Born Again Speaking in Tongues

corazondeldei · Jun 4, 2019

Here's the best way of knowing who are indwelt or have the Holy Spirit.

NIV1984 John 14:20-24
On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves me. He who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love him and show myself to him.” Then Judas (not Judas Iscariot) said, “But, Lord, why do you intend to show yourself to us and not to the world?” Jesus replied, “If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him. He who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me.

Do we obey His teachings? How can anyone say that he has the Holy Spirit yet disobeys God's commands, to LOVE one another which is the fulfillment of the law.

NIV1984 1 John 5:2-3
This is how we know that we love the children of God: by loving God and carrying out his commands. This is love for God: to obey his commands. And his commands are not burdensome,

NIV1984 2 John 1:6
And this is love: that we walk in obedience to his commands. As you have heard from the beginning, his command is that you walk in love.

God is LOVE and He is all in all. What else do we need if we have love? Is God not enough?

NIV1984 1 Corinthians 13:1-3
If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing.

Some in here CLAIM to have FAITH ALONE while some CLAIM to have the Holy Spirit because they speak in tongues and some seems to know everything...

NIV1984 1 Corinthians 13:8
Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away.

NIV1984 1 Corinthians 8:1-3
...We know that we all possess knowledge. Knowledge puffs up, but love builds up. The man who thinks he knows something does not yet know as he ought to know. But the man who loves God is known by God.

NIV1984 Galatians 5:14-15
The entire law is summed up in a single command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” If you keep on biting and devouring each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.

The Gospel of God is the gospel of LOVE which is the WORD of TRUTH and the Gospel of our salvation.

NIV1984 John 6:63
The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life.

NIV1984 John 1:1
The Word Became Flesh In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Jesus is the WORD that became flesh and who instructed His disciples to preach the gospel unto all nations, to baptize them in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit, and teach them to OBEY everything He has commanded them. Do you love him?

NIV1984 John 14:15-17
“If you love me, you will obey what I command. And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever— the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you.

NIV1984 1 Corinthians 3:18-21
Do not deceive yourselves. If any one of you thinks he is wise by the standards of this age, he should become a “fool” so that he may become wise. For the wisdom of this world is foolishness in God’s sight. As it is written: “He catches the wise in their craftiness”; and again, “The Lord knows that the thoughts of the wise are futile.” So then, no more boasting about men! All things are yours,

And finally...

NIV1984 1 John 2:3-6
We know that we have come to know him if we obey his commands. The man who says, “I know him,” but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did.

garee · Jun 4, 2019

eternally-gratefull said:

The news flash is that not only do metaphor like poison used to describe believer will not be harmed by false prophecy but another of the same series that follows all believers as another metaphor is speaking in tongues the new language of the gospel as prophecy it has the power to give those dead in their sins and trespasses new born again spirit life.

Some confuse the idea of following and leading . Prophecy lead sign follow according to the law regarding signs .

Its a sign against those who refuse to not look to the foundation of the doctrine .They are identified as those who fall back in judgement

The tribe of Dan eliminated from the tribes in Revelation is set aside to those who are effected by the poison of false prophecy. They fall backward to indicate judgement and no sabbath rest for the weary .

.Judas who is eliminated from the 12 Apostles to represent the bride of Christ like gates is also used as a negative example of those who will not hear all of prophecy. Some call cherry pickers as those who fall back slain in the Spirit. They picked the wrong cherry as it would seem like sour grapes it turned to be poison

Genesis 49:17 Dan shall be a serpent by the way, an adder in the path, that biteth the horse heels, so that his rider shall fall backward.

John 18:5-7 King James Version (KJV)They answered him, Jesus of Nazareth. Jesus saith unto them, I am he. And Judas also, which betrayed him, stood with them. As soon then as he had said unto them, I am he, they went backward, and fell to the ground. Then asked he them again, Whom seek ye? And they said, Jesus of Nazareth.

wolfwint · Jun 4, 2019

Waggles said:

Do you realy know what you are teaching? Your claim is that before 1908 you cant find a spirit filled person ore a person baptised with the Holy Spirit in your country! Janet Lancaster was the first in 1908.
I realy wonder that you believe such a false teaching.

Footprint · Jun 4, 2019

mailmandan said:

This lady in my prayer group had seen something some years ago in the Holy Ghost, that there were Christians who thought they were saved but were actually lost and she wept heavily at the look in their eyes when they found they did not make it, this was a look of terror.

Dan, I ask you to please consider and weigh all the biblical evidence that has been brought to your attention.

With the love of Christ,
God bless!

mailmandan · Jun 4, 2019

Wansvic said:

There is a reason for that.

