Is it possible to identify a true Christian from a false one

[Adstar]

Most nominal Christians would say yes to all of those questions. But they will add things like, "you must remain obedient to he end" and all kinds of other requirements. They refuse to accept that Jesus did everything necessary to save everyone who believes in Him for the forgiveness of their sin.

And that's when you find out they are not Christians because they do not trust in the atonement of the LORD Jesus Christ to pay the penalty for all their sins... They believe that salvation is secured by being obedient to the laws of God to the end.. Something that no human being can be ""obedient to the end"".. Along with all the other works based requirements they wrongly add to maintain their own salvation status..

I believe it goes even further than that, I believe God chose to save a certain number of people before He created the world.

Of course Because He foreknew who would be accepting His way of salvation and who would be rejecting it..

Not just a group called the Church, but individuals who He knew before they were born.

People who accept the Way of salvation automatically enter into the body of believers which is called the church.. They may never belong to a denominational church or even enter into a physical church but they are part of the Spiritual Church of Holy Spirit indwelled people..

So I take God at His Word when He said, that His elect were chosen before He laid the foundations of the world.

So do i. His Word is truth..

 

[Slayer]

And that's when you find out they are not Christians because they do not trust in the atonement of the LORD Jesus Christ to pay the penalty for all their sins... They believe that salvation is secured by being obedient to the laws of God to the end.. Something that no human being can be ""obedient to the end"".. Along with all the other works based requirements they wrongly add to maintain their own salvation status..



Of course Because He foreknew who would be accepting His way of salvation and who would be rejecting it..



People who accept the Way of salvation automatically enter into the body of believers which is called the church.. They may never belong to a denominational church or even enter into a physical church but they are part of the Spiritual Church of Holy Spirit indwelled people..



So do i. His Word is truth..

I agree with everything you said, except for the "He foreknew who would be accepting His way of salvation and who would reject it"

The Reformed Church believes that God is the One who decides to give the gift of salvation to His elect and He leaves the rest in their sin, so they see the Gospel as foolishness.

There are just too many scriptures describing salvation as a gift given by God to His elect, or chosen people. It also supports the belief that God is sovereign over all things, including who He chooses to save

 

[Adstar]

I agree with everything you said, except for the "He foreknew who would be accepting His way of salvation and who would reject it"

The Reformed Church believes that God is the One who decides to give the gift of salvation to His elect and He leaves the rest in their sin, so they see the Gospel as foolishness.

There are just too many scriptures describing salvation as a gift given by God to His elect, or chosen people. It also supports the belief that God is sovereign over all things, including who He chooses to save

Then you are a calvinist.. I am not a calvinist. I believe Believe God predestined people to be conformed to the image of His Son by His foreknowing them from the foundation of the world..

Romans 8: KJV
29 "For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren."

foreknow comes before predestinate..

 

[EmilyFoster]

It’s very difficult to distinguish but I feel it’s not our place to judge. In a Christian congregation if you know people closely you’ll know their lifestyle and what’s in their hearts which reflects in their deeds. But not matter what we’re called to walk in God’s love.

 

[rlm68]

It’s very difficult to distinguish but I feel it’s not our place to judge. In a Christian congregation if you know people closely you’ll know their lifestyle and what’s in their hearts which reflects in their deeds. But not matter what we’re called to walk in God’s love.

Maybe judge is not the correct term here, but to discern someone's spirit is a definite must!!

And yes, in a way discerning someone's spirit is judging them, but it is now within the framework of what's acceptable according to scripture.

 

[Slayer]

Then you are a calvinist.. I am not a calvinist. I believe Believe God predestined people to be conformed to the image of His Son by His foreknowing them from the foundation of the world..

Romans 8: KJV
29 "For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren."

foreknow comes before predestinate..

By quoting Romans 8: shows that you actually agree with us. If He foreknew a person before they were born, it means He had a relationship with the person and He caused him to be born with the seed of faith in him.

If he predestined him to be conformed to the image of His Son means that He planted the ability to believe and obey the Gospel message when he hears it.

All of this supports the view that God chose who He was going to save before they were born, so yes if you believe that you agree with us "Calvinists" as you call us but we call ourselves Bible believing, followers of Christ also known as Christians.

 

[Metternich]

Hmmm. Wondering what qualifies as a "grievous" sin that identifies someone isn't a Christian?

1 Cor 6:9-10
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor sexual perverts, 10 nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God.

 

[mailmandan]

1 Cor 6:9-10
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor sexual perverts, 10 nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God.

Don’t forget verse 11 - And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.

Galatians 5:19 - Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

1 John 3:9 - No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

 

[theanointedsinner]

Don’t forget verse 11 - And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.

Galatians 5:19 - Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

1 John 3:9 - No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

looks very familiar as whatever the message that somehow assured my salvation

therefore, do not judge by mere appearance but make the right judgment

 

[selfdissolving]

How can we distinguish between a true believer and someone who claims to be Christian but are not truly converted.

None of the Disciples knew that Judas was a Devil, they thought he was a true Christian.

