12 Signs You Are A Modern-Day Pharisee

[7seasrekeyed]

He defended Jesus against the other thief, which was an act of faith. An act. An action. He also recognized Jesus as divine, displayed a belief in God and repented while suffering excruciating pain. It seems like he did a few thhings.


The parable of the sheep and goats. It doesn't get more clearer than that. Nowhere does Jesus say in that parable that the "goats" were sentenced to hell because they didn't believe in Him. Also the parable of the rich man and Lazarus.

"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven." (Matthew 7:21)

I'm skeptical about the interpretation of his writings.


I find it impossible to take the entire Bible into consideration, as (in my opinion) it contains contradictory verses.

tell you what Lucien

before I respond to what you wrote, please explain what you mean by saying in your profile that you were 'born a Christian'

how do you understand salvation if you believe you were born and already a Christian?

 

[7seasrekeyed]

"Ralph-, post: 3700022, member: 259903"

I explained it this way:

"...the Modern day Pharisee is the one who abuses grace in the same way that the Pharisees of old abused the law."

The point being, as I said, they do that to justify their sinful lives and to give the appearance of being right with God. One glorifies the greatness of the law while abusing it. The other glorifying the greatness of grace while abusing it.

what? this is not the same. there are still people who abuse the law the same way they did 2000 years ago



The point is, this is hardly the problem with the church today. The far, far larger problem in the church today is the abuse of grace.

while I agree people misunderstand and are taught badly and think grace is some kind of elastic that just snaps 'em back into place no matter what, I think you are comparing apples to oranges as the saying goes

to sum up, I would understand that a Pharisee of any age, are those who look down their snoots at others and fancy themselves better (from my other post)

And you think grace people do not ever do this in feigned humility?

no. I do not think 'grace people', as you put it, feign humility. I find those who confuse the 'good' works we are created in Christ Jesus to do, as 'proof' of salvation and are far more likely to look down on others

I've seen this in this very forum over and over

being a Pharisee is something different than feigned humility. I also do not understand how you think a person can abuse grace.

You can never abuse the grace of God. if you can abuse it, that would mean you never loose it .( rhyme not intended)

you either have it or you do not. our sin cannot abuse God's grace. His grace is available to us each and every time we sin

His grace does not change. if someone is not really saved, God is well aware of it. I don't think it's something we need to worry about other than praying for a person like that

 

[Ralph-]

what? this is not the same. there are still people who abuse the law the same way they did 2000 years ago

Of course there are. What I said was they are few in number. Very few in number relative to the vast number of people in the church.

The big problem in the church today is not Christians trying to earn salvation by works. Good grief, all you have to do is look around you and see that Christians are definitely not noted for being careful to do the righteous works of the law because they think that's how they are made righteous before God.

while I agree people misunderstand and are taught badly and think grace is some kind of elastic that just snaps 'em back into place no matter what, I think you are comparing apples to oranges as the saying goes

It's okay. If you don't get it, you don't get it.

Today's corrupted grace teachings no more guide people into obedience to God than the corrupted law teachings of the Pharisees guided people into obedience to God. Though each give the appearance of having done so. Today's Pharisees ruling the (Protestant) church are just as hypocritical as the Pharisees of old were, and are just as sure they are pleasing to God, despite their hypocrisy as the old Pharisees were.

to sum up, I would understand that a Pharisee of any age, are those who look down their snoots at others and fancy themselves better (from my other post)

You have noticed the hateful, condescending posts coming from some people in this forum towards others who they feel are teaching the works gospel, haven't you? Paul was obviously aware of how Christians who stand by faith can become arrogant in their status by the fact he warned us not to be:

"20Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear "-Romans 11:20

How you treat those who are not in the Tree indicates how humble and not conceited you are in your privileged place in the Tree.

I also do not understand how you think a person can abuse grace.

Without addressing the issue of 'once saved always saved', it's clear t hat anyone who says a believer is able to live the sinful life of an unbeliever if they want and grace will cover it is indeed abusing grace.

You can never abuse the grace of God.

Yes, you can. Even if you or someone else wants to insist 'sanctified' in Hebrews 10:29 is referring to unsaved people, the author is making it abundantly clear that a person can indeed 'insult the Spirit of grace'.

if you can abuse it, that would mean you never loose it .( rhyme not intended)

Hey, you're a poet and don't realize that!

