prophets, and wise men, and scribes, and of them ye will kill and crucify, and of them ye will scourge in your synagogues, and will pursue from city to city;
[SUP]35 [/SUP]that on you may come all the righteous blood being poured out on the earth from the blood of Abel the righteous, unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the sanctuary and the altar:
[SUP]36 [/SUP]verily I say to you, all these things shall come upon this generation.
[SUP]34 [/SUP]`Because of this, lo, I send to you prophets, and wise men, and scribes, and of them ye will kill and crucify, and of them ye will scourge in your synagogues, and will pursue from city to city;
[SUP]35 [/SUP]that on you may come all the righteous blood being poured out on the earth from the blood of Abel the righteous, unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the sanctuary and the altar:
[SUP]36 [/SUP]verily I say to you, all these things shall come upon this generation.
So, who was Christ angry at, the first century religious leaders who put Him to death or is He mad at some 21st century dudes?[SUB][/SUB]
You keep ignoring the abomination of desolation never took place. It was planned but the gold statue of the emperor was damaged before it could be placed in the temple. Also the tribulation of the devastation happening that had to be halted or the population of the earth being eliminated. When did that happen???
Much of the Symbolism is either explained within the text or is based on other parts of the Bible. One needs a good working knowledge of the Bible to understand Revelation and to some extent knowledge of ancient history. Not everyone is prepared to invest the time or effort in obtaining either. That's one reason why there are so many books on the subject. In my view there are four main versions partly due to the reasons I've stated. Also because there is a tendency to opt for one version and ignore elements included in others. I don't believe that any of them have the complete answer alone
Ignoring the fact that Daniel states the book is closed until the end times. Revelation has the same issues. Thus causing 4 seperate Biblical views of eschatology. Explain how the following sites are in error. Details not blanket statements please.
Here are a couple of sites discussing the 4 main eschatologyical views. Notice some have minor variations.
https://www.blueletterbible.org/faq/mill.cfm
Eschatology, end times, & millennialism: Competing theories
Here are a couple of sites discussing the 4 main eschatologyical views. Notice some have minor variations.
https://www.blueletterbible.org/faq/mill.cfm
Eschatology, end times, & millennialism: Competing theories
I looked at the sites you quote. They both say more or less the same about each position except they come at them from different angles. I'm not sure what you are asking. As far as the actual positions are concerned the sites accurately explain the beliefs and differences of each one.
Daniel was told that the book was closed until the time of the end. When Daniel received the visions that time was hundreds of years in the future. John saw the book or Scroll being opened by Christ who reveals its contents. The time of the end started in the first century and is called the last days in a number of places in the NT. We have been in the time of the end since then and are still waiting for Christs return which will mark the final end of the last days.
Daniel was told that the book was closed until the time of the end. When Daniel received the visions that time was hundreds of years in the future. John saw the book or Scroll being opened by Christ who reveals its contents. The time of the end started in the first century and is called the last days in a number of places in the NT. We have been in the time of the end since then and are still waiting for Christs return which will mark the final end of the last days.
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The rapture as the as to the first resurrection occurred when Christ said it is finished. The graves were opened and all the saints that did have the Spirit of Christ in them entered the new Jerusalem a city prepared as the bride of Christ. Since then for a believer to be absent of their bodies of death is to enter the first rapture resurrection .
When he who is here living in believers destroys this world on the last day the saints that do remain as those reigning with Christ offering the gospel .....in the twinkling of the eye both will raise and receive their new incorruptible body .
Remember without parables like the book of Revelation Christ, the Holy Spirit spoke not.Not only did he bring the revelation but also
Revelation 1 King James Version (KJV)
1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified "it" by his angel unto his servant John:
He did not just send it without meaning.
To signify identifies the context is parables, that hide the spiritual, signified meaning from the lost
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The word Revelation means to reveal or unveil. What you suggest is just the opposite. If you examine the book and compare it to parts of the Pentateuch,Prophets and Gospels you will find that a great deal of Revelation is connected to them.Examples are the plagues of Egypt, Ezekiel which appears to be used as a template to Revelation having at least 20 similar features shared by both books, Then there is the much debated Daniel and the Prophetic words of Jesus. Allusions to OT passages can be found throughout the book.
So when Christ said CLEARLY that "they" would not go through all the cities of Israel before He returned, He lied?
When He said some of them standing before Him would not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming to reign, He lied?
When He said ALL THESE things would come to that generation (the one He was speaking to), He lied?
When He said all the tribes of the Land (Israel) would mourn even those who pierced Him would do so when He returned, He lied?
When He told the scribes that the next time they would see Him, He would be coming on the Clouds of Heaven (angels) in Power, He didn't really mean that they would see Him thus, He lied?
When Paul said Jesus was ABOUT to judge the living and dead, he didn't mean ABOUT, he was off by 2,000 years thus he lied?
The main problems you and most are having is three-fold:
1. You don't understand the nature of Christ's Parousia (i.e. presence) return.
2. You've lost audience integrity thinking all these things were not written to those who these words were written to and instead they were written to a generation many thousands of years later. Thus Titus was to have no blessed hope and the Thessalonians were to have no rest and all those standing there would die, and those who killed Christ don't face His wrath while still on earth and instead His wrath was for some future generation many thousands of years later who had nothing to do with His death and rejection.
