If Perchance Catholicism Is Mistaken
- Thread starter Webers.Home
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
E
Hi Eternally-Gratefull, some of the Romans who put the Lord to death ended up believing after doing so, yes?
~Deut
p.s. - if we (who are saved from our sins and from the wrath of God by Jesus' death on the Cross) are not the cause of/reason for His death, what/who is
Matthew 27
50 Jesus cried out again with a loud voice, and yielded up His spirit.
51 And behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom, and the earth shook; and the rocks were split,
52 and the tombs were opened; and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised;
53 and coming out of the tombs after His resurrection they entered the holy city and appeared to many.
54 Now the centurion, and those who were with him keeping guard over Jesus, when they saw the earthquake and the things that were happening, became very frightened and said, “Truly this was the Son of God!”
~Deut
p.s. - if we (who are saved from our sins and from the wrath of God by Jesus' death on the Cross) are not the cause of/reason for His death, what/who is
.
But they rejected him and made did what they could to make sure he died. Remember, they chose to save barrabus
False prophets add to the written prophecy of God that has been sealed for nearly 2 thousand years
Having another written authority other than the Bible alone all its entirety is the foundation of all the pagan religions of the world. In that way no man can serve two masters.
Sola scriptura as in all things written in the law and the prophets is the law of God .It is the reforming restoring authority in any generation of denomination.
No man can serve two laws or masters in that way, One master makes the another with out effect.
One is our teaching authority, our father in heaven . Not the law of the non inspired fathers on earth as oral traditions of men.
A clear distintion between the eternal things of God and the temporal things of men must be made.
It is there that the rubber meets the road... bottom line.
Having another written authority other than the Bible alone all its entirety is the foundation of all the pagan religions of the world. In that way no man can serve two masters.
Sola scriptura as in all things written in the law and the prophets is the law of God .It is the reforming restoring authority in any generation of denomination.
No man can serve two laws or masters in that way, One master makes the another with out effect.
One is our teaching authority, our father in heaven . Not the law of the non inspired fathers on earth as oral traditions of men.
A clear distintion between the eternal things of God and the temporal things of men must be made.
It is there that the rubber meets the road... bottom line.
-
1
- Show all
Is The correct knowledge arrived at by the leading of the Holy Spirit
Of each individual
through the word of God, or the body of Christ as a whole?
I'm not saying it's one way or the other, I am saying that whichever way a person thinks it is, individual or group, it's based on the assumption that that is the way it is.
And as I talked about above, just as an observation, the Bible was not available to most people as individuals for study.
Of each individual
through the word of God, or the body of Christ as a whole?
I'm not saying it's one way or the other, I am saying that whichever way a person thinks it is, individual or group, it's based on the assumption that that is the way it is.
And as I talked about above, just as an observation, the Bible was not available to most people as individuals for study.
If you look at John 16:8-11 you will see that the word and the Holy Spirit are connected and cannot be separated. Written or spoken the word tells and the Holy Spirit give clarity to bring the necessary heart conviction for the soul to come to Christ.
There is and always has been only one way to eternal life. By grace through faith.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
There is and always has been only one way to eternal life. By grace through faith.
For the cause of Christ
Roger
Well, perhaps we're disagreeing because we're thinking different things of what "Abraham God" means.
Do Jews worship Abraham God?
Is Abraham God a trinity?
Jews say Abraham God is not a Trinity. We might read the Jewish scriptures, and say those scriptures say that Abraham God is a trinity. But the Jews read the same scriptures and say that Abraham God is not a trinity.
So if Abraham God is a trinity, and the Jews say that the god they worship is not a trinity, then do Jews worship Abraham God?
Do Jews worship Abraham God?
Is Abraham God a trinity?
Jews say Abraham God is not a Trinity. We might read the Jewish scriptures, and say those scriptures say that Abraham God is a trinity. But the Jews read the same scriptures and say that Abraham God is not a trinity.