But, yes, that is the (false) argument. But let's just stick to the fact that, yes, one can abuse the Spirit of grace and let's not delve into the nether regions of 'once saved always saved'. Grace abounds, but it does have it's limit. It's not as hyper-extendable as more and more Christians in the church are insisting.

you either have it or you do not. our sin cannot abuse God's grace. His grace is available to us each and every time we sin

That's not true. Grace is not available for blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. That's the one thing grace can not be hyper-extended to cover. A person may think that grace will always abound more and more in the face of abounding sin but Jesus made it clear that it won't abound all the more over the sin of blasphemy of the Spirit.

 

[Zmouth]

4.) You don’t repent of sin…you don’t have any “serious” sin to repent of. ( hesrd this more than once )

Do you believe all men are created equal?

7.) Your salvation is based on your works, not on Jesus.

Blessed is the man unto whom the LORD imputeth not iniquity, and in whose spirit there is no guile. Ps 32:2

 

[garee]

But, yes, that is the (false) argument. But let's just stick to the fact that, yes, one can abuse the Spirit of grace and let's not delve into the nether regions of 'once saved always saved'. Grace abounds, but it does have it's limit. It's not as hyper-extendable as more and more Christians in the church are insisting.

What kind of limit?

Every time a person sins in unbelief(no faith) they abuse the confidence they do have. He informs us he will work it out in us to end just liken as he began in the beginning .Our fellowship is with the good news not our fleshly works

For your fellowship in the gospel from the first day until now; Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ: Philippians 1:5-6

Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure. Do all things without murmurings and disputings: Philippians 1:12-14

Those who insist it is not fair that His love works differently in others should stop complaining about hyper grace .He will not forget the love that others they have shown before His name.

Everyone gets the same reward "eternal life". The former things will not be remeberered or ever come to mind to those who are keeping score.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Of course there are. What I said was they are few in number. Very few in number relative to the vast number of people in the church.

The big problem in the church today is not Christians trying to earn salvation by works. Good grief, all you have to do is look around you and see that Christians are definitely not noted for being careful to do the righteous works of the law because they think that's how they are made righteous before God.



It's okay. If you don't get it, you don't get it.

Today's corrupted grace teachings no more guide people into obedience to God than the corrupted law teachings of the Pharisees guided people into obedience to God. Though each give the appearance of having done so. Today's Pharisees ruling the (Protestant) church are just as hypocritical as the Pharisees of old were, and are just as sure they are pleasing to God, despite their hypocrisy as the old Pharisees were.



You have noticed the hateful, condescending posts coming from some people in this forum towards others who they feel are teaching the works gospel, haven't you? Paul was obviously aware of how Christians who stand by faith can become arrogant in their status by the fact he warned us not to be:

"20Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear "-Romans 11:20

How you treat those who are not in the Tree indicates how humble and not conceited you are in your privileged place in the Tree.




Without addressing the issue of 'once saved always saved', it's clear t hat anyone who says a believer is able to live the sinful life of an unbeliever if they want and grace will cover it is indeed abusing grace.



Yes, you can. Even if you or someone else wants to insist 'sanctified' in Hebrews 10:29 is referring to unsaved people, the author is making it abundantly clear that a person can indeed 'insult the Spirit of grace'.



Hey, you're a poet and don't realize that!

But, yes, that is the (false) argument. But let's just stick to the fact that, yes, one can abuse the Spirit of grace and let's not delve into the nether regions of 'once saved always saved'. Grace abounds, but it does have it's limit. It's not as hyper-extendable as more and more Christians in the church are insisting.



That's not true. Grace is not available for blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. That's the one thing grace can not be hyper-extended to cover. A person may think that grace will always abound more and more in the face of abounding sin but Jesus made it clear that it won't abound all the more over the sin of blasphemy of the Spirit.

did you misunderstand what I wrote?

well yes you did!

know why?

that would be because you have an agenda against OSAS which I did not mention but you have tried to insert vigoursly until you were told not to

since you messed up what I wrote so badly, let me give you some advice.

stop trying to filter what other people say through the lens of your war against OSAS

and telling someone if they do not undertand that is ok?

dude. You just EXEMPLIFIED the pharisee spirit right there! that comment is dismissive and you indicate that only those who really get it...I mean really really get it...can understand what YOU are saying. that's how you come across

you truly do not understand the grace of God and that is indicated by what you said above. I NEVER EVER said a thing about God's grace being extended to those who are not saved but you add to that and bring up 'the unpardonable sin'

maybe you have a sin mindset instead of a grace mindset?

