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eternally-gratefull
Guest
The origional covenant still stands,
The new replaces the mosaic, not the abrahamic, the abrahamic will stand forever
Ezekiel 37:7
- Thread starter KALYNA18
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The new replaces the mosaic, not the abrahamic, the abrahamic will stand forever
THANK GOD someone knows this
The abrahamic covenant is STILL GOING.
The covenant God made with Noah is also still going. Despite these being in the portion of Scriptures MAN named "OT", they are still going. The MOSAIC covenant is not going today. Thats what the scriptures mean when they say that covenant is "passing away". It did when the temple was destroyed in Ad70
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
Gen 17: I will make you exceedingly fruitful; and I will make nations of you, and kings shall come from you. 7 And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you. 8 Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.”
This is the origional covenant, the new covenant did not replace this covenant, it is still binding.
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
The covenant God made with David is still in affect also, and will be fulfilled completely
I would tell you that just like the law is written upon the hearts of the new covenant believer, so too this covenant is transformed into the covenant made through Jesus. So, we agree but disagree. I do believe God is honoring his promises to Abraham, the same way he is honoring the promises to Israel made through Moses.
Both Abraham and Moses were shown and promised Jesus the Messiah. All covenants and promises lead to him. The promises made to Abraham are fulfilled in the covenant made through Jesus. The prophet Isaiah speaks of the Lord making an everlasting covenant in regards to Israel. Yet, this covenant is not referring to Abraham, nor Moses.
Isaiah 42:6
“I, the Lord, have called you in righteousness; I will take hold of your hand. I will keep you and will make you to be a covenant for the people and a light for the Gentiles,
Isaiah 49:8
[ Restoration of Israel ] This is what the Lord says: “In the time of my favor I will answer you, and in the day of salvation I will help you; I will keep you and will make you to be a covenant for the people, to restore the land and to reassign its desolate inheritances,
Isaiah 61:8
“For I, the Lord, love justice; I hate robbery and wrongdoing. In my faithfulness I will reward my people and make an everlasting covenant with them.
This speaks of Jesus. The covenant is made through Jesus, not Abraham, not Moses. Though the promises of those covenants withstand. Because all covenants lead to and promised their redemption, through Jesus the Messiah.
Humble question. You believe in dual covenant theology?
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
One problem, Israel, is still in sin, and still scattered throughout the world, as she has been since 70 AD. And Jesus is not sitting on Davids throne, in jerusalem, where all the nations come once a year to worship him, and those who do not are punished. And so many other things the OT says about the time of restoration.
There are many covenants, salvation has always been by grace through faith, from the time of Adam until today, no one was saved by obeying the abrahamic covenant, or the mosaic, or davidic or whatever covenant there is. So the term dual covenant theology is misleading,
Remember the old covenant said here is my law, do this or else your cursed. “Cursed is everyone who does not confirm and obey all”
The new covenant says i have done this, so I will write my law in your heart and you will do.
One is a requierment that only christ fulfilled
One is grace that Christ purchased
So, you see many covenant and One form of salvation throughout them. I see one everlasting covenant that speaks throughout time, which transforms to each generation. It calls to each generation through the spoken Words of God. These Words have parallel sides, each speaking the same message to different generations. Others see it as dispensational, you seem to identify with duality. I find those expressions more 2 dimensional. I see God's Word as 3 dimensional reaching through out time.
As far as Israel's restoration. It is my hearts desire and the focus of my ministry. To show the heart God has for Israel and let Christians know that their own salvation will NOT be acquired apart from Israel. God will and does not replace Israel with those from the nations. He is long suffering and waits so that many will not perish. Yet, many mistake his long suffering patience with anger, punishment, and abandonment. This too is a test, to see who will remain 'faithful' to his Word. That ALL will be restored, especially the people of Israel who he loves.
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eternally-gratefull
Guest
No i see different covenants concerning specific things, not related to salvation, and the responsibiliy to interpret the covenants for what they were, not trying to force anyones eternal destiny according to that particular covenant.
I see God gave a nation a promise, in Lev 26 he gave them conditions they must adhere to if they are to enjoy the benefits of that promise, and penalties imposed if they disobey. But even in the end, if the final form of punishment is enacted because of sin, God will still never forget his promise to that nation, and if they repent he will restor them, and return them to the land promised their for-fathers, in fact prophesied this very thing will take place, Ez 37 just being one of those prophecies about restoration.
