Trinity vs. Oneness

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Are you Trinitarian, or Sabellian (Oneness, usually, Oneness Pentecostal)?

  • Trinitarian

    Votes: 45 77.6%

  • Sabellion

    Votes: 6 10.3%

  • What's the difference?

    Votes: 7 12.1%
  • Total voters
    58
A

AgeofKnowledge

Guest
#101
#101
ShelleBelle76 said:
You are smart and seem well educated in your beliefs. And you communicate those beliefs in a clear and concise way, which is much appreciated to those of us who are seeking truth with an open heart and mind. With all that going for you, why diminish yourself by being so condescending?

Said with love. :)
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Thank you for the love and love right back at ya :). Disagreeing with heresy is not condescending. Read the Pauline Epistles and notice how Paul the Apostle contests with the heretics of his day which included early gnostics and Judaizers. He loved the church enough to use the language necessary to protect the authentic Christian assemblies and teach them what Jesus and the Apostles had taught him. Note how he engaged heretics and heresy.

You must understand, we aren't dealing with authentic Christians that simply disagree on non-essential topics of our faith. We are dealing with dyed in the wool cults and deceived false teachers at times here. Jesus, the apostles, and the early church fathers are our example in this regard. Keep reading. They aren't tolerant of that kind of heresy and for good reason. Authentic: Yes! Condescending: No! Though it appeared that way to you.

God bless you and may God lead you, all the wonderful Christian people here, the curious, the seekers, and yes those caught up in cults and false religious systems of deception the devil has blinded them with INTO ALL TRUTH! Praise the Lord for that!
 
B

BananaPie

Guest
#102
#102
loveschild said:
I've seen Jesus a few times. I've seen the Holy Spirit. The Father talked to me the other day. I'm body, soul, and spirit plus the Holy Spirit lives in me. That not all easy to explain either.
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Praise the Lord, sister, for God is good to you!
 
C

Churchboy202

Guest
#103
#103
To say that the fullness of God was not in Christ is to go against basic scripture! Who died on the Cross? Well, we know that God can not die at all.But there's a term we oneness folks use called ' dual nature'. Seeing that Jesus Was both God and man ,I'd say the MAN Christ Jesus died on the Cross!He died as the lamb. God never dies! He was both God and Man! Historians say 'the GodMAn'.

I don't have time to get too deep in this discussion , but If you'll find me on Facebook we can discuss it. I rarely get on this site plus I'm knew to it.
[email protected] find me on facebook
 
F

forerunner

Banned
#104
Jun 29, 2010
398
0
0
#104
Well churchboy. I would hope you keep posting here. We need more people like you who have understood and embraced the truth about the dual nature of Christ, and the Oneness of God.

God Bless you.
 
D

Dmurray

Guest
#105
#105
Agree with the above Post!
 
A

AgeofKnowledge

Guest
#106
#106
Churchboy202 said:
To say that the fullness of God was not in Christ is to go against basic scripture!
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I never said the fullness of God wasn't in Christ. I said God wants you to know Him in all His fullness (God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit). To say that God the Father and God the Holy Spirit only exist as avatars of Jesus and are not persons in their own right is to error greviously with scripture and teach heresy and mislead people. Those who did so in the early church were rightly excommunicated for it as was your entire Oneness movement from the Assemblies of God. It's heresy and it's wrong to mislead people with it.
 
R

Redeemed79

Guest
#107
#107
1Covenant said:
I would urge caution when dealing with oneness folks. They are not dummies and they have their own reasoned biblical examples for their beliefs.
I have spent two years reading and studying on it and believe me it can be tricky.
Most of the Trinitarians that I have seen confront a oneness believer end up walking away and just dogmatically believing the Trinity since both sides had their scripture proofs. Which to that, I Praise God that at least they didn't give into the oneness theology, but I would rather people see the heart of the difference and not just argue semantics or metaphysics or even isolated proof texts.

The heart of the issue is the atonement. Who had to atone for sin?

The oneness cannot put the fullness of God in Christ's death on the cross. The Trinitarian can because he confesses that mystery of the trinity which is laid out in my avatar.
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Hiya! I have been wondering how i could make the picture of your avatar and put it on here and now dont need to (because wallah here it is) as this is EXACTLY what I believe! Yay to come across it, it's brilliant. I don't know what people are talking about when they call each other names (mostly denomination names)...I've never known anything other than the body of Christ as a whole (though not stupid I do know that churches have dif names and beliefs just never looked into it is all). Probably cos I've not come across so much diversity as i have on here and I'm from New Zealand and maybe its not as rife here. But I agree with how you and your avatar (and scripture) teaches it.
:)
 
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C

charisenexcelcis

Guest
#108
#108
Churchboy202 said:
To say that the fullness of God was not in Christ is to go against basic scripture! Who died on the Cross? Well, we know that God can not die at all.But there's a term we oneness folks use called ' dual nature'. Seeing that Jesus Was both God and man ,I'd say the MAN Christ Jesus died on the Cross!He died as the lamb. God never dies! He was both God and Man! Historians say 'the GodMAn'.

I don't have time to get too deep in this discussion , but If you'll find me on Facebook we can discuss it. I rarely get on this site plus I'm knew to it.
[email protected] find me on facebook
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It depends upon how you are defining death. If is was the cessation of existance, you would be right. But Jesus never ceased to exist. So, God, in that sense, can die.
 
