Why I now believe that salvation can be lost.

Noose · Oct 7, 2019

Ezek 18:
20The soul who sins is the one who will die. A son will not bear the iniquity of his father, and a father will not bear the iniquity of his son. The righteousness of the righteous man will fall upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked man will fall upon him.

21But if the wicked man turns from all the sins he has committed, keeps all My statutes, and does what is just and right, he will surely live; he will not die. 22None of the transgressions he has committed will be held against him. Because of the righteousness he has practiced, he will live. 23Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? declares the Lord GOD. Wouldn't I prefer that he turn from his ways and live?

24But if a righteous man turns from his righteousness and practices iniquity, committing the same abominations as the wicked, will he live? None of the righteous acts he did will be remembered. Because of the unfaithfulness and sin he has committed, he will die.

25Yet you say, ‘The way of the Lord is not just.’

Nat2019 · Oct 9, 2019

Nat2019 said:

I just want to add something to my message. When I came to these truths I found, it wasnt because I wanted to follow a bunch of theological ideas. It was because I was searching for the truth comparing what I was taught in OSAS to the bible. So when I was looking for the truth I didn't think about theology. I didnt even know much about it. But years down the track I was doing some research about the truths I found. I compared OSAS to scriptures In my bible and could see they didnt match up. Also when in OSAS I always felt confused about what I believed and couldn't make sense about how I could be free from sin, because the beliefs I applied from OSAS didnt help me change or be like christ. I also couldn't understand why the holy spirit didnt deliver me from my sins for years while in OSAS. So this is how I changed gospels.

My mother found the website evangelical outreach because she couldn't understand why my father was a OSAS Christian, stopped using drugs. Then started using drugs turned from God and didnt want to know God anymore. So my mother was confused. If my husband is guaranteed salvation why doesn't he want to be a Christian anymore. So she was asking questions, I was asking questions and the answer we both found is OSAS isnt biblical.

So many may say I am deceived but I just cant follow OSAS anymore. Because to me I couldn't find the solution of how to change. I was In despair looking for a way out. While in OSAS people would make out like I was okay with God without following his will. One day I read my bible and it convicted me, so I threw it across my bedroom in anger. I wasnt okay living In sin and being a Christian. I was confused and messed up. I also thought it was ok to get in a relationship with a Muslim. But I was convicted that it was wrong, but I still ignored God and Got consequences for it. I never preached the gospel in OSAS. I never had a desire too. My favorite preachers were David Wilkinson, Carter Conlin and Dr Charles Stanley- I found out Dr Charles standley says weeping and nashing are In heaven. I felt church was nothing but a social club and most the sermons I listened to were boring and alot didn't even make sense. I couldn't wait for the church services to finish. Right now I do not attend church, the only person I have to fellowship is my mother because I said goodbye to all my OSAS friends a few years ago. I just felt like God wasn't in these Churches. How can I come back to such a belief system where I felt no peace. Many will say how can you say you have no peace with guaranteed salvation. Well I needed to be free from my sins, and I would cry constantly, feeling like I just didnt want to live against God, but I felt helpless. All my decisions against Gods will were having an impact on my life. The consequences I had for so many things, would shock some people. I actually shouldn't be alive because of the many dangerous situations I put my self in. So this is why I see the importance of HOLY LIVING because I have seen the consequences of UNHOLY LIVING. When you do so many wrong things you start to feel like a horrible person. When I Obey God, my life is more peaceful. Not too say I dont still have problems but if I didn't care about any of the bible. Right now I would probably be
*In an abusive relationship.
*Prison
*Dead
*Mental hospital

Because in my life i have had alot of problems and I would find others with the same problems. These people are not In a good place right now.
So the reason I have stayed out of alot of trouble so far is because I am trying to apply the bible to my life.
This doesn't mean I haven't had temptations to fall into sin. There are moments when I have stumbled and fallen. But I just try again, with the help of God. Do I think I will lose my salvation all the time NO. I dont think that. I just believe we need to live in accordance with Gods word. Because I have seen the consequences of not following his word.

