Of course. But in this case the duly noted Saturday Sabbath preserves the infallible integrity of the account.
Good Friday?
- Thread starter Webers.Home
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The Bible does not say saturday is the sabbath. They had no gtegorian calendar so stop insisting on imposing gregorian timeframes on a jewish calendar. Its like people that insist Jesus birthday is actually december 25. Now where does it say in the Bible that its a certain day in december! The jewish people dont observe OUR calendar.
What? Of course the Sabbath just happens to fall on Saturday. Obvious. Of course there was no Gregorian calendar back in that day. Obviously.
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The Saturday sabbath is a red herring.
There was another sabbath that week to go along with Saturday's: the
Passover sabbath. (Ex 12:16, Lev 23:5-8)
Passover sabbath is interesting. The routine sabbath always falls on the very
same day of the week every time. But Passover sabbath floats; hence it can,
and it does, occur on any given day of the week; sometimes even coincident
with the routine sabbath; for example 2018 and 2019, and sometimes
consecutive with the routine sabbath; for example 2008.
It's sometimes objected that whereas Yom Kippur and the Feast of Trumpets
are specifically called sabbaths; the first day of the feast of unleavened
bread isn't. It's set aside for an holy convocation which just simply means a
sacred assembly. But it's also added that no manner of work shall be done
on that day; which is exactly what a sabbath is all about (Gen 2:2-3). In
reality, the objection is just semantic nit picking.
Anyway; John calls that day a sabbath, which pretty much settles it for me.
But it's a sneaky sabbath that easily escapes people's notice so they end up
counting only one of the sabbaths related to Christ's crucifixion and
resurrection. Without that sneaky sabbath, they're pretty much stuck with
the Good Friday model; which of course is unworkable.
_
The Saturday sabbath is a red herring.
There was another sabbath that week to go along with Saturday's: the
Passover sabbath. (Ex 12:16, Lev 23:5-8)
Passover sabbath is interesting. The routine sabbath always falls on the very
same day of the week every time. But Passover sabbath floats; hence it can,
and it does, occur on any given day of the week; sometimes even coincident
with the routine sabbath; for example 2018 and 2019, and sometimes
consecutive with the routine sabbath; for example 2008.
It's sometimes objected that whereas Yom Kippur and the Feast of Trumpets
are specifically called sabbaths; the first day of the feast of unleavened
bread isn't. It's set aside for an holy convocation which just simply means a
sacred assembly. But it's also added that no manner of work shall be done
on that day; which is exactly what a sabbath is all about (Gen 2:2-3). In
reality, the objection is just semantic nit picking.
Anyway; John calls that day a sabbath, which pretty much settles it for me.
But it's a sneaky sabbath that easily escapes people's notice so they end up
counting only one of the sabbaths related to Christ's crucifixion and
resurrection. Without that sneaky sabbath, they're pretty much stuck with
the Good Friday model; which of course is unworkable.
_
Of course I understand all of this. Nevertheless the Sabbath referred to is undoubledly the Saturday Sabbath. Why? Because the Sunday after the first regular Saturday Sabbath is....the Feast of Firstfruits. Which of course fits phophetically with the Ressurection.
So...the sequence is undoubtedly Fri-Sat-Sun.
Not really. The case is quite strong actually, and the Scriptures concise.
It may intrest you to study the "early Passover" aka Last Supper. Now THAT DID occurr on Thursday. Galileans were running out of phase about half a day ahead for several reasons and this was traditional in Jesus day.....
So much doubt? Not as far as I'm concerned. My studies are wrapped up and this case is closed. Bless God for this.
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The preponderance of evidence indicates that Christ's crucified dead body
was restored to life during the third day rather than later when the third was
over and done with.
● Matt 17:22-23 . . Jesus said unto them: The Son of man shall be betrayed
into the hands of men: and they shall kill him, and the third day he shall be
raised again.
● Mark 9:31 . . He taught his disciples, and said unto them: The Son of man
is delivered into the hands of men, and they shall kill him; and after that he
is killed, he shall rise the third day.
● Luke 9:22 . .The Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by
the elders, chief priests and teachers of the law, and he must be killed and
on the third day be raised to life.
● Luke 24:21-23 . .We trusted that it had been he which should have
redeemed Israel: and beside all this, today is the third day since these
things were done. Yea, and certain women also of our company made us
astonished, which were early at the sepulcher; and when they found not his
body, they came, saying, that they had also seen a vision of angels, which
said that he was alive.
● Luke 24:46 . . He said unto them: Thus it is written, and thus it behooved
Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day
● Acts 10:40 . . God raised him up the third day
● 1Cor 15:4 . . he rose again the third day
_
The preponderance of evidence indicates that Christ's crucified dead body
was restored to life during the third day rather than later when the third was
over and done with.
● Matt 17:22-23 . . Jesus said unto them: The Son of man shall be betrayed
into the hands of men: and they shall kill him, and the third day he shall be
raised again.
