WOAH, just saw this while driving over here

[posthuman]

I don't see what the problem is

i see a problem:

you just proved what faith is and how it works.
This is written throughout the Bible.
In Mark 11: 24 the Bible says to believe that you have already received something before you have it and then you will have it.
And again it is written in four different places in the New Testament, to him that has, that which he has shall be given to him.
This is exactly how Faith Works.
You ask for or speak to something believing that what you have asked for or spoke to has already been granted or already given, and then it will manifest in the natural, but we are the initiators of that, not God.
God may be the one who prompted us to speak or to act in faith because it's already there in us. But if the faith is not there, for the thing that we desire or ask for, it won't matter what the will of God is, or how much the Spirit moves or prompt the person, nothing will happen because nothing will have been granted or given.
You either have to have it and then it will be given or you have to not have it and then it will be taken away, removed, or eradicated.
Faith is having the thing you are believing for, or not having the thing you reject.
Things are already done in the natural after they are done or given in the spirit world AFTER we pray for or speak to something desired, NOT before.

you spent 3 paragraphs agreeing with what i have been pointing out, then you said this:

The translations are correct

which contradicts what you had just spent all this time saying about faith..
and i've been talking about the implications of the Greek original, but you offer no comment on the subject of what the language says. you expressed an argument of ideas through which you say you're in agreement with me and what i said the Greek itself brings out, but you contradict your own evidence ((which you present only in terms of your own thought, by fiat)) by saying the antithesis is true.

the problem is that you can't accept what is written because you don't believe what is written, even as someone who believes in OSAS rejects scripture that says otherwise, because in their eyes, it just cannot be, and so they reject it.
that is what you are doing with this first because it goes against what you believe and so you have to make it fit your Doctrine.

bigger problem: you go on to falsely accusing me of some kind of completely nebulous, ill-defined and wholly unsubstantiated heresy when all i've been doing is pointing out that the scripture in its original language points to something you spent the first 3 paragraphs of your reply agreeing with.

that doesn't make sense, dude.
you agree with what i'm saying the more literal translation is, you say so, then you say you disagree, and attack me without any foundation for doing so.
what's up with that?

 

[posthuman]

At least posthuman tried to use scripture to prove somebody wrong, albeit incorrectly but nonetheless he used scripture to try to back up what he believes.

i don't think you correctly comprehend what my involvement in this thread has been.

this is the first thing i wrote, directly answering the question in the OP ((what does it mean, His word does not go out from Him and return void?)):

to me it means what God says is 'as good as gospel' haha
He will do all His will. when He says, "let there be" then there is. when He says "I will deliver" He surely delivers. He does not fail
for example as He tells the apostles, what you bind or loose on earth shall have already been bound or loosed in heaven. they do not bind and loose on their own authority or leading. already done by His own word; it is effective!

others - with no evidence other than their opinion - started saying i was abusing and incorrectly quoting Matthew 18:18.
i took pains to point out that the many translations exist which say "shall have already been loosed in heaven" etc -- and pointed to the tense and form of the words in the Greek, in order to defend myself and what i said.

that's it.

i was accused of misquoting scripture, and i've given evidence to the contrary: that i quoted it correctly ((though many modern versions, i believe, don't have this rendered in English well)). there is a nuance in the Greek language here that isn't expressed well in English. i've been talking about the Greek of Matthew 18:18, and no one has engaged that subject at all.

i haven't been talking about doctrine at all. i haven't been trying to 'prove someone wrong' about anything other than the accusation that i mishandled Matthew 18:18 when i alluded to it in my first post on page one.

 

[know1]

It kinda feels like when they hand a statavarious violin to a gorilla.
Indeed...it ain't pretty.
Thank you for your comments.
Truly a breath of fresh air.
I assist a pastor ,or i used to, in a mens bible study. They are all milionaire businessmen. That kinda worked against me. Not whole lot,but anything we did outside the class was tedious because i can not drop $80 on lunch when it's my turn to pay. They agreed to work around it. Well it didn't really pan out well. I CONSTANTLY felt a tension over that. They insisted every time that i go eat with them.
But the major breaking point came when my antichrist frend of 30 years got saved. This was HUGE!!! IT WAS AND STILL IS SURREAL AND DISARMING. I still pinch myself. Well he got saved like me,into a charismatic church.
When he broke and got saved it was at his business and the man annointed him with oil.
When i shared the testimony the Baptists began to mock and lampoon the testimony. I was shocked. I calmly rebuked them.
They got quiet and insisted i retell them. When i got out the first three words 2 of them erupted in uncontrollable laughter. I knew then it was a spirit. I had stirred a unclean spirit.
Without a word,i gathered my notes ( i was teaching that day) walked out and never looked back.
I do not belong with antichrist,mocking antiholyspirit believers.
The epistles were written to Holy Spirit baptised believers by Holy Spirit baptised believers.

