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YHVH, the Triune God, is speaking.
And he refers to himself using singular pronouns.
Is 45:5 I am the LORD, and there is no other, besides me there is no God; I equip you, though you do not know me,
The capital letters represent YHVH.
As I have said, in terms of Being, God is one. In terms of Persons, God is three.
YHVH is also used to refer to the Father, as well as Jesus. As I have said, YHVH the Triune God is speaking, and there is non besides Him.
If you claim Jesus is speaking, then my question would be, does the Father exist as a distinct Person, and is he God? If you claim the Father is speaking, then my question would be, does the Son exist as a distinct Person, and is he God? You cannot answer either question without denying the deity of the Father or the Son, because this verse states there is only one God, and there is no other God.
The Trinity doctrine allows me to reconcile all of the Scriptural statements about God. Other views simply do not allow this.
The Trinity doctrine is Scriptural, and the other views are not. It is not a mere matter of my opinion. You guys might want to make such a claim so you can gain acceptance, and then attempt to gain dominance. I doubt it will work because there are tons of faithful Trinitarians who know that Scriptural statements regarding God cannot be reconciled outside of the Trinity doctrine. I have certainty that Christianity ultimately dominates over all other aberrant worldviews and false versions of Christianity.
Cultic groups don't stop there, though....they want to convince others of other false teachings. This is because, without an understanding of the Trinity, their entire belief system is in shambles and cannot be reconciled. I know this from being an anti-Trinitarian. Bad doctrines don't exist in isolation; they have a cascade effect into other areas of Christian doctrine.
Perhaps it would be helpful to identify your own position regarding God before discussing this further.
And he refers to himself using singular pronouns.
Is 45:5 I am the LORD, and there is no other, besides me there is no God; I equip you, though you do not know me,
The capital letters represent YHVH.
As I have said, in terms of Being, God is one. In terms of Persons, God is three.
YHVH is also used to refer to the Father, as well as Jesus. As I have said, YHVH the Triune God is speaking, and there is non besides Him.
If you claim Jesus is speaking, then my question would be, does the Father exist as a distinct Person, and is he God? If you claim the Father is speaking, then my question would be, does the Son exist as a distinct Person, and is he God? You cannot answer either question without denying the deity of the Father or the Son, because this verse states there is only one God, and there is no other God.
The Trinity doctrine allows me to reconcile all of the Scriptural statements about God. Other views simply do not allow this.
The Trinity doctrine is Scriptural, and the other views are not. It is not a mere matter of my opinion. You guys might want to make such a claim so you can gain acceptance, and then attempt to gain dominance. I doubt it will work because there are tons of faithful Trinitarians who know that Scriptural statements regarding God cannot be reconciled outside of the Trinity doctrine. I have certainty that Christianity ultimately dominates over all other aberrant worldviews and false versions of Christianity.
Cultic groups don't stop there, though....they want to convince others of other false teachings. This is because, without an understanding of the Trinity, their entire belief system is in shambles and cannot be reconciled. I know this from being an anti-Trinitarian. Bad doctrines don't exist in isolation; they have a cascade effect into other areas of Christian doctrine.
Perhaps it would be helpful to identify your own position regarding God before discussing this further.
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You don't believe Jesus is God by Himself but are calling other people cults.
You need to be asking yourself these questions, don't ask me. Many places God uses singular nouns and many places, God uses plural nouns for Himself. So, must we conclude that God is 3 in 1? why?! The reason i say Trinity is nothing more than a misunderstanding.
You need to be asking yourself these questions, don't ask me. Many places God uses singular nouns and many places, God uses plural nouns for Himself. So, must we conclude that God is 3 in 1? why?! The reason i say Trinity is nothing more than a misunderstanding.
My personal beliefs are weird but generally, yes, God came in flesh in the name of Jesus.
Isa 43:
9All the nations gather together
and the peoples assemble.
Which of their gods foretold this
and proclaimed to us the former things?
Let them bring in their witnesses to prove they were right,
so that others may hear and say, “It is true.”
10“You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord,
“and my servant whom I have chosen,
so that you may know and believe me
and understand that I am he.
Before me no god was formed,
nor will there be one after me.
11I, even I, am the Lord,
and apart from me there is no savior.
12I have revealed and saved and proclaimed—
I, and not some foreign god among you.
You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord, “that I am God.
13Yes, and from ancient days I am he.
John 8:23But he continued, “You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. 24I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am he, you will indeed die in your sins.”
