A NON-CHARISMATIC UNDERSTANDING OF TONGUES

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K

kaylagrl

Guest
#381
#381
7seasrekeyed said:
exactly! as I said, I have never heard of anyone doing a mashup with spiritual and water baptism and you do not seem to have either

you have been around more than I have...so you tell me!
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No, I've never heard anyone mistaking the meaning of Baptized in the Holy Ghost. It's a simple turn of phrase. No one mistakes water baptism for being baptized with or in the Holy Spirit. smh
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
#383
#383
kaylagrl said:
Acts 1:4-5 for John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now."

Matthew 3:11 "As for me, I baptize you with water for repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, and I am not fit to remove His sandals; He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.

Acts 11:15-16 "And I remembered the word of the Lord, how He used to say, 'John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.' "And as I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell upon them just as He did upon us at the beginning.


It is a term Pentecostals use, it means the very same thing as with or by. No one with any common sense confuses water baptism with Holy Spirit baptism.
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I did some studying on this topic yesterday, remember that I am not Pentecostal ;), and the actual Greek word would be 'in' the Holy Spirit. comparison to water baptism, as in fully immersed, but not the same...obviously

the KJ and others do translate using the word with, but the word 'in' should be understood as the correct word
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#384
Dec 12, 2013
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#384
7seasrekeyed said:
really?

I have never heard any single person conflate those 2 things whatsoever

I have been to Charismatic, Pentecostal, Baptist, Presbyterian, Brethren, non-denominational, Messianic Assembly, Anglican and several others and have had good Catholic friends and the only place I have ever seen any such misinformed information is right here in this thread

the gifts were not confined to the 1st C

I know where you stand and you know where I stand, but I tell you I have never heard or know of anyone becoming confused over water and the Holy Spirit
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Note.....I was addressing the point EG was making.....did not say ALL, but rather many....and I know numerous people that have dealt with this....and even those that peddle the H.S. does not endwell the believer
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#385
#385
VCO said:
Correction: WE ALL WERE IMMERSED {BAPTIZIED} BY THE HOLY SPIRIT into One Body, the Spiritual Body of Jesus Christ.

1 Corinthians 12:12-13 (KJV)
12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body:
so also is Christ.
13 For by one Spirit [.HE is the Baptizer, not what HE immersed us into.] are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

2 Corinthians 13:5 (ESV)
5 Examine yourselves, to see whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Or do you not realize this about yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you fail to meet the test!
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No! Immersed is talking about water baptism. Baptized by,with,or in the Holy Spirit is not speaking of water baptism. Check the verses I posted. They are each very clear there is a water baptism and a baptism in/with/by the Holy Spirit. Not the same thing.
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
#386
#386
dcontroversal said:
Note.....I was addressing the point EG was making.....did not say ALL, but rather many....and I know numerous people that have dealt with this....and even those that peddle the H.S. does not endwell the believer
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I'm aware whose point you were addressing and I stated my response to that

people are peddling the Holy Spirit?

what a way to put it.

I would agree with Kayla. if you actually read, let alone study the Bible, you cannot mix up the 2 and using that to deny the infilling of the Holy Spirit is weak at best
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#387
Dec 12, 2013
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#387
7seasrekeyed said:
I'm aware whose point you were addressing and I stated my response to that

people are peddling the Holy Spirit?

what a way to put it.

I would agree with Kayla. if you actually read, let alone study the Bible, you cannot mix up the 2 and using that to deny the infilling of the Holy Spirit is weak at best
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No need to get mouthy with me....I was addressing a question and comment by someone else....no wonder these threads bring out the mouth....!!
And take 2 seconds to read what I actually wrote....

PEOPLE PEDDLING THE HOLY SPIRIT DOES NOT INDWELL THE BELIEVER....
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
#388
#388
that's it for me for now.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#389
Dec 12, 2013
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#389
Gotta love how charismatics red x a truthful statement about the completed word of God.....zero honesty!!!!
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
#390
#390
dcontroversal said:
No need to get mouthy with me....I was addressing a question and comment by someone else....no wonder these threads bring out the mouth....!!
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I answered you and that makes me mouthy?

I don't think so. saying people are peddling the Holy Spirit is something objectionable and I think you know that

I'm not going to be bullied around here. there is no need to talk like that to me!

people are talking here and going back and forth. that's all
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#391
Dec 12, 2013
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#391
kaylagrl said:
No, I've never heard anyone mistaking the meaning of Baptized in the Holy Ghost. It's a simple turn of phrase. No one mistakes water baptism for being baptized with or in the Holy Spirit. smh
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You mght want to read again and lose the NO ONE phrase....some do and have even on this particular site
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#392
Dec 12, 2013
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#392
7seasrekeyed said:
I answered you and that makes me mouthy?

I don't think so. saying people are peddling the Holy Spirit is something objectionable and I think you know that

I'm not going to be bullied around here. there is no need to talk like that to me!

people are talking here and going back and forth. that's all
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again you are not reading what I am writing....try again with understanding this time....you are missing the forest because of the trees...

and if you think I am bullying you have serious issues...