I said that the grace of God cannot be abused. and that is a TRUE statement. God does not change. He is immutable. that, means His grace does not change either

human beings change. which is why that grace is extended in the first place

and then you come up with this:

That's not true. Grace is not available for blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. That's the one thing grace can not be hyper-extended to cover. A person may think that grace will always abound more and more in the face of abounding sin but Jesus made it clear that it won't abound all the more over the sin of blasphemy of the Spirit

you just love to use that word hyper, eh? I did not even hint at the remarks you make in that quote above and the way you lean, I don't think further remarks will be useful since you have an agenda and I do not

 

[Ralph-]

What kind of limit?

Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

You can be guilty of a lot of things in this life and it won't matter in the end. Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit ain't one of them.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

You can be guilty of a lot of things in this life and it won't matter in the end. Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit ain't one of them.

the op says nothing about that.

that is a different subject

you are back on your OSAS kick again

you were told to stop

 

[Ralph-]

did you misunderstand what I wrote?

well yes you did!

know why?

that would be because you have an agenda against OSAS which I did not mention but you have tried to insert vigoursly until you were told not to

Are you a psycho?
You started it, lol:

You can never abuse the grace of God. if you can abuse it, that would mean you never loose it .

 

[Ralph-]

the op says nothing about that.

that is a different subject

you are back on your OSAS kick again

you were told to stop

No, you're hearing it that way.

Saved or unsaved, blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is unforgivable. The grace of God doesn't go there. OSAS is irrelvant to this.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

CS1:

OSAS is not the context of this please leave the post context to what it is. Thank you

after you replied to Lucien

 

[Ralph-]

did you misunderstand what I wrote?

well yes you did!

know why?

that would be because you have an agenda against OSAS which I did not mention but you have tried to insert vigoursly until you were told not to

since you messed up what I wrote so badly, let me give you some advice.

stop trying to filter what other people say through the lens of your war against OSAS

and telling someone if they do not undertand that is ok?

dude. You just EXEMPLIFIED the pharisee spirit right there! that comment is dismissive and you indicate that only those who really get it...I mean really really get it...can understand what YOU are saying. that's how you come across

you truly do not understand the grace of God and that is indicated by what you said above. I NEVER EVER said a thing about God's grace being extended to those who are not saved but you add to that and bring up 'the unpardonable sin'

maybe you have a sin mindset instead of a grace mindset?

I said that the grace of God cannot be abused. and that is a TRUE statement. God does not change. He is immutable. that, means His grace does not change either

human beings change. which is why that grace is extended in the first place

and then you come up with this:



you just love to use that word hyper, eh? I did not even hint at the remarks you make in that quote above and the way you lean, I don't think further remarks will be useful since you have an agenda and I do not

This post is exactly why I'm afraid to go back to church and be around church folk again.

 

[CS1]

Do you believe all men are created equal?



Blessed is the man unto whom the LORD imputeth not iniquity, and in whose spirit there is no guile. Ps 32:2

Yes, all men were created equal. The issue now is the fall of man was not what God created man for. so all are equally sinners. Ps 32:2 is not to be seen as the state of being of all but of those who have repented. Your point is what?

 

[CS1]

This post is exactly why I'm afraid to go back to church and be around church folk again.

if you are afraid to be around people who do not understand you or you do not understand them. Maybe the issue is you.

 

[CS1]

the op says nothing about that.

that is a different subject

you are back on your OSAS kick again

you were told to stop[/QU

Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

You can be guilty of a lot of things in this life and it won't matter in the end. Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit ain't one of them.

you do not understand "Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit ". One of the most misunderstood things Jesus spoke about.

Yet those most of the time overlook That Jesus was the only one who said this. And who He was speaking to, the Pharisees which bring it back to the original post, "12 signs you are a modern-day Pharisees". Matthew 23 sum's it up for us. it is those who call themselves of Christ who blasphemy.

Anything they do not agree with Biblically they insult, attack, mock, scoff, and belittle. When a good report of what is praiseworthy, they doubt it and need more proof. Because they did not see; it did not happen even more doubting than Thomas. They look to dis-prove over having faith in. For example, If a doctor says it was a miracle (an unexplained event did supernaturally) They seek to find if the person believed what they do before accepting. The bible is full of them.

Jesus forgave sin's and said that Pharisees attacked him
The blind man from birth healed Pharisees attacked him and intimidated parents kicked him out of the synagogue
Healed on the Sabbath Pharisees blew a gasket
ministered to drunks, prostitutes, crooks, they judge Him

and so much more they did.

Vipers, full of dead men's bones, fake hypocrites. Have a form of godliness but deny when God has done something. it is Pharisees who blaspheme the Holy Spirit.

