Free Grace or Faith and Works?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

A man justified before God by:

  • God's free Grace

    Votes: 1 4.3%

  • Faith alone in Christ's work

    Votes: 9 39.1%

  • Faith proved outwardly by works of love

    Votes: 3 13.0%

  • Faith proved outwardly by works of law

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Faith and works (or merit alongside Christ's)

    Votes: 1 4.3%

  • Works alone

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Other (please comment)

    Votes: 9 39.1%
  • Total voters
    23
G

GHClarkII

Active member
#1
Mar 20, 2019
150
35
28
#1
My time on this forum has been relatively short, but I've seen a common theme. There seems to be a long standing debate between those who teach free Grace and those who do not, in whatever form that takes. Some think salvation can even be lost and our purchased redemption can be forfeited. I'd really like to see someone defend this idea of faith and works. I'm hoping this can get a good discussion going about the nature of Grace.

May God be the Judge
 
Deuteronomy

Deuteronomy

Well-known member
#2
Jun 11, 2018
3,334
3,704
113
68
#2
A man justified before God by:
  • God's free Grace
  • Faith alone in Christ's work
  • Faith proved outwardly by (our) works
Yes!

A man justified before God by:
  • Faith and works (or merit alongside Christ's)
  • Works alone
No!

~Deut

Titus 3​
5 He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy.​
.
 
E

eternally-gratefull

Guest
#3
#3
The term grace gift means unmerited, or unearned, thus by defenition it has s free (to whom it is given)

But it came by a great cost, the cross
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#4
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
#4
The following is clear enough.....

But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness
 
G

GHClarkII

Active member
#5
Mar 20, 2019
150
35
28
#5
Guys it a simple question. These are mutually exclusive. It's the justification BEFORE GOD. How are we ultimately justified.
 
crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#6
Nov 24, 2012
30,742
3,670
113
#6
Abraham was justified before God long before it was proved by 'works of love'.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#7
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
#7
GHClarkII said:
Guys it a simple question. These are mutually exclusive. It's the justification BEFORE GOD. How are we ultimately justified.
Click to expand...
Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by FAITH WITHOUT THE DEEDS/WORKS OF THE LAW....

Galatians 2 states by the FAITH OF CHRIST.....

Of or from indicate source...Jesus begins, finishes and completes the work of faith in us that SAVES AND JUSTIFIES US BEFORE GOD
 
MessageOfTheCross

MessageOfTheCross

Senior Member
#8
Sep 3, 2016
6,344
530
113
#8
The operation of the Holy Spirit is accomplished through Faith and Grace. Romans 8:2

As I stated before, when I talk about placing your Faith in Christ, 100% understand that. When I talk about placing your Faith in the Cross, 99% on this form don’t have the foggiest idea what you are talking about. They think you are talking about a wooden beam...it is the same with most Christians.
 
Deuteronomy

Deuteronomy

Well-known member
#9
Jun 11, 2018
3,334
3,704
113
68
#9
Deuteronomy said:
A man justified before God by:
  • God's free Grace
  • Faith alone in Christ's work
  • Faith proved outwardly by (our) works (this is true before "men", but not before God)
.
Click to expand...
GHClarkII said:
Guys it a simple question. These are mutually exclusive. It's the justification BEFORE GOD. How are we ultimately justified.
Click to expand...
Whoops, I was wrong and your are correct (about point #3 above). Sorry about that, only points #1 and #2 above are correct when speaking of justification BEFORE GOD (not point #3).

So, we are justified ~before God~ by faith in Christ's work (and, of course, by God's gracious choice to save us on that basis alone). The works that we do as a result of being saved are one of the big ways that we demonstrate/prove/validate the truth of our justification before men (both to others and to ourselves as well .. cf 2 Corinthians 13:5), but not before God, as such works are never necessary to prove the validity of our justification to Him who sees the heart, to the One who declares us just.

So we are justified ~before God~ both by His grace .. e.g. Romans 3:24; Titus 3:7, and by faith .. e.g. Romans 3:28, 5:1; Galatians 3:24.

~Deut

Romans 5​
8 God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.​
9 Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from the wrath of God through Him.​
10 For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life.​
.
 
G

gb9

Senior Member
#10
Jan 18, 2011
12,321
6,690
113
#10
MessageOfTheCross said:
The operation of the Holy Spirit is accomplished through Faith and Grace. Romans 8:2

As I stated before, when I talk about placing your Faith in Christ, 100% understand that. When I talk about placing your Faith in the Cross, 99% on this form don’t have the foggiest idea what you are talking about. They think you are talking about a wooden beam...it is the same with most Christians.
Click to expand...
maybe you could explain.....
 
G

GHClarkII

Active member
#11
Mar 20, 2019
150
35
28
#11
So far the responses are great. I love to hear so many people teaching Sola fide and God's free unmerited grace. Don't forget to vote please
 
crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#12
Nov 24, 2012
30,742
3,670
113
#12
MessageOfTheCross said:
When I talk about placing your Faith in the Cross, 99% on this form don’t have the foggiest idea what you are talking about.
Click to expand...
Perhaps that is because our faith is to be ONLY in Jesus Christ and not in our dying to self. In any case do you have a verse or two that says we are to have faith in the Cross?
 
GracethroughfaithinChrist

GracethroughfaithinChrist

Senior Member
#13
Sep 6, 2014
7,034
5,435
113
#13
Romans 5:1-2
Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ: 2By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.
 
Blik

Blik

Senior Member
#14
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#14
God's plan for us includes all, faith, works, and grace. If we understand and accept God's plan for us we need to understand what part each of these three play in that plan.
 
crossnote

crossnote

Senior Member
#15
Nov 24, 2012
30,742
3,670
113
#15
Blik said:
God's plan for us includes all, faith, works, and grace. If we understand and accept God's plan for us we need to understand what part each of these three play in that plan.
Click to expand...
That may be His plan, but the issue the OP is dealing with is how a man is justified. And that must be kept separate from works in the area of our justification before God.
 
Blik

Blik

Senior Member
#16
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#16
dcontroversal said:
The following is clear enough.....

But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness
Click to expand...
How can Christ cleanse us of sin we cling to and have faith in?
 
G

Guojing

Banned
#17
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
113
#17
Blik said:
How can Christ cleanse us of sin we cling to and have faith in?
Click to expand...
Simple, the problem of Sin that separated you from God is not your individual sins but the sin nature u inherited from Adam
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#18
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,402
113
#18
Blik said:
How can Christ cleanse us of sin we cling to and have faith in?
Click to expand...
Sin was dealt with at he cross...Jesus sastified that debt....it is finished = paid in full and for the believer...where sin abounds grace abounds the more!!

After salvation sin is an issue of fellowship and and not sonship!
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#19
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,776
113
#19
GHClarkII said:
I'm hoping this can get a good discussion going about the nature of Grace
Click to expand...
How did you fail to include "Grace through faith" in your options?

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. (Eph 2:8-10)

All should note that good works cannot be separated from salvation by grace through faith. They do not earn or merit salvation, but they are necessary for sanctification.

As to "nature of grace" who can explain God's "amazing grace"?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.