You can get yourself into situations you wish you never entered.

Nat2019 · Oct 9, 2019

Nat2019 said:

I just want to add something to my message. When I came to these truths I found, it wasnt because I wanted to follow a bunch of theological ideas. It was because I was searching for the truth comparing what I was taught in OSAS to the bible. So when I was looking for the truth I didn't think about theology. I didnt even know much about it. But years down the track I was doing some research about the truths I found. I compared OSAS to scriptures In my bible and could see they didnt match up. Also when in OSAS I always felt confused about what I believed and couldn't make sense about how I could be free from sin, because the beliefs I applied from OSAS didnt help me change or be like christ. I also couldn't understand why the holy spirit didnt deliver me from my sins for years while in OSAS. So this is how I changed gospels.

My mother found the website evangelical outreach because she couldn't understand why my father was a OSAS Christian, stopped using drugs. Then started using drugs turned from God and didnt want to know God anymore. So my mother was confused. If my husband is guaranteed salvation why doesn't he want to be a Christian anymore. So she was asking questions, I was asking questions and the answer we both found is OSAS isnt biblical.

So many may say I am deceived but I just cant follow OSAS anymore. Because to me I couldn't find the solution of how to change. I was In despair looking for a way out. While in OSAS people would make out like I was okay with God without following his will. One day I read my bible and it convicted me, so I threw it across my bedroom in anger. I wasnt okay living In sin and being a Christian. I was confused and messed up. I also thought it was ok to get in a relationship with a Muslim. But I was convicted that it was wrong, but I still ignored God and Got consequences for it. I never preached the gospel in OSAS. I never had a desire too. My favorite preachers were David Wilkinson, Carter Conlin and Dr Charles Stanley- I found out Dr Charles standley says weeping and nashing are In heaven. I felt church was nothing but a social club and most the sermons I listened to were boring and alot didn't even make sense. I couldn't wait for the church services to finish. Right now I do not attend church, the only person I have to fellowship is my mother because I said goodbye to all my OSAS friends a few years ago. I just felt like God wasn't in these Churches. How can I come back to such a belief system where I felt no peace. Many will say how can you say you have no peace with guaranteed salvation. Well I needed to be free from my sins, and I would cry constantly, feeling like I just didnt want to live against God, but I felt helpless. All my decisions against Gods will were having an impact on my life. The consequences I had for so many things, would shock some people. I actually shouldn't be alive because of the many dangerous situations I put my self in. So this is why I see the importance of HOLY LIVING because I have seen the consequences of UNHOLY LIVING. When you do so many wrong things you start to feel like a horrible person. When I Obey God, my life is more peaceful. Not too say I dont still have problems but if I didn't care about any of the bible. Right now I would probably be
*In an abusive relationship.
*Prison
*Dead
*Mental hospital

Because in my life i have had alot of problems and I would find others with the same problems. These people are not In a good place right now.
So the reason I have stayed out of alot of trouble so far is because I am trying to apply the bible to my life.
This doesn't mean I haven't had temptations to fall into sin. There are moments when I have stumbled and fallen. But I just try again, with the help of God. Do I think I will lose my salvation all the time NO. I dont think that. I just believe we need to live in accordance with Gods word. Because I have seen the consequences of not following his word.

You can get yourself into situations you wish you never entered.

My father's friend from OSAS didnt stop using Drugs even though he was "saved" . This man used to come to my mum and dads house with his child. He also came to church with us all the time.

Then I saw him in the city walk past and he was homeless and on meth. So if the holy spirit did all the work according to OSAS why didnt it work In my dad or dads friend. As well as myself and my mother and many other people. How come many of us came to salvation and had our lives turn worse after salvation. Wasn't the spirit in OSAS supposed to sanctify us to make us like Christ. Well that didnt happen for many people.😭

Noose · Oct 9, 2019

Nat2019 said:

I just want to add something to my message. When I came to these truths I found, it wasnt because I wanted to follow a bunch of theological ideas. It was because I was searching for the truth comparing what I was taught in OSAS to the bible. So when I was looking for the truth I didn't think about theology. I didnt even know much about it. But years down the track I was doing some research about the truths I found. I compared OSAS to scriptures In my bible and could see they didnt match up. Also when in OSAS I always felt confused about what I believed and couldn't make sense about how I could be free from sin, because the beliefs I applied from OSAS didnt help me change or be like christ. I also couldn't understand why the holy spirit didnt deliver me from my sins for years while in OSAS. So this is how I changed gospels.

