GOD'S SABBATH AND THE REAL TRUTH OF COL 2:14-17 WHO DO WE BELIEVE GOD or MAN?

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trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
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It does not say in scripture that monday or any other days are HOLY....why are you contradicting GOD ?
Your own opinion/understanding is at work which we are told not to indulge in...why ? because it is from another spirit. Learn to speak the words of GOD !
It does. It says that all days are equal. Just read it.

"One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind."
R 14:5
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
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It does. It says that all days are equal. Just read it.

"One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind."
R 14:5
I'm afraid it does not say what you read as scripture...it says PEOPLE/persons ESTEEM one day better than another...that means it stems from HUMAN/carnal reasoning....it's not GOD-given (that one day is better than another, just human thinking) and that is what christianity has based their religion on. GOD's word is that the Sabbath day is Holy...no other ! Think about it !!!
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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It does. It says that all days are equal. Just read it.

"One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind."
R 14:5
God again set a certain day, calling it "today."
(Hebrews 4:7)

The stone which the builders rejected
Has become the chief cornerstone.
This was the Lord’s doing;
It is marvelous in our eyes.
This is the day the Lord has made;
We will rejoice and be glad in it!

(Psalm 118:22-24)
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
794
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I'm afraid it does not say what you read as scripture...it says PEOPLE/persons ESTEEM one day better than another...that means it stems from HUMAN/carnal reasoning....it's not GOD-given (that one day is better than another, just human thinking) and that is what christianity has based their religion on. GOD's word is that the Sabbath day is Holy...no other ! Think about it !!!
Please, read Romans 14, the chapter. The context says something different than you do.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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I'm afraid it does not say what you read as scripture...it says PEOPLE/persons ESTEEM one day better than another...that means it stems from HUMAN/carnal reasoning....it's not GOD-given (that one day is better than another, just human thinking) and that is what christianity has based their religion on. GOD's word is that the Sabbath day is Holy...no other ! Think about it !!!
it does say "each should be fully convinced in their own mind" & not, 'you must convince everyone to esteem one day above others & judge those who do not'

in fact the entire chapter of Romans 14 is a context of not judging one another over these things, and that both the one who eats and the one who does not eat do so unto the Lord


So whatever you believe about these things keep between yourself and God.
(Romans 14:22)
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
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God again set a certain day, calling it "today."
(Hebrews 4:7)

The stone which the builders rejected
Has become the chief cornerstone.
This was the Lord’s doing;
It is marvelous in our eyes.
This is the day the Lord has made;
We will rejoice and be glad in it!

(Psalm 118:22-24)
You are giving the impression that ''today' could refer to 'any day you/we ESTEEM RIGHT...when in fact Heb 4 refers to ''the seventh day...and the finished work from creation (again the 7th day)...'today refers to a 'certain day....not any day.
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
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It is the SAME God who tries to unite all mankind, it's just that He started with ONE nation the Jews who were supposed to be/become an EXAMPLE to all other nations...but failed .Deut 4v6-8.
Jesus said, "I will draw all men unto me." (Joh 12:32b) and as Father and Son are One, they failed, (as you admit), because they were following the god of the Jews and not the Father who is God over all. As Jesus said, "If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him." (Joh 14:7)

Try to understand the God of the Jews is NOT the God of Dan 7:13.
"I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him."

As Micah 5:2 puts it 700 years before Jesus was born:
But you, O Bethlehem Ephrathah, who are too little to be among the clans of Judah, from you shall come forth for me one who is to be ruler in Israel, whose coming forth is from of old, from ancient days.
 
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beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
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it does say "each should be fully convinced in their own mind" & not, 'you must convince everyone to esteem one day above others & judge those who do not'

in fact the entire chapter of Romans 14 is a context of not judging one another over these things, and that both the one who eats and the one who does not eat do so unto the Lord

So whatever you believe about these things keep between yourself and God.
(Romans 14:22)
right, no more DISCUSSING anything with you since you consider it 'judgement. of course that does not stop you from giving your opinion !
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
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Jesus said, "I will draw all men unto me." (Joh 12:32b) and as Father and Son are One, they failed, (as you admit), because they were following the god of the Jews and not the Father who is God over all. As Jesus said, "If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him." (Joh 14:7)

Try to understand the God of the Jews is NOT the God of Dan 7:13.
"I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him."
sorry..too difficult to read small print.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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You are giving the impression that ''today' could refer to 'any day you/we ESTEEM RIGHT...when in fact Heb 4 refers to ''the seventh day...and the finished work from creation (again the 7th day)...'today refers to a 'certain day....not any day.

