Faith comes by "hearing", "hearing" by the word of God ? You decide .

[Pisteuo]

I read the definition like 6 times. NOWHERE did I see it talk about a court proceeding.

Yes. I believe the faith we have to believe the Gospel comes from God alone. Hearing the Word triggers that faith we were given as a gift into the action of confessing with our mouth, and believing in our heart. At which time we are sealed with the Holy Spirit, who will transform us into the image of Jesus Christ. Oh How I wish this transformation was instantaneous!

So although our Salvation is sealed with the Holy Spirit forever, we still inhabit our dead flesh, and unfortunately, still sin because of not walking in the Spirit every moment of every day.

And again , I'm using the new Strongs expanded .

 

[PennEd]

Ok , so your saying God surrenders our life to Himself " for us " claiming something that is not ours , " for us " ?

Let's continue to play out your understanding . One of the things that must happen in the Salvation journey is the parable of the sower , where 3out of the 4 soils fail . In your understanding , recieving His Spirit at a moment of " believing ," would mean those 3 that fail in the parable of the sower would have the Spirit of Christ in them when they failed . Are you ok with that fact ?

I completely disagree with your interpretation of the parable.

Where does it say the 1st 3 were saved?

I'd also like to ask, when you were physically born, was that a one time event, or a long drawn out process? Why would our Spiritual birth be different?

 

[PennEd]

And again , I'm using the new Strongs expanded .

What does that matter? That is some dudes interpretation just like yours. The definition is what it is.

 

[garee]

Garee , if you read post 43 you understand where I'm coming from . If you don't agree , replace my understanding ( of the beginning of the Salvation journey while Christ is not ours yet ) with a better understanding . Here's the question .

.

Here the answer . If we begin the journey with hearing him as the light unto our path and lamp called the hearing of His faith that works in us to both will and do his good pleasure we will end with the same work of faith. Sometimes Christian can say foolish thing( I know I have plenty) we are not be considered a fool as one that has no faith. They say in their unconverted heart there is no God.

Galatians 3 King James Version (KJV)O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the "hearing of faith"?Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain. He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

 

[Pisteuo]

I completely disagree with your interpretation of the parable.

Where does it say the 1st 3 were saved?

I'd also like to ask, when you were physically born, was that a one time event, or a long drawn out process? Why would our Spiritual birth be different?

I never said the 3 that failed were saved , your understanding implied it . I'm asking you to defend ” your understanding .

 

[Pisteuo]

What does that matter? That is some dudes interpretation just like yours. The definition is what it is.

So we're just talking about interpretationns ?

Then what is your qualifications that would give value to your specific interpretation ?

You know , that would Trump Strongs ?

 

[Pisteuo]

Here the answer . If we begin the journey with hearing him as the light unto our path and lamp called the hearing of His faith that works in us to both will and do his good pleasure we will end with the same work of faith. Sometimes Christian can say foolish thing( I know I have plenty) we are not be considered a fool as one that has no faith. They say in their unconverted heart there is no God.

Galatians 3 King James Version (KJV)O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the "hearing of faith"?Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain. He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

Ok , let me start with saying the " hearing ," I've highlighted in Rom. 10:17 as defined in the Strongs expanded as ( compared to a courtroom hearing ) is not Tobe confused with other kinds of hearing that I understand we do and are capable of .

With that said , at the beginning of the Salvation journey , if God calls us to Christ , He's calling us to Christ , not to His Word . If we" hear " the call , sense the call , we turn in our mind from our way to His way ( repentance ) . We aren't called to " believe " , we are called to faithe , defined in the Vines as " a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender . ."
Pisteuo is an act , based upon abelief , sustained by confidence . So belief is a part of pisteuo , but taken by itself is error and perverts the believing part to God word instead of God Himself .

Do you understand what I'm saying about the Faith that God gives us , the noun pistis ? Verses the faithing we respond with , the verb pisteuo , that was mistranslated as Believe , believer , and believing into the English language ?

 

[PennEd]

I never said the 3 that failed were saved , your understanding implied it . I'm asking you to defend ” your understanding .

Romans 1:16 New King James Version (NKJV)
The Just Live by Faith
16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel [a]of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.


If you do not understand the simplicity of the Gospel, I'd recommend you pray to the Lord for wisdom and discernment. May God grant it to you.

 

[Pisteuo]

Romans 1:16 New King James Version (NKJV)
The Just Live by Faith
16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel [a]of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.


If you do not understand the simplicity of the Gospel, I'd recommend you pray to the Lord for wisdom and discernment. May God grant it to you.

We haven't even come to a point of talking about the Gospel yet . I don't talk about God's Word with anyone , until they can show an understanding of how it would become theirs . In other words how Faith and faithing are applied , that results in a recieving of the Spirit of Christ , making Christ , His word , and His promises in His word out to claim and talk about .

You seem to be giving up on trying to support your understanding of the beginning of the Salvation process.

 

[garee]

Ok , let me start with saying the " hearing ," I've highlighted in Rom. 10:17 as defined in the Strongs expanded as ( compared to a courtroom hearing ) is not Tobe confused with other kinds of hearing that I understand we do and are capable of .

With that said , at the beginning of the Salvation journey , if God calls us to Christ , He's calling us to Christ , not to His Word . If we" hear " the call , sense the call , we turn in our mind from our way to His way ( repentance ) . We aren't called to " believe " , we are called to faithe , defined in the Vines as " a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender . ."
Pisteuo is an act , based upon abelief , sustained by confidence . So belief is a part of pisteuo , but taken by itself is error and perverts the believing part to God word instead of God Himself .

Do you understand what I'm saying about the Faith that God gives us , the noun pistis ? Verses the faithing we respond with , the verb pisteuo , that was mistranslated as Believe , believer , and believing into the English language ?

Christ has sat in the judgemt seat in our stead. No condemnation or second trial for those in Christ. That would be double jeopardy

I understand it as our new faith that accompanies His faith that he freely gives us so that we can believe, as having faith towards Him. We are not saved by our new faith towards Him

Hebrews 6:1 King James Version (KJV) Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,


Hebrews 6:9-10 King James Version (KJV) 9 But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak. For God is not unrighteous to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have shewed toward his name, in that ye have ministered to the saints, and do minister.
beter things accompany salvation.

His faith towards us working in us to both will and do His good pleasure. The horse before the cart.

 

[Pisteuo]

Christ has sat in the judgemt seat in our stead. No condemnation or second trial for those in Christ. That would be double jeopardy

I understand it as our new faith that accompanies His faith that he freely gives us so that we can believe, as having faith towards Him. We are not saved by our new faith towards Him

Hebrews 6:1 King James Version (KJV) Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,


Hebrews 6:9-10 King James Version (KJV) 9 But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak. For God is not unrighteous to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have shewed toward his name, in that ye have ministered to the saints, and do minister.
beter things accompany salvation.

His faith towards us working in us to both will and do His good pleasure. The horse before the cart.

Your understanding is seriously affected by not having a correct understanding of Faith and faithing , pistis and pisteuo . Salvation is by Grace through Faith . Christ's pisteuo did what only He can do " Grace " . Our pisteuo does only what we can do , responding by personally surrendering our lives to Him and living a life inspired by such surrender . Christs Faith doesn't do that for us , Christ's Faith made it possible for us to do that .