My mother found the website evangelical outreach because she couldn't understand why my father was a OSAS Christian, stopped using drugs. Then started using drugs turned from God and didnt want to know God anymore. So my mother was confused. If my husband is guaranteed salvation why doesn't he want to be a Christian anymore. So she was asking questions, I was asking questions and the answer we both found is OSAS isnt biblical.

So many may say I am deceived but I just cant follow OSAS anymore. Because to me I couldn't find the solution of how to change. I was In despair looking for a way out. While in OSAS people would make out like I was okay with God without following his will. One day I read my bible and it convicted me, so I threw it across my bedroom in anger. I wasnt okay living In sin and being a Christian. I was confused and messed up. I also thought it was ok to get in a relationship with a Muslim. But I was convicted that it was wrong, but I still ignored God and Got consequences for it. I never preached the gospel in OSAS. I never had a desire too. My favorite preachers were David Wilkinson, Carter Conlin and Dr Charles Stanley- I found out Dr Charles standley says weeping and nashing are In heaven. I felt church was nothing but a social club and most the sermons I listened to were boring and alot didn't even make sense. I couldn't wait for the church services to finish. Right now I do not attend church, the only person I have to fellowship is my mother because I said goodbye to all my OSAS friends a few years ago. I just felt like God wasn't in these Churches. How can I come back to such a belief system where I felt no peace. Many will say how can you say you have no peace with guaranteed salvation. Well I needed to be free from my sins, and I would cry constantly, feeling like I just didnt want to live against God, but I felt helpless. All my decisions against Gods will were having an impact on my life. The consequences I had for so many things, would shock some people. I actually shouldn't be alive because of the many dangerous situations I put my self in. So this is why I see the importance of HOLY LIVING because I have seen the consequences of UNHOLY LIVING. When you do so many wrong things you start to feel like a horrible person. When I Obey God, my life is more peaceful. Not too say I dont still have problems but if I didn't care about any of the bible. Right now I would probably be
*In an abusive relationship.
*Prison
*Dead
*Mental hospital

Because in my life i have had alot of problems and I would find others with the same problems. These people are not In a good place right now.
So the reason I have stayed out of alot of trouble so far is because I am trying to apply the bible to my life.
This doesn't mean I haven't had temptations to fall into sin. There are moments when I have stumbled and fallen. But I just try again, with the help of God. Do I think I will lose my salvation all the time NO. I dont think that. I just believe we need to live in accordance with Gods word. Because I have seen the consequences of not following his word.

You can get yourself into situations you wish you never entered.

My advice, it is love for others that matters; meaning, you don't need to hate or separate yourself from your OSAS friends because of their ideas.

Noose · Oct 9, 2019

Nat2019 said:

Mmhhh, the OSAS team will say that he was never truly saved to begin with so i guess one can only know that they are saved at the very end during judgement. But it doesn't matter.

Nat2019 · Oct 9, 2019

Noose said:

It seems like only those with drug addictions werent ever saved. But if you commit other sins you were saved in OSAS. Because In OSAS sins are judged differently. A person can gossip, but another cant get high. Its double standards to me.

Nat2019 · Oct 9, 2019

Noose said:

Like people in OSAS can say anything they like in conversation, they can gossip etc. But a person who drinks or uses drugs inst a Christian and was never saved to begin with.
A perfect example is a OSAS believer i had a coffee with a few years ago. He wanted to be my friend. But I couldn't because of my beliefs.