Wansvic said:

Paul was questioning them in order to obtain their status. Paul does not infallibly know their hearts, hence the question. Again, Paul asked them in Acts 19:2 if they had received the Holy Spirit when they believed (assuming they believed) yet their answer in verse 3 reveals that they were not yet believers in Jesus. They had received the baptism of John but did not realize that Jesus Christ was the One to whom John's baptism pointed. Paul gave them instructions about Jesus.

Acts 19:4 - Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. 5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Why would they be baptized all over again if they already believed in Jesus and were saved?

After believing Paul's presentation of the gospel, they came to saving faith in Christ and were afterwards baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. Paul laid hands on them to receive the Holy Spirit (which was not the case in Acts 2 and Acts 10). *Exception, not the rule. This signified their inclusion into the church and the purpose was to emphasize unity in the church. Keep in mind that Acts is a transitional book and this is an early stage of the church. The laying on of hands signified their inclusion into the church. Apostles were also present when the Samaritans (chapter 8) were included. The Jews despised the Samaritans! God's purpose was to emphasize unity in the church.

*Elsewhere we clearly see that those who believe receive the Holy Spirit. (John 7:38-39; Acts 10:43-47; 11:17; 15:8,9; Ephesians 1:13)

mailmandan · Jun 4, 2019

Wansvic said:

You put way too much emphasis (over emphasize) "in Jesus name" as a baptism formula that saves, as if reciting those exact words magically saves believers during their baptism and on the other hand, if believers are baptized in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, the implication (according to your doctrine) would result in an invalid baptism that would cause the believer to remain lost.

The specific words, "in Jesus name" is not a reference to a baptismal formula but a reference to authority. Jesus Himself specifically tells us to baptize “in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit” (Matthew 28:19) which is baptizing by His authority. You would be wise to listen to Jesus over your church.

mailmandan · Jun 4, 2019

Footprint said:

There are genuine Christians and there are "nominal" Christians. There are genuine believers and there are make believers.

1 John 5:11 - And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. 13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.

Praise God!

Poinsetta · Jun 4, 2019

If you start speaking in tongues
They’ll jump you

jaybird88 · Jun 4, 2019

7seasrekeyed said:

your just dodging cause you have dug a pretty deep hole, i dont blame ya.

mailmandan · Jun 4, 2019

Waggles said:

Churches that pervert the gospel are not of the faith. You can attack Galakiah all you want, but the fact remains your church teaches false doctrine. I'll never forget when a woman who left the RLDS church after 35 years became a Christian and her eyes were then opened to the truth about the cult she had been deceived by for so many years. She actually wrote a book called, "The RLDS Church Christian or Cult" and it really helped open up the eyes of other members of that church, including my wife who was also raised in that church. Of course people who still remained in the RLDS church and refused to repent and believe the gospel accused her of leaving the faith and tried their best to discredit her anyway they could. It goes with the territory.

As for child molesting, that can happen in any church. The Roman Catholic church has had it's share of that. It's not hard to find wolves in sheep's clothing among the sheep in any church, including the Southern Baptist church. I know the sword of the Spirit hurts when it cuts, but you need to reconsider your teachings in regards to the doctrine of salvation. Salvation by water baptism + speaking in tongues (dipped or condemned/speak in tongues or condemned) is a "different" gospel. Either we are trusting 100% in Jesus Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of our salvation or else we are 100% lost. Christ's finished work of redemption IS sufficient and complete to save believers. No supplements needed. (Romans 3:24-28; 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9)

mailmandan · Jun 4, 2019

Footprint said:

"Lost Christian" is an OXYMORON. There are many people who believe they are Christians, but are deceived and will not make it. (Matthew 7:22-23) I was born and raised in the Roman Catholic church and prior to my conversion, I have weighed all the Biblical evidence and have come to the conclusion that Christ's finished work of redemption IS sufficient and complete to save believers. No supplements needed. (Romans 3:24-28; 4:5-6; Ephesians 2:8,9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9)

I am not deceived by false religions and cults.

Footprint · Jun 4, 2019

mailmandan said:

"believe in the name of the Son of God" - And, what is the name of the Son that you do not believe in? Notice "Son" is not a name, and yet your so willing to be baptized without his name!

Really? a member of the bride who refused to take on the name of the husband.

God bless!

mailmandan · Jun 4, 2019

Footprint said:

No need for slanderous remarks. 1 Corinthians 6:11 - "And such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, and in the Spirit of our God."

Ephesians 5:20 - "always giving thanks for all things in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ to God, even the Father."

Colossians 3:17 - "And whatever you do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks through Him to God the Father."

*We can see that in the name of Jesus designates authority.

I was not baptized without His name. "By the authority of Jesus Christ, I baptize you in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit," (was stated during my baptism) just as Jesus commanded in Matthew 28:19. Why do you reject the words of Jesus in Matthew 28:19? Once again, the specific words, "in Jesus name" is not a reference to a baptismal formula, but is a reference to authority. Jesus Himself specifically tells us to baptize “in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit” (in Matthew 28:19) which is baptizing by His authority. Why do you reject His authority?

