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GodisONE

Active member
Jul 11, 2018
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What does "Lord said to my Lord" mean and what does "I put your enemies under your feet" mean?

Concentrate on "I, your" and "Lord said to Lord", these are parts which I wonder how you read them. Because, taken literally, it again destroys your position. So you must read it in some different way. Which one?

I do not want your defense, just the information how you read it, simply and clearly, give me one sentence for each. For exaple, calvinists read "God loved the world" like "God loved the elect ones from the world". This is what i want from you to tell me, how you read the verse above.



what is interesting are verse 1 and verse 4.


1 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool*.

4 The LORD hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek.


if you notice, the LORD in verse 1 and 4 are ALL CAPITALIZED.
why is this significant?
look at verse 4, it's clear this LORD is a (((((PRIEST OF THE ORDER OF MELCHIZEDEK))))).

who do we know from Hebrews this is speaking of?
Yeshua!!

so it is clear in both verses, the LORD is the SAME PERSON, which we know is Yeshua [the WORD] because we know He IS Melchizedek [the High Priest] of Abraham!!


but I do agree, it is interesting how this was written.
basically it reads:
Yahweh said unto Yeshua [the WORD]...
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
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Yes on the outward and also what i thought initially of the verse was that one person (First Lord) is speaking to another person (second Lord) but it's not- This verse like the other one on Jesus' baptism is an almost physical presentation of authorities of God for your sake. All this verse says is that the son will be triumphant.

I'm not going to add or reduce words in scripture, someone might think ill of me. I'll let the scripture say what it says but from my end, that verse means - the Father's works will attain victory through the son, a prophesy.
The Lord said to my Lord: “Sit at my right hand until I put your enemies under your feet".

So, you read it like:

The current authority said to my non-existing (yet) authority: wait (in your non existence) until i will do something for you and I will disappear then and you will be the one.

?

If not, give me your citation.
 

Noose

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2016
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The Lord said to my Lord: “Sit at my right hand until I put your enemies under your feet".

So, you read it like:

The current authority said to my non-existing (yet) authority: wait (in your non existence) until i will do something for you and I will disappear then and you will be the one.

?

If not, give me your citation.
Are you playing word games to discredit what i'm saying?
If that Psalm is not a prophesy, what is it? and if it is a prophesy, how is it fulfilled?

I said, it is not like one person speaking to another, it is an understanding which is physically presented for you and me. Jesus being God doesn't need to be told that He is loved or that He will be victorious, God is actually speaking to us (sons) so that we are equipped.
 

GodisONE

Active member
Jul 11, 2018
212
44
28
Are you playing word games to discredit what i'm saying?
If that Psalm is not a prophesy, what is it? and if it is a prophesy, how is it fulfilled?

I said, it is not like one person speaking to another, it is an understanding which is physically presented for you and me. Jesus being God doesn't need to be told that He is loved or that He will be victorious, God is actually speaking to us (sons) so that we are equipped.


a good example is Peter:

by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
22 Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him.


Peter is basically claiming Yeshua is the RIGHT HAND of GOD.
he does not say He sit on God's right side, but clearly states is on the RIGHT HAND of God

we know Peter baptized in the ONENESS like PAUL in Book of Acts.
so clearly, Peter is explaining that Yeshua is the RIGHT HAND of GOD, not a separate person from God!!
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
794
113
Are you playing word games to discredit what i'm saying?
If that Psalm is not a prophesy, what is it? and if it is a prophesy, how is it fulfilled?

I said, it is not like one person speaking to another, it is an understanding which is physically presented for you and me. Jesus being God doesn't need to be told that He is loved or that He will be victorious, God is actually speaking to us (sons) so that we are equipped.
Give me your reading, not explanation. If you are not willing, stop attacking me.
 

Noose

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2016
5,096
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Give me your reading, not explanation. If you are not willing, stop attacking me.
I have already given you a reading:

"The Father says to the son, i will make you victorious"

Psalm 118:15 Shouts of joy and salvation resound in the tents of the righteous: “The right hand of the LORD performs with valor! 16The right hand of the LORDis exalted! The right hand of the LORD performswith valor!”

Exodus 15:6 Your right hand, O LORD, is majestic in power; Your right hand, O LORD, has shattered the enemy.

