Was Lot a carnal christian or unbeliever

[CherieR]

How was he compaired to abraham in his walk?

I am not sure but it seems Lot had his own interests in mind when Abraham let Lot have the choose of where he wanted to go. Lot picked a land that with his eyes looked really good. I think many would have done the same as Lot did with the little information he had.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

What do people think about when abraham rescued lot, and met melchisedek,

Here we have lot, who had everything taken, and was set to be a slave with nothing, rescued, and given an opportunity to go back with abraham, to go with the king of salem, , or go back with the evil king of sodom,

Yet he chose the latter,

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I am not sure but it seems Lot had his own interests in mind when Abraham let Lot have the choose of where he wanted to go. Lot picked a land that with his eyes looked really good. I think many would have done the same as Lot did with the little information he had.

True. Sad but true..lol

 

[CherieR]

What do people think about when abraham rescued lot, and met melchisedek,

Here we have lot, who had everything taken, and was set to be a slave with nothing, rescued, and given an opportunity to go back with abraham, to go with the king of salem, , or go back with the evil king of sodom,

Yet he chose the latter,

Maybe he had already got settled down and comfortable enough where he was? Maybe like he doesn't like the city where he lives and the crime but he doesn't feel very comfortable moving either?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Maybe he had already got settled down and comfortable enough where he was? Maybe like he doesn't like the city where he lives and the crime but he doesn't feel very comfortable moving either?

Maybe, this is certainly a possibility

Was the place the same after? Did the army destroy it?

 

[CherieR]

Maybe, this is certainly a possibility

Was the place the same after? Did the army destroy it?

Not sure. Have not thought about that.

 

[oldethennew]

just read this thread, so we don't know what others have said,
but we have read and say, that -
'God delivered 'just Lot', which is saying that He was 'justified in God's eyes -
'he obeyed His Commandments, even though full of weakness, but who are we
who have not travelled this old road at some point in our own journey!?...

 

[Jimbone]

Alot off accusation here

Can you give proof which proves lot was not saved? Especially since peter called him righteous, did peter lie?

As for me, I am just trying to discuss lot so please leave your personal attacks outside, they are not welcome.

I actually never addressed the salvation of Lot at all in my comment, and definitely NEVER said he wasn't saved, but if I had to guess I'd say God sparing him from judgement suggest he was saved, both literally and figuratively.

Also there was some assumptions made, and deductions from past and present comments, but what all exactly did I "accuse" you of? Maybe I accused you of preaching a weak Jesus who saves and may or may not change you, but I other than that didn't see any other accusation to warrant you saying there were "a lot of accusations here". I guess I accused you of not listening to past conversations between us and I guess that's "personal" too, but still as far as those being "a lot of accusations here", I don't see it. I also would really like for you to quote my "personal attacks" too please, because nothing I wrote was meant as an "attack", nor was it personal, only commenting on words you posted publicly, please clarify my "attacks" so I can apologize for them. Simply disagreeing and sharing a differing view is NOT attacking. If they felt like "attacks" then maybe there's some truth to what I was saying. Again if not please show me where I'm wrong, attacking, outside scripture, or dishonoring our King and/or His children at all, because I'm not here for any of those reasons, and I don't see it. You commented on my comment to correct me, and I just don't see where I need correcting, plus you never even said exactly what you thought was wrong, you just can't seem to stand when people speak about possible false conversion. This is eternity we are dealing with and needs to always be talked about, no matter if it hurts feelings or not. Thanks and have a great day.

 

[dcontroversal]

2nd Peter--->and He rescued righteous Lot, being distressed by the conduct in sensuality of the lawless

 

[Adstar]

Curious to hear responses. Lets look at lots life.

Lot was never a Christian.. Christians came into existence on the day of Pentecost,, many generations after the time of Lot..

As being a believer in God, Lot had some faith and it was accounted to him for rightiousness and thats why God sent the Angels to call him out of sodom to save lot from the wrath to come.. Was Lot a sinner like all other men? Yes..

 

[posthuman]

well he was not a Christian to begin with, so.....?

