Not By Works

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Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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New International Version 1984 Romans 2:1-11 God’s Righteous Judgment You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge the other, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things.
Perhaps a mirror would help?

 

Endoscopy

Senior Member
Oct 13, 2017
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HOW ABOUT SAYING JESUS "WAS CURSED? IS THAT TOLERABLE TO "OSAS" ALL- KNOWING SCHOLARS?
Here you go. Refute Jesus. KJV NIV and AMPC.

John 10 KJV
24 Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly.
25 Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.
26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
30 I and my Father are one.

31 Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him.
32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?

John 10 NIV
24 The Jews who were there gathered around him, saying, “How long will you keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly.”
25 Jesus answered, “I did tell you, but you do not believe. The works I do in my Father’s name testify about me, 26 but you do not believe because you are not my sheep. 27 My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. 28 I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. 30 I and the Father are one.”
31 Again his Jewish opponents picked up stones to stone him, 32 but Jesus said to them, “I have shown you many good works from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?”

John 10 AMPC
24 So the Jews surrounded Him and began asking Him, How long are You going to keep us in doubt and suspense? If You are really the Christ (the Messiah), tell us so plainly and openly.
25 Jesus answered them, I have told you so, yet you do not believe Me [you do not trust Me and rely on Me]. The very works that I do by the power of My Father and in My Father’s name bear witness concerning Me [they are My credentials and evidence in support of Me].
26 But you do not believe and trust and rely on Me because you do not belong to My fold [you are no sheep of Mine].
27 The sheep that are My own hear and are listening to My voice; and I know them, and they follow Me.
28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never lose it or perish throughout the ages. [To all eternity they shall never by any means be destroyed.] And no one is able to snatch them out of My hand.
29 My Father, Who has given them to Me, is greater and mightier than all [else]; and no one is able to snatch [them] out of the Father’s hand.
30 I and the Father are One.

31 Again the Jews brought up stones to stone Him.
32 Jesus said to them, My Father has enabled Me to do many good deeds. [I have shown many acts of mercy in your presence.] For which of these do you mean to stone Me?
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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That Came from galatians and Duetronomy; ...cursed is any man who hangs from a tree KJV or pole NIV. He took upon himself our curse. Look it up.
He has been raging on that point for months... he is not about to give it up just yet ;)
 

Seohce

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2016
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Is that what Moses and Paul were? :rolleyes:
DO YOU ALSO DECLARE JESUS "WAS CURSED?

MOSES AND PAUL DID NOT SAY THAT JESUS "WAS CURSED.

New International Version 1984 Mark 3:28-29 I tell you the truth, all the sins and blasphemies of men will be forgiven them. But whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of an eternal sin.”

New International Version 1984 Revelation 21:8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
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DO YOU ALSO DECLARE JESUS "WAS CURSED?

MOSES AND PAUL DID NOT SAY THAT JESUS "WAS CURSED.

New International Version 1984 Mark 3:28-29 I tell you the truth, all the sins and blasphemies of men will be forgiven them. But whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of an eternal sin.”

New International Version 1984 Revelation 21:8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”
How quickly you forget :eek: I have quoted the exact Scriptures to you... as have others.
 

Seohce

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2016
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Perhaps a mirror would help?

New International Version 1984 James 1:19-27 Listening and Doing My dear brothers, take note of this: Everyone should be quick to listen, slow to speak and slow to become angry, for man’s anger does not bring about the righteous life that God desires. Therefore, get rid of all moral filth and the evil that is so prevalent and humbly accept the word planted in you, which can save you. Do not merely listen to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says. Anyone who listens to the word but does not do what it says is like a man who looks at his face in a mirror and, after looking at himself, goes away and immediately forgets what he looks like. But the man who looks intently into the perfect law that gives freedom, and continues to do this, not forgetting what he has heard, but doing it—he will be blessed in what he does. If anyone considers himself religious and yet does not keep a tight rein on his tongue, he deceives himself and his religion is worthless. Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.
 