This man told his friend a OSAS believer if he doesnt stop using drugs he will go to hell. Then he has come out and been honest on social media saying he's into erotic stuff and was posting porn on the internet. Before that he had photos of provocative women on a photography page.

So this person can go to heaven and someone that uses drugs cant. It doesn't sound fair to me. Alot of these people are like that. Isnt this self righteousness in itself.

You know what at least by what I follow now all believers are treated equally.

Nat2019 · Oct 9, 2019

Nat2019 said:

Like people in OSAS can say anything they like in conversation, they can gossip etc. But a person who drinks or uses drugs inst a Christian and was never saved to begin with.
A perfect example is a OSAS believer i had a coffee with a few years ago. He wanted to be my friend. But I couldn't because of my beliefs.

This man told his friend a OSAS believer if he doesnt stop using drugs he will go to hell. Then he has come out and been honest on social media saying he's into erotic stuff and was posting porn on the internet. Before that he had photos of provocative women on a photography page.

So this person can go to heaven and someone that uses drugs cant. It doesn't sound fair to me. Alot of these people are like that. Isnt this self righteousness in itself.

You know what at least by what I follow now all believers are treated equally.

My own parent told me my sins were worse than hers in OSAS even she couldn't see the hypocrisy. Because if you get drunk in OSAS your sins are worse then others. Then you can get labeled "NON CHRISTIAN".

But if you gossip, say foul language etc your a Christian.

A girl from my church goes

"God might find me a man who was a previous drug addict, who not one anymore because he is delivered.

"MY THOUGHTS"
What makes you think he has to change but you dont have to change and be a women who dresses modestly. What makes you think he can't use drugs but you can sell alcohol at a casino.

I see this alot I'm these churches. You look at a drug dealer badly, yet you can work in a bottle shop or bar selling alcohol. So Christian's dont think you can sell alcohol and someone cant sell pot its double standards. God has one standard. We cant make up our rules of who is a worse person sinfully.

Nat2019 · Oct 9, 2019

Noose said:

Noose I dont hate people because I chose to fellowship with those of my own doctrine. As you can see we dont see eye to eye on the bible.

Nat2019 · Oct 9, 2019

Noose said:

I don't hate my ex friends at all. I just want to fellowship with those who are of "one mind". This is because I have experienced quite alot of hateful comments from those in OSAS. Alot of them call me judgmental just for not accepting their doctrine. This is even off the internet. You give a gospel phamplet to some OSAS believers and they are rude to you. OSAS believers called security on my mother for preaching the gospel. So how can I be friends with them. Many hate those who dont follow OSAS and call them deceivers, pharasees, work salvationists. Etc.

Noose · Oct 9, 2019

Nat2019 said:

Like people in OSAS can say anything they like in conversation, they can gossip etc. But a person who drinks or uses drugs inst a Christian and was never saved to begin with.
A perfect example is a OSAS believer i had a coffee with a few years ago. He wanted to be my friend. But I couldn't because of my beliefs.

This man told his friend a OSAS believer if he doesnt stop using drugs he will go to hell. Then he has come out and been honest on social media saying he's into erotic stuff and was posting porn on the internet. Before that he had photos of provocative women on a photography page.

So this person can go to heaven and someone that uses drugs cant. It doesn't sound fair to me. Alot of these people are like that. Isnt this self righteousness in itself.

You know what at least by what I follow now all believers are treated equally.

Doesn't matter, we are no different from these people. Christ died for such and we are required to have the same mind that Christ for while we were still ungodly and enemies, He showed love and died for us.

Nat2019 · Oct 9, 2019

Nat2019 said:

It was hard to say goodbye to my best friend 😭. I felt like I had to because we weren't seeing eye to eye on the bible. She told me I can't see the bible In black and white. She was involved in the Baptist church I walked out of. Some decisions aren't easy. I had to say goodbye to this group of people I really liked. I thought we were following the same gospel, but then they give out phamplets with Law preaching- Ray comfort. I couldn't be part of this group of people because they told me I was forgiven for my future sins and those who sin are never saved to begin with. Then one of there members is rude to me In the library and basically rejecting me for my beliefs. I was upset about the whole thing. But I know I cant preach what they are preaching.

