What Pentecostal denomination does NOT believe in the initial evidence doctrine?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
#41
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
1,829
113
#41
notuptome said:
Some truth but not all the truth. God said He was ending tongues. God did not say He would end the Holy Spirit's ministry in the hearts and lives of His children. So by carefully altering the truth you accuse those who would hold to the truth.

God has chosen the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. Not signs and wonders. Not healings and raising the dead. Nope just simple preaching which to them that perish foolishness.

Walk your dog and by the mercy of God you will return.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Click to expand...

The Great Commission​

Mar 16:14　 Finally he appeared to his eleven disciples while they were eating. He rebuked them for their unbelief and stubbornness, because they had not believed those who had seen him after he had risen.


Mar 16:15　 Then he told them, "As you go into all the world, proclaim the gospel to everyone.


Mar 16:16　 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever doesn't believe will be condemned.


Mar 16:17　 "These are the signs that will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues;


Mar 16:18　 they will pick up snakes with their hands; even if they drink any deadly poison it will not hurt them; and they will place their hands on the sick, and they will recover."


Mar 16:19　 So the Lord Jesus, after talking with his disciples, was taken up to heaven and sat down at the right hand of God.


Mar 16:20　 Then his disciples went out and preached everywhere, while the Lord kept working with them and confirming the message by the signs that accompanied it.
 
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#42
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#42
stonesoffire said:
The Great Commission​

Mar 16:14　 Finally he appeared to his eleven disciples while they were eating. He rebuked them for their unbelief and stubbornness, because they had not believed those who had seen him after he had risen.


Mar 16:15　 Then he told them, "As you go into all the world, proclaim the gospel to everyone.


Mar 16:16　 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever doesn't believe will be condemned.


Mar 16:17　 "These are the signs that will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues;


Mar 16:18　 they will pick up snakes with their hands; even if they drink any deadly poison it will not hurt them; and they will place their hands on the sick, and they will recover."


Mar 16:19　 So the Lord Jesus, after talking with his disciples, was taken up to heaven and sat down at the right hand of God.


Mar 16:20　 Then his disciples went out and preached everywhere, while the Lord kept working with them and confirming the message by the signs that accompanied it.
Click to expand...
Three signs which were for Jews ended with the completion of the NT. Foolishness of preaching, foolish to those who perish but the grace of God to those who are saved thereby.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
K

KelbyofGod

Senior Member
#43
Oct 8, 2017
1,881
721
113
#43
SpoonJuly,
I hope to answer your post#29 later today. It would take some explaining because of your use of the word "salvation" in the questions. I see people using that word as if it means the same thing to everyone using it. If I answer using the wrong definition, it would convey the wrong (perhaps even an opposite) meaning.

If you think I'm just splitting hairs, please try to list EXACTLY what is required in "salvation". (leave nothing out). Thanks.

Love in Jesus,
Kelby
 
PS

PS

Senior Member
#44
Jan 11, 2013
5,399
695
113
#44
notuptome said:
Some truth but not all the truth. God said He was ending tongues. God did not say He would end the Holy Spirit's ministry in the hearts and lives of His children. So by carefully altering the truth you accuse those who would hold to the truth.

God has chosen the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. Not signs and wonders. Not healings and raising the dead. Nope just simple preaching which to them that perish foolishness.

Walk your dog and by the mercy of God you will return.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Click to expand...
I am trying to remember a scripture that tells us the gifts of the Spirit are for all generations.

I will get back to you when I remember. Just to say God is eternal and so are His gifts to those who seek them.
 
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#45
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#45
PS said:
I am trying to remember a scripture that tells us the gifts of the Spirit are for all generations.

I will get back to you when I remember. Just to say God is eternal and so are His gifts to those who seek them.
Click to expand...
The disciples did not seek gifts. We do not lead the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit leads us into truth and righteousness.

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
PS

PS

Senior Member
#46
Jan 11, 2013
5,399
695
113
#46
notuptome said:
The disciples did not seek gifts. We do not lead the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit leads us into truth and righteousness.

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Click to expand...
Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy. (1Co 14:1 KJV)
 
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#47
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#47
PS said:
Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy. (1Co 14:1 KJV)
Click to expand...
There are Spiritual gifts that are not tongues, prophesy and knowledge. Do you seek these gifts? How many would say they have sought the gift of healing? Any or many who have been sick have certainly sought the gift of healing.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
PS

PS

Senior Member
#48
Jan 11, 2013
5,399
695
113
#48
notuptome said:
There are Spiritual gifts that are not tongues, prophesy and knowledge. Do you seek these gifts? How many would say they have sought the gift of healing? Any or many who have been sick have certainly sought the gift of healing.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Click to expand...
Either we have a doubting Thomas or you don't know THE wonder working God.

We are here to encourage people and all I'm hearing is negativity. Put it this way, my God is the God of Paul and the disciples and I cannot imagine them talking the way you do. Goodbye.
 
S

SpoonJuly

Guest
#49
#49
KelbyofGod said:
SpoonJuly,
I hope to answer your post#29 later today. It would take some explaining because of your use of the word "salvation" in the questions. I see people using that word as if it means the same thing to everyone using it. If I answer using the wrong definition, it would convey the wrong (perhaps even an opposite) meaning.