3. You think the rapture and resurrection happen in the physical realm for mortals to see. And you think alive people are taken to heaven, without dying, being immediately transformed into spiritual beings in direct conflict with Heb 9:26-27.
Please address these three points and we'll go from there.
When He said some of them standing before Him would not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming to reign, He lied?
When He said ALL THESE things would come to that generation (the one He was speaking to), He lied?
When He said all the tribes of the Land (Israel) would mourn even those who pierced Him would do so when He returned, He lied?
When He told the scribes that the next time they would see Him, He would be coming on the Clouds of Heaven (angels) in Power, He didn't really mean that they would see Him thus, He lied?
When Paul said Jesus was ABOUT to judge the living and dead, he didn't mean ABOUT, he was off by 2,000 years thus he lied?
The main problems you and most are having is three-fold:
1. You don't understand the nature of Christ's Parousia (i.e. presence) return.
2. You've lost audience integrity thinking all these things were not written to those who these words were written to and instead they were written to a generation many thousands of years later. Thus Titus was to have no blessed hope and the Thessalonians were to have no rest and all those standing there would die, and those who killed Christ don't face His wrath while still on earth and instead His wrath was for some future generation many thousands of years later who had nothing to do with His death and rejection.
3. You think the rapture and resurrection happen in the physical realm for mortals to see. And you think alive people are taken to heaven, without dying, being immediately transformed into spiritual beings in direct conflict with Heb 9:26-27.
Please address these three points and we'll go from there.
Of course it took place!!! Just because you incorrectly identify it doesn't mean it didn't happen. Please see if you can follow the bouncing ball:
The end of the regular sacrifice to Caesar happened in 66 AD as recorded by Josephus in "War of the Jews, 2-17-2".
Eleazar, the son of Ananias the high priest, a very bold youth, who was at that time governor of the temple, persuaded those that officiated in the Divine service to receive no gift or sacrifice for any foreigner. And this was the true beginning of our war with the Romans; for they rejected the sacrifice of Caesar on this account; and when many of the high priests and principal men besought them not to omit the sacrifice, which it was customary for them to offer for their princes, they would not be prevailed upon. These relied much upon their multitude, for the most flourishing part of the innovators assisted them; but they had the chief regard to Eleazar, the governor of the temple.
The Abomination of Desolation was standing (arrived) in the "holy place" (Jerusalem) exactly 1,290 days later in accordance with Dan 12:11 at Shabbat 70 AD. The Roman abominable idols of Zeus, Caesar and Rome, carried by the soldiers, was the Abomination of Desolation which was the trigger for Christians to flee Judea. 45 days later (1335 days according to Daniel), Rome laid siege to Jerusalem thus beginning the "Great Tribulation" of Jerusalem.
The time, times and half a time, or three and a half years was the interval of time between the first arrival of the Roman solders at the Feast of Tabernacles in 66 AD to the siege of Jerusalem on Passover of 70 AD.
Dan 12:1 predicts that "Your (Daniels's) people would be delivered at that time - everyone found written in the book." Eusebius writes, "The members of the Jerusalem church by means of an oracle given by revelation to acceptable persons there, were ordered to leave the City (Jerusalem) before the war began and settle in a town in Peraea called Pella." Here the Christian Jews were saved in the wilderness to wait out the War.
The Abomination of Desolation was standing (arrived) in the "holy place" (Jerusalem) exactly 1,290 days later in accordance with Dan 12:11 at Shabbat 70 AD. The Roman abominable idols of Zeus, Caesar and Rome, carried by the soldiers, was the Abomination of Desolation which was the trigger for Christians to flee Judea. 45 days later (1335 days according to Daniel), Rome laid siege to Jerusalem thus beginning the "Great Tribulation" of Jerusalem.
The time, times and half a time, or three and a half years was the interval of time between the first arrival of the Roman solders at the Feast of Tabernacles in 66 AD to the siege of Jerusalem on Passover of 70 AD.
Dan 12:1 predicts that "Your (Daniels's) people would be delivered at that time - everyone found written in the book." Eusebius writes, "The members of the Jerusalem church by means of an oracle given by revelation to acceptable persons there, were ordered to leave the City (Jerusalem) before the war began and settle in a town in Peraea called Pella." Here the Christian Jews were saved in the wilderness to wait out the War.
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You are ignoring that several prophecies of end times didn't happen yet. The biggest one is the abomination of desolation. Titus had a gold statue made of himself and ordered it put in the temple. That would have been it but the statue was damaged before it could be placed there. He then had a hissy fit and ordered the temple and most of Jerusalem destroyed. Josephus records the viewing of the temple complex be destroyed. It happened just as Jesus prophecied. No stone left on another one. Oops that requires a temple to desecrate. In order for that to be fulfilled a new temple will have to be built.