R

Ricke

Guest
#109
#109
David
You stated "in that sense, God can die". How can God die David, if our Bibles tell us in Hebrews 7 v 3 that God had no beginning nor will he ever have an end.? Jesus the Son, the fleshly body of the eternal died at Calvary, not God the Father, The Spirit.

I Think it has been fully explained many times already, that God manifested himself in a fleshly body to become our atonement for everyone's Sins. He did not create "separate" God , person, separate personalities. This is where the Trinity view is in total error from scripture. God was both Spirit and Human together as ONE not TWO.
 
C

charisenexcelcis

Guest
#110
#110
Ricke said:
David
You stated "in that sense, God can die". How can God die David, if our Bibles tell us in Hebrews 7 v 3 that God had no beginning nor will he ever have an end.? Jesus the Son, the fleshly body of the eternal died at Calvary, not God the Father, The Spirit.

I Think it has been fully explained many times already, that God manifested himself in a fleshly body to become our atonement for everyone's Sins. He did not create "separate" God , person, separate personalities. This is where the Trinity view is in total error from scripture. God was both Spirit and Human together as ONE not TWO.
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And I have told you several times that Jesus was the Son from all eternity. Jesus did not cease to exist and he did not suffer spiritual death. If death is not the cessation of existance, then it does not conflict with the eternal Godhead. You are dividing Christ when you have the body die, but not Jesus himself. How could He have been a sacrifice and bear our sins if He didn't die.
 
F

forerunner

Banned
#111
Jun 29, 2010
398
0
0
#111
charisenexcelcis said:
And I have told you several times that Jesus was the Son from all eternity. Jesus did not cease to exist and he did not suffer spiritual death. If death is not the cessation of existance, then it does not conflict with the eternal Godhead. You are dividing Christ when you have the body die, but not Jesus himself. How could He have been a sacrifice and bear our sins if He didn't die.
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The man Jesus Christ did die on the Cross, and He was the perfect sacrifice. However God did not die nor can God die
 
C

charisenexcelcis

Guest
#112
#112
forerunner said:
The man Jesus Christ did die on the Cross, and He was the perfect sacrifice. However God did not die nor can God die
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Then God did not atone, man did. Not once in scripture does Jesus ever act as if He is divided. He is the "only Savior and God". If God could redeem Jesus through a miraculous birth, what need is there for a sacrifice? For God so loved the world that He sent His only Son that whosoever believe in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life. Salvation was accomplished through the sent Son, not the "created fleshly body". It says that He endured the cross. It says that He could of call a legion of angels to free him, which means nothing if the eternal God just withdrew in the moment of death.
 
F

forerunner

Banned
#114
Jun 29, 2010
398
0
0
#114
charisenexcelcis said:
Then God did not atone, man did
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Ummm, yeah?????? however not man in general, but a man Jesus Christ.

1st Corinthians 15
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.


Romans 5
11 And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.
12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
15 But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.


1st timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;


Now come on man you are not really saying you think God died are ya? The bible clearly tells us that the man born of Mary live died and rose again?
 
F

forerunner

Banned
#115
Jun 29, 2010
398
0
0
#115
livingbygrace said:
Nor can God become sin for us
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Right the Son of God did. However living Grace Jesus was both the Father and the Son. I k now you deny His deity, I do not. However I understand what charisenexcelcis seems not to. That He was fully human and in his humanity distinct from the Father through His human nature , not a separate personhood.
 
C

charisenexcelcis

Guest
#116
#116
forerunner said:
Ummm, yeah?????? however not man in general, but a man Jesus Christ.

1st Corinthians 15
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.


Romans 5
11 And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.
12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.
14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.
15 But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.


1st timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;


Now come on man you are not really saying you think God died are ya? The bible clearly tells us that the man born of Mary live died and rose again?
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Yes I am. I am not saying that He ceased to exist. Jesus was fully God and fully man, not a combination but 100/100. It would be a mockery of His sacrifice to say that His God-nature somehow withdrew rather than enduring the cross. This is one of the underlying truths of the Phillipians passage. "He endured the shame", not withdrawing.
 
C

charisenexcelcis

Guest
#117
#117
forerunner said:
Right the Son of God did. However living Grace Jesus was both the Father and the Son. I k now you deny His deity, I do not. However I understand what charisenexcelcis seems not to. That He was fully human and in his humanity distinct from the Father through His human nature , not a separate personhood.
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You shatter the nature of Jesus for your own purposes.
 
F

forerunner

Banned
#118
Jun 29, 2010
398
0
0
#118
charisenexcelcis said:
Yes I am. I am not saying that He ceased to exist. Jesus was fully God and fully man, not a combination but 100/100. It would be a mockery of His sacrifice to say that His God-nature somehow withdrew rather than enduring the cross. This is one of the underlying truths of the Phillipians passage. "He endured the shame", not withdrawing.
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Why do you think Jesus cried out My father why have you forsaking me.

God did not die. To say that He did makes a mockery of God and the whole of scripture.


You obviously have a skewed idea of the Father son relationship, but i already knew that i just didn;t realize how shewed it could get.
 
L

livingbygrace

Banned
#120
Dec 19, 2009
2,723
7
0
#120
forerunner said:
Right the Son of God did. However living Grace Jesus was both the Father and the Son. I k now you deny His deity, I do not. However I understand what charisenexcelcis seems not to. That He was fully human and in his humanity distinct from the Father through His human nature , not a separate personhood.
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I wasn't wishing to start an argument between you and I. But God Himself cannot become sin for us as I understand scripture, so God could not die on the cross
 
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