If you think I'm just splitting hairs, please try to list EXACTLY what is required in "salvation". (leave nothing out). Thanks.

Love in Jesus,
Kelby
Click to expand...
John 3:15-18
Ephesians 2:8
Salvation is the forgiveness of sin, eternal life, victory over death.
It is a gift of God to all WHO BY FAITH BELIEVE.

Not complicated at all.
 
CS1

CS1

Well-known member
#50
May 23, 2012
13,058
4,346
113
#50
notuptome said:
There are Spiritual gifts that are not tongues, prophesy and knowledge. Do you seek these gifts? How many would say they have sought the gift of healing? Any or many who have been sick have certainly sought the gift of healing.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Click to expand...
what a contradiction of the word of God. Completely error. One does not have to believe tongues are for today I have no issue with that. It does not bother me in the least. You are just wrong. But when you say unbiblical things like " There are Spiritual gifts that are not tongues, prophesy and knowledge"

You must know that 1cor chapter 12 thru 14 says they are spiritual gifts and called "Gifts of the Holy Spirit. as does
Rom 12:6
 
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
#51
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
1,829
113
#51
PS said:
I am trying to remember a scripture that tells us the gifts of the Spirit are for all generations.

I will get back to you when I remember. Just to say God is eternal and so are His gifts to those who seek them.
Click to expand...

? This?


2:39　 For this promise belongs to you and your children, as well as to all those who are distant, whom the Lord our God may call to himself."
 
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#52
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#52
CS1 said:
what a contradiction of the word of God. Completely error. One does not have to believe tongues are for today I have no issue with that. It does not bother me in the least. You are just wrong. But when you say unbiblical things like " There are Spiritual gifts that are not tongues, prophesy and knowledge"

You must know that 1cor chapter 12 thru 14 says they are spiritual gifts and called "Gifts of the Holy Spirit. as does
Rom 12:6
Click to expand...
You do not even read the scriptures you claim to rely upon. 1 Cor 12:4-11 and Eph 4:11-12. The error here is your biased accusations. All emotion and no biblical basis.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
H

Hevosmies358

Guest
#53
#53
notuptome said:
Three signs which were for Jews ended with the completion of the NT. Foolishness of preaching, foolish to those who perish but the grace of God to those who are saved thereby.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Click to expand...
Got a chapter and verse on that?
 
CS1

CS1

Well-known member
#55
May 23, 2012
13,058
4,346
113
#55
notuptome said:
You do not even read the scriptures you claim to rely upon. 1 Cor 12:4-11 and Eph 4:11-12. The error here is your biased accusations. All emotion and no biblical basis.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Click to expand...
you can make insults all you like you said " There are Spiritual gifts that are not tongues, prophesy and knowledge" yes there gifts other than those of the prophetic gifts and we are told in scripture to desire them. I see where you name all others and speak to them foolishly. You are just immature. there has been more Biblical application taught to you in the last two days then you have applied in this whole thread.
 
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#57
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#57
CS1 said:
you can make insults all you like you said " There are Spiritual gifts that are not tongues, prophesy and knowledge" yes there gifts other than those of the prophetic gifts and we are told in scripture to desire them. I see where you name all others and speak to them foolishly. You are just immature. there has been more Biblical application taught to you in the last two days then you have applied in this whole thread.
Click to expand...
You make no argument from scripture only personal insults.

God has revealed the hopelessness of your situation.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
stonesoffire

stonesoffire

Poetic Member
#58
Nov 24, 2013
10,665
1,829
113
#58
notuptome said:
Oh come on I have cited 1 Cor 13:8-13 more than times than I can count.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Click to expand...
1Co 13:8　 Love never fails. Now if there are prophecies, they will be done away with. If there are languages, they will cease. If there is knowledge, it will be done away with.


1Co 13:9　 For what we know is incomplete and what we prophesy is incomplete.


1Co 13:10　 But when what is complete comes, then what is incomplete will be done away with.

Will be...not are.

Jesus is our completion. When He comes we are completed.
 
PS

PS

Senior Member
#59
Jan 11, 2013
5,399
695
113
#59
stonesoffire said:
? This?


2:39　 For this promise belongs to you and your children, as well as to all those who are distant, whom the Lord our God may call to himself."
Click to expand...
Thank you! :) That is what I was thinking of, but where is it? I have looked in 1&2 Peter but cannot find it.
 
notuptome

notuptome

Senior Member
#60
May 17, 2013
15,050
2,538
113
#60
stonesoffire said:
1Co 13:8　 Love never fails. Now if there are prophecies, they will be done away with. If there are languages, they will cease. If there is knowledge, it will be done away with.


1Co 13:9　 For what we know is incomplete and what we prophesy is incomplete.


1Co 13:10　 But when what is complete comes, then what is incomplete will be done away with.

Will be...not are.

Jesus is our completion. When He comes we are completed.
Click to expand...
Jesus was already here and departed. The scripture does not say when the complete or perfect returns. no scripture shows the part which is the OT and the complete which when the NT is added. The only thing not complete at that time was the scripture. Now with the entire revelation of God we become as men and not children. We see as God want us to see.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
You must log in or register to reply here.