Not By Works
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Hi dc,
I admire your resisting scripture like it is water off a ducks back, but this reflects the state
of your heart not mine. Jesus said this simply
38 You study the scriptures thoroughly because you think in them you possess eternal life,
and it is these same scriptures that testify about me,
39 but you are not willing to come to me so that you may have life.
John 5
What is interesting is if one does not listen to the Lord and keep in ones heart one scripture,
then the next, then the next, they never build a whole.
What dominates ones thinking is the framework one accepts and what rises is that which makes
it work. It is clear we have different frameworks, and you have found a solution you are happy
with. That is certainly better than some.
Intelligence can be also a handicap, that we invent too complex a solution, when the simple
child like one is lying in front of us. And you will always gain cudous from people standing for
faith against those who defame the power of the cross, because there is great truth in this.
It does not mean what you have with an immortal spirit and sinful lifestyle and flesh is biblical,
it is just camouflaged under a lot of abuse and polarising good people as evil. If anything you
exemplify, how the human heart needs love and acceptance and will pay the price of righteousness
and truth to get it. It is so close to the power of love and righteousness, but then close is not
good enough.
I followed a man who came to the Lord, saw many people saved, preached well, but fell for God
heals anything we have the faith to claim for. He got cancer, claimed much and died. God is sovereign,
and we stand only by His grace. It is His word that alone is our guide, so there I bow, at His cross
and listen to His voice. God bless you.
I admire your resisting scripture like it is water off a ducks back, but this reflects the state
of your heart not mine. Jesus said this simply
38 You study the scriptures thoroughly because you think in them you possess eternal life,
and it is these same scriptures that testify about me,
39 but you are not willing to come to me so that you may have life.
John 5
What is interesting is if one does not listen to the Lord and keep in ones heart one scripture,
then the next, then the next, they never build a whole.
What dominates ones thinking is the framework one accepts and what rises is that which makes
it work. It is clear we have different frameworks, and you have found a solution you are happy
with. That is certainly better than some.
Intelligence can be also a handicap, that we invent too complex a solution, when the simple
child like one is lying in front of us. And you will always gain cudous from people standing for
faith against those who defame the power of the cross, because there is great truth in this.
It does not mean what you have with an immortal spirit and sinful lifestyle and flesh is biblical,
it is just camouflaged under a lot of abuse and polarising good people as evil. If anything you
exemplify, how the human heart needs love and acceptance and will pay the price of righteousness
and truth to get it. It is so close to the power of love and righteousness, but then close is not
good enough.
I followed a man who came to the Lord, saw many people saved, preached well, but fell for God
heals anything we have the faith to claim for. He got cancer, claimed much and died. God is sovereign,
and we stand only by His grace. It is His word that alone is our guide, so there I bow, at His cross
and listen to His voice. God bless you.
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Hi dc,
You resist most of the theology and thought of the church from the beginning, by your own confession.
But if you are prepared to be intellectually honest, free grace theology can be explained and shown for
its strengths and weaknesses. Addicts love it, because it describes their addictive personality, and their
battle with their behaviour that they cannot control but runs them.
And your enthusiasm to set free legalists should be applauded, because it is so small minded and
unloving. There are though many other variations and issues than just this. In the age of individuality
and self expression our problem is abuse and experimentation, getting a focus on meaning and
significance in a world dying from climate change and possible the end of civilisation.
But you want this divide and your swinging the sword, a very heroic mission, but it is not mine.
I want to meet people, have them open their hearts, be healed and walk with Jesus in repentance
and faith, knowing His victory and change as they walk forward in the Kingdom.
Unfortunately to you this is a closed door, so that is as it is. God bless you.
I doubt there is ever the capability for you to see what I am saying, but love always hopes.
You resist most of the theology and thought of the church from the beginning, by your own confession.
But if you are prepared to be intellectually honest, free grace theology can be explained and shown for
its strengths and weaknesses. Addicts love it, because it describes their addictive personality, and their
battle with their behaviour that they cannot control but runs them.