Footprint · Jun 4, 2019

mailmandan said:

And yet you refuse his name, choosing therefor authority in the titles Father, Son, Holy Ghost. It looks like you have rejected Colossians 3:17.

Further, in post #691 you said, "Lost Christian" is an OXYMORON."

Perhaps you should get out of that OSAS delusion, and consider...

1 Corinthians 9:27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

Here all ten were believers and all had lamps, waiting for the husbend...

Matthew 25:1 Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.
Matthew 25:10 And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.

Here they were all given talents, they were all servants...

Matthew 25:28 Take therefore the talent from him, and give it unto him which hath ten talents.
Matthew 25:30 And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

And, I leave you with this...

Matthew 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.

Revelation 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

How can you be faithful by rejecting his name?

Just a few things to consider,
God bless!

mailmandan · Jun 4, 2019

Footprint said:

I have not rejected Colossians 3:17 (more slander) but you have rejected Matthew 28:19 which was stated by Jesus -- by the authority of His name. You refuse His authority over reciting His name in a specific way as a formula for salvation. You are deceived.

Works-salvationists are very hostile towards OSAS (particularly Roman Catholics). It's you who is under a delusion.

This verse is often cited by works-salvationists (particularly Roman Catholics) to teach a loss of salvation. Paul asks the question. What is the prize before Paul? Is it that reward of which he spoke in verse 1 Corinthians 9:18? The problem with your biased interpretation is that there is a difference between a prize and a gift. A prize is something that you work for and earn where a gift is something that you freely accept without merit. Prize (brabeion) - the prize awarded to a victor, the reward (recognition) that follows triumph. That doesn't sound like the free gift of eternal life (Romans 6:23; Ephesians 2:8) now does it?

1 Corinthians 3:14-15 mentions - If the work that anyone has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward. If anyone's work is burned up, he will suffer loss, (of reward) though he himself will be saved..

1 Corinthians 9:24, Paul mentions - Do you not know that those who run in a race all run, but only one receives the prize? Run in such a way that you may obtain it. That doesn't sound like the free gift of eternal life either. That sounds like an Olympic race where all run, but only one receives the gold medal. Would this mean that everyone else is disqualified from the Olympics? Silver medal, bronze medal, no medal but finished the race, all disqualified from the race? You need to rightly divide the word of truth. Interestingly enough, the NIV in 1 Corinthians 9:27 reads - ..disqalified for the prize.

It's your assumption that all ten were believers. The wording of the five foolish virgins in our text is all too familiar to the reader of Matthew’s Gospel: Matthew 25:11 - "Later, the other virgins came too, saying, ‘Lord, lord! Let us in!’ 12 But he replied, ‘I tell you the truth, I do not know you!"

Matthew 7:21 - "Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the kingdom of heaven" but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven - (See John 6:40). 22 On that day, many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, didn’t we prophesy in your name, and in your name cast out demons and do many powerful works?’ 23 Then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you. Depart from me you who work iniquity!’ (Matthew 7:21-23) The wise virgins had oil for their lamps, while the foolish virgins did not. The wise virgins had the opportunity to obtain oil, and did so. The foolish virgins had plenty of opportunity to obtain oil, but did not. It is possible to be in close contact with Christ, and with Christians, and yet not be saved. I am reminded of a similar passage in the Gospel of Luke:

Luke 13:23 Someone asked him, "Lord, will only a few be saved?" So he said to them, 24 "Exert every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to. 25 Once the head of the house gets up and shuts the door, then you will stand outside and start to knock on the door and beg him, ‘Lord, let us in!’ But he will answer you, ‘I don’t know where you come from.’ 26 Then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in your presence, and you taught in our streets.’ 27 But he will reply, ‘I don’t know where you come from! Go away from me, all you evildoers!’ 28 There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth when you see Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and all the prophets in the kingdom of God but you yourselves thrown out. 29 Then people will come from east and west, and from north and south, and take their places at the banquet table in the kingdom of God. 30 But indeed, some are last who will be first, and some are first who will be last."

Jesus is warning us in this parable that there will be a number of people who look like Christians, who associate with Christians, and who even think they are Christians, who will be shocked to learn that they are not saved at the return of our Lord. What a sobering thought!

The talents represent monetary value and are distibuted according to ability (verse 15). The requirement is to invest in Christ. The first two servants deposited their money with the bankers (Matthew 25:27) but the third servant buried his money in the ground (verse 25). The third servant had been given abilities and the opportunity to believe and bear fruit in accordance, but had chosen to reject it.