Jewel5712

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2018
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As I told you before
Refute it biblically. Your asinine comments about me don't refute what the Apostles Creed doctrinal statement stays. Start refuting or shut up about it. Your assertion about the Catholic Church is ignoring history. The Catholic Church started much later. The catholic church was from the apostles. Do you understand the difference between the two? Obviously not. You are Bible only and ignore Christian history. You put on your blinders too often and pontificate wrong facts.
.
I MUST say a lot of catholics are so steeped in the HISTORY and traditions especially of the OT..they dont acknowlege the NT..you DONT need to go through a prirst for confessionn forgiveness etc..Jesus death made AWAY with that...but catholics wont budge because.."thats the way its ALWAYS been done..TRADITION" ..
 

TruthTalk

Senior Member
Jul 17, 2017
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Lately, I have realized that we as a generation tend to struggle with being lazy temporally and spiritually. Me included. We all like the idea of sitting back and handing the reins to Jesus Christ, but I wonder how efficient that is when we lay down and refuse the need to do anything. If we really believe in Jesus Christ, shouldn’t we do the things (works) that he commands us to do? (John 8:39) Then isn’t it both by grace and by works that we find the happiness of a Christ-like life? Works don’t save us in themselves, but they invite His grace to change us into happier, better people.

I love these ideas:

“A God who makes no demands is the functional equivalent of a God who does not exist.”

The story is told of a man who simply would not work. He wanted to be taken care of in every need. To his way of thinking, the Church or the government, or both, owed him a living because he had paid his taxes and his tithing. He had nothing to eat but refused to work to care for himself. Out of desperation and disgust, those who had tried to help him decided that since he would not lift a finger to sustain himself, they might as well just take him to the cemetery and let him pass on. On the way to the cemetery, one man said, “We can’t do this. I have some corn I will give him.”
So they explained this to the man, and he asked, “Have the husks been removed?”
They responded, “No.”
“Well, then,” he said, “drive on.”
...
I am under no illusion that this can be achieved by our own efforts alone without (Jesus’s) very substantial and constant help. “We know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do.” And we do not need to achieve some minimum level of capacity or goodness before God will help--divine aid can be ours every hour of every day, no matter where we are in the path of obedience. But I know that beyond desiring His help, we must exert ourselves, repent, and choose God for Him to be able to act in our lives consistent with justice and moral agency. My plea is simply to take responsibility and go to work so that there is something for God to help us with.

Todd Christofferson
Hi Lovingothers, and welcome to Christianchat.com. You are correct we are saved by grace not by works lest anyone should boast. If you are a member of a rock solid bible teaching Church I do not think you will find many people are sitting around doing nothing like the fictitious guy in your sermon on idleness is doing.

If you have people like that in your body of believers I would speak to the lazy guy and show him what the bible teaches about Christians "who will not work for their food." Personally I know our Pastor will not hand out money to just any body who ask's for money. First he will want to know if they are able to work and are not disabled.

Your fictitious story about the lazy guy just does not seem likeit is a true life event to me.

2 Thessalonians 3:10-15
10)
For even when we were with you, "we gave you this rule": The one who is unwilling to work shall not eat.”
11)
We hear that some among you are idle and disruptive. They are not busy; they are busybodies. 12) Such people we command and urge in the Lord Jesus Christ to settle down and earn the food they eat. 13) And as for you, brothers and sisters, never tire of doing what is good. 14Take special note of anyone who does not obey our instruction in this letter. Do not associate with them, in order that they may feel ashamed. 15Yet do not regard them as an enemy, but warn them as you would a fellow believer.
 