Isa 43:
9All the nations gather together
and the peoples assemble.
Which of their gods foretold this
and proclaimed to us the former things?
Let them bring in their witnesses to prove they were right,
so that others may hear and say, “It is true.”
10“You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord,
“and my servant whom I have chosen,
so that you may know and believe me
and understand that I am he.
Before me no god was formed,
nor will there be one after me.
11I, even I, am the Lord,
and apart from me there is no savior.
12I have revealed and saved and proclaimed—
I, and not some foreign god among you.
You are my witnesses,” declares the Lord, “that I am God.
13Yes, and from ancient days I am he.
John 8:23But he continued, “You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world. 24I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am he, you will indeed die in your sins.”
Currently not attached.
My personal beliefs are so weird they scare me sometimes. But i read the bible and i know Trinity isn't in there.
Isa 9:
6For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given,
and the government will be on his shoulders.
And he will be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
Name= Authority
The child's authority shall be:
1. Wonderful Counselor = Holy spirit
2. Mighty God =Mighty God
3. Everlasting Father = Father
These are authorities, not persons.
My personal beliefs are so weird they scare me sometimes. But i read the bible and i know Trinity isn't in there.
Isa 9:
6For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given,
and the government will be on his shoulders.
And he will be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
Name= Authority
The child's authority shall be:
1. Wonderful Counselor = Holy spirit
2. Mighty God =Mighty God
3. Everlasting Father = Father
These are authorities, not persons.
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Which point of the Trinity doctrine do you deny?
1. God is one in terms of essence.
2. God is three in terms of Persons (Father, Son, Holy Spirit).
3. The Father is God (YHVH).
4. The Son is God (YHVH).
5. The Holy Spirit is God (YHVH).
6. These three persons are co-essential (sharing the same essence) and co-eternal (they have always existed).
If you can identify which point you disagree with, it would be helpful. If you don't want to identify which point you disagree with, then we have no basis for further discussion.
1. God is one in terms of essence.
2. God is three in terms of Persons (Father, Son, Holy Spirit).
3. The Father is God (YHVH).
4. The Son is God (YHVH).
5. The Holy Spirit is God (YHVH).
6. These three persons are co-essential (sharing the same essence) and co-eternal (they have always existed).
If you can identify which point you disagree with, it would be helpful. If you don't want to identify which point you disagree with, then we have no basis for further discussion.
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Everlasting Father is referring to Jesus' role as creator and the source of creation. It isn't referring to him being the Father in terms of Person.
This is a misunderstanding of Oneness Pentecostals.
Jesus also was a Paraklete (Counselor) like the Spirit, but not the Spirit. See John 14:16, which proves this, and also establishes the distinct Personhood of the Spirit, which some cultic groups deny. See also 1 John 2:1, which identifies Jesus as the Paraklete, along with the Spirit.
The Greek word Paraklete carries this connotation of being a Counselor, comforter, advocate, etcetera.
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I disagree with everything.
God is simply God.
What then shall we say about this:
2 Pet 1:4Through these He has given us His precious and magnificent promises, so that through them you may become partakers of the divine nature, now that you have escaped the corruption in the world caused by evil desires.
Can we now say that God is 4 persons in one?!
God is simply God.
What then shall we say about this:
2 Pet 1:4Through these He has given us His precious and magnificent promises, so that through them you may become partakers of the divine nature, now that you have escaped the corruption in the world caused by evil desires.
Can we now say that God is 4 persons in one?!
It is good, you are accepting that the verse describes Jesus as having the authority of the Father and the Son and the Holy spirit.
This confirms what Paul said about all deity dwelling in Him in bodily form.
Your extra explanation doesn't make sense to me.
John 14/15/16 if read carefully, you'll see that Jesus is claiming to be the Father and the Holy spirit too. Because if He doesn't go, the Holy spirit doesn't come, but if He goes, the Holy spirit comes, yet the Holy spirit was already there with the disciples. He also promises them that He will go and come to them shortly.
This confirms what Paul said about all deity dwelling in Him in bodily form.
Your extra explanation doesn't make sense to me.
John 14/15/16 if read carefully, you'll see that Jesus is claiming to be the Father and the Holy spirit too. Because if He doesn't go, the Holy spirit doesn't come, but if He goes, the Holy spirit comes, yet the Holy spirit was already there with the disciples. He also promises them that He will go and come to them shortly.