Keep in mind that all who say they are Christians are not Christians, even as the Bible says that the seed/tares of the devil or the non-believers would be among the Believers, within the church.
Even Jesus said, not everyone that says to him or calls him Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven, and that you will know them by their fruits, for a corrupt tree cannot produce good fruit, and neither can a good tree produce bad fruit.
I would also like to point out that in order for something to be corrupted it or they had to at first be good. Such as the devil who was at one time good and he became corrupted along with the demons and the sons of God that are written in the Book of Genesis.
The Bible also talks about a person being like the spirit that is in them. Jesus said of the Pharisees that they were of their father the devil and the works of their father they will do, even as the sons of God or the true believers, if I can use that term, will do the works of their father, for as the spirit is in you so are you or so you will become.
Jesus said to the Pharisees that they could not receive the truth because they were of their father the devil.
At the same time I would like to mention that there are varying degrees of corruption within a person. So I believe, not everyone who cannot receive truth is of the devil.

 

[know1]

i see a problem:



you spent 3 paragraphs agreeing with what i have been pointing out, then you said this:



which contradicts what you had just spent all this time saying about faith..
and i've been talking about the implications of the Greek original, but you offer no comment on the subject of what the language says. you expressed an argument of ideas through which you say you're in agreement with me and what i said the Greek itself brings out, but you contradict your own evidence ((which you present only in terms of your own thought, by fiat)) by saying the antithesis is true.



bigger problem: you go on to falsely accusing me of some kind of completely nebulous, ill-defined and wholly unsubstantiated heresy when all i've been doing is pointing out that the scripture in its original language points to something you spent the first 3 paragraphs of your reply agreeing with.

that doesn't make sense, dude.
you agree with what i'm saying the more literal translation is, you say so, then you say you disagree, and attack me without any foundation for doing so.
what's up with that?

I can understand where you think I contradicted myself. If you would permit me to explain myself.
What I agreed with was your interpretation of the words in the scripture. However, what I did not say is that I did not agree with your understanding of the scripture as a whole as to what it is saying.
That is what I disagree with.
Amplified version interprets the scripture the way you believe.
There are many scripture verses interpreted according to our understanding and the way we see other verses and what they are saying. Which could lead to misinterpreting the scripture.
I believe this to be one of those cases in Matthew 18: 18, due to a lack of understanding of how things were in the spirit world.
If we were to interpret the words, shall be loosed, we would have to say that she'll be, is in the future tense, and loosed, is in the past tense, just like it's written and the Greek.
It's still means that it shall be done in the future, not that it has already been done but will be done, even though we use a past tense word after the future tense words.
So what I was saying is that it is already done after we pray for or speak to something that we desire rather than it's already been granted before we even say anything and it's already been pre-approved by God before we even pray.
it's basically saying that we cannot do anything or receive anything or cause anything to happen without the pre-approved will of God.
In other words, if God didn't tell you to do it or prompt you to ask for it then we have no business going there.
Bitstrips the believer of having any Authority to ask for or say anything or to have any authority over anything.
I don't agree with that stance because scripture says contrary.
It would make the scripture that says, death and life is in the power of the tongue... And they shall eat the fruit thereof, obsolete and void of any affect.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

i don't think you correctly comprehend what my involvement in this thread has been.

this is the first thing i wrote, directly answering the question in the OP ((what does it mean, His word does not go out from Him and return void?)):



others - with no evidence other than their opinion - started saying i was abusing and incorrectly quoting Matthew 18:18.
i took pains to point out that the many translations exist which say "shall have already been loosed in heaven" etc -- and pointed to the tense and form of the words in the Greek, in order to defend myself and what i said.

that's it.

i was accused of misquoting scripture, and i've given evidence to the contrary: that i quoted it correctly ((though many modern versions, i believe, don't have this rendered in English well)). there is a nuance in the Greek language here that isn't expressed well in English. i've been talking about the Greek of Matthew 18:18, and no one has engaged that subject at all.

i haven't been talking about doctrine at all. i haven't been trying to 'prove someone wrong' about anything other than the accusation that i mishandled Matthew 18:18 when i alluded to it in my first post on page one.