So if Abraham God is a trinity, and the Jews say that the god they worship is not a trinity, then do Jews worship Abraham God?
I don't think the Catholics are saying that everything that is written in the Quran is true.
Actually, I'm pretty sure they don't say that.
a quote I think is interesting from the lumen gentium
14. This Sacred Council wishes to turn its attention firstly to the Catholic faithful. Basing itself upon Sacred Scripture and Tradition, it teaches that the Church, now sojourning on earth as an exile, is necessary for salvation. Christ, present to us in His Body, which is the Church, is the one Mediator and the unique way of salvation.
Actually, I'm pretty sure they don't say that.
a quote I think is interesting from the lumen gentium
14. This Sacred Council wishes to turn its attention firstly to the Catholic faithful. Basing itself upon Sacred Scripture and Tradition, it teaches that the Church, now sojourning on earth as an exile, is necessary for salvation. Christ, present to us in His Body, which is the Church, is the one Mediator and the unique way of salvation.
Yes, Protestants, Eastern Orthodox, and Roman Catholics all affirm the Trinity and the deity of Jesus.
Jews, Muslims, and Jehovah's witnesses just to use some examples, all deny I both the trinity and the deity of Christ.
Mormons of course would probably say Jesus is God, but then they say everyone is going to become a god.
Jews, Muslims, and Jehovah's witnesses just to use some examples, all deny I both the trinity and the deity of Christ.
Mormons of course would probably say Jesus is God, but then they say everyone is going to become a god.
I don't think lumen gentium is quite saying that
16. Finally, those who have not yet received the Gospel are related in various ways to the people of God.(18*) In the first place we must recall the people to whom the testament and the promises were given and from whom Christ was born according to the flesh.(125) On account of their fathers this people remains most dear to God, for God does not repent of the gifts He makes nor of the calls He issues.(126) But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator. In the first place amongst these there are the Muslims, who, professing to hold the faith of Abraham, along with us adore the one and merciful God, who on the last day will judge mankind.
You speak English better than I speak any other language, but you might be missing some of the nuances in what is being said above.
If you say that two different people worship the same God, are you saying that they both believe exactly the same thing about God? Like maybe one person believes God inspired the King James Bible, and another person doesn't believe that? Are they still worshiping the same God?
This is where the idea of the nature of God comes in.
For example, Christians believe that there is the physical and the spiritual, and that God is not a physical being (though he incarnated himself into a physical body in Jesus). Hindus, I think, say that there is just one substance, and that the world is made out of "God stuff" or something like that.
So in that case, we're Christians and Hindus have a different view of the nature of God, it would make sense to say they are worshipping a different God.
But then it would look like Jews are probably worshipping a different God, since they think God's nature is different than Christians do. But then there's some things in the Bible that seem to indicate that Jews are worshiping the same God.
16. Finally, those who have not yet received the Gospel are related in various ways to the people of God.(18*) In the first place we must recall the people to whom the testament and the promises were given and from whom Christ was born according to the flesh.(125) On account of their fathers this people remains most dear to God, for God does not repent of the gifts He makes nor of the calls He issues.(126) But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator. In the first place amongst these there are the Muslims, who, professing to hold the faith of Abraham, along with us adore the one and merciful God, who on the last day will judge mankind.
You speak English better than I speak any other language, but you might be missing some of the nuances in what is being said above.
If you say that two different people worship the same God, are you saying that they both believe exactly the same thing about God? Like maybe one person believes God inspired the King James Bible, and another person doesn't believe that? Are they still worshiping the same God?
This is where the idea of the nature of God comes in.
For example, Christians believe that there is the physical and the spiritual, and that God is not a physical being (though he incarnated himself into a physical body in Jesus). Hindus, I think, say that there is just one substance, and that the world is made out of "God stuff" or something like that.
So in that case, we're Christians and Hindus have a different view of the nature of God, it would make sense to say they are worshipping a different God.
But then it would look like Jews are probably worshipping a different God, since they think God's nature is different than Christians do. But then there's some things in the Bible that seem to indicate that Jews are worshiping the same God.
