Why I now believe that salvation can be lost.

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Nat2019

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John 6:70-71 ESV / 38 helpful votes
Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you, the Twelve? And yet one of you is a devil.” He spoke of Judas the son of Simon Iscariot, for he, one of the Twelve, was going to betray him.
John 6:70
Jesus answered them, “Did I not CHOOSE YOU, the Twelve? And yet one of you is a devil.”
 
notuptome

notuptome

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Nat2019 said:
John 6:70-71 ESV / 38 helpful votes
Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you, the Twelve? And yet one of you is a devil.” He spoke of Judas the son of Simon Iscariot, for he, one of the Twelve, was going to betray him.
John 6:70
Jesus answered them, “Did I not CHOOSE YOU, the Twelve? And yet one of you is a devil.”
Click to expand...
They were all of the devil until they believed. One rejected and remained with the devil.

How about you? Which will you choose? You know a lot but do you believe Gods grace is sufficient to save you from your sins? Do you believe you need to add your works of righteousness to the blood of Christ to atone for your sin?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
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Nat2019

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mailmandan said:
Just as I thought. You are trying to turn this passage of scripture into salvation by faith “plus works.” :( Once again, love is the greatest of faith, hope and love because long after faith and hope are no longer necessary, love will still be the governing principle that controls all that God and his redeemed people are and do throughout eternity. We won't need faith and hope in our glorified bodies in the presence of the Lord. In regards to Matthew 25, you are confusing descriptive passages of scripture with prescriptive passages of scripture and the end result once again is salvation by works. Your true colors are really showing.
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No, love needs to be displayed in action, just as the bible says. Be a doer of the word not a hearer only- this also applies to loving others. By the way there isnt anything wrong with doing good deeds to others;). Whether for salvation or not, its always the best way:) God actually commands us to love.
 
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Nat2019

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notuptome said:
They were all of the devil until they believed. One rejected and remained with the devil.

How about you? Which will you choose? You know a lot but do you believe Gods grace is sufficient to save you from your sins? Do you believe you need to add your works of righteousness to the blood of Christ to atone for your sin?

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Click to expand...
Wow another rude comment!!
 
mailmandan

mailmandan

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Nat2019 said:
No, love needs to be displayed in action, just as the bible says. Be a doer of the word not a hearer only- this also applies to loving others. By the way there isnt anything wrong with doing good deeds to others;). Whether for salvation or not, its always the best way:) God actually commands us to love.
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It’s not about love must be displayed in action in order to become saved but WILL be displayed in action if we truly are saved. (Romans 5:5; 1 John 4:7) Also, we are saved FOR good works and NOT BY good works. (Ephesians 2:8-10)
 
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Nat2019

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Nat2019 said:
Wow another rude comment!!
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You won't get people to your kind of Christianity by acting like this, making assumptions, calling them a creature in your other message etc. They will run from you. I watched a video on YouTube of this group of so-called Christian's who went to a Muslim school and ate some of their holy book. Because they believe these people are deceived. Their way is the right way, according to their own beliefs that another religion is false. But I dont believe in getting revenge on others with different religious beliefs.

You have your view and your entitled to it, but I won't be changing my beliefs;). It doesn't matter how hard you try, I won't fall for OSAS doctrine. Neither will I do it because of being pressured.
 
Social1

Social1

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Nat2019 said:
Jesus CHOSE JUDUS ISCARIOT
John 6:67-71 ESV /
So Jesus said to the Twelve, “Do you want to go away as well?” Simon Peter answered him, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life, and we have believed, and have come to know, that you are the Holy One of God.” Jesus answered them, “(Did I not choose you), the Twelve? And yet one of you is a devil.” He spoke of Judas the son of Simon Iscariot, for he, one of the Twelve, was going to betray him.
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Proverbs 16:4 - the Lord has made all things for himself, yeah, even the wicked for the day of evil.
We have to thank little old Judas for playing his part. He so clearly clarify that not everyone is made to go to heaven nor has the choice.
Is you claim either or both of those mentioned fax you are also saying God is partial
 
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Nat2019

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mailmandan said:
It’s not about love must be displayed in action in order to become saved but WILL be displayed in action if we truly are saved. (Romans 5:5; 1 John 4:7) Also, we are saved FOR good works and NOT BY good works. (Ephesians 2:8-10)
Click to expand...
Sure have your view:)
 