There are some who live as true Christians for most of their lives, only to be exposed as false believers by committing some grievous sin that no true believer would commit.

There are also those who became Christians at an older age after living very sinful lives, they also have a strong testimony but we can't be sure that they are genuine either.

I don't think it's possible to distinguish the true believers from the false, only God knows who they are. So I believe we need to treat everyone as brothers and sisters until they prove otherwise.

it's real simple.

1 John 4:15
If anyone acknowledges that Jesus is the Son of God, God lives in them and they in God.

1 Corinthians 12:3
Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, "Jesus be cursed," and no one can say, "Jesus is Lord," except by the Holy Spirit.

 

[theanointedsinner]

it's real simple.

1 John 4:15
If anyone acknowledges that Jesus is the Son of God, God lives in them and they in God.

1 Corinthians 12:3
Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, "Jesus be cursed," and no one can say, "Jesus is Lord," except by the Holy Spirit.

for 1 cor 12:3, you know that people can cut and paste, "Jesus be cursed," "Jesus is Lord," so clearly, that's not what it's talking about

keep in mind that I'm not accusing selfdissolving of anything, instead, I'm trying to clarify something

 

[pjharrison]

How can we distinguish between a true believer and someone who claims to be Christian but are not truly converted.

None of the Disciples knew that Judas was a Devil, they thought he was a true Christian.

There are some who live as true Christians for most of their lives, only to be exposed as false believers by committing some grievous sin that no true believer would commit.

There are also those who became Christians at an older age after living very sinful lives, they also have a strong testimony but we can't be sure that they are genuine either.

I don't think it's possible to distinguish the true believers from the false, only God knows who they are. So I believe we need to treat everyone as brothers and sisters until they prove otherwise.

If you are talking about antichrist, you can test the spirit. If they don't believe that Jesus who is God came in the flesh. That is antichrist. 1 John 4:3 3but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.
Judas was a man deceive and used by the devil. John 13:27 27As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan entered into him. So Jesus told him, "What you are about to do, do quickly."

 

[Kim82]

It is not always possible to tell that is why Jesus said:
Matthew 13:24-30 New King James Version (NKJV)
The Parable of the Wheat and the Tares
24 “The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field; 25 but while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat and went his way. 26 But when the grain had sprouted and produced a crop, then the tares also appeared. 27 So the servants of the owner came and said to him, ‘Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?’ 28 He said to them, ‘An enemy has done this.’ The servants said to him, ‘Do you want us then to go and gather them up?’29 But he said, ‘No, lest while you gather up the tares you also uproot the wheat with them. 30 Let both grow together until the harvest, and at the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, “First gather together the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them, butgather the wheat into my barn.” ’ ”

 

[theanointedsinner]

If you are talking about antichrist, you can test the spirit. If they don't believe that Jesus who is God came in the flesh. That is antichrist. 1 John 4:3 3but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.
Judas was a man deceive and used by the devil. John 13:27 27As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan entered into him. So Jesus told him, "What you are about to do, do quickly."

and here's an example of what not to do

say for example, "should I sin"?
you open the bible randomly like it's "page lottery" or something, and point finger randomly on a page, it can say "What you are about to do, do quickly."

and pursue sin

because, the bible should never be taken out of context

 

[pjharrison]

and here's an example of what not to do

say for example, "should I sin"?
you open the bible randomly like it's "page lottery" or something, and point finger randomly on a page, it can say "What you are about to do, do quickly."

and pursue sin

because, the bible should never be taken out of context

How was that taken out of context?

 

[theanointedsinner]

to the thread title, the better question is, why do we want to be able to identify? is it so we can judge false Christians and be self-righteous about it? that motive is sin

or, to be more careful and hang out with true Christians.

and I believe that even "fake it till you make it" helps, at least they have the desire to "make it"
and since John 6:44 says that no one can come to Jesus unless God draws them
the desire to "make it" comes from God, that God is working in their heart

if they decide to "fake it till they make it" we can pray that God can help them "make it"

 

[pjharrison]

and here's an example of what not to do

say for example, "should I sin"?
you open the bible randomly like it's "page lottery" or something, and point finger randomly on a page, it can say "What you are about to do, do quickly."

and pursue sin

because, the bible should never be taken out of context

to the thread title, the better question is, why do we want to be able to identify? is it so we can judge false Christians and be self-righteous about it? that motive is sin

or, to be more careful and hang out with true Christians.

and I believe that even "fake it till you make it" helps, at least they have the desire to "make it"
and since John 6:44 says that no one can come to Jesus unless God draws them
the desire to "make it" comes from God, that God is working in their heart

if they decide to "fake it till they make it" we can pray that God can help them "make it"

You don't even know what I was posting too.

 

[theanointedsinner]

How was that taken out of context?

I never thought about what it means to take the Bible out of context
maybe explanation is needed

 

[theanointedsinner]

You don't even know what I was posting too.

how can we resolve this confusion?

 

[pjharrison]

how can we resolve this confusion?

You said I posted out of context. The post I read spoke of Judas also.