The 144,000 named in Revelation
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90%, don't over exaggerate man, as for mouthy you hold the top gun for that on the forum. I see you use this on many on here.
I quote plenty of scripture so that claim is baseless.
16 pegged you right here:
This is what I see from you when someone disagrees with you:
And your above response affirms it.
I quote plenty of scripture so that claim is baseless.
16 pegged you right here:
This is what I see from you when someone disagrees with you:
And your above response affirms it.
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90%, don't over exaggerate man, as for mouthy you hold the top gun for that on the forum. I see you use this on many on here.
I quote plenty of scripture so that claim is baseless.
16 pegged you right here:
This is what I see from you when someone disagrees with you:
And your above response affirms it.
View attachment 191206
I quote plenty of scripture so that claim is baseless.
16 pegged you right here:
This is what I see from you when someone disagrees with you:
And your above response affirms it.
View attachment 191206
Of course I can read - you lost it when I showed you how the Gentiles were not intended in the kings wedding parable - then got further bent out of shape with 16 when he agreed with what I posted going on your "pal" routine from your extensive verbiage library along with mouthy.
You need to mature "pal".
137 results for mouthy.
You need to mature "pal".
137 results for mouthy.
Of course I can read - you lost it when I showed you how the Gentiles were not intended in the kings wedding parable - then got further bent out of shape with 16 when he agreed with what I posted going on your "pal" routine from your extensive verbiage library along with mouthy.
you need to mature "pal".
137 results for mouthy.
View attachment 191211
you need to mature "pal".
137 results for mouthy.
View attachment 191211
I never said the sealing meant they were saved and I don't believe that's what the sealing was for, it for protection.
If you're basing this on the fact that I said the 144000 were the first saved Jews then you are wrong.
I said they were saved because they are the FIRSTFRUITS unto Christ. Firstfruits means the first of something. Firstfruits unto Christ are the FIRST of MANY to come to faith in Christ.
Pay attention to what the bible says about firstfruits unto Christ.
Rom_16:5 Likewise greet the church that is in their house. Salute my wellbeloved Epaenetus, who is the firstfruits of Achaia unto Christ.
If Achaia is throwing you off just remove it.... "who is the firstfruits unto Christ from Achaia".
If you're basing this on the fact that I said the 144000 were the first saved Jews then you are wrong.
I said they were saved because they are the FIRSTFRUITS unto Christ. Firstfruits means the first of something. Firstfruits unto Christ are the FIRST of MANY to come to faith in Christ.
Pay attention to what the bible says about firstfruits unto Christ.
Rom_16:5 Likewise greet the church that is in their house. Salute my wellbeloved Epaenetus, who is the firstfruits of Achaia unto Christ.
If Achaia is throwing you off just remove it.... "who is the firstfruits unto Christ from Achaia".
Listen.....I have studied this every way to Sunday....none of the above is throwing me off.....the word OF and or FROM comes from the same Greek word and both indicate source....YOU are conflating two issues BASED upon ONE WORD enlarged above.....ALL that verse states is that Epaenetus was the first to BE born AGAIN from or of ACHAIA......it has NO bearing on the 144,000 that are SEALED by an angel that ascends from the east/earth to SEAL a group that is ALREADY listed 4 times in HEAVEN.....
a. Why do they need protection is they are already in heaven
b. Show me another example of someone being sealed to protect them from destruction other than salvation
c. I never said you said the sealing was because they were saved
d. I pointed out that the sealing is UNIQUE....WHY does GOD need to have an angel SEAL someone to protect them....did God seal David, Joshua, Caleb, Daniel etc. to protect them?
And see...I am trying to have dialogue and you fire on me....and you guys wonder why I fire back.....
a. Why do they need protection is they are already in heaven
b. Show me another example of someone being sealed to protect them from destruction other than salvation
c. I never said you said the sealing was because they were saved
d. I pointed out that the sealing is UNIQUE....WHY does GOD need to have an angel SEAL someone to protect them....did God seal David, Joshua, Caleb, Daniel etc. to protect them?
And see...I am trying to have dialogue and you fire on me....and you guys wonder why I fire back.....
I personally believe it is symbolic....has nothing to do with protection and or salvation obviously......the reason I say this is because God is very specific in his word and it does NOT give nor imply a reason....and again I point out that you have two angels conversing....ONE is descending to the EARTH to hurt the EARTH and the ANGEL that is ASCENDING from the EAST is ascending to SEAL.....we cannot ignore this fact and the contradiction between the words descending to the earth and ascending from the EAST....nor can we ignore the 4x implication of where they are located.......put together it makes no sense that they are on the earth.....
I'm not firing on you Dcon I just explained my position again in case you didn't understand what I meant. Anyway, moving along.
Rev 7:3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.
There is nothing in chapter 7 that points to the 144000 being in heaven at that time. In fact it clearly shows that are on the earth and are being sealed before wrath is poured out.
The earth is about to be hammered but before it is, the angel seals 144,000 Jews ON EARTH. Why would you think they are in heaven at this point?
Rev 7:3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.
There is nothing in chapter 7 that points to the 144000 being in heaven at that time. In fact it clearly shows that are on the earth and are being sealed before wrath is poured out.
The earth is about to be hammered but before it is, the angel seals 144,000 Jews ON EARTH. Why would you think they are in heaven at this point?
I'm trying to see your point about the ascending and descending angels.... First of all I don't see that in chapter 7 at all. I see four angels STANDING on the earth and another angel ascending from the east. What am I missing?
Rev 7:1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.
Rev 7:2 And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,
Rev 7:3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.
Rev 7:1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.
Rev 7:2 And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,
Rev 7:3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.