PEOPLE PEDDLING THAT THE HOLY SPIRIT DOES NOT INDWELL THE BELIEVER

so...grammatically speaking...what are they peddling??????
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#393
#393
VCO said:
NO, they speak in Ecstatic Utterance, and it is not an Earthy Language that had not been learned by the user. Ecstatic Utterances are Learned Behavior or a Psychological Phenomena similar to THE HINDU RELIGION, and NEITHER are of the Holy Spirit. It is a Natural Phenomena, not super natural, and the problem with that is NO ONE is HEARING in his own Dialectos, therefore IN RARE CASES, a demon can make use of an unsuspecting tongues speaker with out them being aware of it, to Curse Christ in the Sanctuary. Remember Peter was used to deliver a message from SATAN, what makes you feel IMMUNE. Now in the Modern day Charismatic or Pentecostal Churches, the hearers understand NOTHING, they rely on an unproven Interpreter, and NO unbelieving Jew or Jews are present. Every time it was used in the BIBLE an unbelieving JEW heard in his own Dialectos.

You can consider that to BE YOUR SECOND WARNING ABOUT BEING A DIVISIVE PERSON.

How do I know it has to be an Earthly Language ? ? ?

1 Corinthians 1:22 (KJV)
22 For the Jews require a sign,
and the Greeks seek after wisdom:

Acts 2:6-12 (KJV)
6 Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language. [.dialektos - is an earthly language so correct even the ACCENT is Correct.]
7 And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?
[.What was amazing is Galilaeans had a strong accent, and none could detect it.]
8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?
9 Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia,
10 Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes,
11 Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.
12 And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this?

Malachi 3:6 (KJV)
6 For I am the LORD, I change not;
therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed.


ANYTHING LESS IS A COUNTERFEIT, ASK ANY JEWISH CHRISTIAN.
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Where do you get the idea that a demon can cause someone speaking in tongues to curse Christ by mistake? What do you base that on? Pentecostals do the exact same as was done in the NT. One speaks one interprets. Tongues is to edify the church and glorify God. That has nothing to do with unbelieving Jews.

Now,as to your warning, this is a discussion forum and that is what is done here. I am discussing. If you do not like this you can skip my posts. But I do not take kindly to being warned by anyone but those in authority to do so. Calm down and you present your side and I'll present mine. If we disagree that's fine. It's not the end of the world.
 
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7seasrekeyed

Guest
#394
#394
dcontroversal said:
again you are not reading what I am writing....try again with understanding this time....you are missing the forest because of the trees...

and if you think I am bullying you have serious issues...

PEOPLE PEDDLING THAT THE HOLY SPIRIT DOES NOT INDWELL THE BELIEVER

so...grammatically speaking...what are they peddling??????
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I guess Paul peddled the Holy Spirit then

although I don't think he described it that way

but you are entitled to your opinion as am I
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
#395
#395
dcontroversal said:
You mght want to read again and lose the NO ONE phrase....some do and have even on this particular site
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If you have read the NT you would not be confused. I posted verses that make it clear. I don't see how anyone could mistake it. People here are confused about a lot of things...
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#396
Dec 12, 2013
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#396
7seasrekeyed said:
I guess Paul peddled the Holy Spirit then

although I don't think he described it that way

but you are entitled to your opinion as am I
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No offence, but you must really be tired, not paying attention or just so hyper sensative to this topic that you cannot honestly address what I have said.....seriously
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#397
Dec 12, 2013
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#397
kaylagrl said:
If you have read the NT you would not be confused. I posted verses that make it clear. I don't see how anyone could mistake it. People here are confused about a lot of things...
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And if you had actually read what I have written you would

a. Not be confused
b. Not making flippant remarks about me reading the N.T.

I am really starting to wonder how many people are really honest...because so far neither one of you have addressed what I said honestly
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#399
Dec 12, 2013
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#399
7seasrekeyed said:
I guess Paul peddled the Holy Spirit then

although I don't think he described it that way

but you are entitled to your opinion as am I
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No actually Paul preached Jesus Christ.....so does the Spirit....it does not SPEAK IF ITSELF.....easy litmus test

Preaches Jesus <--being led of God

Pushes Holy Spirit over Christ <--Not led of God

And for sure I expect all sorts of arguments......and 10 to 1 what religious persuasion balks and argues the truth of what I just posted

But when He the, Spirit of truth, shall come, He will guide you into all the truth. For He will not speak from Himself, but whatever He may hear, He will speak. And He will declare to you the things coming.
 
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kaylagrl

Guest
#400
#400
dcontroversal said:
And if you had actually read what I have written you would

a. Not be confused
b. Not making flippant remarks about me reading the N.T.

I am really starting to wonder how many people are really honest...because so far neither one of you have addressed what I said honestly
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Where did I make a flip remark about you reading the NT?! You said people in the thread were confused, and I made the remark that if they read the NT they would know the difference. I did not say you! So perhaps it is you who is sensitive, no?

Now you are saying I'm dishonest. Who has the bigger reason to be offended? How bout we simmer down and try this again. What is it that you want addressed, what are you trying to say that is being misunderstood? No one is trying to be dishonest with you.
 
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