The fact that the latter man in this parable is called wicked and lazy and an unprofitable servant (Matthew 25:30) who is cast out into outer darkness, certainly indicates that he was not a true disciple of the master. The idea of this illustrative parable is that all true believers will produce fruit in varying degress. All genuine believers are fruitful, but not all are equally fruitful (Matthew 13:23). Those who produce no results are not truly converted.

This man's characterization of the master maligns him as "reaping and gathering" what he had no right to claim as his own. This lazy so-called servant does not represent a genuine believer. It's obvious that this man had no true knowledge of the master. Two of these servants were children of God, but not the third. Children of God are not cast out into outer darkness.

*The fact that this man is called a servant does not mean necessarily that he is saved. The Jews are called the Lord’s servants, but they were NOT ALL SAVED.

*Leviticus 25:55 - For the children of Israel are servants to Me; they are My servants whom I brought out of the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God.

*Isaiah 43:10 - (speaking of Israel) - "You are My witnesses,” says the Lord, “And My servant whom I have chosen..

Few are chosen because few choose to repent and believe the gospel. Called, chosen and faithful is descriptive of believers. Romans 8:30 - Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified. *ALL of them. *Notice how Paul uses the past tense for a future event to stress it's certainty.

There is nothing for me to consider and none of your arguments are anything new or enlightening. I've heard these same arguments from Roman Catholics and other works-salvationists numerous times. My rebuttal to your arguments is something for you to consider.

Waggles · Jun 4, 2019

eternally-gratefull said:

Soshare the documentation of all this. You made the claim.
And by the way you did refer to "true believers" so that would limit your case studies to Pentecostal Christians who stand on
faith in Mark 16:

garee · Jun 4, 2019

mailmandan said:

It would seem some have a mystical wonderment tool like transubstantiation a Catholic oral tradition as in; "what you see is not what you get" To be baptized in authority/name as the hearing of faith (hearing God)It has nothing with the metaphor used to represent the unseen eternal . Water is used in ceremonial laws they are shadows(no substance) that point to a invisible God who is much more than a drop of H2O.

Its how his doctrines come not his person. He as Emmanuel indwells the believer we are privileged to be called the temple of God prepared as his wife the church. The doctrines of God are the authority we are to get under. It is there he does shower us with all blessing.

Deuteronomy 32:1-3 King James Version (KJV) Give ear, O ye heavens, and I will speak; and hear, O earth, the words of my mouth. My doctrine shall drop as the rain, my speech shall distil as the dew, as the small rain upon the tender herb, and as the showers upon the grass:

Waggles · Jun 4, 2019

mailmandan said:

You and others keep on declaring that salvation is given simply only on believing in Jesus Christ and calvary.
Yet in the NT, especially in Acts and the epistles, believing is described and presented as putting repentance into action and
becoming obedient to the commandments of Jesus:
believing in Jesus is to believe in what must I do to be saved ...
repentance > water baptism by full immersion confessing one's faith in Jesus as Lord and Saviour for the remission of sins;
to be accompanied by the baptism of the Holy Spirit with the Bible evidence of speaking in tongues; to walk with the Lord and to
display the fruit of the Spirit.

You can trash, you can berate, you can make all manner of false accusations against Pentecost and in particular - The Revival
Fellowship - but at each meeting when the gift of prophecy is given and God speaks to his children both the Father and Jesus
confirm their great pleasure in a church that wrangles not with the scriptures and is fully obedient to his commandments.
Obedience is not works.
The full gospel of salvation is not a perversion of the gospel.

corazondeldei · Jun 5, 2019

NIV1984 James 3:13-18
Two Kinds of Wisdom
Who is wise and understanding among you? Let him show it by his good life, by deeds done in the humility that comes from wisdom. But if you harbor bitter envy and selfish ambition in your hearts, do not boast about it or deny the truth. Such “wisdom” does not come down from heaven but is earthly, unspiritual, of the devil. For where you have envy and selfish ambition, there you find disorder and every evil practice. But the wisdom that comes from heaven is first of all pure; then peace-loving, considerate, submissive, full of mercy and good fruit, impartial and sincere. Peacemakers who sow in peace raise a harvest of righteousness.

NIV1984 1 Corinthians 3:18-21
Do not deceive yourselves. If any one of you thinks he is wise by the standards of this age, he should become a “fool” so that he may become wise. For the wisdom of this world is foolishness in God’s sight. As it is written: “He catches the wise in their craftiness”; and again, “The Lord knows that the thoughts of the wise are futile.” So then, no more boasting about men! All things are yours,

Waggles · Jun 5, 2019

corazondeldei said:

Thankyou
for wisdom is one of the nine gifts of the Holy Spirit distributed to members of our Pentecostal church for the edification of
the body of Christ.
Wisdom and knowledge and discerning between spirits …
the Pentecostal church is not just about speaking in an unknown tongue but having the blessings of these nine gifts working
within the congregation.
And when the prophets speak it is the wisdom and love of God that we directly hear from above.

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