● Mark 9:31 . . He taught his disciples, and said unto them: The Son of man
is delivered into the hands of men, and they shall kill him; and after that he
is killed, he shall rise the third day.
● Luke 9:22 . .The Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by
the elders, chief priests and teachers of the law, and he must be killed and
on the third day be raised to life.
● Luke 24:21-23 . .We trusted that it had been he which should have
redeemed Israel: and beside all this, today is the third day since these
things were done. Yea, and certain women also of our company made us
astonished, which were early at the sepulcher; and when they found not his
body, they came, saying, that they had also seen a vision of angels, which
said that he was alive.
● Luke 24:46 . . He said unto them: Thus it is written, and thus it behooved
Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day
● Acts 10:40 . . God raised him up the third day
● 1Cor 15:4 . . he rose again the third day
_
So you have these verses, and then you have the verse you quoted when you started the thread:
So that's where all the doubt and confusion comes from--some verses indicate three days and three nights, some verses indicate two nights and a third day.
It all goes to show that the Bible isn't intended to be used as a history book; it's a book of spiritual truth. The point of the story isn't the length of time that Jesus was dead (and the Biblical accounts in that regard are contradictory), the point of the story is that Jesus was crucified to reconcile man with God, and that He rose from the dead as Lord when that job was done (and the Biblical accounts in that regard are all in unison).
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If Matt 12:40 isn't historical, then people have good reason to assume that
Jesus' crucifixion to reconcile man with God isn't historical either. Both would
have to be thrown out of court as religious fiction.
Were I the Devil, the one element of Christianity that I would make my
mission in life to invalidate is Christ's resurrection because according to Rom
4:25, it is by means of his resurrection that hell-bound people obtain an
acquittal.
But according to Rom 10:9-11 it is necessary for hell-bound people to be
persuaded that Jesus existed and that he actually came back from death.
Failure to believe that will result in hell-bound people failing to obtain an
acquittal; and thus ending up in the wrong place.
So you see, the topic of this discussion might be just another bull session to
you and me, but it's life and death for others.
_
If Matt 12:40 isn't historical, then people have good reason to assume that
Jesus' crucifixion to reconcile man with God isn't historical either. Both would
have to be thrown out of court as religious fiction.
Were I the Devil, the one element of Christianity that I would make my
mission in life to invalidate is Christ's resurrection because according to Rom
4:25, it is by means of his resurrection that hell-bound people obtain an
acquittal.
But according to Rom 10:9-11 it is necessary for hell-bound people to be
persuaded that Jesus existed and that he actually came back from death.
Failure to believe that will result in hell-bound people failing to obtain an
acquittal; and thus ending up in the wrong place.
So you see, the topic of this discussion might be just another bull session to
you and me, but it's life and death for others.
_
Nah, you're just overthinking it. The exact day of the week that Jesus was crucified is not life and death to anyone. Pay attention to the real message (Jesus died to reconcile man with God, and was resurrected) and you won't throw the baby out with the bathwater.
.
Unknown to a pretty good number of Bible students is that Jesus and his
men ate their Passover dinner the night of his arrest. (Matt 26:17-20, Mark
14:12-17, and Luke 22:7-15)
The Jews ate their Passover after he was dead and buried. (John 13:1-2,
John 18:28-29, John 19:13-14, and John 19:31)
The Jews were somehow unaware that their religious calendar was tardy the
year that Christ was crucified. He, being a prophet in direct contact with
God, would of course have known the precise moment that Passover that
year was supposed to begin; which is no doubt at least one of the reasons
why Christ ate his own Passover before the Jews ate theirs.
Ironically, the Jews were careful to avoid going after Jesus during Passover.
● Matt 26:3-5 . .Then the chief priests and the elders of the people
assembled in the palace of the high priest, whose name was Caiaphas, and
they plotted to arrest Jesus in some sly way and kill him. But not during the
feast-- they said --or there may be a riot among the people.
Due to their religious calendar's error, the Jews inadvertently crucified Jesus
during the very season they wanted to avoid.
Now, when we combine the Passover sabbath and the weekly routine
sabbath and the difference of one day between Jesus' Passover and the
Jews' Passover, we end up with a very complicated can of worms to sort out.
I sometimes suspect that most people accept the Good Friday model
because it doesn't require any thinking; whereas the actual facts of the
matter are a bit of a challenge to comprehend.
_
Unknown to a pretty good number of Bible students is that Jesus and his
men ate their Passover dinner the night of his arrest. (Matt 26:17-20, Mark
14:12-17, and Luke 22:7-15)
The Jews ate their Passover after he was dead and buried. (John 13:1-2,
John 18:28-29, John 19:13-14, and John 19:31)
The Jews were somehow unaware that their religious calendar was tardy the
year that Christ was crucified. He, being a prophet in direct contact with
God, would of course have known the precise moment that Passover that
year was supposed to begin; which is no doubt at least one of the reasons
why Christ ate his own Passover before the Jews ate theirs.
Ironically, the Jews were careful to avoid going after Jesus during Passover.