And your enthusiasm to set free legalists should be applauded, because it is so small minded and
unloving. There are though many other variations and issues than just this. In the age of individuality
and self expression our problem is abuse and experimentation, getting a focus on meaning and
significance in a world dying from climate change and possible the end of civilisation.
But you want this divide and your swinging the sword, a very heroic mission, but it is not mine.
I want to meet people, have them open their hearts, be healed and walk with Jesus in repentance
and faith, knowing His victory and change as they walk forward in the Kingdom.
Unfortunately to you this is a closed door, so that is as it is. God bless you.
I doubt there is ever the capability for you to see what I am saying, but love always hopes.
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I hope and PRAY that you mean what I think you meant. That is what we CALL OSAS. Maybe now you can understand what I meant by that term. Like I said in my TESTIMONY, it is like the difference between Night and Day. Growing up as a Lutheran, I only knew about Him. The night of third attempt at suicide, brought me into the Light of the SON, and from that moment on, I KNEW HIM, and HE KNEW ME before Time Began. I can now call you my Sister in Christ, if you meant It never goes away. Yes, we were raised in a Christian environment, and maybe we should have been asking each other what we MEANT by the TERMS that we USE.
Others, PLEASE do not follow my plan to test the LORD with my plans to commit suicide. IT IS A GRIEVOUS SIN.
Matthew 4:7 (HCSB)
7 Jesus told him, “It is also written: Do not test the Lord your God.”
Here are some verses that falls under the heading It never goes away. If you meant what I think you meant.
John 10:27-28 (HCSB)
27 My sheep hear My voice, I know them, and they follow Me.
28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish—ever! No one will snatch them out of My hand.
2 Timothy 2:19 (HCSB)
19 Nevertheless, God’s solid foundation stands firm, having this inscription: The Lord knows those who are His, and Everyone who names the name of the Lord must turn away from unrighteousness.
2 John 1:2 (HCSB)
2 because of the truth that remains in us and will be with us forever.
1 John 2:19 (HCSB)
19 They went out from us, but they did not belong to us; for if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us. However, they went out so that it might be made clear that none of them belongs to us.
It never goes away.
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I absolutely do.
But there are the ones you call "never were saved" and I call them "those who have lost their salvation" same group of people. But where I believe you can not abide in the root and produce fruit and not be saved, you believe "a never were saved" can abide and produce fruit.
Where you believe the most horrible person who believes the doctrine OSAS (because he doesn't know there is a "never really saved" part can go around claiming they are saved.
I don't believe they can someone who has turned from God and is a most horrible person can claim they are a Christian, EVEN if they once abided in the root.
We say and talk of the exact same people, exact same end for them both, just a difference in names and state of being.
I believe that through repentance, they may be welcomed back into the family, but God has a limit, hence the God will not be mocked. I believe the "ifs" and "mays" are of vast importance in the Word. I believe that both sides have got to fulfill their side to the promises made, Not just One. I believe God can be nothing other than Just. You get what you deserve and God is specific about who deserves and who doesn't., or else God would be a respecter of persons, and He says He isn't so He can't be.
I don't know how the "never really saved" comes back. You can't be baptized twice.
But there are the ones you call "never were saved" and I call them "those who have lost their salvation" same group of people. But where I believe you can not abide in the root and produce fruit and not be saved, you believe "a never were saved" can abide and produce fruit.
Where you believe the most horrible person who believes the doctrine OSAS (because he doesn't know there is a "never really saved" part can go around claiming they are saved.
I don't believe they can someone who has turned from God and is a most horrible person can claim they are a Christian, EVEN if they once abided in the root.
We say and talk of the exact same people, exact same end for them both, just a difference in names and state of being.
I believe that through repentance, they may be welcomed back into the family, but God has a limit, hence the God will not be mocked. I believe the "ifs" and "mays" are of vast importance in the Word. I believe that both sides have got to fulfill their side to the promises made, Not just One. I believe God can be nothing other than Just. You get what you deserve and God is specific about who deserves and who doesn't., or else God would be a respecter of persons, and He says He isn't so He can't be.
I don't know how the "never really saved" comes back. You can't be baptized twice.