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Nat2019

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Social1 said:
Proverbs 16:4 - the Lord has made all things for himself, yeah, even the wicked for the day of evil.
We have to thank little old Judas for playing his part. He so clearly clarify that not everyone is made to go to heaven nor has the choice.
Is you claim either or both of those mentioned fax you are also saying God is partial
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If your chosen you can still lose eternal life like Judas. If we deny him he will deny us.
 
mailmandan

mailmandan

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Nat2019 said:
John 6:70-71 ESV / 38 helpful votes
Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you, the Twelve? And yet one of you is a devil.” He spoke of Judas the son of Simon Iscariot, for he, one of the Twelve, was going to betray him.
John 6:70
Jesus answered them, “Did I not CHOOSE YOU, the Twelve? And yet one of you is a devil.”
Click to expand...
Judas was never saved and did not lose eternal life but was an unbelieving, unclean devil who betrayed Jesus. (John 6:64-71) So why did Jesus choose Judas? John 13:18 - I do not speak concerning all of you. I know whom I have chosen; but that the Scripture may be fulfilled, ‘He who eats bread with Me has lifted up his heel against Me.’

Footnotes
 
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Nat2019

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eternally-gratefull said:
No

James said what does it profit a man if he CLAIMS to have faith

Stick to the word.
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It's in the word
James 2:14-22 New International Version (NIV)
Faith and Deeds
14 What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them? 15 Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food. 16 If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it? 17 In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.
18 But someone will say, “You have faith; I have deeds.”
Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faithby my deeds. 19 You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.
20 You foolish person, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless[a]?21 Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22 You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made (complete) by what he did
 
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Nat2019

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mailmandan said:
Judas was never saved and did not lose eternal life but was an unbelieving, unclean devil who betrayed Jesus. (John 6:64-71) So why did Jesus choose Judas? John 13:18 - I do not speak concerning all of you. I know whom I have chosen; but that the Scripture may be fulfilled, ‘He who eats bread with Me has lifted up his heel against Me.’

Footnotes
Click to expand...
Then why was he chosen?
 
mailmandan

mailmandan

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eternally-gratefull said:
No

James said what does it profit a man if he CLAIMS to have faith

Stick to the word.
Click to expand...
Amen! In James 2:14, we read of one who says/claims they have faith, but have no resulting evidential works (to substantiate their claim). That is not genuine faith, but a bare profession of faith. So when James asks, "Can that faith save him?" he is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an empty profession of faith/dead faith.

*So James does not teach that we are saved "by" works. His concern is to show the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed (James 2:14) by the individual is genuine. Simple! (y)
 
notuptome

notuptome

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Nat2019 said:
Wow another rude comment!!
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Rude or just a little too close to the truth? Those who turned back in John 3:19-21 turned away from the light of the truth. They did not want light but darkness because their deeds were not fit for the light.

Don't blame me but turn to Christ and seek His forgiveness.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
 
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Nat2019

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mailmandan said:
Amen! In James 2:14, we read of one who says/claims they have faith, but have no resulting evidential works (to substantiate their claim). That is not genuine faith, but a bare profession of faith. So when James asks, "Can that faith save him?" he is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an empty profession of faith/dead faith.

*So James does not teach that we are saved "by" works. His concern is to show the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed (James 2:14) by the individual is genuine. Simple! (y)
Click to expand...
So faith alone doesn't exist then.
 
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Nat2019

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notuptome said:
Rude or just a little too close to the truth? Those who turned back in John 3:19-21 turned away from the light of the truth. They did not want light but darkness because their deeds were not fit for the light.

Don't blame me but turn to Christ and seek His forgiveness.

For the cause of Christ
Roger
Click to expand...
I hope your deeds are fit for the light. Hopefully you are not doing anything behind closed doors;)That we cant see;)

I will let God be the judge:).
 
mailmandan

mailmandan

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Nat2019 said:
So faith alone doesn't exist then.
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Don’t confuse faith that trusts in Christ “alone” for salvation (Ephesians 2:8,9) with an empty profession of faith/dead faith that remains “alone” - barren of works. (James 2:14-20)
 
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