● Matt 26:3-5 . .Then the chief priests and the elders of the people
assembled in the palace of the high priest, whose name was Caiaphas, and
they plotted to arrest Jesus in some sly way and kill him. But not during the
feast-- they said --or there may be a riot among the people.
Due to their religious calendar's error, the Jews inadvertently crucified Jesus
during the very season they wanted to avoid.
Now, when we combine the Passover sabbath and the weekly routine
sabbath and the difference of one day between Jesus' Passover and the
Jews' Passover, we end up with a very complicated can of worms to sort out.
I sometimes suspect that most people accept the Good Friday model
because it doesn't require any thinking; whereas the actual facts of the
matter are a bit of a challenge to comprehend.
_
.
FYI: If that's true, then where do we place it in the chronology?
A: It began at sundown the afternoon of the Lord's burial.
FYI: Then where do we place the routine sabbath?
A: It followed on the heels of the Passover sabbath and is seen when the
women went out to the cemetery. (Matt 28:1, Mark 16:1)
So the order of events is:
Sunday was resurrection day.
Saturday was the routine sabbath day.
Friday was the Passover sabbath day.
Thursday was crucifixion day.
FYI: That's a total of four days. Isn't that one too many?
A: It's tempting to count the afternoon of Christ's burial as one of the days
as per Matt 12:40 and John 2:19-22, but don't do it. Wait until the Jews'
preparation for Passover comes to an end and they're ready to sit down and
dine upon their lambs before starting to tally the days and nights or your
chronology won't come out right. It's essential to leave crucifixion day set
aside for the slaughtering of lambs; including the one on the cross.
NOTE: The timing of Jesus' crucifixion is remarkable. He was executed
during the very day that the Jews were preparing for their Passover. Had the
Jews' religious calendar not been incorrect that year, they would've put him
to death some other day. (Matt 26:3-5)
_
FYI: If that's true, then where do we place it in the chronology?
A: It began at sundown the afternoon of the Lord's burial.
FYI: Then where do we place the routine sabbath?
A: It followed on the heels of the Passover sabbath and is seen when the
women went out to the cemetery. (Matt 28:1, Mark 16:1)
So the order of events is:
Sunday was resurrection day.
Saturday was the routine sabbath day.
Friday was the Passover sabbath day.
Thursday was crucifixion day.
FYI: That's a total of four days. Isn't that one too many?
A: It's tempting to count the afternoon of Christ's burial as one of the days
as per Matt 12:40 and John 2:19-22, but don't do it. Wait until the Jews'
preparation for Passover comes to an end and they're ready to sit down and
dine upon their lambs before starting to tally the days and nights or your
chronology won't come out right. It's essential to leave crucifixion day set
aside for the slaughtering of lambs; including the one on the cross.
NOTE: The timing of Jesus' crucifixion is remarkable. He was executed
during the very day that the Jews were preparing for their Passover. Had the
Jews' religious calendar not been incorrect that year, they would've put him
to death some other day. (Matt 26:3-5)
_
I have to say that this is an interesting theory. Unfortunately it makes assumptions that are unproven from scripture.
Scripture states:
-early Galilean Passover feast (Thursday)
-mock trial late Thursday into early Friday
-Crucifixion 9am preparation day (Friday)
-death occurred at 3pm Friday just as all the Paschal lambs are being slaughtered in Judea
-burial occurred before sundown (6pm) Friday
-Sabbath (Saturday)
-Feast of Firstfruits (Sunday) resurrection occurs sometime after sundown Sunday and before the women arrive early Sunday morning
The ultimate fulfillment of Passover and Firstfruits has been met, Sunday becomes the traditional "Lord's day" of meeting for the Church
Have you sorted it out yet? i tried looking on wiki for a hebrew calendar and the entry was wayyy to long.
passover falls on different days each year. There is also the feast of unleavened bread which lasts seven days.
At the time of crucifixtion the gospel accounts are very specific.
See mark 14:1-2. They did not want to kill him on the passover feast day. So they waited the day after.
What is the third day though, would it be the third day of the feast of unleavened bread? Why, because its a miracle if unleavened bread rises!
Jesus eats passover and is betrayed night one
Jesus trial and crucifixtion day one and night two
Sabbath day two and night 3
Jesus arises day 3
Check out luke 24:20-21
Note..that Jesus considered his time was at hand the moment he was betrayed not from the moment that he died.
At least that is how I understand it.
passover falls on different days each year. There is also the feast of unleavened bread which lasts seven days.
At the time of crucifixtion the gospel accounts are very specific.
See mark 14:1-2. They did not want to kill him on the passover feast day. So they waited the day after.
What is the third day though, would it be the third day of the feast of unleavened bread? Why, because its a miracle if unleavened bread rises!
Jesus eats passover and is betrayed night one
Jesus trial and crucifixtion day one and night two
Sabbath day two and night 3
Jesus arises day 3
Check out luke 24:20-21
Note..that Jesus considered his time was at hand the moment he was betrayed not from the moment that he died.
At least that is how I understand it.