Psalm 89:13 Mighty is Your arm, strong is Your hand; Your right hand is exalted.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
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Noose, how do you read this verse:

Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage; rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness.
Philippians 2:8
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
794
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I have already given you a reading:

"The Father says to the son, i will make you victorious"
To the non-existing son, because son is only an authority that will exist after he will be born from Marry, right?

So its like God talking to Abraham in the times of Adam. Some strange kind of personalised prophecy, we have no example of in the Bible. Not to say that its one person talking to himself, according to you.
 

Noose

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2016
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Noose, how do you read this verse:

Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage; rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness.
Philippians 2:8
God made Himself a servant for our sake
Malachi 3:1
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
794
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God made Himself a servant for our sake
Malachi 3:1
How do you read the verse? You are still trying to run away from the application of your belief.

Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage; rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness.

Do you read it like:
Authority, who was God, did not consider equality with himself...?
 
Jun 29, 2018
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we know from scripture that Yeshua had the FATHER and HOLY SPIRIT living inside Him.
There are the literal expressions and in relative sense. And in your case, spoken in a relative sense, you perceive literally. The fact is that not only in Jesus, but also in believers according to the Scriptures, God-Father, Son and Spirit are live inside (in a certain sense), believers are temples of the Holy Spirit. Is this the conclusion that we (all believers) are God-Father?
In Christ, there was the fullness of the Godhead, but it is speaks of the fullness of the revelation/manifestation of God in Christ. This does not mean that God-Father completely settled in Jesus Christ, nowhere is this said!
 

Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
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we obviously are aware that the WORD [made flesh][Yeshua] already existed from the very beginning, since Paul claims in Colossians that He is the first and last, beginning and the end, alpha and omega, etc.
Would you mind sharing your thought about whether the Word comes from the Spirit or does the Spirit come from the Word?

The written word [being the spoken word made flesh] did not exist from the beginning. The spoken word did not exist until day 1 when God said let there be light and there was light. And God saw the light that it was good.


we know He was Melchizedek [Abraham's personal High Priest], He was God with 2 angels who met Abram and told Sarai she would have a baby before sending His angels to Sodom and Gomorrha,
Actually you think Melchizedek was the eternal God who is described by Paul as being "Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually. But the Father of lights, the eternal one, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning, as written in James 1:17, does not change in nature or form so he who is of God hears Gods words.

Gen 14:10
and the kings of Sodom and Gomorrah fled, and fell there; and they that remained fled to the mountain.

And he brought back all the goods, and also brought again his brother Lot, and his goods, and the women also, and the people. And the king of Sodom went out to meet him after his return from the slaughter of Chedorlaomer, and of the kings that were with him, at the valley of Shaveh, which is the king's dale.
Genesis 14:16-17

But if you read the scriptures it says Abram was a prophet of God, whom the LORD said he would raise up from amongst the brethren and put his words in that prophet's mouth, and it shall come to pass that whosoever will not hear the words that he shall speak in the LORD's name, it would be required of them. That pretty much makes one a priest of the LORD.

You are mixing the account of Genesis 14 with the account of Genesis 19.

Now in Genesis 14, verses 18-20 it is written;
And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he [Abram] was the priest of the most high God.
And he [Melchizedek] blessed him [Abram] and said,
Blessed be Abram of the most high God, possessor of heaven and earth:​
And blessed be the most high God, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand.​
And he [Melchizedek] gave him [Abram] tithes of all.
Gen 14:16-17

21 And the king of Sodom said unto Abram, Give me the persons, and take the goods to thyself.
22 And Abram said to the king of Sodom, I have lift up mine hand unto the LORD, the most high God, the possessor of heaven and earth,
23 That I will not take from a thread even to a shoelatchet, and that I will not take any thing that is thine, lest thou shouldest say, I have made Abram rich:
24 Save only that which the young men have eaten, and the portion of the men which went with me, Aner, Eshcol, and Mamre; let them take their portion.
Gen 14:21-24
 

Zmouth

Senior Member
Nov 21, 2012
3,391
134
63
In Christ, there was the fullness of the Godhead, but it is speaks of the fullness of the revelation/manifestation of God in Christ. This does not mean that God-Father completely settled in Jesus Christ, nowhere is this said!
God the Spirit and the Word of God are one Spirit of truth, whom is the comforter, being the Holy Ghost, the LORD

Or read Deut 32:4-6
"...a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he. They have corrupted themselves, their spot is not the spot of his children: they are a perverse and crooked generation. Do ye thus requite the LORD, O foolish people and unwise? is not he thy father that hath bought thee? hath he not made thee, and established thee?