Hebrews 4:7 says He appointed another day and called it 'today'
this is true no matter which day of the week you read it. this is not a passage you must only read on saturdays, because it says the appointed day is "
today." it is not false on thursdays -- tho thursday is today: today, if you hear His voice :)

His works have been finished since the creation of the world.
(Hebrews 4:3)

the author is talking about the real rest of God, not the shadow of it, and from this talk of rest, he begins writing about the glory of Christ, which outshines everything else.

The Law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming -- not the realities themselves.
(Hebrews 10:1)

Christ has come, and will come again -- the stumbling stone, the foundation & cornerstone, He is the day i will rejoice in: He separated light from darkness and called the light "day" -- He Himself
 
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posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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right, no more DISCUSSING anything with you since you consider it 'judgement. of course that does not stop you from giving your opinion !
you're certainly free to ignore my discussion. but i'm giving scripture, not opinion, here - at least 14 verses referenced in my last three posts.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
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Obviously...care to explain ?
Just read the chapter. The direction of it is different than what you think.

The chapter says that we can serve God various ways, that weak faith follows rules and considers some things holy/clean while other things considers common/unholy, that strong faith is free and that both ways are equal. We should not judge people, therefore, regarding how/when they serve God.
 
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beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
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Just read the chapter. The direction of it is different than what you think.

The chapter says that we can serve God various ways, that weak faith follows rules and considers some things holy/clean while other things considers common/unholy, that strong faith is free and that both ways are equal. We should not judge people, therefore, regarding how/when they serve God.
Yes indeed we are free to serve God as our heart believes since in this period of Grace and no longer under the letter of the OT. But does that mean that everything we do is ''approved of God ? Or do HIS Commands still apply ? what is your opinion ?
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
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Yes indeed we are free to serve God as our heart believes since in this period of Grace and no longer under the letter of the OT. But does that mean that everything we do is ''approved of God ? Or do HIS Commands still apply ? what is your opinion ?
Everything is not approved by God. Sin is still sin (robbery, murder, lie...)

But way or timing of how we serve God is not sin anymore (which is different from the OT) - observing days, festivals, food, what we wear and similar.
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
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Since it is against God's law He has reasons for it. It is stated that keeping the law will make for a happier life. Are you equating atheist and other views of ethics equivalent to Gods?? These psychologists studied men and women that had casual sex and those also who were faithful to their spouses. That was their results!! Quibble all you want.
the issue isn't what a group of psychologists say.

I was evaluating the idea, expressed above by a different user, that we "must learn the culture and ways of the times that a direction was written in to learn what the teaching is"

so, what do you say? If a person wants to keep the law should they keep it as written, according to the letter, or should they take into account the intent of the directive in light of modern science, culture, and Technology?
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
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Everything is not approved by God. Sin is still sin (robbery, murder, lie...)

But way or timing of how we serve God is not sin anymore (which is different from the OT) - observing days, festivals, food, what we wear and similar.
So if it is still sin to steal why is it not still sin to reject the 7th day sabbath >>>they are both from the same 10 Commands which obviously TO ME and James are to be kept INTACT Jas 2v10,11....why not to you ? what makes you and other christians tear out the sabbath ? Paul in Rom 14 ?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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So if it is still sin to steal why is it not still sin to reject the 7th day sabbath >>>they are both from the same 10 Commands which obviously TO ME and James are to be kept INTACT Jas 2v10,11....why not to you ? what makes you and other christians tear out the sabbath ? Paul in Rom 14 ?
James uses an example from Leviticus, not the 10 words, to illustrate that breaking one part of the Law makes you guilty of all.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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So if it is still sin to steal why is it not still sin to reject the 7th day sabbath >>>they are both from the same 10 Commands which obviously TO ME and James are to be kept INTACT Jas 2v10,11....why not to you ? what makes you and other christians tear out the sabbath ? Paul in Rom 14 ?
You should probably ask, why does Paul say treating every day alike and treating one day as greater than another are both to the Lord, and why does he command by the Spirit that we should not let anyone judge us over a sabbath?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
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You should probably ask, why does Paul say treating every day alike and treating one day as greater than another are both to the Lord, and why does he command by the Spirit that we should not let anyone judge us over a sabbath?
And ask, why were the tablets God inscribed broken? And ask, why & how did the priests in the Law desecrate the sabbath without guilt? And ask, how did circumcision take precedence over sabbath if the 8th day fell on a 7th? And ask, how is it that God appointed another day, and why did He call it "today"?