I don't think it matters. you will be wrong no matter what. you might remember I agreed with your post and responded in my post 89

further, words will be changed as the improbable interpretation is further examined...it will be you who misunderstood (applicable to anyone who does not see this binding thing) and no matter what, an excuse will always be forthcoming

there is nothing whatsoever about binding the devil or demons...Jesus never did it...the disciples never did it and there is no reference to it anywhere in scripture...other than misinterpreting and folks should know that 1 verse does not a doctrine make

so obviously some groups have formed a wrong doctrine around something Jesus said and off we go.

they are free to believe what they want and guess they have not yet noticed the devil et al are still wandering around seeking whom they can devour. not even a little bit bound

but don't let me stop you trying to get them to understand

 

[posthuman]

I don't think it matters. you will be wrong no matter what. you might remember I agreed with your post and responded in my post 89

further, words will be changed as the improbable interpretation is further examined...it will be you who misunderstood (applicable to anyone who does not see this binding thing) and no matter what, an excuse will always be forthcoming

there is nothing whatsoever about binding the devil or demons...Jesus never did it...the disciples never did it and there is no reference to it anywhere in scripture...other than misinterpreting and folks should know that 1 verse does not a doctrine make

so obviously some groups have formed a wrong doctrine around something Jesus said and off we go.

they are free to believe what they want and guess they have not yet noticed the devil et al are still wandering around seeking whom they can devour. not even a little bit bound

but don't let me stop you trying to get them to understand

Thanks

all i know of in scripture is that Satan is bound in the bottomless pit for a thousand years and that others are held in chains since the days of Noah. Jesus cast demons out, not bound them. but I really haven't commented on any doctrine in this thread, and don't really mean to.

 

[know1]

I always wondered what was meant by " my wordd will not RETURN void.
This was just answered from heaven as i was praying and driving.
It has to do with definitive authoritive prayer,as in praying for a need or someones healing. ( maybe anything for that matter)

When you or i invoke scripture, as i was in healing prayer for a man i passed by, those verses are sent to heaven, or sent BACK to heaven.
They are returning to the giver.
The results are immediately set in motion.
Man o man. It was a no brainer all along

Your thoughts?

I just came across another first in the Bible surname your prayers returning to you and not the. Or returning to the sender and not to God.
It's in Psalms 35 verse 13 at the end of that verse it said that his prayers return to his own bosom.
I haven't studied that verse earlier prayers for words at all but it just looks like it backs up what I said earlier concerning your prayers or words returning to you, the sender, rather than back to God, that's all.

 

[know1]

I just came across another first in the Bible surname your prayers returning to you and not the. Or returning to the sender and not to God.
It's in Psalms 35 verse 13 at the end of that verse it said that his prayers return to his own bosom.
I haven't studied that verse earlier prayers for words at all but it just looks like it backs up what I said earlier concerning your prayers or words returning to you, the sender, rather than back to God, that's all.

Sorry about that, I did that from my phone and I don't know what I said.
basically what I was saying is that even though I don't know exactly what that is saying because I haven't studied it I found it interesting and it just seems like it's saying the same thing, that I stated earlier about the prayers returning to the sender.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Thanks

all i know of in scripture is that Satan is bound in the bottomless pit for a thousand years and that others are held in chains since the days of Noah. Jesus cast demons out, not bound them. but I really haven't commented on any doctrine in this thread, and don't really mean to.

right

that would not be a human putting the devil in the pit

and yes...Jesus cast them out...which I would think is better than leaving them there, bound and fuming

as for myself, I got in trouble just by noting that Isaiah 55 was a reference to GOD's word not returning to Him void

the whole thing went south pretty quickly

 

[garee]

You can set the bar higher. It is up to each believer to choose the level of victory and power to walk and live in.

Its up to Him who is of one mind and always does whatsoever his soul desires. We have the privilege of prayer in respect to these bodies of death nothing more .