But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.
Mark 13:11

John 14:16-18
6 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

John 14:26
But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

John 15:26
But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
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a good example is Peter:

by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
22 Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him.


Peter is basically claiming Yeshua is the RIGHT HAND of GOD.
he does not say He sit on God's right side, but clearly states is on the RIGHT HAND of God

we know Peter baptized in the ONENESS like PAUL in Book of Acts.
so clearly, Peter is explaining that Yeshua is the RIGHT HAND of GOD, not a separate person from God!!
Peter said that Jesus is on the right hand of God. Not that he is the right hand of God.

The proper reading of Peter also destroys oneness. Because in the oneness, Jesus is the only God and the only person and therefore He cannot be "on the right hand of God".

Oneness people must twist hundreds of verses.
 

Noose

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2016
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How do you read the verse? You are still trying to run away from the application of your belief.

Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage; rather, he made himself nothing by taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness.

Do you read it like:
Authority, who was God, did not consider equality with himself...?
Nope.
I read it the way i read it-the son doesn't consider equality with the Father something to be grasped.
 

Noose

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2016
5,096
932
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There are the literal expressions and in relative sense. And in your case, spoken in a relative sense, you perceive literally. The fact is that not only in Jesus, but also in believers according to the Scriptures, God-Father, Son and Spirit are live inside (in a certain sense), believers are temples of the Holy Spirit. Is this the conclusion that we (all believers) are God-Father?
In Christ, there was the fullness of the Godhead, but it is speaks of the fullness of the revelation/manifestation of God in Christ. This does not mean that God-Father completely settled in Jesus Christ, nowhere is this said!
There's no such thing as half and full revelation or half and full manifestation of God- presence of God means God; the reason Moses was told to remove his sandles for even the ground became holy.
Does the presence of the Father in us make us the Father? NO, who did we beget for us to be called the Father? Jesus is the Father because He is our God; He begot us and the son will always be subject to the Father forever.
 

Noose

Senior Member
Apr 18, 2016
5,096
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Peter said that Jesus is on the right hand of God. Not that he is the right hand of God.

The proper reading of Peter also destroys oneness. Because in the oneness, Jesus is the only God and the only person and therefore He cannot be "on the right hand of God".

Oneness people must twist hundreds of verses.
Nope.

The verse destroys you because right hand of God is not a place but victory/glory.

Psalm 118:15 Shouts of joy and salvation resound in the tents of the righteous: “The right hand of the LORD performs with valor! 16The right hand of the LORD is exalted! The right hand of the LORD performs with valor!”

Exodus 15:6 Your right hand, O LORD, is majestic in power; Your right hand, O LORD, has shattered the enemy.

Psalm 89:13 Mighty is Your arm, strong is Your hand; Your right hand is exalted.

Even if it were a place, trinity would still be in shambles because there will be two beings right there; Jesus (one being) would be on the right of another being (God)- God forbid.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
794
113
Nope.

The verse destroys you because right hand of God is not a place but victory/glory.

Psalm 118:15 Shouts of joy and salvation resound in the tents of the righteous: “The right hand of the LORD performs with valor! 16The right hand of the LORD is exalted! The right hand of the LORD performs with valor!”

Exodus 15:6 Your right hand, O LORD, is majestic in power; Your right hand, O LORD, has shattered the enemy.

Psalm 89:13 Mighty is Your arm, strong is Your hand; Your right hand is exalted.

Even if it were a place, trinity would still be in shambles because there will be two beings right there; Jesus (one being) would be on the right of another being (God)- God forbid.
You are again running away from the point, trying to concentrate on "what does the right hand mean" and afraid of talking about what does it mean that Jesus is on the right hand of God (and therefore not that God).

When you say that Jesus is in the glory of God, you won nothing, because you have still the same problem, Jesus is not that God.
 

trofimus

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2015
10,684
794
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Nope.
I read it the way i read it-the son doesn't consider equality with the Father something to be grasped.
But you believe that Son is the Father, so how can he grasp his equality to Father. You must read it "equality to himself", even though the text is clear they are two.