Jewel5712

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2018
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ROFLMAO
Pot calling the kettle black. That description fits you to a T. Never ever have you Biblically proven the Apostles Creed wrong but rant and rave about it without showing cause. You ignore the historical setting for the need for it. You act like everybody in the time it was written had a Bible like today. I have several times over the past times have asked you for refutation and never ever have you given it. When are you going to provide it. Keep in mind every church has a doctrinal statement. The Apostles Creed is a statement of doctrine. Ask your pastor about the one for your church. That is if you go to church to hear a mere man preach the gospel.
Hey..CS1 IS 'Mr Pot"...:(
 

Jewel5712

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2018
4,091
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Hilarious.....Jesus went to hell....<--another false Catholic dogma.....He went to Abraham's BOSOM A.K.A. paradise.....not HELL.....the following scripture is speaking of the GRAVE not HELL PROPER....one errors of the peddle Catholic creed!!!

For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption
Sorry d..a little late to the game..what are you quoting?
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
60,322
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DOES IT SAY THAT JESUS "WAS CURSED?
They both say, cursed is anyone who hangs on a tree. "Tree" is another word used for cross, as in, cursed is anyone who is crucified on a cross. Do you believe Jesus was crucified on a cross? It is a rather central tenet in Christian beliefs. So central, in fact, that a cross symbolizes Christianity, and many people around the world recognize it as such. Is Jesus a nobody to you?
 

Seohce

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2016
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They both say, cursed is anyone who hangs on a tree. "Tree" is another word used for cross, as in, cursed is anyone who is crucified on a cross. Do you believe Jesus was crucified on a cross? It is a rather central tenet in Christian beliefs. So central, in fact, that a cross symbolizes Christianity, and many people around the world recognize it as such. Is Jesus a nobody to you?
YOU'RE NO DIFFERENT THAN THOSE WHO CRUCIFIED HIM.

CAN YOU PROVIDE SCRIPTURES THAT SAYS JESUS WAS “CURSED" ASIDE FROM PAUL’S? I DON’T MEAN THAT HE HIMSELF CALLED JESUS “CURSED" BUT ONLY THOSE WHO TEACH A GOSPEL OF ANOTHER KIND WHICH IS NO GOSPEL AT ALL.

Galatians 1:8-9 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!

WHATEVER THE LAW SAYS IT SAYS TO THOSE WHO ARE UNDER THE LAW.(rom 3:19). IT WAS CREATED BY GOD FOR MAN AND NOT FOR HIMSELF.

1 Timothy 1:9-11 We also know that LAW IS MADE NOT FOR THE RIGHTEOUS but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious; for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, for adulterers and perverts, for slave traders and LIARS and perjurers—and for whatever else is CONTRARY TO THE SOUND DOCTRINE that conforms to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which he entrusted to me.

OUR LORD DID NOT CONSIDER HIMSELF UNDER THE LAW WHEN HE SAID;

John 15:25 But this is to fulfill what is written in THEIR Law: ‘They hated me without reason.’

THE CURSE OF THE LAW IS “DEATH".

1 Corinthians 15:55-57 “Where, O death, is your victory? Where, O death, is your sting?” The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law. But thanks be to God! He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

“BY BECOMING A CURSE FOR US" MEANS “ BY DYING FOR US" SINCE THE CURSE OF THE LAW IS “DEATH”, AND THE GOSPEL CLEARLY SAYS THAT CHRIST DIED FOR THE FORGIVENESS OF SINS(JUSTIFICATION).

NOWHERE IN THE GOSPEL OF CHRIST TELLS US THAT “HE WAS CURSED” FOR THE FORGIVENESS OF SINS.

JESUS IS THE “WORD THAT BECAME FLESH" AND THAT WORD IS GOD.(john 1:1-3 & 14) GOD IS THE SUPREME BEING AND AUTHORITY, THE ALMIGHTY LIVING GOD, THE CREATOR, LAW GIVER AND THE JUDGE(james 4:12) AND NO ONE CAN JUDGE OR CURSE HIM OR CALL HIM “CURSED".

Galatians 3:10,13 All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who DOES NOT CONTINUE TO DO everything written in the Book of the Law.”

“Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law BY BECOMING A CURSE FOR US, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree.”

1 Corinthians 2:10-16 but God has revealed it to us by his Spirit. The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God. For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the man’s spirit within him? In the same way no one knows the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God. We have not received the spirit of the world but the Spirit who is from God, that we may understand what God has freely given us. This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words. The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned. The spiritual man makes judgments about all things, but he himself is not subject to any man’s judgment: “For who has known the mind of the Lord that he may instruct him?” But we have the mind of Christ.

PAUL CLEARLY DESCRIBED WHO ARE THOSE HE CONSIDERED “CURSED”;

Galatians 3:10 All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.”

UNDERSTANDING THE ABOVE VERSE WILL BRING US TO THE CORRECT UNDERSTANDING OF THE FF: VERSE;

Galatians 3:13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree.”

WE SHOULD ALL KNOW THAT THE LORD JESUS IS THE “WORD THAT BECAME FLESH" AND ACCORDING TO JOHN “THE WORD IS GOD". (john 1:1-3 & 14)

GOD IS THE SUPREME BEING AND AUTHORITY WHO CREATED THE LAW FOR MAN AND NOT FOR HIMSELF SO WHAT IS MAN TO CALL HIM “CURSED"?

WHO AMONG BELIEVERS WOULD QUESTION GOD’S VULNERABILITY TO CURSES OR WHATEVER EVIL ACTS AGAINST HIM? ...PETER EXPLAINS IT BETTER;

2 Peter 3:14-18 So then, dear friends, since you are looking forward to this, make every effort to be found spotless, blameless and at peace with him. Bear in mind that our Lord’s patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him. He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are HARD TO UNDERSTAND, which IGNORANT and UNSTABLE people DISTORT, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction. Therefore, dear friends, since you already know this, be on your guard so that you may not be carried away by the ERROR of lawless men and fall from your secure position. But grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and forever! Amen.

1 Timothy 6:3-5 If anyone teaches false doctrines and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching, he is conceited and understands nothing. He has an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions and constant friction between men of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth and who think that godliness is a means to financial gain.

isaiah 5:20-24 Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter. Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes and clever in their own sight. Woe to those who are heroes at drinking wine and champions at mixing drinks, who acquit the guilty for a bribe, but deny justice to the innocent. Therefore, as tongues of fire lick up straw and as dry grass sinks down in the flames, so their roots will decay and their flowers blow away like dust; for THEY HAVE REJECTED THE LAW OF THE LORD ALMIGHTY AND SPURNED THE WORD OF THE HOLY ONE OF ISRAEL.

Hebrews 10:26-29 If we DELIBERATELY keep on sinning after we have received the KNOWLEDGE OF THE TRUTH, no sacrifice for sins is left, but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God. Anyone who rejected the law of Moses died without mercy on the TESTIMONY OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSES. How much more severely do you think a man deserves to be punished who has TRAMPLED THE SON OF GOD under foot, who has TREATED AS AN UNHOLY THING the blood of the covenant that sanctified him, and who has INSULTED THE SPIRIT OF GRACE?


.. GOD CANNOT BE MOCKED…


...LET GOD BE TRUE AND EVERY MAN A LIAR…


John 14:6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and THE TRUTH and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
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I think you can find on google that donald trumps grandpa was a pimp that believed in eugenics and his paw was arrested in times square for being part of an illegal KKK rally.
Which Proves you cannot trust anything from the Fake News Sites, and that you are Gullible.
 

Magenta

Senior Member
Jul 3, 2015
60,322
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YOU'RE NO DIFFERENT THAN THOSE WHO CRUCIFIED HIM.
None of us are... except maybe you ;) In which case, Jesus did not die for you. Now that is sad :(

Then, too, there is this:

New International Version 1984 Romans 2:1-11 God’s Righteous Judgment You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge the other, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things. .