The Jews in Israel have been excavating in the north part of the City of David and have found underground evidence of required items used in the temple including a spring. This then is the location of the temple since there is no other spring anywhere near this site and flowing water is mandatory. In addition there is a channel for blood to flow away from an alter there. Also grooves for other items.
Your eschatology has severe problems.
The Jews in Israel have been excavating in the north part of the City of David and have found underground evidence of required items used in the temple including a spring. This then is the location of the temple since there is no other spring anywhere near this site and flowing water is mandatory. In addition there is a channel for blood to flow away from an alter there. Also grooves for other items.
Your eschatology has severe problems.
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Where was the temple built?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Rmk6_bIDMM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Rmk6_bIDMM
Of course the abomination of desolation occurred:
Adam Clarke's commentary:
Verse 15
The abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel - This abomination of desolation, St. Luke, ( Luke 21:20, Luke 21:21
, refers to the Roman army; and this abomination standing in the holy place is the Roman army besieging Jerusalem; this, our Lord says, is what was spoken of by Daniel the prophet, in the ninth and eleventh chapters of his prophecy; and so let every one who reads these prophecies understand them; and in reference to this very event they are understood by the rabbins.
The Roman army is called an abomination, for its ensigns and images, which were so to the Jews. Josephus says, (War, b. vi. chap. 6), the Romans brought their ensigns into the temple, and placed them over against the eastern gate, and sacrificed to them there.
The Roman army is therefore fitly called the abomination, and the abomination which maketh desolate, as it was to desolate and lay waste Jerusalem; and this army besieging Jerusalem is called by St. Mark, Mark 13:14, standing where it ought not, that is, as in the text here, the holy place; as not only the city, but a considerable compass of ground about it, was deemed holy, and consequently no profane persons should stand on it.
Verse 16
Then let them which be in Judea flee into the mountains - This counsel was remembered and wisely followed by the Christians afterwards. Eusebius and Epiphanius say, that at this juncture, after Cestius Gallus had raised the siege, and Vespasian was approaching with his army, all who believed in Christ left Jerusalem and fled to Pella, and other places beyond the river Jordan; and so they all marvellously escaped the general shipwreck of their country: not one of them perished. See on Matthew 24:13; (note).
Adam Clarke's commentary:
Verse 15
The abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel - This abomination of desolation, St. Luke, ( Luke 21:20, Luke 21:21
, refers to the Roman army; and this abomination standing in the holy place is the Roman army besieging Jerusalem; this, our Lord says, is what was spoken of by Daniel the prophet, in the ninth and eleventh chapters of his prophecy; and so let every one who reads these prophecies understand them; and in reference to this very event they are understood by the rabbins. The Roman army is called an abomination, for its ensigns and images, which were so to the Jews. Josephus says, (War, b. vi. chap. 6), the Romans brought their ensigns into the temple, and placed them over against the eastern gate, and sacrificed to them there.
The Roman army is therefore fitly called the abomination, and the abomination which maketh desolate, as it was to desolate and lay waste Jerusalem; and this army besieging Jerusalem is called by St. Mark, Mark 13:14, standing where it ought not, that is, as in the text here, the holy place; as not only the city, but a considerable compass of ground about it, was deemed holy, and consequently no profane persons should stand on it.
Verse 16
Then let them which be in Judea flee into the mountains - This counsel was remembered and wisely followed by the Christians afterwards. Eusebius and Epiphanius say, that at this juncture, after Cestius Gallus had raised the siege, and Vespasian was approaching with his army, all who believed in Christ left Jerusalem and fled to Pella, and other places beyond the river Jordan; and so they all marvellously escaped the general shipwreck of their country: not one of them perished. See on Matthew 24:13; (note).
I have been down the path using the numbers you use. The problem is most theologians say a prophetic day is a year. Therefore the 1335 days is 1335 years. Then there is the starting point. This is hard to determine. These numbers have been used to try and predict when Jesus will return. Lots of guesses and failure every time. Go back to the drawing board and take Daniel's word the book is closed till the end times.
Why do so many try to make 70AD the end times? Jesus isn't sitting on the throne in Jerusalem.
Why do so many try to make 70AD the end times? Jesus isn't sitting on the throne in Jerusalem.
The holy place is not the city of Jerusalem but the temple. Trying to wiggle around this fact is illogical!!! It is just trying to make 70AD end times ignoring the tribulation prophecies. There are trumpets and bowls causing massive destruction. One has to be shortened to prevent all life being killed. That one implies a nuclear war. Armageddon will start that war. You keep ignoring a lot of end times prophecies that have yet to take place. At no time in the past has there been a war that could wipe out all life. How do you explain away this??
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The point is that the rapture time consisting of a milli-second doesn't allow time for Christs' duties at His 2nd advent.
When Christ comes He has a lot to do; fight and win the battle of Armageddon and reign on earth for 1000 years.
The 2nd advent will not occur until the later part of the 7 year trib. period....per scripture.
The point is that the rapture time consisting of a milli-second doesn't allow time for Christs' duties at His 2nd advent.
When Christ comes He has a lot to do; fight and win the battle of Armageddon and reign on earth for 1000 years.
The 2nd advent will not occur until the later part of the 7 year trib. period....per scripture.