Nat2019 · Oct 9, 2019

Noose said:

Noose I am talking about double standards within OSAS

eternally-gratefull · Oct 9, 2019

Nat2019 said:

Double standards?

eternally-gratefull · Oct 9, 2019

Nat2019 said:

I don't hate my ex friends at all. I just want to fellowship with those who are of "one mind". This is because I have experienced quite alot of hateful comments from those in OSAS. Alot of them call me judgmental just for not accepting their doctrine. This is even off the internet. You give a gospel phamplet to some OSAS believers and they are rude to you. OSAS believers called security on my mother for preaching the gospel. So how can I be friends with them. Many hate those who dont follow OSAS and call them deceivers, pharasees, work salvationists. Etc.

Non osas people can be just as bad,

i would think the truth is more important

Nat2019 · Oct 9, 2019

Nat2019 said:

I just want to say I am not in a box with other NON OSAS believers because I have different beliefs to them and some think we have to follow the sabbath command and get water baptized for salvation. I have different beliefs so I cannot be put in a box with other NON OSAS believers.

Some in OSAS dont judge others sins worse than theirs but this is the very rare person. If they dont judge their fellow brother they will judge the unbelievers instead and say they are worse people sinfully.
When I quote scripture about certain subjects regarding sin it isnt because- I want to judge others. It's because I want to show others these scriptures exist in the bible... am I constant calling people names and saying their sins are worse than mine. Am I constantly pointing out "you dishonest person" to you. I am not picking out your individual sins and calling you names.

I read on another thread someone who disagrees with another person calling them a "swine" I do not believe in this kind of christianity even if that person appears to be against OSAS.

Nat2019 · Oct 9, 2019

To the OSAS believer on here who was called a "swine" I don't agree with the person who called you that. I was actually shocked to read such a message like that. You deserve respect aswell.... Its not okay to do this on both sides. What I am talking about is double standards with OSAS. Not double standards with OSAS vs NO OSAS believers.

But I am glad you mentioned it. Double standards are not okay for both of us.😂. But I will let you know if I write a scripture I am not trying to judge you personally. I also dont think I am better than you In any way or more holy in my own eyes. I am just a human being as well.

Nat2019 · Oct 9, 2019

Nat2019 said:

I don't hate my ex friends at all. I just want to fellowship with those who are of "one mind". This is because I have experienced quite alot of hateful comments from those in OSAS. Alot of them call me judgmental just for not accepting their doctrine. This is even off the internet. You give a gospel phamplet to some OSAS believers and they are rude to you. OSAS believers called security on my mother for preaching the gospel. So how can I be friends with them. Many hate those who dont follow OSAS and call them deceivers, pharasees, work salvationists.....

I just want to add that their are many OSAS believers who don't view others sins worse than theirs and they are accepting toward the gospel of conditional security. Many can have a civil conversation with you about their beliefs. Some feel the need to directly "attack", but some can talk about their beliefs civilly. I guess that goes for both sides doesnt it.

And when I say OSAS is a doctrine to promote a license for immorality its because of my experience. So if I made some feel attacked by my comments. I just want to say it's the doctrine I was attacking and not you personally. Many people dont think OSAS is promoting a license for immorality, but I have seen differently. If we think we are guaranteed enteral life and think we can sin all we want and still enter eternal life. Is that promoting a license for immorality?

You who reads this may not think that, but many do.....

mailmandan · Nov 6, 2019

I've noticed that those who relentlessly attack the OSAS doctrine the most are those who teach salvation by works and I have also noticed that ALL false religions and cults teach salvation by works and strongly disagree with OSAS, which has always been a red flag for me!

Lightskin · Nov 6, 2019

mailmandan said:

And I’ve noticed those who teach salvation by works usually deny they’re teaching it while accusing OSAS believers of being disobedient for refusing to perform works.

Why I now believe that salvation can be lost.

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