I also see, if we think God will not keep his promise to them, there is no assurance God will keep any promise to us, which if true, our faith is baseless. In which case, I think replacement theology is dangerous. Not only to Gods character, but to our own faith.
I believe all things relate to Jesus, the salvation of God. Everything in our universe is held together by him and his word. The covenants he made with others reflect the covenant he makes with all. He is the beginning AND the end. And all points in between.
Some examples;
The story of Jacob going to Laban for a wife represents the story of Jesus' first coming. Jacob being Jesus, Laban being unbelieving Israel, and Jacob’s children being the twelve disciples.
After Jacob attains his wives he leaves Laban and is confronted by Esau. After Jesus attains his disciples they leave Israel (go into all the world) and are confronted by unbelieving Israel. (Messianic persecution after Jesus' resurrection at the hands of unbelieving Israel)
When Jacob prepares to meet Esau after Laban represents when Jesus will return to Israel and be confronted by wild Israel. Jacob is returning home to deal with the rift between him and his brother. Jesus comes back to deal with the rift between his followers and unbelieving Israel. Jacob and Esau are restored, just as wild Israel will be restored when Jesus comes back.
Like Moses brought the children of Israel through the baptism of the Red Sea to hear the very words of God spoken from Mt. Sinai.
John brought the children of Israel through the baptism of the Jordan River to hear the very words of God spoken from Yeshua at Mt. Zion.
The Word has parallels throughout time. God's word is everlasting to everlasting. For a believer this is fascinatingly wonderful, yet for the non-believer it's like 'history repeating itself' over and over again. All things lead to Jesus.
This specific passage prophesy to dry bones...
I can see it applying both to the nation of Israel and spiritually to everyone God calls to have his word spoken to...remember when we were lost and without Christ in our lives we were dead in our sins. We were like those dry bones scattered and lifeless.
The picture of them coming together in resurrection is just like our born again moment...we are given a new heart and a new body, we get 'knit together' when we gather together in church gatherings to become the body of Christ.
Another moment this passage recalls, if we go back to Genesis. When God created Adam he made him out of the dust of the earth and he spoke and breathed life into adam. And then later he made Eve out of .adams rib. His BONE. So clearly bones are important...you may not know it, but your skeleton is the frame or vessel of which contains your very soul.
I know this deep down which is why I have a conviction that cremation is wrong for a believer..to burn then grind up a believers bones to a powder/ashes and scatter them to the four winds is not how God would treat his precious creation. That more sounds like what hell is like and the punishment for that is destroying everything even all the bones in fire. Not one bone of Jesus was crushed, even though he was crucified.. So thank God for that.
When we are buried we rest in our bones (the flesh decays away) and then we are raised to life again, the bones will rise and be given new life.
I can see it applying both to the nation of Israel and spiritually to everyone God calls to have his word spoken to...remember when we were lost and without Christ in our lives we were dead in our sins. We were like those dry bones scattered and lifeless.
The picture of them coming together in resurrection is just like our born again moment...we are given a new heart and a new body, we get 'knit together' when we gather together in church gatherings to become the body of Christ.
Another moment this passage recalls, if we go back to Genesis. When God created Adam he made him out of the dust of the earth and he spoke and breathed life into adam. And then later he made Eve out of .adams rib. His BONE. So clearly bones are important...you may not know it, but your skeleton is the frame or vessel of which contains your very soul.
I know this deep down which is why I have a conviction that cremation is wrong for a believer..to burn then grind up a believers bones to a powder/ashes and scatter them to the four winds is not how God would treat his precious creation. That more sounds like what hell is like and the punishment for that is destroying everything even all the bones in fire. Not one bone of Jesus was crushed, even though he was crucified.. So thank God for that.
When we are buried we rest in our bones (the flesh decays away) and then we are raised to life again, the bones will rise and be given new life.
E
eternally-gratefull
Guest
This is all good and well my friend
But prophecy is still prophecy. God gives prophecy to prove he is omniscient and the only true god.
If those prophecies do not come true literally, the purpose is not met, and God is not glorified, because we can make prophecies say or mean prety much whatever we want.