Then try to make sinners think they did so they can not come to the saving knowledge of Christ. Don't believe them Read Matthew chapter 12 read the whole thing then focus on verses 22-39 It was the Pharisees Jesus was speaking to because it was the Pharisees who were blaspheming not the sinner; the self-righteous were.


Read Matthew Chapter 23 IN the NLT Who is Jesus speaking to when he called them hypocrites?

Who was Jesus speaking to when he said Vipers, polished on the outside but inside you are evil sick and twisted. and don't forget about the Scribes too. You who have studied the law and see God and know what He has done, yet will not see God doing it today.

it is the Pharisees that is the issue and it is this kind today that is the issue too. Praise God The Lord will deal with these half-baked cakes. The Woe has been said over 200 years ago to them and to those today. And yes they are here in CC too.

most of them fear church and make foolish statements about the people in the church and why they don't do anymore. That is a lie.
They don't go to Church today because :

they are self-righteous
Prideful
and most can't stand them in the church because they are the ones who cause divisions in the body.
They don't go to church because those who are learned put them in their place and they don't like it.

they prey on the new believers

they deny the move of God and they think God has called them to make the wrong right but get angry when they will not hear them.

they are unteachable, think they are untouchable and ungrateful

Woe to those modern-day hypocrites.

 

[Ralph-]

if you are afraid to be around people who do not understand you or you do not understand them. Maybe the issue is you.

Her not understanding was not the problem, lol.

 

[Ralph-]

put them in their place and they don't like it.

That is what happened. Although I had no intention of 'putting her in her place' I responded with scripture to what she posted (this is a forum to do that) and she, as you say, 'blew a gasket'.

Virtually everything you wrote describes the modern day Pharisee who tramples grace like the old Pharisee trampled the law. God help you when you get one of them mad at you. And I mean that. Case in point.

 

[Ralph-]

you do not understand "Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit ". One of the most misunderstood things Jesus spoke about.

I'm glad you made the connection that Jesus spoke about this in regard to the Pharisees of his day.

They knew they were rejecting the Holy Spirit, yet they did it anyway. Jesus calls that blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. That's what people today are doing who trample on the grace of God, insulting it, but who claim it's impossible to abuse grace because grace covers ALL things, even the sin of rejecting grace. No, Jesus was very clear about that. Grace is NOT going to cover that. Grace does not go everywhere. It does in fact have a line that it will NOT cross.

We don't even need to talk about it's implications to OSAS (which I'm not) to know that Christ clearly and plainly said that is unforgivable. You can not abuse grace and think it will cover that sin. No it will not. Yet, I am told, even scolded, over and over that yes it will because it's impossible to abuse grace. That's the spirit of the new Pharisee in the church.

 

[Ralph-]

Pharisee of Jesus' day: The person who gets murderously mad at you when you say that they are outside of the boundaries of the law they say they cherish so much but do not live by.

Pharisee of our day: The person who gets murderously mad at you when you say that they are outside the boundaries of the grace they say they cherish so much but do not live by.


Sorry, folks, if any of you are offended by that, but I calls them as I sees them. There's a truth movement going on in the world today and I'd like to see it happen in the church. Time to call a spade a spade.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

again, no one can abuse God's grace because God is immutable

God does not change. therefore, His grace remains THE SAME

that is why His grace is enough for little sins and the big whopper sins

sin is the level playing field that creates equality before God

God's grace is the ultimate 'fix' that creates equality before Him

no one earns it, no one keeps it and no one is more saved than another

this is what you stumble on Ralph because you are seeing through the lens of your impossible assertions that the grace of God is somehow affected by our sin. His grace is ALWAYS there and it does not change. It is always available and always enough to cover any sin, otherwise Jesus would have to die over and over and over again

are you able to understand what I am saying here or are you going to attempt to create a false impression of me by saying 'I blew a gasket' ?

what we do with grace is accept or not. we cannot even 'keep' ourselves saved. we are saved by the grace of God and He is our Father from there on out and He cares for His children...even those who constantly quibble over issues that are salvation 101

nothing I have said from this post and back, indicates in any way shape or form, that I think or that anyone should think, they now have license to sin

if God does not extend His grace to those outside of His family, then how can you say a human can abuse His grace?

if His grace is sufficient for all of us all the time, then that is what He had in mind to begin with

perhaps clear your mind of seeing sin as a stumbling block for God. He does not have that problem

if we sin, we go to God and He forgives us. we separate ourselves from God. no one who has ever EVER trusted in Him has been turned away by Him

the disobedient are not those who are the sons and daughters. and that does not mean people never struggle with sin if they are believers because quite the opposite is true. that is when we need to remember who the accuser is and take it all to God who is faithful and just and forgives