The Catholics the same. Another written authority of man making the written tradition of God without effect. Any sect or demonation who oral traditions do add or subtract from his puts us in a place of being alert.
No fruit coming from sacred scripture.
All things written in the law and the prophets (sola scriptura) reformed and restored the first century government of God as it did in the fifteenth century or any time period.
They under the law of the fathers .(out of sight out of mind) simply refused to dismiss the laws of their fathers as having no authority to be heard on high. Their oral traditions as commandments of men had no value when laid on the side of sola scriptura. It has no equal.
In the end worshiping or what they call venerating the fathers seen as if they were in the place of our heavenly father not seen . Paul turned it right side up and declared: "I worship the God of the fathers". . . . . Not the many fathers as God not seen . no faith. . . dead in ones trespasses and sin without a living hope in this presence world.
Acts 24:5-14 For we have found this man a pestilent fellow, and a mover of sedition among all the Jews throughout the world, and a ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes: Who also hath gone about to profane the temple: whom we took, and would have judged according to our law. But the chief captain Lysias came upon us, and with great violence took him away out of our hands, Commanding his accusers to come unto thee: by examining of whom thyself mayest take knowledge of all these things, whereof we accuse him. And the Jews also assented, saying that these things were so. Then Paul, after that the governor had beckoned unto him to speak, answered, Forasmuch as I know that thou hast been of many years a judge unto this nation, I do the more cheerfully answer for myself:Because that thou mayest understand, that there are yet but twelve days since I went up to Jerusalem for to worship.
And they neither found me in the temple disputing with any man, neither raising up the people, neither in the synagogues, nor in the city: Neither can they prove the things whereof they now accuse me. But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are "written in the law and in the prophets:"
No adding or subtracting. Another way below of saying sola scruiptura the Christians one source of faith..
Isaiah 28: 10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:(sola scriptura)
Isaiah 28: 11-13 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people. To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear. But the word of the Lord was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken. Wherefore hear the word of the Lord, ye scornful men, that rule this people which is in Jerusalem.
No fruit coming from sacred scripture.
All things written in the law and the prophets (sola scriptura) reformed and restored the first century government of God as it did in the fifteenth century or any time period.
They under the law of the fathers .(out of sight out of mind) simply refused to dismiss the laws of their fathers as having no authority to be heard on high. Their oral traditions as commandments of men had no value when laid on the side of sola scriptura. It has no equal.
In the end worshiping or what they call venerating the fathers seen as if they were in the place of our heavenly father not seen . Paul turned it right side up and declared: "I worship the God of the fathers". . . . . Not the many fathers as God not seen . no faith. . . dead in ones trespasses and sin without a living hope in this presence world.
Acts 24:5-14 For we have found this man a pestilent fellow, and a mover of sedition among all the Jews throughout the world, and a ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes: Who also hath gone about to profane the temple: whom we took, and would have judged according to our law. But the chief captain Lysias came upon us, and with great violence took him away out of our hands, Commanding his accusers to come unto thee: by examining of whom thyself mayest take knowledge of all these things, whereof we accuse him. And the Jews also assented, saying that these things were so. Then Paul, after that the governor had beckoned unto him to speak, answered, Forasmuch as I know that thou hast been of many years a judge unto this nation, I do the more cheerfully answer for myself:Because that thou mayest understand, that there are yet but twelve days since I went up to Jerusalem for to worship.
And they neither found me in the temple disputing with any man, neither raising up the people, neither in the synagogues, nor in the city: Neither can they prove the things whereof they now accuse me. But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are "written in the law and in the prophets:"
No adding or subtracting. Another way below of saying sola scruiptura the Christians one source of faith..
Isaiah 28: 10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:(sola scriptura)
Isaiah 28: 11-13 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people. To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear. But the word of the Lord was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken. Wherefore hear the word of the Lord, ye scornful men, that rule this people which is in Jerusalem.