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H
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Awsome, you just nulified: Not by works, implying no work is required. Our works of Righteousness were not of "Faith that works by Love." And only the Love of God (that dosent reject anyone) will cause Faith to work. If we dont have unconditional Love and despise the weak in the Fairh, it's no wonder our Faith doesent work and we would end up believing a lie: deceived to remain babes in Christ. Grace is the influence of God that is sufiscient: to kill our sin nature (comonlly knowm as egotist: the fruit of thee mind of the flesh, the fruit of the tree of knowlege.
"Nothing shall by any means harm you if you believe," does not make sence until you include dying will not harm us: if we believe and follow Jesus in His suffering amd death. As you can see, there is work involved, but mot work we could do appart from God. Even Jesus was raised by the Holy Spirit after carrying our sin to death and hell. God will not let us bear more than we can handle: the more mature we are, the more we rely on His Grace. Why some are afraid to grow up? Teresa of Avilla told the Lord: If this is how you treat your friends, its no wonder you have so fiew. As we follow Jesus in His death, we enter Resurrection that can't be obtained any other way. What seems to end our life, causes us to enter into Life in God. There is no Saint who has not tasted suffering with Christ: to carry us to the Resurection. Every one suffers, wether in fear and unbelief or with Christ. "Perfect Love delivers us from all fear." I have experienced reeiving this comfort and know it cant be attained by our works, as I have not been able to live in that comfort even tho experience feeadom from all fear: having the rightful place for Fear at the time: in admiration of God. We can only make room to receive in the fear of God: in our time of trouble we receive the Grace we need in admiration worship.
"Nothing shall by any means harm you if you believe," does not make sence until you include dying will not harm us: if we believe and follow Jesus in His suffering amd death. As you can see, there is work involved, but mot work we could do appart from God. Even Jesus was raised by the Holy Spirit after carrying our sin to death and hell. God will not let us bear more than we can handle: the more mature we are, the more we rely on His Grace. Why some are afraid to grow up? Teresa of Avilla told the Lord: If this is how you treat your friends, its no wonder you have so fiew. As we follow Jesus in His death, we enter Resurrection that can't be obtained any other way. What seems to end our life, causes us to enter into Life in God. There is no Saint who has not tasted suffering with Christ: to carry us to the Resurection. Every one suffers, wether in fear and unbelief or with Christ. "Perfect Love delivers us from all fear." I have experienced reeiving this comfort and know it cant be attained by our works, as I have not been able to live in that comfort even tho experience feeadom from all fear: having the rightful place for Fear at the time: in admiration of God. We can only make room to receive in the fear of God: in our time of trouble we receive the Grace we need in admiration worship.
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There you go quoting something I absolutely DO NOT BELIEVE, claiming it is my belief. You PEOPLE are Famous for That. When are you ever going to ASK US WHAT WE BELIEVE AND ACCEPT WHAT WE SAY IS OUR BELIEF.
ONLY THOSE WHO ABSOLUTELY BELIEVE THIS TRUTH ARE GENUINELY OSAS BELIEVERS:
John 14:15 (HCSB)
15 “If you love Me, [That is born again, where HIS LOVE is poured into our Hearts (human spirit) Rom. 5:5 producing the same kind of LOVE in us, towards GOD.]
you will keep My commands. [That is an absolute given, with no turning back whatsoever, 1 John 2:19. Not that we are PREFECT AT IT, but we WILL continue to STRIVE to KEEP His Commands, 1 John 7-10. It is SEALED, and the Holy Spirit is our SEAL, John 14:16-17 & Eph. 1:13-14. GUARDED by GOD'S POWER, and is already our possession in HEAVEN waiting for us, 1 Pet. 1:3-5.
Philippians 1:6 (HCSB)
6 I am sure of this, that He who started a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.
John 10:27-28 (HCSB)
27 My sheep hear My voice, I know them, and they follow Me.
28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish—ever! No one will snatch them out of My hand.
2 John 1:2 (HCSB)
2 because of the truth that remains in us and will be with us forever.
Every SINGLE verse in the above, we consider it means LITERALLY WHAT IT SAYS.
Does that mean YOU do not THINK IT MEANS LITERALLY WHAT IT SAYS ? ? ?
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