God considered Lot righteous or He would not have sent angels to remove him and his family from the city

this was done in response to his uncle Abraham pleading with God if the city could be spared if even 10 righteous men were to be found in it

however, it would seem that not even that many were to be found

IMO 10 is the size of Lot's family:
(2) he & his wife
(2) two unmarried daughters
(2) two married daughters
(2) their husbands
(2) two unmarried sons
-------------
10

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Lot was never a Christian.. Christians came into existence on the day of Pentecost,, many generations after the time of Lot..

As being a believer in God, Lot had some faith and it was accounted to him for rightiousness and thats why God sent the Angels to call him out of sodom to save lot from the wrath to come.. Was Lot a sinner like all other men? Yes..

Yes, I made a mistake it should have said a carnal believer not christian. To late to change.

Was he really a sinner like everyone else. Compare him with Abraham. Look at the differences..

 

[posthuman]

What was different, if anything was different, about Lot hesitating and his wife hesitating?

 

[7seasrekeyed]

IMO 10 is the size of Lot's family:
(2) he & his wife
(2) two unmarried daughters
(2) two married daughters
(2) their husbands
(2) two unmarried sons
-------------
10

yeah I don't know

I was looking at that too

however he only fled with 2 daughters it seems...unless the 2 were engaged which might be considered married back then...to the 2 'husbands'

I'm not sure on this one

at any rate, God did not spare the city so there were not 10 righteous

but the # in the family has me guessing

 

[eternally-gratefull]

What was different, if anything was different, about Lot hesitating and his wife hesitating?

I do not see a difference,

I see both wanted to stay, they did not want to leave, Their desire was to continue to live in that city,

 

[Nehemiah6]

IMO 10 is the size of Lot's family:
(2) he & his wife
(2) two unmarried daughters
(2) two married daughters
(2) their husbands
(2) two unmarried sons
-------------
10

This is speculation. What we see in Scripture is that Lot is the only one who is deemed *righteous* by God. He was justified by grace through faith, although his faith may have been minimal.

 

[Nehemiah6]

What was different, if anything was different, about Lot hesitating and his wife hesitating?

The Bible says that Lot was vexed (or troubled) by the wickedness of the people around him (not that he did anything about it). But it would seem that his wife had no problem with that, since she longingly looked back and was punished.

 

[posthuman]

This is speculation. What we see in Scripture is that Lot is the only one who is deemed *righteous* by God. He was justified by grace through faith, although his faith may have been minimal.

The only speculative part is really that he had 2 sons. This is based on this verse:

Genesis 19:12
The two men said to Lot, "Do you have anyone else here—sons-in-law, sons or daughters, or anyone else in the city who belongs to you? Get them out of here

The words are all plural, so we're talking about not a single son or daughter but at least 2.
I 'speculate' that the angels God sent to gather Lots family were not completely ignorant of who they were sent to seek out and save. If the angels said 'sons' it makes sense to me they know exactly whether Lot actually has sons or not, and they know how many. This, like God asking in the garden, 'where are you?' isn't a question from lack of knowledge, but a question proving the truth, like an attorney asking questions not because they don't know the answer, but in order for the record of the answer to be established in court.

This neatly explains why Abraham stopped at ten, too, and the alternative is that Abraham argued with God over a completely arbitrary number, which I see as an untenably awkward position.

 

[posthuman]

The Bible says that Lot was vexed (or troubled) by the wickedness of the people around him (not that he did anything about it). But it would seem that his wife had no problem with that, since she longingly looked back and was punished.

The Bible doesn't say she 'longingly looked back'

The word actually means she 'lagged behind' and that's pretty much the same as hesitating. If she indeed had more children that Lot didn't go speak to, or who were in any case left behind, then what we have is possibly a mother's anguish over the certain death of her children, and struggling in despair over dying with them vs. living without them.

She was turned to salt - which is a preservative, and is no where in scripture a symbol of evil. She did not perish in the city.

 

[posthuman]

I do not see a difference,

I see both wanted to stay, they did not want to leave, Their desire was to continue to live in that city,

What if they had more children, and this is why Lot hesitated, and also why his wife lingered?

I realize that 99.95% of all sermons on the topic say she, seeing the city being destroyed by fire from heaven, was such a complete idiot that she turned around to go get her favorite baubles, knowing that she would certainly die in the process. I think that's a pretty unlikely scenario tho, even though by assuming these are intelligent people it puts me in a very tiny minority.